Discussion How will Koon and Rak keep up with Baam

[Namchan]

The only way I see them keeping up is clan secret techniques. Maybe Khun showing spear skills on the train was just for fun but maybe it was foreshadowing his potential growth. Ran has the lightning pill... but I’m not sure that’s Aguero’s style.

As far as Rak... there’s hope he will find something clan related this arc. But it’s just a hope at this point.

This was so spot on hahaha

 

[DyingBreed]

Just stayin in his side alive i guees is good enough ?

 

[Jack Van Burace]

Well, Yuri's wolhaiksong's helpers on 2nd Floor were nowhere near her badassery but they did help her. Same goes for Evan, not really strong but able to gather cool equipments and use then wisely. And he is higher ranked than her. So I wouldn't mind much the power gap, teamwork involves way more than fighting main Bosses.

Another option available for Rak tho is to Merge with siblings from another part of the original Giant that Split into 5. We see one of them as similar to Anak's Race, so perhaps Anak Will fuse with Rak in the Future? Maybe they Will find other 3 strong people that fuse into a godly being temporarily, similar to Power buff of Hoaqin? Imagine Rak+anak fused together and the almightyness that alone would ensemble. Now picture 3 other badass guys like them in a 5-way Merge. It would be, by far, the strongest non ranker being we would see.

 

[CantiOG]

Defender is a rare position whose aim is to protect the Light Bearer and/or Spear Bearer during battle.

I predict that Rak will become a Defender(stone shield shinsoo), with a minor in SB, while Khun will be the LH and main Spear (in the case of just this trio fighting).

SIU has already told us that WC/LH is the best possible duo, and Eduan(SB) and Hendo(DF) were an incredible duo. This trio would incorporate all of that.

With Khun having the goal of surpassing his father, as well as a rare quality, obvious natural talent and cunning I don't see why anyone is doubting him. His biggest asset is his tactics, his fighting skills come as a second but he's not lacking. I hope to see him in combat more though. All the pieces are being put into place for them to excel. Rak being a Native One just seals the deal. They're all gonna be High Ranker level.

 

[kkck]

Seeing how things have played out koon and rak can now fulfill a number of positions.

Koon has 3 positions he can fill comfortably as far as I can tell: Lightbearer, spear bearer and fisherman.

Lightbearer will remain the primary position koon covers. It is easily how he can be most useful to bam in general. Aguero will likely never catch up to bam however as a light bearer aguero can be perfect support for him. And it is also an ideal position to support rak.

Spear bearer for obvious reasons. It is where the bulk of his talent lies.

And with his current power boost aguero has the markings of a fisherman. He has an insanely strong body and with his ice spears he should have good stuff for close quarter combat. This is something I would guess aguero will actively avoid though. I guess this very stuff makes him adequate for a scout as well though knowing aguero he will likely avoid this position like a plague.

As for rak, he also became much more versatile.

Obviously he will remain a spear bearer though I kinda feel this is not where the bulk of his talent lies.

Defender seems likely in general. And with this he would be perfect support for either bam or aguero. Mostly for aguero though, I can't imagine rak being able to defend successfully against someone that bam is having trouble with.

Rak with this will have excellent qualities for fisherman. He isn't smart or cooperative enough for scout though. With a rock armor he'd be ideal for close quarter combat. Before the rock armor rak of course had a strong body but he seemed to fall short of a 10 family member. Though his shinsoo resistance could be insane even by noble standards. Anyways, with a rock armor to complement his strong body he could be a force to fear in the front lines. If he were to have a rematch against an arie I could see him pull a ran.

And I daresay rak has the markings of a competent wave controller. We have seen him use rock so far but going by eduan's explanation it seems likely that other elements will be available to him. Control over a variety of elements is ideal for a wave controller.

And of course on paper the combinations seem limitless but I do think the substantial power difference between bam and the others will limit them. Rak properly defending bam remains unlikely. Aguero would have no business being a fisherman for bam. Neither would rak. Bam at this point simply doesn't have the proper traits to be a fisherman due to his comparatively weak body but on shinsoo alone he'd still be much higher than aguero or rak. Realistically speaking combinations involving aguero and rak are far more even. Heck, it'd even make sense that bam plays the fisherman role while aguero throws the spears as support.

I guess another factor to consider is just how far rak can go with his newfound powers. Eduan acknowledged the native one that traveled with them was insanely strong. If rak has the talent for that then his potential could be even higher than aguero's...

 

[Jack Van Burace]

Seeing how things have played out koon and rak can now fulfill a number of positions.

Koon has 3 positions he can fill comfortably as far as I can tell: Lightbearer, spear bearer and fisherman.

