Discussion The Demon King

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Will he look like the man in Escanor's wanted poster? I think I'd like that.
​

Alright I think it's about time we had a thread dedicated to discussing the Demon King, since he pretty much got introduced in the story.
Here's what we know so far. He's the one who gave the 10 commandments their decrees of course, but for some reason he's currently in purgatory, which suggests that he's dead. Did Mel succeed in killing him, along with Dolor and Gloxinia who are reported to have fought him alongside Mel?

And apparently he's the one who cursed Mel and is the reason why Mel can't die for good. He also has been feeding off Mel's emotions in order to regain his strength.

This suggests that he plans on taking hold of Mel's body or to be more precise his emotions. An emotioneless Mel will surely be as powerful as he were before he betrayed the demon clan 3000 years ago.

Another thing that is worth mentioning is the size of the demon king, which based on this panel could be huge. I theorized that just like Izraf who was the king of the vampires was rather huge himself, then maybe Suzuki is also going for something like that for the king of the demons.

Also it's worth noting that he seems to be in ethereal shape, which could mean that he lost his body.Just like we saw with Fraudrin previously, so this might reinforce the theory that he could end up possessing Mel.

When it comes to the demon king and the lore, I find it more and more likely that he's the equivalent of Satan or Lucifer to be more precise. Given the similarities in appearance between the demon and Goddess clan, and how their powers are polar opposites, it would fit that the demon king was a former Goddess clan member, who rebelled and later established the demon clan.

Both the demon and Goddess clan seem to be inspired by Christianity, the most notable hints are the 10 commandments for the demons, and the 4 Great Angels for the Goddess clan. There's also Nerobasta's attack, Ark, which is a direct reference to the Ark of the covenant, a rather important religious artifact which is said to contain the tablets of the 10 commandments. Coincidence? I don't think so. This further reinforces the idea that the demon and Goddess clan were once one and the same.After all demons are for the most part fallen angels in the Bible.

Now if I were to speculate about why the demon king would break away from the Goddess clan, maybe he was too proud like Lucifer and he thought he could rival God?The mere fact that he created the 10 commandments makes him the equivalent of God. And so he started a rebellion and was cast away. That or maybe he was disgusted with the ways of the Goddess clan, but I find that to be pretty unlikely atm.

Now the big question is will the demon king be resurrected, and if so would it be through Mel? For various reasons I can see that happening, if it's just for the sake of learning the truth about the Demon and Goddess clan.

What are your thoughts?

 

[Tavore]

If Mel,Doler and Glox killed the demon king how did the they become members of the 10 commandments?

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

If Mel,Doler and Glox killed the demon king how did the they become members of the 10 commandments?

They died and were resurrected and of course converted by the demon king.
King said that Gloxinia was reported to having died during the war. Even Mera can bring dead people back, and she's just a TC. You can bet that the demon king can do the same.
Might even be they met him in purgatory.
By that time they must have had enough reasons to join the demons, for Dolor he lost a fight and maybe even died, and for Gloxinia he lost someone really close to him, and it had something to do with the humans.

 

[oxtopus]

They died and were resurrected and of course converted by the demon king.
King said that Gloxinia was reported to having died during the war. Even Mera can bring dead people back, and she's just a TC. You can bet that the demon king can do the same.
Might even be they met him in purgatory.
By that time they must have had enough reasons to join the demons, for Dolor he lost a fight and maybe even died, and for Gloxinia he lost someone really close to him, and it had something to do with the humans.

Nope,that theory was debunked by meliodas. They weren't killed and they joined the ten commandments voluntarily(mind control maybe?). So the demon king wasn't killed by them.

Do you really think that the demon king,as hyped as he is,could be defeated by gloxinia,dolor and meliodas?(note that this isn't prime mel,but mel who converted by eli and has no demon powers but was as strong as zeldris.).

So there could be more to the demon king being in purgatory. He might be dead or he might still be in the seal but is capable of manifesting in purgatory and there's also that part about him losing his power. In which there could be two explanations for :-

1. He lost his magic due to the goddess seal just like the ten commandments.

2. Him and meliodas powers are tied. The weaker meliodas gets,the weaker the dk becomes. So when meliodas was stripped of his demon power/darkness by elizabeth I, the dk also lost his power. So by returning meliodas to his previous dark powerful self,the dk also regains his old power.

 

[Demonspeed]

They beat him but it doesn't mean they killed him. We don't know when they did it too, I doubt it was near the end of the war.

The DK had to be alive in order to give the Piety Commandment to Mel's replacement, Zeldris.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Nope,that theory was debunked by meliodas. They weren't killed and they joined the ten commandments voluntarily(mind control maybe?). So the demon king wasn't killed by them.

