Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2017] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[shoyoboyo]

Villain and conflict aren't the same thing, not even close.

They do go hand in hand. For the most part, the villain is the one that creates the main conflict of the story arcs, especially since this is a battle shounen. You know, those stories that focus on introducing villains for the heroes of the story to defeat? A lot of the arcs are build ups that lead towards the big fight with the villains of that arc. The big fight is what makes the build up worthwhile. So when the fights are boring or with little tension, it makes the readers think "All of that build up just for this?"

What about all stories that don't have a villain? The most sold story ever, huge classic and the father of Modern Romances, Don Quixote, doesn't have a villain! So what about that?

Has nothing to do with this argument.

And aren't you people that like to place as a flaw of a series the systematic increase of strength of the villains. Well One Piece has at least 2 arcs where the villains it shows are weaker than before, Wapol and Hody. Interestingly those are 2 of the most liked arcs of the Series. Personally, I love Drum Island and Fishman Island.

Are you speaking for yourself here? Because from what I've seen, not a lot of people are fans of Fishman Island. If you looked around, you would find that arcs with big hype battles and impactful moments are the ones that people like the most. Ennies Lobby, Marineford, Alabasta, etc.

 

[Tamil]

Just saying "is not typical" doesn't make it atypical. It basically something totally different. Is like people just love to praise the series and so invented a generic manner of praising it. "Not Typical" something.

Nope, OP Fishman Island, that started right after they left Sabaondy Archipelago and submerged, and a ton more "voyage" like things to offer than HxH "atypical" "voyage". That is so "atypical" that doesn't have basically nothing of a voyage to offer.

Also a timeskip exist to show the progress of the characters and the world after that "void" span of time. HxH had no progress to show, not even the characters progress. Well, I could give you Leorio, that in the beginning of the arc, and not in the timeskip, turned an apprentice of one of the Zodiacs.
So are you going to say that is also an "atypical" timeskip? Yep, Togashi writes so well that he does everything "atypical" and so it is so good.

If you focused in what he actually is doing, and not what he isn't(the atypical stuff you say he does, though he doesn't), you would get a better grasp of the story and its quality.
But it really doesn't matter to me how you see the story, and certainly you're happy fangasming with it. So keep doing it. But when trying to say that something, that the series doesn't even do, is better than something that other series indeed do. Remember that you can be called about it.

All I said that the timeskip isn't your typical timeskip and ofc knowing you, it triggered you...

If you say so. It's not about which had more "voyage", hence why I compared an expedition arc to the first arc of the timeskip. The Dark Continent thus far is better than Fishman Island. It has a lot more subplots and story has more depth than what the Fishman Island had to offer. I'm merely comparing the starting arcs of both "timeskips".

I don't want this to turn out to some wall of texts discussion like we did about Toei not so long ago. I find the HxH "timeskip"/voyage arc (if you don't think it's a voyage then w.e) to be far better than what One Piece offered at the start. I said my piece on the matter and not really in the mood to write walls of texts to argue with you.

Yep, I'm happy "fangasming" with it. I already have a grasp of the story/quality and it does exceed One Piece's.

 

[Nakura]

Btw, A shot out to Twice from My Hero Academia. Seeing a character who supports a transcharacter(especially a villain) in a manga is really a nice surprise. Need more of those.

Yeah, that was nice to see. I like how it's not treated as if it's a big deal either, similar to when we found out about the other trans character. He just sorta implied it in an Omake and that was it.

 

[Leoat12]

We Can't Study color page

Spoiler

Takemoto should use more opened swimsuits to make her tan even through the body. XD
Besides that, the color page is great. We are looking forward to the beach chapter! XD

 

[Doughboy]

I've always peeped dude was a trans, his friend that popped in that flashback before Overhaul killed him was a trans too. In FA's translation he called Overhaul a "fine yakuza" lol. It doesn't add anything to the actual story but it's cool that Hori wanted to include something that isn't the norm in shonen.

WNL slowly is getting more fanservice in the chapters and covers... hopefully a boost is on the come up.

 

[Leoat12]

WNL slowly is getting more fanservice in the chapters and covers... hopefully a boost is on the come up.

The chapters being more ecchi I disagree, but the CPs are normally done with the intention to please the reader in color, so why not. Nisekoi had all kinds of CPs and it didn't become ecchi in any moment. I hope WNL doesn't go the ecchi way, we cannot stand two ecchi mangas in the same magazine.

 

[Doughboy]

The chapters being more ecchi I disagree, but the CPs are normally done with the intention to please the reader in color, so why not. Nisekoi had all kinds of CPs and it didn't become ecchi in any moment. I hope WNL doesn't go the ecchi way, we cannot stand two ecchi mangas in the same magazine.

I agree with this, it's been balanced well and of course, you know I like Yuragi alot but they're two different series though even if they're in the same genre. The amount has increased but in a slow moderation and doesn't feel too forced. This series really does give off Nisekoi vibes the more I read it. Ogata though

 

[Tamil]

Check it out guys
https://otakumode.com/news/597ff8f4d490d99e22b3ad91/Weekly-Shonen-Jump-Exhibition-VOL-1-Photo-Report

The exhibition looks amazing, there's a lot of pics included

 

[G_I_A]

Black Clover replacing the sales of a supposedly decrease sales on One Piece will be the funniest thing I will read today, probably, so congrats. XD
1) Black Clover will never sell enough to replace 1/10 of One Piece sales
2) One Piece sales will not decrease anytime soon, Black Clover will end before it happens.

Bonus: Whole Cake arc has been great, I don't know what you are talking about.

Are you referring to One Piece total sales or volume to volume sales?

 

[Ecchi Boy]

About Shaman King, an Argentine publisher named Ivrea said one of the reasons that Shaman King is in a hiatus in Argentina is why Shueisha lost the copyrights of the work, which are now with the author.
Can anyone tell me if this is true?

Apparently its true which explains why he said that if shaman king flowers came back, it will be called something different he probably will start it in kodansha

 

[Bigivelfhq]

All I said that the timeskip isn't your typical timeskip and ofc knowing you, it triggered you...

If you say so. It's not about which had more "voyage", hence why I compared an expedition arc to the first arc of the timeskip. The Dark Continent thus far is better than Fishman Island. It has a lot more subplots and story has more depth than what the Fishman Island had to offer. I'm merely comparing the starting arcs of both "timeskips".

I don't want this to turn out to some wall of texts discussion like we did about Toei not so long ago. I find the HxH "timeskip"/voyage arc (if you don't think it's a voyage then w.e) to be far better than what One Piece offered at the start. I said my piece on the matter and not really in the mood to write walls of texts to argue with you.

Yep, I'm happy "fangasming" with it. I already have a grasp of the story/quality and it does exceed One Piece's.

I didn't got triggered.
Is just a fact that it isn't a timeskip!
And it has nothing of atypical, from a arc to another almost always a certain amount of time passes, normally it is not specified, but it doesn't make a timeskip every time you change from an arc.

One Piece is full of them, every island traveling is a timeskip by that definition.
Do you even consider Long Ring Long Land to Water 7 a timeskip? Because the time jumped was in fact specified. Are you going to say that is also an atypical Timeskip? :O One Piece also does atypical stuff :O

Dragon Ball by your definition is also full of Timeskips, Every time before a tournament.
Naruto, every time before a mission.
And this goes and goes on.

Time passing without much notice, isn't a time skip.

The arc we are right now in HxH is not a voyage arc. It has nothing of a voyage, just the fact that they are in a huge boat waiting to reach the middle point, doesn't make a voyage. If nothing of the exterior is any important to what is happening it can't be a voyage arc. Literally you could remove the boat part without any difficulty and this arc wouldn't have any difference. Instead of boat taking time until the next island, make it a special facility for the decision of the King where they have to be for a x amount of time. Nothing would change at all.

 

[WyldViolet]

I think it would be clever of Togashi to make what was initially seen as some kind of transitional arc to be even longer than the Ant arc.
Have any entire manga worth of chapters with Kurapika as the main character.

I know this isnt the HxH thread but I'm really hyped to see how Chrollo is going play into all this.

