Year Round The Football/Soccer Thread v2

[FrostyMouse]

I have no problem with a league wanting to put forth a good image. All leagues do this, even here. That's why you suspend Terry and make an example out of him. But to bring the law into it, just because "someone" complained to the authorities? Ridiculous. If that's the case why aren't people who "assault" another player on the pitch brought up on charges more regularly? There's actual videotaped evidence of such things...so with this we have...like what? Lip-reading? One person's word against the other? . It's stupid in my opinion.

Neither do I, but it's how the leagues go about it that's often the problem. Roger Goodell has tried to clean up hits in the NFL because of all the concussion lawsuits, but that was more about protecting the NFL's ass, not because they really cared.

They gave Suarez an eight game suspension and made an example out of him. From the start of the Terry thing, it was never going to be about a suspension from the EPL, only this tiny fine and that's it.

Nigel De Jong didn't even get a single game suspension for that terrible flying kick in the 2010 WC Final, although he wasn't sent off, so...

The person who reported the incident is supposedly an "off duty police officer."

With the Terry thing, we have lip reading, which can't even confirm exactly what was said (although the jury's out on that one), and then it's a he said she said thing. If this was about a suspension from the EPL, that's important, but this is about a £2,500 fine, and that's it. This law just needs to be scrapped. Trying to clean up the game is fine, but bringing a law into something on the field is complete bs.

 

[Imperium]

The Suarez and Terry cases are different. One is the FA dealing the punishment, the police did not investigate and the FA dealt with it as they saw fit. The other is another animal entirely. Its outside the FA's jurisdiction. A member of the public (reported to be an off duty police officer) called the police to report it. The police investigated it and decided they had a case. The CPS was contacted who then prosecuted. The FA has not even begun to charge Terry.

What will most likely happen is Terry is not charged. The FA will say they wont do anything further because look even the police did not have enough evidence to convict him. All parties will leave satisfied. The FA will not having their inconsistent rulings (suarez was punished on even shakier evidence) and institutional bias for English players brought up and as a bonus they also look tough on racism, the fans having something to talk during the off-season, the papers have something to print and Terry has his name cleared. Everything goes hunky dory and the season begins. This whole thing is part of the constant football soap opera. It is all par for the course.

 

[FrostyMouse]

I know, Imperium, but what's the point at all? Unless the point was to distract attention from how poor the English team was at the Euros...I mean, in a way, I think the FA wanted to be shot of Fabio Capello, and they knew he supported Terry, so this whole three ring circus was probably more about Capello than anything else. Still, I don't like the way it went down. It's all just trash, when the summer should be about the Euros, the Olympics, and summer transfers, not about whether or not Terry, Anton, and the rest of everyone has an axe to grind about something. The soap opera crap needs to end.

 

[Imperium]

I know, Imperium, but what's the point at all? Unless the point was to distract attention from how poor the English team was at the Euros...I mean, in a way, I think the FA wanted to be shot of Fabio Capello, and they knew he supported Terry, so this whole three ring circus was probably more about Capello than anything else. Still, I don't like the way it went down. It's all just trash, when the summer should be about the Euros, the Olympics, and summer transfers, not about whether or not Terry, Anton, and the rest of everyone has an axe to grind about something. The soap opera crap needs to end.

This shit is to men in this country what Eastenders is to women. It wont end. Its the same in most sports I'd imagine. There will always be a crisis around the corner for everyone to eat up, and eat it up we do.

Its not really about the England team. Nor do I dont think its about Capello as much. They sacked him over the Terry thing yes, but they had no other choice. They probably wanted Capello there more then anyone, so they could blame him when everything inevitably failed in the Euro's (and probably wouldnt have had to pay such a huge severance pay if they sacked him after the Euro's). But then Capello forced their hand more. There was no way the FA could let Terry stay as captain of England while he was on trial on those allegations. No way. Belive me if if they let Terry be captain what would have happened is the media would have a field day and before you know it everyone from the old lady down the road to the Prime minister would be denouncing them. They did what they had to do, it was all politics. Capello is a footballing man, he does not really care for the crap behind the scenes. Having Terry as a captain is the best for the team, and having him as a captain is a footballing decision only he should make. He drew the line and they sacked him. Both parties in my opinion are not to blame, it was just how things went. The FA knew they were about to enter a huge shitstorm and they acted fast.