Do you really think that the demon king,as hyped as he is,could be defeated by gloxinia,dolor and meliodas?(note that this isn't prime mel,but mel who converted by eli and has no demon powers but was as strong as zeldris.).

So there could be more to the demon king being in purgatory. He might be dead or he might still be in the seal but is capable of manifesting in purgatory and there's also that part about him losing his power. In which there could be two explanations for :-

1. He lost his magic due to the goddess seal just like the ten commandments.

2. Him and meliodas powers are tied. The weaker meliodas gets,the weaker the dk becomes. So when meliodas was stripped of his demon power/darkness by elizabeth I, the dk also lost his power. So by returning meliodas to his previous dark powerful self,the dk also regains his old power.

Where was it debunked? And haven't you read what I said about them having already had enough reasons to join the demons? How does that contradict with them being converted by the demon king? It doesn't, I'm simply saying he made them into demons but they voluntarily wanted to join the demons because of their hatred of humans.
You assume that, I doubt Mel suddenly became weak and in fact him becoming this weak prolly has to do with the demon king feeding on his emotions, so 3000 years ago he should have been about as strong as his commandment self or slightly less, definitely not as weak as now he couldn't have become so weak overnight unless someone stole his power like we saw. And why do you think the demon king cursed him in the first place in such a way too, if not because he's the one who killed him and he did that to ensure he would feed on Mel's emotions each time he died?

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 12, 2016, Original Post Date: Aug 12, 2016 ---

They beat him but it doesn't mean they killed him. We don't know when they did it too, I doubt it was near the end of the war.

The DK had to be alive in order to give the Piety Commandment to Mel's replacement, Zeldris.

The demon king must have died during the war because it's hard to see how the demons would lose if he was alive during the whole war.

 

[Demonspeed]

Yes he died, but I think Meliodas and his friends beat him when they fought, they said he also killed two Commandments, right? Maybe it was a 3 VS 3 even. They beat him but he didn't die, he died later from something else. This or he managed to give the Piety Commandment to Zeldris while he was agonizing.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Yes he died, but I think Meliodas and his friends beat him when they fought, they said he also killed two Commandments, right? Maybe it was a 3 VS 3 even. They beat him but he didn't die, he died later from something else. This or he managed to give the Piety Commandment to Zeldris while he was agonizing.

What makes you so sure he didn't die? Where was it stated?
We have someone who was said to be the next candidate to be the demon king and prolly the most powerful demon fighter fighting the demon king alongside two other people, and somehow that means they couldn't win? They fought the demon king do you honestly believe he would just let them go if they lost or just couldn't win?
And Dolor and Glox could have only become friends with Mel after he betrayed the demons,which means they got a good idea of how strong he was by fighting by his side, which means he wasn't terribly weakened by then.
And if the Goddess clan could kill the demon king, then why seal the demons in the first place? And why not seal him with the rest if he wasn't already dead?

 

[Demonspeed]

What makes you so sure he didn't die? Where was it stated?
We have someone who was said to be the next candidate to be the demon king and prolly the most powerful demon fighter fighting the demon king alongside two other people, and somehow that means they couldn't win? They fought the demon king do you honestly believe he would just let them go if they lost or just couldn't win?
And Dolor and Glox could have only become friends with Mel after he betrayed the demons,which means they got a good idea of how strong he was by fighting by his side, which means he wasn't terribly weakened by then.
And if the Goddess clan could kill the demon king, then why seal the demons in the first place? And why not seal him with the rest if he wasn't already dead?

I am not saying I am sure he didn't die, it's just a speculation of mine. I just don't see how Zeldris could have received his Commandment if the DK died in this battle, same for Dolor and Glox, since the DK is the only one who can give them.

The Goddess clan alone might be unable to beat him, but a war is not just a matter of PL, the fact that they managed to seal the 10C is a good example.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

I am not saying I am sure he didn't die, it's just a speculation of mine. I just don't see how Zeldris could have received his Commandment if the DK died in this battle, same for Dolor and Glox, since the DK is the only one who can give them.

The Goddess clan alone might be unable to beat him, but a war is not just a matter of PL, the fact that they managed to seal the 10C is a good example.

Then why you make it sound like it's some absolute truth and a verified fact in the manga? You don't even bring a solid argument to prove your point about how Mel+ DoloGlox wouldn't be able to beat him. Your only argument is that he needs to give Zel his decree. I'll break it for you, he did that immediately or shortly after Mel's betrayal, besides it's a minor detail, a technicality. It certainly isn't the reason Mel wouldn't be able to kill the DK.
So Mel betrayed the demons first, he killed 2TCs while doing so. Zel became Mel's replacement shortly after AND only after that did Mel face his father.Does that make sense to you?

