Brandish shrinks and grows entire people which include everything inside people ergo their organs, blood, atoms, ect. Like I said she can organ bust mid combat and it's downplay to think otherwise. Only way if she couldn't use it mid combat is that if it required prep to do so like Fairy Law, but it obviously doesn't.
Brandish shrinks and grows entire people which include everything inside people ergo their organs, blood, atoms, ect. Like I said she can organ bust mid combat and it's downplay to think otherwise. Only way if she couldn't use it mid combat is that if it required prep to do so like Fairy Law, but it obviously doesn't.
Ok, since using in/off combat, off-guard/on-guard etc doesn't matter, Jellal stomps Erza with bind snake then since he can just do it with swipe of a hand, no need for perp time.
Mest mind controls and destroys Spriggans
I didn't say Light-Shadow DF Sting was slower. I said DF Sting and DF Rogue together are slower than Base Natsu, which is why he was kicking the shit out of them. Oh, and Sting didn't need Light Shadow mode to keep up with Larcade lol, he was doing it in Base. Being a spriggan don't make you fast, this was never stated nor was it shown. Very few spriggans are fast and Brandish isn't one of them. She has no speed feats.
Organ bust has no combat showing. And Kyria can still cut Brandish's strength when shrunk. Not that Brandish has the speed feats to attack first against someone who can clash swords with Erza.
WRT twin dragons, that was before Sting and Rouge got their massive powerups.
Towards the end of GMG, both of them are stronger than base Natsu/Gajeel, but weaker than their dual forms. Sting got his potential unlocked by Lector 'dying' and Rouge by FR's shade.
Pot powerup Twin dragons are collectively above Jeimma, who's above Demon Gates
Ok, since using in/off combat, off-guard/on-guard etc doesn't matter, Jellal stomps Erza with bind snake then since he can just do it with swipe of a hand, no need for perp time.
Mest mind controls and destroys Spriggans
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WRT twin dragons, that was before Sting and Rouge got their massive powerups.
Towards the end of GMG, both of them are stronger than base Natsu/Gajeel, but weaker than their dual forms. Sting got his potential unlocked by Lector 'dying' and Rouge by FR's shade.
Pot powerup Twin dragons are collectively above Jeimma, who's above Demon Gates
Your point doesn't make sense since both times Jellal used bind snake he had to lower the guard of Erza and touch her where she won't notice him placing it. Brandish onscreen shrunk people instantly mid combat. She never once showed the need to make preparations unlike Jellal. You pushing hard to treat bind snake and Mass Manipulation on the same level but they simply aren't.
Mass Manipulation
Instaneous
Use mid combat
Can be triggered with a thought
Bind Snake
Needed to honey trap Erza ergo make her go off guard
Took awhile for the effect to happen
Required touch
Your argument is flawed since Mass Manioulation and Bind Snake do not operate under the same functions and one was shown to do it instantly on multiple occassions while the other never had.
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Mest also could mentally f with anyone but his memory manipulation takes time. You're comparing an apple to a non existent orange since again Brandish's powers were shown to work instantly. It was also shown to have been used instantaneously whilst in combat.
Your point doesn't make sense since both times Jellal used bind snake he had to lower the guard of Erza and touch her where she won't notice him placing it. Brandish onscreen shrunk people instantly mid combat. She never once showed the need to make preparations unlike Jellal. You pushing hard to treat bind snake and Mass Manipulation on the same level but they simply aren't.
Mass Manipulation
Instaneous
Use mid combat
Can be triggered with a thought
Bind Snake
Needed to honey trap Erza ergo make her go off guard
Took awhile for the effect to happen
Required touch
Your argument is flawed since Mass Manioulation and Bind Snake do not operate under the same functions and one was shown to do it instantly on multiple occassions while the other never had.
--- Double Post Merged, ---
Mest also could mentally f with anyone but his memory manipulation takes time. You're comparing an apple to a non existent orange since again Brandish's powers were shown to work instantly. It was also shown to have been used instantaneously whilst in combat.
You're describing x784 Bind Snake, which needed prep time and touch
In x793, he does it with a wave of his hand. Erza turned back for a second, and he instantly cast bind snake on her.
