Discussion The 5 great calamities.

[vanihba2000]

I'd definitely would like to see how our crew, Leorio et al, deals with the "immortal sickness". And then, the plant weapon is intriguing too.

So what are your views on the different calamities?

 

[JijiHunter]

I'm voting Brion, but I'm more interested in the ruins it's protecting than the sentinel itself

I've always wanted a HxH arc with some sort of archeological mystery to solve

 

[shionoro]

I think i am most interesting in ai due to her possible connection with alluka.

It would also probably give us some information about what happened to zzyg zoldyek and how alluka came to our world.

 

[Demonspeed]

Brion and Hellbell, because they have not been released in the common world and the items you can find there are more interesting IMO. Zobae is also pretty intriguing because it grants immortality, when you think about it it's not a bad thing, and yet it has the potential to destroy the world. I wonder how the immortal feels, you'd expect the victim to suffer but the one in the lab seemed to be fine.

 

[MSofAofCOCA]

I'm definitely curious about all of them, so I'll rank them with an explanation:

Most Curious
1) Brion: Rather than the sentinel itself, I am more curious about the ruins. A fallen civilization? A crashed spaceship? A lonely god? hm...
But then, if we take the ruins out of the equation, Brion is nothing but another monster to fight. Hardly something to be called a "calamity", imo.

2) Papu/Pup: I don't really understand what it is supposed to be: a monster that feeds on humans while putting them in a pleasant state? Or something more nefarious, maybe like Ai, this thing grants a happiness that comes with a heavy price? At the end of the day, it seems to be another monster, and seemingly one with a lesser reach and Ai. Not something I would consider a "calamity".

3) Ai: The reason this is so far down is because we've already had a look into this through Alluka's story. I definitely want Ai's/Alluka's/Nanika's story to be developed, but it is a whole lot less mysterious than the previous two, but looks more interesting to me than the next two.

4) Zobae: It will be interesting to see the inevetable propogation and the attempt to cure this disease. I trust Togashi will put a novel spin on it, but I still doubt that it will be anything far from what the name suggests.

5) Hellbell: Reason being that I think the snake is simply a monster. I don't beliveve we've any info on it's abilities or influence on previous travelers, so imo it's just a frightning monster. Given how strong some ppl in HxH can be, I don't think it'll be amounting to much as a "calamity".
Least Curious

So... yeah. I'm more interested in Brion mostly because of the implications of developing the world/universe of HxH. However, out of the above, I'd say atm I'd only count Ai and Zobae as true "calamities", since their release into the general public would be absolutely devastating. For the rest, while I think that they will be interesting, atm they read as little more than local monsters of the DC.

------
That said, it kind of seems like Togashi created monsters around people's worst fears:

Actual Monsters: Hellbell
Aliens: Brion
Diseases: Zobae
Ghosts/the Supernatural/Possession: Ai
Drugs/Self-destructing behaviour: Papu
------

That-that said, I also realized that the calamities were met in different parts of the DC. I look forward to all the other dangers the characters are bound to come across, especially if they decide to/are forced to land on another part of the continent.

 

[warriorofvirtue]

I wonder why chimera ants aren't running the dark continent. seeing the way the reproduce, its plague like and highly adaptable. you'd think they'd have integrated with all the other crazy ish on the DC. but if they haven't. I wonder what is on the DC that is strong or resistant enough to not have the chimera spread.

 

[shionoro]

Well, imagine it like that: In our world, ants are insanely scary things. They are armies, and even individually, they are monsters.
The thing is, they are, luckily, also very small.

I guess the dark continent is the same. There is no queen able to eat one of the giant beasts there, so the ants can only grow so strong.
I am sure Meruem could have taken out a lot of those giant monsters, but after all, after ging's estimation, his danger level is nowhere near the great calamities.

Which makes those calamities insanely scary really. On the other hand: The ant king only got as strong as he was because the queen ate a human with nen . Before that, the danger of the ants was certainly manageable. It might be that the ants on the DC are not as strong as the ants we have seen.

 

[warriorofvirtue]

Well, imagine it like that: In our world, ants are insanely scary things. They are armies, and even individually, they are monsters.
The thing is, they are, luckily, also very small.

I guess the dark continent is the same. There is no queen able to eat one of the giant beasts there, so the ants can only grow so strong.
I am sure Meruem could have taken out a lot of those giant monsters, but after all, after ging's estimation, his danger level is nowhere near the great calamities.

Which makes those calamities insanely scary really. On the other hand: The ant king only got as strong as he was because the queen ate a human with nen . Before that, the danger of the ants was certainly manageable. It might be that the ants on the DC are not as strong as the ants we have seen.

i get that 100. but just like the queen ant did in the series couldn't she feast on lower dangers or maybe like a hellbell's corpse and still get the benefits. she was eating fish and small animals.i'm sure we'll see them again somehow. i'm just curious as to how all these deadly things coexist in the DC.

 

[Demonspeed]

I wonder why chimera ants aren't running the dark continent. seeing the way the reproduce, its plague like and highly adaptable. you'd think they'd have integrated with all the other crazy ish on the DC. but if they haven't. I wonder what is on the DC that is strong or resistant enough to not have the chimera spread.

Because there are far stronger monsters, civilizations and disasters there? The Queen was first seen running away horribly injured, and she said Humans were the best of food, giving birth to someone like Meruem, who was the pinnacle of their race. HellBell annihilated armies and its poison(I guess he has some?) is definitely far more lethal than that of the Rose or whatever they have in the known world, the calamities are no joke. Just seeing what Alluka can do should tell you enough, they can truly cause the end of Humanity.

Meruem was killed by poison but I think he was above B, maybe B+. Knuckle said they'd need a whole nation to be able to beat him IIRC.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 22, 2016, Original Post Date: Apr 22, 2016 ---

Threat levels translated by @magickirua back then for those who forgot or never read it.

Still didn't learn to read that.

 

[Phantron]

In the secret lab we're told that the Zobae carrier has been held in captivity for at least 50 years. A single carrier of Zobae has a threat level of B+ (and a destructive power rating of B2, so it's not just the disease that's dangerous), and is still contained for 50 years without the world of HXH ending. Compared to that, subduing any human being is a piece of cake. There's presumably special methods involved that the story doesn't get into but they have to exist unless we're supposed to believe a single small room is supposed to be able to hold a tier B+ threat. Beyond isn't worried about escaping because it's not like he's going to break out of his cell now and start swimming toward DC when he's nowhere close to his destination, and even if he was never able to break out of his cell, he'd assume that the Zodiac have to release him when they confront anything in DC just to survive.

Just because the world of HXH seems to have a very different set of laws (for example, being an assassin is a legal profession and killing people is legal for Hunters) doesn't mean the characters blatantly disregard authority, and the fact that Ilumi applied for a license instead of just walking into wherever and then throw some needles at anyone who questions him suggests that there's considerable risk to the latter method. Killua learned most of his assassin training from Ilumi and one of the common theme is to remain undetected and wait for the best opportunity, and yet the guy who taught him this is not confident to be able to evade border patrol. It's almost absurd how powerful certain government agencies would have to be in the world of HXH for people to act the way they are, though you can sort of see this based on the encounter with the Brion. Based on all the available information, the Brion almost certainly is a lifeform that can be understood unlike the rest of the calamities where you don't necessarily even know how to kill one and it's rated at B+. Volume 33 gives their stats as:

Numbers: C (10-99)
Destructive Power: A1
Overall threat: B+

Here it's not clear if A1 refers to the collective power of the Brion or an individual Brion, though since all the 5 calamities are said to be able to destroy humanity, I'd lean toward an individual Brion having the power of A1 (greater than the strongest human, but less than Meruem who almost certainly is solely responsible for the Ants' power rating of A). At B+ this means they're a threat that can be defeated with the combined might of the world which puts it as the weakest calamity (Zobae's threat level of B+ refers to the threat posed by a single carrier of Zobae). That means even scores of DC beings that are far stronger than the strongest human (human individuals max out at B power) can be beaten. If we get to the stuff that cannot be understood, like Ai/Pap/Hellbell, we can say that it's at least somewhat understood how their method of propagation happens (e.g. Hellbell is probably through music). If a government has at least attempted to deal with stuff that seems to be impossible to stop like Ai (we see the guys do monitor the deaths that matches the profile of an Ai at work), anything a human can do with cool Hatsus is absolutely nothing compared to that. Now since the governments of HXH deals with existential threats and apparently the Rose was once used as a terrorist weapon, so maybe they don't actually care too much if random individuals are killing people as long as they don't overdo it because there's nothing to suggest an individual's Hatsu can do worse than things a terrorist attack with a Rose let alone a calamity.

 

[Terahawk]

In the secret lab we're told that the Zobae carrier has been held in captivity for at least 50 years. A single carrier of Zobae has a threat level of B+ (and a destructive power rating of B2, so it's not just the disease that's dangerous), and is still contained for 50 years without the world of HXH ending. Compared to that, subduing any human being is a piece of cake. There's presumably special methods involved that the story doesn't get into but they have to exist unless we're supposed to believe a single small room is supposed to be able to hold a tier B+ threat. Beyond isn't worried about escaping because it's not like he's going to break out of his cell now and start swimming toward DC when he's nowhere close to his destination, and even if he was never able to break out of his cell, he'd assume that the Zodiac have to release him when they confront anything in DC just to survive.