I don't understand why people are so against the idea of Mel being able to defeat the demon king back then. That's very reminiscent of how people were against the idea of Escanor winning against Estarossa and look how that turned out. The problem here is hyping the DK too much just like with Estarossa.
Heck we even have statements that suggests that the gap couldn't be too big between Mel and his father. A prime or close to prime Mel could be able to win if he got help which is exactly what happened .
And why even bring that detail if it's not relevant in some way? We have them fighting the demon king and we later see the demon king in purgatory which is where DEAD people go. I'm sorry but I can't see why he would be there and why he'd need to feed on Mel's emotions if he wasn't defeated and dead on top of that. It doesn't take much to make a link between both events.
Yeah it's a perfect example of how they couldn't subdue them through normal means and I don't see the demon king being any different. The Goddess strength simply wasn't enough, and if they were afraid of Mel then that speaks volumes about how strong he was 3000 years ago so he's the prime candidate to take on the demon king.

 

[Demonspeed]

Did I say he was unable to beat him? No. I said he didn't die, just like Hendrickson or Estarossa, he might have been beaten but they failed to kill him. Then, the war became more intense and he managed to give three Commandments to Zeldris, Glox and Dolor before dying again.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Did I say he was unable to beat him? No. I said he didn't die, just like Hendrickson or Estarossa, he might have been beaten but they failed to kill him. Then, the war became more intense and he managed to give three Commandments to Zeldris, Glox and Dolor before dying again.

Oh and who killed him then? You just said the Goddess clan would be unable to defeat him.
The holy war didn't happen in one day most likely so there's plenty of time to see the Dk give Zel his decree. And Estarossa said that Dologlox are a recent addition to the TCS but not Zel which means he would have taken Mel's place long before they were sealed, and even before Dologlox joined.
And needless to say that the DK can still use some of his powers even if dead, it is suggested that he can or else how can he hope to subdue Mel?Last time we saw them they were about to fight.

 

[Demonspeed]

Oh and who killed him then? You just said the Goddess clan would be unable to defeat him.

I didn't say that, I said the Goddess clan might be unable to defeat him, we don't know everything about them, and only considering what we know, if the Archangels are the equivalent of the TCs then there must be a powerful leader as well, the Goddess Queen or something, who might be on par with him. I am not necessarily saying that they are the ones who killed him , as I said those are speculations. It's possible that Meliodas fought him again and killed him for good, alone this time(and might have been cursed at this moment). He could have even died of old age.

The holy war didn't happen in one day most likely so there's plenty of time to see the Dk give Zel his decree. And Estarossa said that Dologlox are a recent addition to the TCS but not Zel which means he would have taken Mel's place long before they were sealed, and even before Dologlox joined.
And needless to say that the DK can still use some of his powers even if dead, it is suggested that he can or else how can he hope to subdue Mel?Last time we saw them they were about to fight.

Of course Zel took Mel's place before they got sealed, the war was long and he had his Commandment when Fraudrin freed them, same for Dolor and Gloxinia.

Zeldris could have worked for the Demons without being a Commandment, after all he is a Demon. Zeldris is Piety, and Meliodas was most likely Piety so, assuming that's correct, there is no way he could have been a Commandment when Meliodas was the leader. The two others who died have been replaced Glox and Dolor. Estarossa said Glox and Dolor were recent additions but it's not like he was listing them.

What we know:

1. Meliodas left the band
2. Zeldris became the leader
3. Meliodas fought the DK with Dolor and Gloxinia at least once.
4. Meliodas fought Zeldris at least once, the Commandments got sealed by the Goddess clan.

Chronologically, 2 can't have happened before 1 but we don't know when and how exactly Zeldris became the leader. Nut nothing says that Meliodas/Dolor/Gloxinia battle against the DK was their only battle or that Mel fought him only once.

And needless to say that the DK can still use some of his powers even if dead, it is suggested that he can or else how can he hope to subdue Mel?Last time we saw them they were about to fight.

The DK converting the three after his death is a possibility but I find it unlikely. To begin with, he and Meliodas are fighting in the Purgatory right now, being able to use his powers there is perfectly natural, but I doubt he is able to bestow his decrees to living people when he is dead.