So, x793 bind snake:
- don't need honey trap, needs only off guard
- takes a wave of hand to cast
- don't need touch
Seems like your criteria for "organ burst" lmao
"Organ burst":
- used on an opponent powered down and off guard. NOT mid combat
- used on an organ already under it's effect
Using it on organs need more precision than using on an entire body (which is what she had done in combat). They aren't really comparable.
Command T, another spell she use mid combat, shrinks the entire spell, and NOT a PART of a spell.
She has only shown feats of using her mass manipulation magic on full bodies - be it actual mass or magic, rather than on a PART of mass or magic, in combat.
I'll believe your claims on organ burst when I see it happening in combat.
******
Brandish was acting normally against August, and suddenly she went insane.
Nothing suggests Mest was using mind control for a while. If that was the case, "need to off grandpa" would've triggered in the beginning of the talk with August.
To me this suggests Mest clearly did it mid talk, considering he freaked out seeing August and his power level, once they got to him. Somewhere in the middle of the talk, he decided that August was too dangerous and decided to use Brandish against him
Whoops, I should of been more specific while saying FT members, anyway, I do believe she has more MP than Laxus, Erza and most of Natsus’ form, yes I do (by a small margin), BUT, I do believe they would maul her one v one without much problems, as they are formidable fighters and I’ve been convinced many times that you can have immense mp and still gets battered because you’re not a skilled fighter as Magic Power ≠ Power Level, ask Neinhart about that.
May I mention that I don’t think there is a big gap between Laxus and Gildz? I’m so sure Laxus would give Gildarts an high diff.
Why?
When Jellal powered up, Neinhart was shocked by his MP. Suggesting Jellal's MP > Neinhart's. Laxus scales to Jellal.
And Wahl, another Spriggan commented on Laxus' high MP (said something like "among fairy tail, this guy's magic power is top notch. He's dangerous") .
And this is x792.
Maybe a case can be made that Spriggan MP are enough to hax x792 Laxus tiers.
But x793? No way.
x793 good guys >> x792 good guys. By x793, the top tier good guys should've eclipsed at least regular Spriggans in MP
I didn't say Light-Shadow DF Sting was slower. I said DF Sting and DF Rogue together are slower than Base Natsu, which is why he was kicking the shit out of them. Oh, and Sting didn't need Light Shadow mode to keep up with Larcade lol, he was doing it in Base. Being a spriggan don't make you fast, this was never stated nor was it shown. Very few spriggans are fast and Brandish isn't one of them. She has no speed feats.
Organ bust has no combat showing. And Kyria can still cut Brandish's strength when shrunk. Not that Brandish has the speed feats to attack first against someone who can clash swords with Erza.
brandish still can organ bust and its obvious, thats like me saying that kyria cannot use blade hypnosis in combat cause she only used them when erza was still (from last time i remembered)
brandish still can organ bust and its obvious, thats like me saying that kyria cannot use blade hypnosis in combat cause she only used them when erza was still (from last time i remembered)
When Jellal powered up, Neinhart was shocked by his MP. Suggesting Jellal's MP > Neinhart's. Laxus scales to Jellal.
And Wahl, another Spriggan commented on Laxus' high MP (said something like "among fairy tail, this guy's magic power is top notch. He's dangerous") .
Personally, I don't see this as Jellal & Laxus' MP being > Neinhart & Wahl's MP, remember, Spriggans were highly arrogant, Ajeel for example heavily underestimated God Serena and believed he could solo Ishgar despite that clearly not being true. Personally, I think the reason Neinhart was so shocked was because he didn't expect there to be a Wizard in Ishgar with such high MP, not that Jellal's MP itself exceeded his, same with Wahl, they were all expecting Mages in Ishgar to be pathetically weak, and that was the downfall for a majority of them.
brandish still can organ bust and its obvious, thats like me saying that kyria cannot use blade hypnosis in combat cause she only used them when erza was still (from last time i remembered)
This is just false on so many levels, Brandish's case and Kyria's case are two very different things, Brandish used it on an off guard Natsu who wasn't paying attention to her, whilst Kyria used it on Erza, who was not only focusing on her but was still ready to fight her, Erza simply allowed Kyria to speak, it doesn't mean that they still weren't mid battle.
