One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[King Moe]

Why does it seem that you're kinda happy about this turn of events? I'm equally disappointed when supposedly strong characters get such treatment from Oda, be it Sanji, Zoro or anyone else.

Seriously, if I become a prominent mangaka some day I'll treat my cast fairly .

Doubt they won't stop getting stronger, but honestly this was needed to show Zoro can't just always breeze through in fights. They are in Yonko territory so Zoro need to feel like himself again back in pre-timeskip where every fight or most fights feels a struggle for him as now they get deeper in Yonko Saga more. Clearly he needs to retrain himself for the next days until the final fight as it's just Oda showing he need to improve himself more is all (Plus Zoro fans have overhype him way too long honestly, so it's good to take them down a peg and bringing back to reality on situation instead of making up stuff like he is stronger than Luffy, Sanji, Katakuri, etc.).

 

[Takuan]

We are finally back to the EL/TB norm.

What's that? i've never heard of it.

 

[Pirate Queen]

What's that? i've never heard of it.

Before Zoro was wanked to extremes, I'd imagine.

Before the time skip there was never so much Zoro wank....

Frankly, I think this site it rather tame compared to sites like Orojackson but there still an unhealthy amount of it.

 

[Hannibal Psyche]

While his fainting here is off character, well this is Wano, the arc where Big Mom got amnesia because. Oda's portrayal of characters has been rather poor and inconsistent. I'd understand fodder getting amnesia, but Big Mom, an Emperor? and now Zoro despite the fact we've seen him bleed heavily at Thriller Bark.

I don't think Zoro fans rub Zoro's feats in people's faces for the sake of it. It's imo just a retaliation to Sanji fans who are dishonest about the fact that Sanji just hasn't looked good since the skip, and yet can even attempt to undermine Zoro and overrate Sanji.

The Zoro Sanji thing is not a 1 sided thing. It takes 2 to tango. Maybe if some of these Sanji fans were a little more honest about the reality, Zoro fans would actually feel like Oda is doing him a disservice rather than make it a me vs you thing. This is why I hate fanboying of any type, it stops honest discussion.

 

[Pirate Queen]

While his fainting here is off character, well this is Wano, the arc where Big Mom got amnesia because. Oda's portrayal of characters has been rather poor and inconsistent. I'd understand fodder getting amnesia, but Big Mom, an Emperor? and now Zoro despite the fact we've seen him bleed heavily at Thriller Bark.

I don't think Zoro fans rub Zoro's feats in people's faces for the sake of it. It's imo just a retaliation to Sanji fans who are dishonest about the fact that Sanji just hasn't looked good since the skip, and yet can even attempt to undermine Zoro and overrate Sanji.

The Zoro Sanji thing is not a 1 sided thing. It takes 2 to tango. Maybe if some of these Sanji fans were a little more honest about the reality, Zoro fans would actually feel like Oda is doing him a disservice rather than make it a me vs you thing. This is why I hate fanboying of any type, it stops honest discussion.

I have literally debated someone who said Sanji would have a better chance against Katakuri than Zoro would against Doflamingo.

Likewise, I have seen Zoro fans unbearably RIP apart the slightest bit of impressive feat Sanji has accomplished.

This is what happens when a manga has no ships for the fandom to argue over lol!

 

[Hrathgrath]

I think both of them would have been screwed in either fight...

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 31, 2019, Original Post Date: Mar 31, 2019 ---

On another point, I've been thinking about this whole thing with Zoro and this most recent fight. I'm thinking either it's straight up plot device, in which case, you know.. whatever, or possibly that guys weapons were poisoned or drugged or something like that. Though the thing I would like to point out is that he was fighting two different fighters of questionable skill, meaning they could have both been masters...or not... Either way, being drugged is the only thing that makes any sense to me... I mean we are talking about the same guy that took on all of Luffy's obscene amount of... strain or whatever Kuma pushed out of him, and didn't even flinch. And he gets a scythe through his shoulder and he passes out? Like, HP said, it just doesn't do him justice.

 

[XXGenesis]

Soooooooo.....Don't want be that guy, but I take after this chapter, Zoro lost his momentum and hype heavily, so that makes us think his ranking among Strawhats, Monster Trio, Worst Generation, Swordsmen, etc.?

Are we still gonna say he could take on a YC like any of them especially Katakuri after this or even say if Hawkins and Zoro face again, he could have won? Cause right now fanbase especially his own fans see him nit even worthy fighting serious opponents if he can't handle serious hit like he used to back in pre-timeskip.