Lightbearer will remain the primary position koon covers. It is easily how he can be most useful to bam in general. Aguero will likely never catch up to bam however as a light bearer aguero can be perfect support for him. And it is also an ideal position to support rak.

Spear bearer for obvious reasons. It is where the bulk of his talent lies.

And with his current power boost aguero has the markings of a fisherman. He has an insanely strong body and with his ice spears he should have good stuff for close quarter combat. This is something I would guess aguero will actively avoid though. I guess this very stuff makes him adequate for a scout as well though knowing aguero he will likely avoid this position like a plague.

As for rak, he also became much more versatile.

Obviously he will remain a spear bearer though I kinda feel this is not where the bulk of his talent lies.

Defender seems likely in general. And with this he would be perfect support for either bam or aguero. Mostly for aguero though, I can't imagine rak being able to defend successfully against someone that bam is having trouble with.

Rak with this will have excellent qualities for fisherman. He isn't smart or cooperative enough for scout though. With a rock armor he'd be ideal for close quarter combat. Before the rock armor rak of course had a strong body but he seemed to fall short of a 10 family member. Though his shinsoo resistance could be insane even by noble standards. Anyways, with a rock armor to complement his strong body he could be a force to fear in the front lines. If he were to have a rematch against an arie I could see him pull a ran.

And I daresay rak has the markings of a competent wave controller. We have seen him use rock so far but going by eduan's explanation it seems likely that other elements will be available to him. Control over a variety of elements is ideal for a wave controller.

And of course on paper the combinations seem limitless but I do think the substantial power difference between bam and the others will limit them. Rak properly defending bam remains unlikely. Aguero would have no business being a fisherman for bam. Neither would rak. Bam at this point simply doesn't have the proper traits to be a fisherman due to his comparatively weak body but on shinsoo alone he'd still be much higher than aguero or rak. Realistically speaking combinations involving aguero and rak are far more even. Heck, it'd even make sense that bam plays the fisherman role while aguero throws the spears as support.

I guess another factor to consider is just how far rak can go with his newfound powers. Eduan acknowledged the native one that traveled with them was insanely strong. If rak has the talent for that then his potential could be even higher than aguero's...

Well, according to Kaiser/Elaine's statement, Fenrir's fangs should reap through the skin of anyone except a ranker. Bam's Shinsoo reinforcement was boosted by something he learned with the God of Guardians on First visit. He should have a body as resilient as a weak rankers' thanks to that, as long as he can actively use Shinsoo reinforcement skill.

V.'s family likely has the lowest body resilience bonus tho. I can see him being equivalent to regular 10 Family members once he becomes a ranker, but not to princesses, in terms of sturdiness. Which should be fairly ok for fulfilling a fisherman's position, Just not the best at It.

 

[Vitala]

there is no way rak and koon can keep up with baam and i think they will split sson becaus of Zahard orders baam will see that he can't be with his friends anymore.
they could have keep if baam was just a talented regular with the same power but he is an irregular and zahard knows he is alive.
Also just because AA said in season 1 that he wants to be the FH doesn't mean he will be able to surpass his father, i swear they are readers who are very naive but that is comprehensible.
people should read siu blop post of the previous chapter, it's clear that baam friends will never be game changer in the big scale of thing, he even said that they will have their arc where they are the game changer like the name hunt station or the workshop.

 

[kkck]

Well, according to Kaiser/Elaine's statement, Fenrir's fangs should reap through the skin of anyone except a ranker. Bam's Shinsoo reinforcement was boosted by something he learned with the God of Guardians on First visit. He should have a body as resilient as a weak rankers' thanks to that, as long as he can actively use Shinsoo reinforcement skill.

V.'s family likely has the lowest body resilience bonus tho. I can see him being equivalent to regular 10 Family members once he becomes a ranker, but not to princesses, in terms of sturdiness. Which should be fairly ok for fulfilling a fisherman's position, Just not the best at It.

The issue here is that shinsoo reinforcement alone does not make a fisherman. Fishermans usually have a combination of strong bodies AND reinforcement. And the result of that is literally as broken and unfair as it sounds. Bam for all of his skill does not have a strong body to reinforce. Within the context of my previous post, I could see bam using reinforcement alone to surpass his peers' physical prowess. But that is because bam is so strong compared to his peers. Ok, I think I just figured out a way to explain my view on this: with pokemon!

Imagine two pokemon, one is a level 50 glass cannon sp attacker. And the other is a level 15 bulky physical attacker.

And imagine you have them fight BUT they can only use tackle.

The level 50 glass cannon would have nothing short of shitty defenses by definition. But it is so overleveled that it just might beat the level 15 pokemon in a tackle contest.

