Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2019] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[101nemesis]

I don't know how to ask this question without the thread turning into trash.
But do any of you think Black Clover will ever get much further than it already is at in sales? After soon one and a half year of on-going anime, I don't see its peak being much further away than what it is at already, give maybe a 100k increase if lucky before it starts stagnating.
I'm sure it's selling a lot of merch, and is well received on TV, but the anime is also likely to stop eventually.

Am I misinterpreting or undermining its success? Or is that just reality.

From what readers seem to say (even those who hated the initial arcs), the current arc of BC was great. The problem with BC was it was incredibly bland/generic in the beginning. So, the chances of it growing would be minimal. If the series was of a certain quality that the majority felt it's initial arcs were great enough, it might've been able to pull more in over its run especially with better promotion and increasing quality in arcs.

 

[SharkBait]

I don't know how to ask this question without the thread turning into trash.
But do any of you think Black Clover will ever get much further than it already is at in sales? After soon one and a half year of on-going anime, I don't see its peak being much further away than what it is at already, give maybe a 100k increase if lucky before it starts stagnating.
I'm sure it's selling a lot of merch, and is well received on TV, but the anime is also likely to stop eventually.

Am I misinterpreting or undermining its success? Or is that just reality.

The reality is that numerous indications highly suggest and strongly implies that BLack Clover has received much more than a 100K or even 200K increase since the anime aired. The series is still soaring, rising to new heights. Stagnation is inaccurate. Further we know that is killing it on digital sales charts.

If it continues like this it could go on with a few more years remaining in the average of Jump.

In the end, its 200k copies by volume if it does. It will not be a monster grinds sales like Neverland or to my Hero, but it stands out enough.

BLack Clover is far from a 200K seller even when ignoring Digital volume sales, its amounts on the charts exceeds 300K. I dont know where the 200K fiction came from, but its not fact.

 

[WyldViolet]

From what readers seem to say (even those who hated the initial arcs), the current arc of BC was great. The problem with BC was it was incredibly bland/generic in the beginning. So, the chances of it growing would be minimal. If the series was of a certain quality that the majority felt it's initial arcs were great enough, it might've been able to pull more in over its run especially with better promotion and increasing quality in arcs.

I wouldn't say great. A great arc in Black Clover would be an average one in most other battle manga.
It's been fun though as of late.

 

[Jovan]

Current arc in Black Clover has a pretty good reception, which caused the Volume 19 sales to almost go up by 20k in sales for the first 3 days compared to Volume 18.

I dont think it will ever reach the heights of Haikyuu-BHA-One Piece-Neverland quartet, but as long as the recepton is good, it will stay as their middle tier player in WSJ.

 

[shoyoboyo]

One Piece does not belong in that quartet when it sells like 3x as much lol

 

[Jovan]

One Piece does not belong in that quartet when it sells like 3x as much lol

I consider them the Top Regularly Serialized 4 of WSJ (so HxH is out) which was my point. OP is out of any league really lol.

 

[savethecat]

Been catching up to Black Clover lately and I think it’s really fun.

However the twitter anime/manga community, and Jump discord community are saying
“Best thing in Jump currently!”
“Miles better than MHA”.

I feel people are forcing into that status because now that MHA has become a phenomenon, it’s less cool to like it now. Noticed over the years that the hardcore manga fans hate when the “normies” start getting into a series they followed before it was big. So now they pushing the underdog series as being the best thing out now.

Kind of similar to how they’re pushing Jujutsu as the “next big thing”, and “the best Jump series in years”, solely because of the sales, so I feel like people just want to be able to say they followed the series before it was huge.

 

[SharkBait]

However the twitter anime/manga community, and Jump discord community are saying
“Best thing in Jump currently!”
“Miles better than MHA”.

I feel people are forcing into that status because now that MHA has become a phenomenon, it’s less cool to like it now.

I dont think thats true or even accurate. HeroAca fandom is already split over the role of presence of B-class, and adding them to a multi month arc with little to no stakes, has created a massive divisive rift that has left some feeling tepid and lukewarm over the current state of the series. Comparing training matches of no stakes to war of the kingdom with tons of lives on the line, its clear which would resonate more. Perhaps if the series were aligned and Overhaul arc were running at the same time as the current moments in BLack Clover, things would steer more in HeroAca favor, but then again that was already divisive already.