 

[shoyoboyo]

The arc we are right now in HxH is not a voyage arc. It has nothing of a voyage, just the fact that they are in a huge boat waiting to reach the middle point, doesn't make a voyage. If nothing of the exterior is any important to what is happening it can't be a voyage arc. Literally you could remove the boat part without any difficulty and this arc wouldn't have any difference. Instead of boat taking time until the next island, make it a special facility for the decision of the King where they have to be for a x amount of time. Nothing would change at all.

What are you even talking about? It's a voyage arc. You can be stubborn and argue about it all you want, but that doesn't change that it is in fact a voyage arc. They're on a boat and they're trying to reach a destination. That is what a voyage is. What else would ya freakin call it?

 

[Nakura]

Have any entire manga worth of chapters with Kurapika as the main character

I missed Kurapika so much, so I welcome this Kurapika-focused arc. Not sure how I'd feel about this voyage lasting longer than the Chimera Ant arc, but I do definitely enjoy what's been going on.

 

[XtrnlArdent]

I think that I have regained the interest for Neverland, after the Escape Arc it became a little bit boring but now is back on track.

 

[Leoat12]

TPN lost part of its appeal when it stopped being a battle of wits to be a more normal shounen. Surprisingly enough though, it has been doing well on TOCs. It still has to convince myself that it can be as good as it was in its first chapters.

 

[Bigivelfhq]

What are you even talking about? It's a voyage arc. You can be stubborn and argue about it all you want, but that doesn't change that it is in fact a voyage arc. They're on a boat and they're trying to reach a destination. That is what a voyage is. What else would ya freakin call it?

The thing is that they aren't trying to reach a destination, they are reaching it, without any relevance to it. What is relevant is what is happening inside the boat, not the voyage. In fact the voyage only relevance is that it is a time limit. Any kind of time limit would do. Or should it call it a "Time Limit Arc" too?

Just because there is mention of something happening in an arc, doesn't mean that arc is "that thing arc".
Right now this is a "Battle Royal Game arc" that happens to be in a boat going to a destination. The Boat, the Destination and the Travel have 0 relevance, they are just side dishes.

Question, in One Piece was the Sea Train "arc" a Voyage "arc"? Because there was a Boat/Train and it was reaching a destination!
And Namek arc was it a voyage arc? There was a spaceship(in fact 2) and it was reaching a destination! Goku Voyage part of that arc was amazing, seeing him training in the Gravitational Chamber was such a great Voyage, such an atypical voyage

This is the problem of generalizing and conflating everything. Suddenly everything is anything.

 

[Nakura]

Why are we arguing about the term 'voyage'?

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 18, 2017, Original Post Date: Aug 18, 2017 ---

I think that I have regained the interest for Neverland, after the Escape Arc it became a little bit boring but now is back on track.

I'm actually in the same boat, just as of the latest chapter. I finally feel like I'm becoming interested in the world of TPN, due to Shirai's world building as of late, and Demizu's amazing artwork which compliments that world.

 

[G_I_A]

Agreed, I'm looking forward the amazing landscapes Pozuka will draw.

 

[shoyoboyo]

The thing is that they aren't trying to reach a destination, they are reaching it, without any relevance to it. What is relevant is what is happening inside the boat, not the voyage. In fact the voyage only relevance is that it is a time limit. Any kind of time limit would do. Or should it call it a "Time Limit Arc" too?

Just because there is mention of something happening in an arc, doesn't mean that arc is "that thing arc".
Right now this is a "Battle Royal Game arc" that happens to be in a boat going to a destination. The Boat, the Destination and the Travel have 0 relevance, they are just side dishes.

Question, in One Piece was the Sea Train "arc" a Voyage "arc"? Because there was a Boat/Train and it was reaching a destination!
And Namek arc was it a voyage arc? There was a spaceship(in fact 2) and it was reaching a destination! Goku Voyage part of that arc was amazing, seeing him training in the Gravitational Chamber was such a great Voyage, such an atypical voyage

This is the problem of generalizing and conflating everything. Suddenly everything is anything.

I think the fact that you're trying to argue what to call an arc says it all lol