On the other hand, imagine the level 15 pokemon was at level 50. The glass cannon will obviously fail miserably. You'd need a barrier or item of sorts to survive a hit. To win the glass cannon would have to resort to the attacks it is good at. And to survive a hit it would have to resort to barriers or items. Which I would argue is a situation similar to the recent bam vs zahard (though bam had the advantage of continuing to grow stronger through the fight).

--- Double Post Merged, Jul 16, 2018, Original Post Date: Jul 16, 2018 ---

there is no way rak and koon can keep up with baam and i think they will split sson becaus of Zahard orders baam will see that he can't be with his friends anymore.
they could have keep if baam was just a talented regular with the same power but he is an irregular and zahard knows he is alive.
Also just because AA said in season 1 that he wants to be the FH doesn't mean he will be able to surpass his father, i swear they are readers who are very naive but that is comprehensible.
people should read siu blop post of the previous chapter, it's clear that baam friends will never be game changer in the big scale of thing, he even said that they will have their arc where they are the game changer like the name hunt station or the workshop.

Bam's friends already have a death sentence by merely being on the hell train. Bam being with them or not does not change that. If anything it makes sense for bam to stick with them so as to being able to protect them. From what I can tell bam's best bet is to miraculously escape the train and get to another regular safe zone.

 

[Jack Van Burace]

I don't think Bam is above the rest Just level wise. The others likely wont catch up to many of his skills ever. Such as number of Bangs controlled at once, Shinsoo Black Hole, or this type of reinforcement he uses (likely another exclusive feature of irregulars). Even If they are given the same training and battle experience, Bam will still Shine above.

I think he COULD be a Fisherman If he had to, but not an outstanding one. More like those High rankers that can fullfill any position, but still have Wave Controlers as ideal one. That's Bam.

Imho, Spear Bearers are those that can hit from Very afar but also Very strong single attacks. Red Velvet sword, for instance. Bam's attacks are area attacks, never a precise focused hit. But he has strong direct hits, such as Hwajepgongpasol. Amigochaz and Novick have strong close range hits too, and I don't see them fighting from so Far away, despite being Spear Bearers. So Bam could in theory be one too I guess.

He also can freeze enemies and transport people like a lighthouse, or spot invisible enemies such as an Observer, so perhaps he is really going to be High ranker, which requires all positions fullfilled, eventually. As long as he doesn't require class specific knowledge, such as actual Spear throwing or lighthouse programing, perhaps he might.

 

[kkck]

I don't think Bam is above the rest Just level wise. The others likely wont catch up to many of his skills ever. Such as number of Bangs controlled at once, Shinsoo Black Hole, or this type of reinforcement he uses (likely another exclusive feature of irregulars). Even If they are given the same training and battle experience, Bam will still Shine above.

I think he COULD be a Fisherman If he had to, but not an outstanding one. More like those High rankers that can fullfill any position, but still have Wave Controlers as ideal one. That's Bam.

Imho, Spear Bearers are those that can hit from Very afar but also Very strong single attacks. Red Velvet sword, for instance. Bam's attacks are area attacks, never a precise focused hit. But he has strong direct hits, such as Hwajepgongpasol. Amigochaz and Novick have strong close range hits too, and I don't see them fighting from so Far away, despite being Spear Bearers. So Bam could in theory be one too I guess.

He also can freeze enemies and transport people like a lighthouse, or spot invisible enemies such as an Observer, so perhaps he is really going to be High ranker, which requires all positions fullfilled, eventually. As long as he doesn't require class specific knowledge, such as actual Spear throwing or lighthouse programing, perhaps he might.

The example isn't meant to be perfect, just show more or less the current situation. But yeah, bam's companions will likely have a much lower level cap so to speak.

Spear bearers are people who literally throw spears. From what we have seen red velvet sword doesn't have that much range but if it did it'd be a wave controller technique. Novick is a weird case because we have never seen him use a spear at all IIRC. I might be mistaken but I also sort of assumed a spear bearer would have greater range than a wave controller.

 

[Jack Van Burace]

I think Amigochaz contradicts that assumption ever since 2nd Floor.

Imo, we can make ToG classes related to either football positions/roles or RPG classes. To me, Spear Bearers are
mid fielders/fault kickers for football. The guys who can hit the goal and have a strong kick to do It even from afar. Doesn't mean they have to be faraway, just that they have the strongest kick and not necessarily the fastest movement or dribble capacity. Just strength and aim.

Likewise in RPGs there are lancers, 2-handed sword users and archers, all benefitting from range and slower recharge time between attacks in a way. They aren't fast hitters, don't have to be resilient, they just need above all aim, and attacks that cause trouble If they hit. Unlike thieves and assassins (scouts) that rely on being hidden and in Speed or charisma rather than damaging ability. Unlike wizards (Wave Controlers). Unlike support classes (Light bearers). And unlike front row fighters, with High Dodge and hit rate (fisherman).