 

[oxtopus]

Where was it debunked? And haven't you read what I said about them having already had enough reasons to join the demons? How does that contradict with them being converted by the demon king? It doesn't, I'm simply saying he made them into demons but they voluntarily wanted to join the demons because of their hatred of humans.
You assume that, I doubt Mel suddenly became weak and in fact him becoming this weak prolly has to do with the demon king feeding on his emotions, so 3000 years ago he should have been about as strong as his commandment self or slightly less, definitely not as weak as now he couldn't have become so weak overnight unless someone stole his power like we saw. And why do you think the demon king cursed him in the first place in such a way too, if not because he's the one who killed him and he did that to ensure he would feed on Mel's emotions each time he died

Look,there was a theory floating around before ,that the reason glox and dolor were part of the commandments is that,they were killed and resurrected by the demon king into demons. All i'm saying is that mel revelation made it known that they weren't killed and resurrected by the demons but instead joined the commandments due to their personal plights.
No,i'm assuming anything. It was clearly stated in the manga that mel lost his demon powers/darkness and became weak because he was converted by elizabeth and to the contrary the demon king feeding on mel emotions didn't make him weak as you think but instead was what allowed mel to return to his demon form. The more the dk feeds on mel emotions the more meliodas returns to his prime evil self. I thought this was made very clear?

Meliodas could not have been as strong as his prime demon self,after he was converted. Most of his power comes from darkness. Although,i do agree that his human form would't have been as weak as it now,and he would have had a power level higher than the 32,500 he has now. It would probably have been around the same level as zeldris. Afterall,he said meliodas said he wasn't in top shape.
I could have agreed the demon king gave meliodas the immortality curse to feed on mel's emotions and because mel killed him. But that wouldn't make much sense,because if the dk was just killed normally,why would he need to feed on mel emotions,when he didn't lose his power? why wasn't he resurrected by the demons?
So the reason for the demon king being in purgatory,isn't just the simple,mel killed him answer.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Look,there was a theory floating around before ,that the reason glox and dolor were part of the commandments is that,they were killed and resurrected by the demon king into demons. All i'm saying is that mel revelation made it known that they weren't killed and resurrected by the demons but instead joined the commandments due to their personal plights.
No,i'm assuming anything. It was clearly stated in the manga that mel lost his demon powers/darkness and became weak because he was converted by elizabeth and to the contrary the demon king feeding on mel emotions didn't make him weak as you think but instead was what allowed mel to return to his demon form. The more the dk feeds on mel emotions the more meliodas returns to his prime evil self. I thought this was made very clear?

Meliodas could not have been as strong as his prime demon self,after he was converted. Most of his power comes from darkness. Although,i do agree that his human form would't have been as weak as it now,and he would have had a power level higher than the 32,500 he has now. It would probably have been around the same level as zeldris. Afterall,he said meliodas said he wasn't in top shape.
I could have agreed the demon king gave meliodas the immortality curse to feed on mel's emotions and because mel killed him. But that wouldn't make much sense,because if the dk was just killed normally,why would he need to feed on mel emotions,when he didn't lose his power? why wasn't he resurrected by the demons?
So the reason for the demon king being in purgatory,isn't just the simple,mel killed him answer.

No it doesn't contradict that.Them dying and going to purgatory, and meeting the demon king there who could have persuaded them that they should join the demon clan doesn't contradict Mel's statement. They would still would have joined the demon clan of their own free will, they didn't get mindcontrolled or some shit like that, it's their own personal reasons that had them join the demons, and the demon king making them into demons doesn't contradict that, at all.Persuasion =/= mind control.
We don't know that, the bit about Mel's betrayal wasn't explained, where was it stated that Eli converted him? Show me please, we just know he betrayed the demons for some unknown reason that has yet to be explained, and to top it off we don't know if she's even able to do something like that as in take away his power. So yeah you're assuming a lot of things.
I read it as the demon king and Mel becoming one, simple as that.

To restore his body, without that he can't actually be back in the story can he? So his power along with his body are damaged, so he needs to feed on Mel's emotions.And maybe even hijack his body, if Fraudrin can do it, why not the demon king?
And I said he could still use SOME of his power, I didn't say he lost all his power to boot with.
And it's highly possible the demon king cannot leave purgatory by normal means, Mel is an exception because of his curse, so the demon king would have cursed him when he got defeated and killed.What this means is that the demon king like everyone else is stuck at purgatory, Mel is the exception to the rule.

Besides it would be too easy if Mera could just resurrect the demon king,and on top of that it was specifically said that her magic works on people who hold a grudge and resurrects them, what if the demon king simply doesn't hold a grudge?As the one behind the commandments' decrees, such as Estarossa's "Love" it's not impossible to think that he would have some pretty high moral values, and wouldn't be the type to hold a grudge.Maybe just like Estarossa he still loves Mel.