As you can see, Erza was still on guard and prepared for an attack from Kyria, she was pointing her sword at her, this clearly shows that Erza and Kyria were still mid battle as Erza did not let her guard down. It would be different if she pulled a dirty trick (like what Jellal did in ToH with Bind Snake) and used it on Erza then, then yeah, it wouldn't be a mid combat feat.
Personally, I don't see this as Jellal & Laxus' MP being > Neinhart & Wahl's MP, remember, Spriggans were highly arrogant, Ajeel for example heavily underestimated God Serena and believed he could solo Ishgar despite that clearly not being true. Personally, I think the reason Neinhart was so shocked was because he didn't expect there to be a Wizard in Ishgar with such high MP, not that Jellal's MP itself exceeded his, same with Wahl, they were all expecting Mages in Ishgar to be pathetically weak, and that was the downfall for a majority of them.
Based on what is Spriggan's MP higher?
They're just high compared to Makarov. That's, Makarov's MP is only only comparison we officially have
Also, why would you get shocked at someone's MP unless it's higher than yours? If it was say only a bit lesser, that would incite surprise, praise etc rahter than shock, being scared etc.
Jellal's MP > Neinhart's
I can agree this for Wahl/Laxus dynamics, but then again Laxus was nerfed there.
Wahl/Laxxus dynamic = maybe your interpretation.
But Jellal/Neinhart dynamic moreso suggests what I say
Brandish's mere presence terrified Natsu, Gray, and Lucy and concerned Erza, and Erza's MP should scale to Jellal and Laxus while Brandish's MP should scale to most other Spriggans, including Neinhart. Plus, Brandish never powered up, she was just there. she couldn't have been any more chill when her MP scared Gray, she was looking forward to a Star Mango Gelato.
Also, why would you get shocked at someone's MP unless it's higher than yours? If it was say only a bit lesser, that would incite surprise, praise etc rahter than shock, being scared etc.
Jellal's MP > Neinhart's
Just rewatched the fight, he was shocked by the sky opening, saying "No! What happened to the sky!?", not Jellal himself, he didn't understand the magic and likely hasn't seen it before, then he got scared because he knew the spell would defeat him, that doesn't necessarily mean that Jellal had more MP than Neinhart, it just meant he had enough firepower to put Neinhart down.
Plus, Neinhart was already terrified, he got scared when Erza scared away his Historia, then got terrified when he figured out that Erza was Irene's daughter.
Brandish's mere presence terrified Natsu, Gray, and Lucy and concerned Erza, and Erza's MP should scale to Jellal and Laxus while Brandish's MP should scale to most other Spriggans, including Neinhart. Plus, Brandish never powered up, she was just there. she couldn't have been any more chill when her MP scared Gray, she was looking forward to a Star Mango Gelato.
Yeah, nothing too different from what happens in the beginning of every arc to build hype.
Later on, nobody was surprised at sensing Spriggan more.
And even if that's true, this is an year later and good guys have grown a lot, nothing suggest Spriggans have more MP than current good guys.
And I disagree with Erza scaling to them in MP, even now but especially in x792. She's more of a physical combat type, rather than they who are classic mage types (Jellal more so)
Just rewatched the fight, he was shocked by the sky opening, saying "No! What happened to the sky!?", not Jellal himself, he didn't understand the magic and likely hasn't seen it before, then he got scared because he knew the spell would defeat him, that doesn't necessarily mean that Jellal had more MP than Neinhart, it just meant he had enough firepower to put Neinhart down.
Plus, Neinhart was already terrified, he got scared when Erza scared away his Historia, then got terrified when he figured out that Erza was Irene's daughter.
Ok maybe. Regardless you don't get scared or shocked at something that you think is beneath you, even if it's new. If something is new, yet beneath me, I'll be surprised and but to worried.
How would Neinhart realize that attack is going to end him? Right, he sensed the MP at play there. And again, no reason to get shocked at a MP unless it's above your level
Ok, and he was independently terrified of Jellal too. With Erza it's different because he was shocked that his magic disappeared and she was related to Eileen. With Jellal he saw him powering up and got terrified. There is a difference
One more point. We know for a fact that initial stages of partial END had enough MP to bypass average Spriggan hax. Darkness Gray scales. I'd put Gildards above them both, so he scales as well. Current top tier good guys should scale to x792 Gildards? So they scale too
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