The whole thing right now is out of the FA's control, totally out of it. But its playing out how they wanted it too. He wont be charged. If he though is it would be both hilarious and the biggest scandal since Cantona kicked that fan and was arrested.

---------- Post added at 11:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:47 PM ----------

Actually thinking about it now, the Cantona incident is pretty similar. Both derided, stripped of their countries captaincy, criminal charges, big media storm etc. The only difference is Terry has a very strong defence and the prosecution has little to use. Cantona...well you cant really defend a flykick.

 

[FrostyMouse]

This shit is to men in this country what Eastenders is to women. It wont end. Its the same in most sports I'd imagine. There will always be a crisis around the corner for everyone to eat up, and eat it up we do.

I watched a couple of episodes of Eastenders and I couldn't believe how bad it was. Although, all soap operas are pretty bad.

The whole thing right now is out of the FA's control, totally out of it. But its playing out how they wanted it too. He wont be charged. If he though is it would be both hilarious and the biggest scandal since Cantona kicked that fan and was arrested.

You know, if Ashley Cole can get away with shooting a fan at an event, with an air rifle admittedly, there's no way Terry can be found guilty of this.

It is happening the way the FA wanted it to, but I still think that they made bad decisions here. They could've kept Terry on and told the media to screw themselves, but they would never do that.

Actually thinking about it now, the Cantona incident is pretty similar. Both derided, stripped of their countries captaincy, criminal charges, big media storm etc. The only difference is Terry has a very strong defence and the prosecution has little to use. Cantona...well you cant rely defend a flykick.

I like the pun there.

 

[Imperium]

I watched a couple of episodes of Eastenders and I couldn't believe how bad it was. Although, all soap operas are pretty bad.

Yes it is bad. But sadly quite addictive too. *cough* I am almost two years cold turkey.

You know, if Ashley Cole can get away with shooting a fan at an event, with an air rifle admittedly, there's no way Terry can be found guilty of this.

It is happening the way the FA wanted it to, but I still think that they made bad decisions here. They could've kept Terry on and told the media to screw themselves, but they would never do that.

The Cole thing was more an accident than anything. The kid could have sued in a civil trial I think...but yea that wont ever happen.

They have to care because something like that could turn political quite quickly. The political system is reactionary, if something is in the news the opposition will use it to beat the current government or the government will get in their first and denounce it. Regardless heads would roll. Starting with the Chairman of the FA. How that would play out is actually amusing me right now to think about.

Spoiler: "My imagined scenarios"

Press spin it that the FA endorses racism by keeping Terry > The Government will try to ignore it > Opposition jump on this and denounce current government as racist > The Government has a u-turn and condemns the FA even more strongly > Press hacks ask the prince (president of the FA) if he condems racism ("Yes! in the strongest terms") which is twisted to him condemning the FA

Press spin it that the FA endorses racism by keeping Terry > The Government will condemn it > Opposition condemn it > Press hacks ask the prince if he condems racism (Yes! in the strongest terms) which is twisted to him condemning the FA

That will eventually lead to:

The hacks take out their knives and call for everyone's resignation starting from the tealady to the chairman > Weeks later after pressure from the government, the media, fans, officials past and present and the whole public, heads begin to roll and the resignations begin.

It's a sad state of affairs but they just cant ignore it. >_>;

I like the pun there.

In other Football news though, more corruption from FIFA is being reported. Scanning it quickly it seems like the usual stuff. I dont know how far this will go though.

 

[FrostyMouse]

Yes it is bad. But sadly quite addictive too. *cough* I am almost two years cold turkey.

I was in the lounge of a London hostel and it was on. It was kind of odd in a way. The episodes were about this kid who apparently killed a woman, but his delusional mother/aunt (I can't remember which) couldn't accept that her son/nephew could've killed someone.