 

[Obitooooo]

Taking advantage of the fact that we are talking ( No trash ) about Black Clover, it is also true to say that from a time ago, BC has become quite popular internationally.

 

[SharkBait]

screaming joy, someone awesome soul finally has giving us our first ne0;lation bl art, hold me

Series is going to explode in popularity!

 

[Serinox]

BLack Clover is far from a 200K seller even when ignoring Digital volume sales, its amounts on the charts exceeds 300K.

Okay, I know I'm taking the bait and stuff, but this is simply a lie, the charts don't show that at all.

 

[Obitooooo]

Okay, I know I'm taking the bait and stuff, but this is simply a lie, the charts don't show that at all.

It depends on the filter time.

 

[SharkBait]

Okay, I know I'm taking the bait and stuff, but this is simply a lie, the charts don't show that at all.

The end of year charts had the volumes at over 300K sales. Look and see for yourself. https://book-rank.net/report/archives/333

Im not lying here or pulling numbers out of my top hat. BLack Clover is not a 200K selling series.

 

[Serinox]

Yes, we knew that from the overall sales of the series that some volumes have to had sold better than 300k, but you make it sound like Black Clover is a series which manages to move that in the first week like TPN, MHA and the others. Which BC doesn't even manage in a few weeks before dropping off the weekly charts. It's not soaring by any means, it's dabbling around. On a very high level, sure, but overall compared to its competitors, dabbling. But people like to oversell the series' success, for some reason.
(And I say that as someone who likes Black Clover.)

 

[ShenGao]

Current arc in Black Clover has a pretty good reception, which caused the Volume 19 sales to almost go up by 20k in sales for the first 3 days compared to Volume 18.

Volume 19 is selling the same amount as volume 15.
│102907 (3)│193778│226022│------│------┃*,294,282 (*80)┃2018/03｜ブラッククローバー 15
│142077 (5)│201126│228376│243757│256290┃*,256,290 (*33)┃2018/05｜ブラッククローバー 16
│*83957 (3)│176362│214107│232004│244291┃*,244,291 (*31)┃2018/08｜ブラッククローバー 17
│*87702 (3)│176445│207870│******│239424┃*,239,424 (*31)┃2018/11｜ブラッククローバー 18
│102669 (3)│------│------│------│------┃*,102,669 (**3)┃2019/01｜ブラッククローバー 19

The fact that Volume 19 is selling 20k more than volume 18 isn't showing a growth, it's showing that it declined after volume 15 and went back to the same numbers it had 10 months ago.

 

[Maxy Barnard]

However the twitter anime/manga community, and Jump discord community are saying
“Best thing in Jump currently!”
“Miles better than MHA”.

I mean they’re saying it because they like it more, I don’t think this is deep. Like hey yeah I’m mostly a twitter person for manga chat and I count Black Clover among my top 5 Jump of all time (maybe, it changes a lot), but I don’t think I or any other person is kidding themselves about its popularity.

 

[savethecat]

I mean they’re saying it because they like it more, I don’t think this is deep. Like hey yeah I’m mostly a twitter person for manga chat and I count Black Clover among my top 5 Jump of all time (maybe, it changes a lot), but I don’t think I or any other person is kidding themselves about its popularity.

Well within the mainstream audience it’s only become “cool” to like Black Clover fairly recently. Before a few months ago Black Clover was the punching bag of Jump. I never particularly disliked it, and alway found it a fairly solid series.
I’ve seen people that called Black Clover generic trash last year, call it incredible now. And i don’t mean they’re saying “I hated the beginning, but now it’s great”. They’re acting like they’ve never disliked it at all.

I agree that Black Clover has steadily increased in quality as series continues, but the sudden growth in its overall popularity and reception in the community doesn’t feel organic.

 

[Newkerzy]

Been catching up to Black Clover lately and I think it’s really fun.

However the twitter anime/manga community, and Jump discord community are saying
“Best thing in Jump currently!”
“Miles better than MHA”.