Yes, this is a hit to Zoro's characterization.
Many dont like, neither do I. If this continues throughout Wano, where Zoro gets low balled or no shine..........He'll get the same treatment from me at least, that was given to Sanji for his characterization during WCI.


I never personally thought Zoro could take out a YC. Especially after seeing Luffy's fight with Cracker.

Personally speaking for myself..I rank Zoro's unseen full power just a little under Doffy. So speaking towards the whole Zoro will take down a YC...It was either a feat & boost in Power we know Zoro will eventually get. But only passionate fan boys believed Zoro could take out a YC.

Just a friendly reminder before this turns into a heated up argument — let's keep it civil.

I actually am sorta surprised, as severe as it may seem, is this wound really that much worse when compared to Luffy's stomach injury? And even before the wound Luffy absorbed so much damage in his fight vs Katakuri.

Maybe it's due to lack of food/poisoned food? Still not very convincing though...

On the other hand, the scythe could damage some of his vital organs/arteries.

Very surprised somewhat myself.
If Zoro had taken that injury, and just bad been injured and in pain with his battle strenyght lowered for a time during the arc. It would have been kool.

But Zoro passed out in front of another opponent. He had a fight to finish..So it's weird to see that after seeing Zoro endure a beat down from oz, Kuma & Luffy's entire pain & fatigue.

Zoro took the blade in the shoulder, no where near his vitals. If it did, it could make sense why he went down more, but still it's not the first time he took severe damage and was still active and even fight in pre-timeskip.

There is no poison or food and water did nothing. If it was, Oda would go to lengths to hint or show it was those factors, but instead he has Zoro admit it's his own fault, so nothing to defend about it. He just need to retrain himself before the final battle, but even so, think now it's hinting more Orochi will be his final opponent as with being Hiyori, Orochi be after her and doubt Zoro will leave her that state.

Still be hype for a fight between them regardless.

What @Pea is trying to say, is that food & nourishment is bug and important in One Piece.

But he's just trying to make sense of the situation. The injury is a piercing blow very similar to the blow Luffy got..hell luffys blow may even be worst.

Why did Zoro faint?! Its very honestly weird when the writer has had this character endure seemingly much worst and continue to fight or remain conscious.

Why does it seem that you're kinda happy about this turn of events? I'm equally disappointed when supposedly strong characters get such treatment from Oda, be it Sanji, Zoro or anyone else.

Seriously, if I become a prominent mangaka some day I'll treat my cast fairly .

I agree with you PEA. But Moe is entitled to be happy or sad. It's his right.

But now I'm starting to feel bad for the whole straw hat crew. Luffy has gotten a back to back 1 v 1 & development in 1 arc, & seems to be gearing up for another one. While Zoro & Sanji have not gone all out yet, with other nuisances in between such as Zoro's cap strength & Sanji's seemingly lacking behind Zoro a bit before his Raid Suit.

 

[M3J]

People are making such a big deal over Zoro fainting after being stabbed. It doesn't really show he's weak or anything bad, especially after he pulled out the scythe (did he?) and beat the opponent. Nothing to really take from this.

 

[Pirate Queen]

People are making such a big deal over Zoro fainting after being stabbed. It doesn't really show he's weak or anything bad, especially after he pulled out the scythe (did he?) and beat the opponent. Nothing to really take from this.

People make big deals over Sanji for alot less. This is just balancing the scale, in my opinion.

If Sanji was in Zoro's place it would be an equally big deal. Perhaps even bigger

 

[King Moe]

While his fainting here is off character, well this is Wano, the arc where Big Mom got amnesia because. Oda's portrayal of characters has been rather poor and inconsistent. I'd understand fodder getting amnesia, but Big Mom, an Emperor? and now Zoro despite the fact we've seen him bleed heavily at Thriller Bark.

I don't think Zoro fans rub Zoro's feats in people's faces for the sake of it. It's imo just a retaliation to Sanji fans who are dishonest about the fact that Sanji just hasn't looked good since the skip, and yet can even attempt to undermine Zoro and overrate Sanji.

The Zoro Sanji thing is not a 1 sided thing. It takes 2 to tango. Maybe if some of these Sanji fans were a little more honest about the reality, Zoro fans would actually feel like Oda is doing him a disservice rather than make it a me vs you thing. This is why I hate fanboying of any type, it stops honest discussion.

Hannibal your being more biased in your post than understanding. Your choosing sides than being fair judgement. As for the arc on Big Mom and Zoro situation, It's not over for them yet, so you can't say it's horrible off especially BM when both sides have reason to them as it been stated, Big Mom have mental issues as well drowning can affect the human brain to get amnesia. Doesn't matter if she is a Yonko. Like all DF users, her weakness is seawater. She still human and plus being a DF user, it hurts her more than average person.