Look I'm just trying to get to the heart of it, because if the demon king isn't dead then he should have been sealed with the rest, but that does not seem to be the case. Besides there's this:

This makes it sound like the demon king was in purgatory for a while, before Mel at least. Why would he welcome him there, if not for that? Also what is he doing there, if he wasn't actually killed? Or are you saying that he could somehow break free of the seal, when the demons needed Fraudrin's shitty plan to be free after 3000 years?And if he's not dead, and is still sealed, why does he need to feed on Mel's emotions, why can't he just be free of the seal?Don't forget that Mel's curse has been going on for 3000 years, it has to be since Mel was able to live and not die for so long, so the curse would have been put in place 3000 years ago. If the demon king could leave the seal at any point, then it doesn't make much sense.


Don't you think it makes a lot more sense for him to have been dead all that time, and not actually sealed? And that is why he feeds on Mel's emotions, and why he's not with the rest.

We also have Dolor's statement that Mel was the right candidate to be the next demon king.In retrospect, this means that the demon king's throne was vacant, which consolidates the idea that he's dead.

He's even using the present. So that means it's still of actuality right now.

What is your explanation then to these events?

 

[nuur mohamed]

I think Escanor's picture being here is starting to heat things up in here phew....
Let's all calm down and not fight. We will find out soon or later about the demon king.

Yeah I really don't have a lot to say about the demon king because we don't have to much on him. But I'm willing to bet that meliodas won't return and be the meliodas we know, I can already see his father taking away his emotions and him return to his former self so it turn into some plot twist for the series.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

I think Escanor's picture being here is starting to heat things up in here phew....
Let's all calm down and not fight. We will find out soon or later about the demon king.

Yeah I really don't have a lot to say about the demon king because we don't have to much on him. But I'm willing to bet that meliodas won't return and be the meliodas we know, I can already see his father taking away his emotions and him return to his former self so it turn into some plot twist for the series.

If you think that this is a fight, then you clearly haven't seen one yet.
What irkes me the most is people who come here and bash theories just because they don't like them, without actually giving some counter arguments or another possible explanation.
That doesn't contribute to the discussion, at all.

Well I'm not sure how viable that option is for the sake of the plot on the long run, and it could lead to much tears from Elizabeth.It won't be pretty.
And right now, the last thing the good guys need is an emotionless Mel who came back to the demons' side...

That's why I'm more inclined into believing that the demon king will fail and find another way to come back, and that it won't involve having Mel become emotionless. Also obviously we can't expect Mel's power up to be that, as it would make him switch sides, unless Suzuki comes up with some asspull like Mel being emotionless but still being a good guy.

 

[nuur mohamed]

If you think that this is a fight, then you clearly haven't seen one yet.
What irkes me the most is people who come here and bash theories just because they don't like them, without actually giving some counter arguments or another possible explanation.
That doesn't contribute to the discussion, at all.

Well I'm not sure how viable that option is for the sake of the plot on the long run, and it could lead to much tears from Elizabeth.It won't be pretty.
And right now, the last thing the good guys need is an emotionless Mel who came back to the demons' side...

That's why I'm more inclined into believing that the demon king will fail and find another way to come back, and that it won't involve having Mel become emotionless. Also obviously we can't expect Mel's power up to be that, as it would make him switch sides, unless Suzuki comes up with some asspull like Mel being emotionless but still being a good guy.

Yeah he will either fail probably or his plan is a success we just have to wait and see.

I didn't think it was a real fight but, we should all support each other idea and if you don't like someone's idea then you have the right to disagree but don't bash anyone and this is not towards you or anyone. But anyone who bashes people on the threads of MH.

 

[LivewireToriko]

I think Escanor's picture being here is starting to heat things up in here phew....
Let's all calm down and not fight. We will find out soon or later about the demon king.

Yeah I really don't have a lot to say about the demon king because we don't have to much on him. But I'm willing to bet that meliodas won't return and be the meliodas we know, I can already see his father taking away his emotions and him return to his former self so it turn into some plot twist for the series.

Oh god no.

That's the last thing I need so see.

Meliodas turning evil and Elizabeth crying "Lord Meliodas come back to us" for 50 chapters until the power of love gets through to him and he changes back.

 

[nuur mohamed]

Oh god no.

That's the last thing I need so see.

Meliodas turning evil and Elizabeth crying "Lord Meliodas come back to us" for 50 chapters until the power of love gets through to him and he changes back.

Haha I would hate that to but this isn't fairy tail lol (NOT HATING! ) but yeah if he does turn evil we are gonna hear a lot of "Lord Meliodas come back I love you" tbh I kinda want him to turn into his former self so that we can see how he was like back then because from what estarossa and the demon king said he was one evil dude that everyone feared.