Just because the world of HXH seems to have a very different set of laws (for example, being an assassin is a legal profession and killing people is legal for Hunters) doesn't mean the characters blatantly disregard authority, and the fact that Ilumi applied for a license instead of just walking into wherever and then throw some needles at anyone who questions him suggests that there's considerable risk to the latter method. Killua learned most of his assassin training from Ilumi and one of the common theme is to remain undetected and wait for the best opportunity, and yet the guy who taught him this is not confident to be able to evade border patrol. It's almost absurd how powerful certain government agencies would have to be in the world of HXH for people to act the way they are, though you can sort of see this based on the encounter with the Brion. Based on all the available information, the Brion almost certainly is a lifeform that can be understood unlike the rest of the calamities where you don't necessarily even know how to kill one and it's rated at B+. Volume 33 gives their stats as:

Numbers: C (10-99)
Destructive Power: A1
Overall threat: B+

Here it's not clear if A1 refers to the collective power of the Brion or an individual Brion, though since all the 5 calamities are said to be able to destroy humanity, I'd lean toward an individual Brion having the power of A1 (greater than the strongest human, but less than Meruem who almost certainly is solely responsible for the Ants' power rating of A). At B+ this means they're a threat that can be defeated with the combined might of the world which puts it as the weakest calamity (Zobae's threat level of B+ refers to the threat posed by a single carrier of Zobae). That means even scores of DC beings that are far stronger than the strongest human (human individuals max out at B power) can be beaten. If we get to the stuff that cannot be understood, like Ai/Pap/Hellbell, we can say that it's at least somewhat understood how their method of propagation happens (e.g. Hellbell is probably through music). If a government has at least attempted to deal with stuff that seems to be impossible to stop like Ai (we see the guys do monitor the deaths that matches the profile of an Ai at work), anything a human can do with cool Hatsus is absolutely nothing compared to that. Now since the governments of HXH deals with existential threats and apparently the Rose was once used as a terrorist weapon, so maybe they don't actually care too much if random individuals are killing people as long as they don't overdo it because there's nothing to suggest an individual's Hatsu can do worse than things a terrorist attack with a Rose let alone a calamity.

In chapter 36 of the manga, Illumi states that he's there to obtain a hunter's license for a job. He never elaborates on why he needs it, though. He reiterates that he needs it in 37, but the reason why is not revealed. I don't think we can really assume anything about why he needed the license, as he never mentions it again after 37.

 

[Demonspeed]

Rereading the first arc reminded me of what they said about Magical Beasts being able to speak. The Chimera Ant queen could not while the others, more evolved could. We know that the Ai possessing Alluka can speak too but maybe it's because it is in Alluka? Do you think that the calamities can speak?

 

[MSofAofCOCA]

Rereading the first arc reminded me of what they said about Magical Beasts being able to speak. The Chimera Ant queen could not while the others, more evolved could. We know that the Ai possessing Alluka can speak too but maybe it's because it is in Alluka? Do you think that the calamities can speak?

I don't think that calamities being able to speak is too far fetched. However, so far the DC has been presented exclusively as an absolutely primal, survival of the fittest, sort of world. I have a hunch that Brion might be able to communicate, but the other creatures strike me as simply being local monsters of ridiculous strength/ability when compared to humans. I agree with your theory that Nanika can communicate better than other Ai species because she is possessing Alluka. Hellbell and Pup/Papu seem like uncommunicable monsters.

It does not looks like the previous expeditions were able to find any sort of human-like, cultured, lifeforms. However, looking at the size of the continent, it is possible that there are tribes or societies somewhere. They would have to be super strong to individually fight the calamities, or have had some sort of progress in figuring out how to coexist.

......I had a dream a few months ago that if you go far enough into the DC, you'll come across the various Pokémon regions.

 

[shionoro]

It seems clear to me that the calamities are obstacles which have to be avoided at all costs.
If they would be easy to nuke like meruem, then the humans would not be so afraid of them.

The 5000 ants under paristons control are actually far more dangerous than meruem, because there is no way to get rid of them easily.
No matter how strong meruem is, with enough firepower, you can always abuse some nen ability to get close to him and then bomb him.
If all else fails, you nuke a whole country, his en was incredibly far and he can instantly teleport, but even that would not help him against a tomb of well timed nukes.
But having well trained ants run arround and possibly found their own colonies in rural areas, that is a devastating problem. You can't just nuke the whole earth and they outnumber the hunters greatly and you'd possibly not even find them before they reproduce.
And yet, ants are only rank B in danger level.

This cannot be due to pure strength alone. Meruem seems to be the epitome of power, but he fell to poison.
This might be an interesting analogy: The allpowerful meruem fell to an even bigger threat: Humans. And they are no bigger threat because they are stronger than him, but because they have means at their disposal which are simply hax.