It make sense that way to get amnesia. Your the one denying the facts than accepting it on her as others told ya.

As for Zoro, while I understand his durability nature her has, we have to admit Zoro never got hurt badly since timeskip since he never face anyone compare to hurt him more until now. We got heavily hints with Fujitora, Hawkins, and Birdcage by Doflamingo that he wasn't as strong as many think or at least certain stats. Since we are Yonko territory you got to respect him struggling again instead thinking he breeze through easily. Nothing wrong with Oda's writing, he just making him more consistent character since we not expecting to breeze through these type of enemies like in the past.

Also when are Sanji fans a major problem? Sanji fans never done things as bad as Zoro fans in going after others and you know it. They defend and use facts about Sanji while Zoro fans and certain few outside of the them about taking it to more stupid lengths like 'He's done as a fighter, he is weak, he can't do anything, etc.' . Sanji fans are honest and they are aware he been lacking in fighting more lately, but that doesn't mean his whole character is destroy over it like your implying. Zoro fans started the issue with their trolling and overjoyed as well bashing characters and now they are getting karma on it especially their behavior during WCI, so if they don't like it, they shouldn't start issues and overhype Zoro on having a FLAWLESS (Emphasizing) performance in Wano just to get proven wrong hard by Oda cause they think they know how he works, but are wrong. No one knows what he do next, so don't try to push something unless their evidence to heavily implied it will happen or you embarrass in the long run when it turn out badly for you.

I get what you mean by fanboying, but your post seems like your choosing side than fair there. No hate or anything to you, but just saying on perspective on the situation is all.

 

[Brandish μ]

Come on guys, we don't need to talk about fans. If you want to discuss anything it should be the manga, not the people who read it.

Zoro fainting is disappointing personally, because he's pulled through all kinds of injuries before, and it was silly how he let his guard down too. Plot didn't need him to be a tank today.

 

[XXGenesis]

Loving the Zoro thread. Good, honest discussion. Lows & highs are both highlighted, discussed and sorted out.
A general understanding is usually reached or settled upon..CoO discussion, 1 Slash takedowns?! His status quo endurance/durability...etc...How a thread & users should debate, shade is thrown here n there, with some sarcasm and jokes inbetween. But nobody gets their feathers ruffled as they shouldn't. Random rhetoric is propagated from other sites, we address each other's opinions here, respectfully

 

[albertwv]

Seriously, this fight made Zolo look extremely weak. But let's take a look at the situation. 1st. Zolo was fighting vs Gyukimaru, who had stolen his favorite sword, and Zolo mentioned he did not feel right without his 3rd sword. 2nd. Kamazu apparently was strong, though we can not base his strength on anything but the fact that Zolo thought he was strong, which to me is a testament to someone's power, because I am sure Zolo does not think just anybody is strong. 3rd, we don't know how strong Gyukimaru is either but Zolo was facing two opponents, he let his guard down and was stabbed in the shoulder. Now is it fair? Not really but in the real world this doesn't matter unless, do you guys count the time Flambe pierced Luffy in the leg which caused him to get stabbed by Dogtooth? I do not count that, that was cheating. So I don't count Gyukimaru's attempted slash on Zolo. If it wasn't for that, Zolo would have not gotten that badly injured. 4th. Either way, Zolo got stabbed yet he took down Kamazu in one slash, how epic is that, even after getting stabbed, this goes for you Sanji lovers/Zolo haters, when has Sanji one shotted someone after taking heavy damage like that. 5th. To be honest, Oda has been making Zolo look bad in this arc so far. We all can agree that Oda did Zolo wrong in this chapter because, Zolo is known for tanking hits (Kuma in Thriller Bark, Mr.1 dicing him up, Kuma on Shanbody, etc.) yet he passed out after getting stabbed deeply in the shoulder and let Gyukimaru escape. This is totally wrong, Zolo should've still been able to fight or at least NOT passed out. I don't know why Oda did this but hey it happened and it's facts. Now, then someone said that Zolo fans think that Zolo is YC level, which is not true. I do not think he is YC level yet or even Sanji, maybe at the end of the arc but as of yet, neither Zolo or Sanji are YC level yet.

 

[afromarco005]

Seriously, this fight made Zolo look extremely weak. But let's take a look at the situation. 1st. Zolo was fighting vs Gyukimaru, who had stolen his favorite sword, and Zolo mentioned he did not feel right without his 3rd sword. 2nd. