Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2018] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[TheEnhancedExe]

Just the worst

Spoiler: The absolute fucking worst

Spoiler

Good artists are consistent, Togashi isn't. He might have been more consistent in the past. But that would essentially mean, he was a good artist and isn't anymore. (Btw not good doesn't equal him being a terrible artist) This may be because of his bad health, but his health doesn't change the fact that his art isn't consistent anymore.

The panels both of you posted above certainly are drawn well, but they're exceptions. The vast majority of the panels don't even look anywhere near as good as the ones you posted.

I wouldn't call him a terrible artist because he certainly can draw well if he has enough time. Most likely because of his bad health, he now needs more time to draw a chapter than he used to. Therefore he might need to rush the art, which makes the art look bad. At least that would explain his inconsistency.

 

[Belkac3m]

Spoiler

Good artists are consistent, Togashi isn't. He might have been more consistent in the past. But that would essentially mean, he was a good artist and isn't anymore. (Btw not good doesn't equal him being a terrible artist) This may be because of his bad health, but his health doesn't change the fact that his art isn't consistent anymore.

The panels both of you posted above certainly are drawn well, but they're exceptions. The vast majority of the panels don't even look anywhere near as good as the ones you posted.

I wouldn't call him a terrible artist because he certainly can draw well if he has enough time. Most likely because of his bad health, he now needs more time to draw a chapter than he used to. Therefore he might need to rush the art, which makes the art look bad. At least that would explain his inconsistency.

it's ridiculous
the non-consistency you're talking about has nothing to do with his abilities (it's not like you're talking about a singer who has lost his voice) but with the time. Give him enough time and he'll show you his art.

There is no artist (except Miura and Inoue) who can draw 18 pages with the same consistency, with the same quality as the 2 panels you speak about.
But be honest, most of the chapters are well drawn, better than what we see nowadays, without good proportions, without emotions, with a shitty paneling that we can't even understand what is happening, just the same face everywhere. That's why the manga world is in danger.

 

[SharkBait]

World Trigger, Haikyuu!!, BLack Clover, Owari no Serafu, BLue Exorcist are consistently filled to the brim chapter by chapter with good art.

 

[ShenGao]

it's ridiculous
the non-consistency you're talking about has nothing to do with his abilities (it's not like you're talking about a singer who has lost his voice) but with the time. Give him enough time and he'll show you his art.

There is no artist (except Miura and Inoue) who can draw 18 pages with the same consistency, with the same quality as the 2 panels you speak about.
But be honest, most of the chapters are well drawn, better than what we see nowadays, without good proportions, without emotions, with a shitty paneling that we can't even understand what is happening, just the same face everywhere. That's why the manga world is in danger.

With enough time any artist could create something jaw dropping. He chose to work for a weekly magazine so he should be able to maintain the same consistent art quality week after week like all the other mangaka working in the same magazine. If he wants more time he should change the magazine to a monthly one.

 

[TheEnhancedExe]

it's ridiculous
the non-consistency you're talking about has nothing to do with his abilities (it's not like you're talking about a singer who has lost his voice) but with the time. Give him enough time and he'll show you his art.

You basically stated what I wrote in my post. You probably didn't read my entire post then?

There is no artist (except Miura and Inoue) who can draw 18 pages with the same consistency, with the same quality as the 2 panels you speak about.
But be honest, most of the chapters are well drawn, better than what we see nowadays, without good proportions, without emotions, with a shitty paneling that we can't even understand what is happening, just the same face everywhere. That's why the manga world is in danger.

I never said he needs to draw all pages with the same consistency as his well drawn panels. That's you misinterpreting what I said. I just said he's inconsistent.

I can tell you five manga artists that are currently drawing manga in WSJ that are definitely way more consistent than Togashi is:
Oda, Horikoshi, Tabata, Saeki, Boichi

These mangaka all draw really well AND have good panelling on top of that. Of course panelling is really important as well, but it's not everything. Bad art with good panelling is just as bad as good art with bad panelling. I won't deny that Togashi's panelling is really good, but that alone by itself isn't enough to make his art look good. His abilities might be good, but if he can't show them because he doesn't have enough time then what?

Drawing manga is all about having only a short amount of time available. All other mangaka in Shounen Jump have literally the same time available as Togashi. In his case, it's just that his bad health is hindering him to draw as good as he could if he had better health. Despite that, it's about how his art looks like, not how it MIGHT look like if he had more time to draw a chapter. We could sit here for a decade discussion how great and consistent the art of HxH could be if he had more time.

 

[Doughboy]

People have pointed out the art quality of current MHA has been lesser to an extent while the fight with Overhaul from the internship arc was hella messy and hard to follow. A weekly seralization like HxH so the same amount of time. I would not consider Togashi a more consistent artist than Hori.

 

[Belkac3m]

World Trigger, Haikyuu!!, BLack Clover, Owari no Serafu, BLue Exorcist are consistently filled to the brim chapter by chapter with good art.

So these manga have good art, but hxh, yyh and level E are poorly drawn
WT art is just good, the mangaka must at least learn to draw a face
In haikyuu we don't even understand what's going on, full of useless traits, lost proportions, it's just badly drawn
BC, really ? just good, any other artist can do it, the only good thing is the character design.

 

[Mankichi Togawa]

Black Clover art is really consistent (and yes, I remember what happened in last chapter)

 

[Tamil]

No one brings up my boy Shimabu . Toriko had some of the best art for a battle shonen

Spoiler

 

[SharkBait]

No one brings up my boy Shimabu . Toriko had some of the best art for a shonen battle

Spoiler

Because the character designs are very ugly, no one likes muscles.