I believe the same is true for calamities: You cannot just wipe out one very powerful creature (or at least in many cases) with a nuke or due to a good combination of nen abilities.
You cannot simply wipe out a disease like zobae.
And i think the rest have means like that at thweir disposal as well. Maybe you can destroy them, but they simply regrow and keep spreading (like a plant, which brion is).
Maybe gas entities like Ai do not even have a tangible body to destroy.

For some time, i imagined the calamities like the 'gods' of that realm, but i think otherwise now.
I think the calamities might not even big a big problem for the other wildlife or civillians on the DC, but specifically for the humans.

Lots of other creatures might be immune to the danger the calamities produce.

Humans, in this picture, are like fireants. They can wipe out about any other tribe of insects with their superior technology and nen (even the ants are not a big problem if they don't eat a human who has nen), but there are things they cannot fight back against, like parasites, some flesheating plants which attract them.
Or even some fungus which makes them lazy zombies and stops their reproduction.
The ant simply has nothing at their disposal against that, because all its strategies fail.
Once the infection spreads or the ants are on a wrong territory, they will die or their tribe falls apart.

And i imagine the DC to be a place like that for humans, where they have to proof they can take it head on with careful planning and observation.

 

[Demonspeed]

You say "You nuke the whole country" as if it was something easy .

They must be avoided if possible, but there is no way it will happen. That's why they need specialists and strong people.

Aren't the Ants with Pariston just like Palm? Humans who got Nen abilities and are much stronger now. The calamities themselves are not absolute, they said the Guardian sends one of them to the Hunter World on the map when someone tries to go to the DC. They are expecting to meet other races there and much more.

 

[shionoro]

You say "You nuke the whole country" as if it was something easy .

They must be avoided if possible, but there is no way it will happen. That's why they need specialists and strong people.

Aren't the Ants with Pariston just like Palm? Humans who got Nen abilities and are much stronger now. The calamities themselves are not absolute, they said the Guardian sends one of them to the Hunter World on the map when someone tries to go to the DC. They are expecting to meet other races there and much more.

It is not easy, but it can be done. It is equivalent to nuking a city, and the HxH world seems to have a lot of lunatics who use atomic bombs to do that. They'd have no qualms at all to do it to a global threat.

Yes, Pariston possesses the ants which are like palm : They transformed into an ant body and since only the stron gsurvived the evolution, they probably are able to learn nen. 5000 people on the level of ant palm are pretty scary.

Now that you mention it: Maybe the reason why at least some force on the DC wants to prevent humans from entering is because they would tip the balance of power.
I mean, the ants for example are not really that dangerous until they eat a human.
And humans who have access to the things they searched for could prove to be insanely dangerous.
The world humans live in could be like the thing meruem actually wanted to install: A reserve.
And when the population runs too wild and gets dangerous to whoever has power in the DC, they send something to throw it back.

We know that Brion is a weapon from an ancient city. So naturally there are intelligent being on the DC, and they might have a real problem with humans raiding their ancient cities and stealing their tech or knowledge.

 

[Zobaevil]

I'd definitely would like to see how our crew, Leorio et al, deals with the "immortal sickness". And then, the plant weapon is intriguing too.

So what are your views on the different calamities?

I think Only way to Cure Zobae is to get Brion Herbs to cure 10,000 disease
Also Brion,i think there may be a connection to kurapika
Alluka obviously Ai,but then they dont look the same,Nanika had eyes and mouth,but Ai doesnt.
Hellbell can make people have homicidal thoughts,the wiki says but i think hellbell would be the weakest
Papu is known for brutatlity for inserting their whatever into skulls.We might just see more gores than Chimera arc
more cruelty

 

[shionoro]

I think calamities dont work in terms of power.
There is no weakest calamity, much like there is no weakest natural disaster.

The bigger question is which calamities are conscious enough to go after humans on purpose and whether they can be evaded.

 

[YipYip]

The gas life formes, pub and zobae might be nen beasts. That attache them selfes to a host.

Ai in natural environment might just be harmless, but when with a host they turn into unpredictable nen beasts, which doesnt need to behave or look the same as nanika.
I think nanika is a nen beasts born from the personality of alluka.

 

[Demonspeed]

Nen beasts without creator/host? That would be a first. I am expecting to see Nen entities later in the story but I don't think Ai would fit. It is described as a life form and it's gaseous, so from what we know of Nen(assuming these rules apply), they can't be conjured. If they can't be conjured beasts like Abengane then they can't be seen by normal people.

Alluka and Nanika's situation fits the Parasitic Nen description almost perfectly however, but rather than calling Ai a Nen beast, I think they are simply lifeforms which can use Nen like humans, but they need an host. The wish granting ability is Ai's, but it needs Alluka's agreement to work, hence the "codependence of desire". Alluka can't have this much Aura.