The Cole thing was more an accident than anything. The kid could have sued in a civil trial I think...but yea that wont ever happen.

Yes, it was an accident, but he still shot him. Yeah, the kid was never going to sue.

They have to care because something like that could turn political quite quickly. The political system is reactionary, if something is in the news the opposition will use it to beat the current government or the government will get in their first and denounce it. Regardless heads would roll. Starting with the Chairman of the FA. How that would play out is actually amusing me right now to think about.

Spoiler: "My imagined scenarios"

Press spin it that the FA endorses racism by keeping Terry > The Government will try to ignore it > Opposition jump on this and denounce current government as racist > The Government has a u-turn and condemns the FA even more strongly > Press hacks ask the prince (president of the FA) if he condems racism ("Yes! in the strongest terms") which is twisted to him condemning the FA

Press spin it that the FA endorses racism by keeping Terry > The Government will condemn it > Opposition condemn it > Press hacks ask the prince if he condems racism (Yes! in the strongest terms) which is twisted to him condemning the FA

That will eventually lead to:

The hacks take out their knives and call for everyone's resignation starting from the tealady to the chairman > Weeks later after pressure from the government, the media, fans, officials past and present and the whole public, heads begin to roll and the resignations begin.

It's a sad state of affairs but they just cant ignore it. >_>;

In other Football news though, more corruption from FIFA is being reported. Scanning it quickly it seems like the usual stuff. I dont know how far this will go though.

It's that bad in England? Ouch.

Yeah, I'd seen that thing about Havelange earlier. I was so unsurprised.

 

[xi0]

The Suarez and Terry cases are different. One is the FA dealing the punishment, the police did not investigate and the FA dealt with it as they saw fit. The other is another animal entirely. Its outside the FA's jurisdiction. A member of the public (reported to be an off duty police officer) called the police to report it. The police investigated it and decided they had a case. The CPS was contacted who then prosecuted. The FA has not even begun to charge Terry.

Yeah and that's what is exactly wrong with a such a law. But that isn't much of a topic in the way of sports so whatever.

 

[Imperium]

Yeah and that's what is exactly wrong with a such a law. But that isn't much of a topic in the way of sports so whatever.

Well there isnt much in the way of football news unless random transfer gossip is considered, so why not. Care to explain? I'm intrigued. We can put it in spoilers.

 

[Bugzee]

Actually thinking about it now, the Cantona incident is pretty similar. Both derided, stripped of their countries captaincy, criminal charges, big media storm etc. The only difference is Terry has a very strong defence and the prosecution has little to use. Cantona...well you cant rely defend a flykick.

That ish was epic! Love the music they added in the clip.

 

[xi0]

Well there isnt much in the way of football news unless random transfer gossip is considered, so why not. Care to explain? I'm intrigued. We can put it in spoilers.

I'm saying it comes down to a free speech issue. Within the bylaws of the FA they can do what they want, but the law should have no place in this kind of matter. That's why I brought up actually physical assault since that happens all the time. But in the realm of sport it's accepted to be a hazard of the game and it's not always seen by the officials. But there sure is enough videotape evidence. It's the same with verbal things but they're not always as conspicuous. So because someone who wasn't even within range of hearing what happened complained they opened an investigation? (Was this person even AT the match? ) It seems hyper-sensitive and I don't see what purpose it serves. But again, the FA itself can do whatever they want and have.

 

[FrostyMouse]

Gary, that's why it makes so little sense. So, if I say something to my neighbor and some random guy walking down the street hears me cursing out my neighbor (in a possibly racist manner), can he bring this to the police?

Ignoring that, I think it's just part of the craziness of England.

I was in London during the last week of March, but I didn't manage to make it to Stamford Bridge. I wanted to, but I just didn't. Now, I sort of regret it.

 

[xi0]

I mean, I understand I can't be naive and expect laws to be perfectly similar in the Western world, regardless of country. But yeah, it seems like a bunch of malarkey.

 

[FrostyMouse]

Malarkey, now there's a fun word that you don't hear too often.