Hes also not creative, never forget how many of the monster were carbon copy ideas from people's submissions because he ran out of creativity early in the mangas life.

 

[xAsum0x]

Togashi has more text bubbles in his panels then actual art

 

[TheEnhancedExe]

So these manga have good art, but hxh, yyh and level E are poorly drawn
WT art is just good, the mangaka must at least learn to draw a face
In haikyuu we don't even understand what's going on, full of useless traits, lost proportions, it's just badly drawn
BC, really ? just good, any other artist can do it, the only good thing is the character design.

Furudate is one of the artists with the best panelling in all of Shounen Jump. His art might not be the best, but his panelling is on point. Haikyuu is imo really easy to follow.

 

[xAsum0x]

People have pointed out the art quality of current MHA has been lesser to an extent .

But it hasn't, if anything it got alot better

 

[cody]

This seems like a t̶e̶r̶r̶i̶b̶l̶e̶ ̶ great discussion.

 

[Belkac3m]

You basically stated what I wrote in my post. You probably didn't read my entire post then?



I never said he needs to draw all pages with the same consistency as his well drawn panels. That's you misinterpreting what I said. I just said he's inconsistent.

I can tell you five manga artists that are currently drawing manga in WSJ that are definitely way more consistent than Togashi is:
Oda, Horikoshi, Tabata, Saeki, Boichi

These mangaka all draw really well AND have good panelling on top of that. Of course panelling is really important as well, but it's not everything. Bad art with good panelling is just as bad as good art with bad panelling. I won't deny that Togashi's panelling is really good, but that alone by itself isn't enough to make his art look good. His abilities might be good, but if he can't show them because he doesn't have enough time then what?

Drawing manga is all about having only a short amount of time available. All other mangaka in Shounen Jump have literally the same time available as Togashi. In his case, it's just that his bad health is hindering him to draw as good as he could if he had better health. Despite that, it's about how his art looks like, not how it MIGHT look like if he had more time to draw a chapter. We could sit here for a decade discussion how great and consistent the art of HxH could be if he had more time.

A good artist is a good artist, if he draw well, he is a good artist, he will not lose his abilities.
Oda art is like a rough draft, with bad character design, it's difficult to understand what is happening in the panels, the proportions are bad.
tabata was good with hungry joker but now it's just meh
Horikoshi is consistent with his childish design
Saeki and boichi are very good artist, especially that he does not make the story haha.

Togashi also draw WELL and have VERY GOOD PANELING, and good art with bad paneling is just an illustration not a manga.

I see, you mean togashi CAN be a good artist but hxh is badly drawn, but it's not my opinion and we can't get along even if we talk about it for weeks.

 

[razerxs]

Panelling is a writing skill. Your eyes are supposed to follow the words across the page.

 

[Belkac3m]

Apart from the competition they organized with medibang, jump doesn't want to be open to the rest of the world ?

http://www.manga-audition.com/ does a very good job on it, with an old editor from jump, Hojo and Tetsu Hara (Monthly Comic Zenon)

 

[Belkac3m]

Panelling is a writing skill. Your eyes are supposed to follow the words across the page.

Yeah, but not only imo
In araki's book, he explained for example how he wrote first pages of his one-shot, you really have to pay attention to everything. Especially in the fighting, to have a cinematic look.

 

[TheEnhancedExe]

A good artist is a good artist, if he draw well, he is a good artist, he will not lose his abilities.
Oda art is like a rough draft, with bad character design, it's difficult to understand what is happening in the panels, the proportions are bad.
tabata was good with hungry joker but now it's just meh
Horikoshi is consistent with his childish design
Saeki and boichi are very good artist, especially that he does not make the story haha.

Togashi also draw WELL and have VERY GOOD PANELING, and good art with bad paneling is just an illustration not a manga.

I see, you mean togashi CAN be a good artist but hxh is badly drawn, but it's not my opinion and we can't get along even if we talk about it for weeks.

The difference between manga artists and other artists is that mangaka have a low amount of time for drawing their chapters by default. Togashi might be a great artist, but a great artist doesn't equal a great manga artist. Fast drawing is essential for manga. If you can't do that, you're not a good manga artist.

Have you ever seen actual rough drafts? I mean yeah, sometimes it can be difficult to see what's happening, because his panels are really detailed. Despite that, these are most of the time less important moments.

Maybe you're biased, because you don't like the premise of BC? I fail to see how there's any big difference between Hungry Jokers and Black Clovers art.

How is Horikoshi's design childish? Plus you shouldn't be expecting mature art in a shounen manga. This wouldn't fit Boku no Hero Academia at all. In fact his characters probably have the most unique designs among themselves. By that, I mean all characters are easily distinguishable from each other. You can even distinguish them by the way their eyes are looking, since all characters have completely unique eyes.
In probably every other manga, you'll find characters that have at least a few similarities to another character in that same manga. Even if it's the same eye shape and eye colour.

IMO especially Togashi's characters look really off a lot of the time, proportions aren't right, etc, which is my main issue with his art. Furthermore the lack of backgrounds due to him not wanting any assistants makes it even worse. If you like his art despite that, I respect that. That's your opinion and I can't change that. So I think further discussion is useless.

 

[Nakura]

Furthermore the lack of backgrounds due to him not wanting any assistants makes it even worse.

Togashi has assistants.