I feel people are forcing into that status because now that MHA has become a phenomenon, it’s less cool to like it now. Noticed over the years that the hardcore manga fans hate when the “normies” start getting into a series they followed before it was big. So now they pushing the underdog series as being the best thing out now.

Kind of similar to how they’re pushing Jujutsu as the “next big thing”, and “the best Jump series in years”, solely because of the sales, so I feel like people just want to be able to say they followed the series before it was huge.

Honestly, this is just sad to see. I was one of the early adopters of the manga, (and to this day I still remember how I discovered the manga back when the first 10 chapters were scanlated). I hate the "it's popular, so now it sucks" mentality. The criticism towards MHA's current arc is understandable, but it feels like the criticisms are overblown. Personally, I think it's because most of the critique stems from looking at the series in a short-term point of view instead of the bigger picture.

The spotlight on the other classes imo, is setting the ground for future events down the road, and I think it's going to contribute to the plot in a meaningful way. The pacing could be better of course, but overall, it doesn't affect my views on the manga's overall plot in the slightest. But most of all, I think some people are taking Horikoshi for granted. Especially when I've seen worse. That's why I'm grateful for what we have in MHA, warts and all, when I think there could've been worse alternatives Horikoshi could've taken.

As for BC, I get where the hype is coming from now. I've been an on & off reader, but I've got the gist of the current arc, and I can see why, in the past year, it would look like BC has an edge over MHA. BC is a good manga, but if I want to wholeheartedly devote myself to a series, I want that something "special" that I've always experienced in my past manga viewing experience.

 

[Unok]

Yes, we knew that from the overall sales of the series that some volumes have to had sold better than 300k, but you make it sound like Black Clover is a series which manages to move that in the first week like TPN, MHA and the others. Which BC doesn't even manage in a few weeks before dropping off the weekly charts. It's not soaring by any means, it's dabbling around. On a very high level, sure, but overall compared to its competitors, dabbling. But people like to oversell the series' success, for some reason.
(And I say that as someone who likes Black Clover.)

And what exactly is the difference in the big picture? Whatever the volume takes 2 weeks to move 350k or 5 months, it still sold them. It still means it sells 350k per volume. It sounds like only the first week sales matter, which obviously ain't true.

I have always found the sales discussing lame, especially with the start of digital sales. People don't have full picture and go assume things, which sometimes are correct, others - totally off. It sells 200k in the first month, 350k in a year, +50-100k maybe for another year, digital sales not included, but labelled as 200k seller, because "that is what we seen in the first 2-3 weeks". LMAO. All these charts that people look, only show fast sellers. And a year later, you usually don't even know how much actually the volume sold, and you are stuck with some outdated number and think you are correct "because you have old data".

 

[savethecat]

Honestly, this is just sad to see. I was one of the early adopters of the manga, (and to this day I still remember how I discovered the manga back when the first 10 chapters were scanlated). I hate the "it's popular, so now it sucks" mentality. The criticism towards MHA's current arc is understandable, but it feels like the criticisms are overblown. Personally, I think it's because most of the critique stems from looking at the series in a short-term point of view instead of the bigger picture.

The spotlight on the other classes imo, is setting the ground for future events down the road, and I think it's going to contribute to the plot in a meaningful way. The pacing could be better of course, but overall, it doesn't affect my views on the manga's overall plot in the slightest. But most of all, I think some people are taking Horikoshi for granted. Especially when I've seen worse. That's why I'm grateful for what we have in MHA, warts and all, when I think there could've been worse alternatives Horikoshi could've taken.

As for BC, I get where the hype is coming from now. I've been an on & off reader, but I've got the gist of the current arc, and I can see why, in the past year, it would look like BC has an edge over MHA. BC is a good manga, but if I want to wholeheartedly devote myself to a series, I want that something "special" that I've always experienced in my past manga viewing experience.

I agree that MHA’s current arc is a bit hit or miss. But I think even the best series have had mediocre arcs meshed between great arcs. Dragon Ball, Naruto, One Piece, and even Hunter X Hunter.
Just because MHA has a couple arcs don’t aren’t that great isn’t a sign that the entire series is falling off