As Americans, we expect a lot of freedoms, especially as we have so many, and sometimes we do forget that a lot of other countries don't provide nearly as many freedoms as we do. I mean, trash talk and everything is expected in American sports. People like Ray Lewis thrive on that, for example.

 

[xi0]

Malarkey, now there's a fun word that you don't hear too often.

As Americans, we expect a lot of freedoms, especially as we have so many, and sometimes we do forget that a lot of other countries don't provide nearly as many freedoms as we do. I mean, trash talk and everything is expected in American sports. People like Ray Lewis thrive on that, for example.

I saw Ray Lewis in your post before anything else and I thought I'd have to get defensive

Was a pun intended there? Who knows

Anyways, wrong football. And I'm not even trying to compare what the law might be there compared to here, but it just doesn't pass the smell-test to me at all. The actual alleged wrongdoing and the circumstances together. And trash-talkng happens ALL the time in Soccer, despite it trying/failing to keep it's gentlemanly image.

 

[FrostyMouse]

I saw Ray Lewis in your post before anything else and I thought I'd have to get defensive

Was a pun intended there? Who knows

Anyways, wrong football. And I'm not even trying to compare what the law might be there compared to here, but it just doesn't pass the smell-test to me at all. The actual alleged wrongdoing and the circumstances together. And trash-talkng happens ALL the time in Soccer, despite it trying/failing to keep it's gentlemanly image.

Oh, you're a Ravens fan, Gary? I wasn't sure. I happen to a Pats fan, but I respect Ray Lewis.

Perhaps, perhaps. :P

We've already discussed that it already happens, such as what Anton did when he trash talked Terry about the thing with Wayne Bridge's ex-girlfriend or when Materazzi infuriated Zidane with comments about his mother and sister. The problem is when laws like this one come into play.

 

[xi0]

Oh, you're a Ravens fan, Gary? I wasn't sure. I happen to a Pats fan, but I respect Ray Lewis.

Perhaps, perhaps. :P

We've already discussed that it already happens, such as what Anton did when he trash talked Terry about the thing with Wayne Bridge's ex-girlfriend or when Materazzi infuriated Zidane with comments about his mother and sister. The problem is when laws like this one come into play.

PURPLE AND BLACK ATTACK ....yeah Pats, figured

Indeed. It seems the physicality of certain sports allows for this sort of thing to be dealt with internally by the league, except in grievous cases (and the Terry one obviously isn't). I remember what Todd Bertuzzi did to Steve Moore in the NHL and he had to retire because of it. Bertuzzi was suspended indefinitely but was reinstated and is still in the NHL and only received community service and probation.

So a small fine to Terry? What does it actually accomplish? I don't know.

 

[FrostyMouse]

PURPLE AND BLACK ATTACK ....yeah Pats, figured

Indeed. It seems the physicality of certain sports allows for this sort of thing to be dealt with internally by the league, except in grievous cases (and the Terry one obviously isn't). I remember what Todd Bertuzzi did to Steve Moore in the NHL and he had to retire because of it. Bertuzzi was suspended indefinitely but was reinstated and is still in the NHL and only received community service and probation.

So a small fine to Terry? What does it actually accomplish? I don't know.

I've been a Pats fan since before we got Tom. :P

Yeah, it's just iffy. At times, not enough is done, and then we get stupid things like this with Terry. If they truly believed Terry was guilty of something, the FA would've suspended him for a few games.

Even if Terry does get handed a fine tomorrow (I guess later today as it's technically Friday already), nothing happens and nothing changes. We'll all just walk away, Terry will continue to be Chelsea's captain and a member of the England team, and we'll all just think even less highly of Anton than we already do. At least be a good player if we're going to have to deal with this crap.

 

[predsfan]

In other news, Sepp Blatter continues to be a massive piece of crap (trying to keep it nice ). How this man is still in charge is beyond me.

 

[Imperium]

Aaaaand he is not guilty. Forward to the next manufactured story.

Tottenham bought Adebayor for reported 4 million.

*cough*

As someone beautifully put it today: Adebayor! Adebayooooor! We sold him for 25 million! And now he's worth four!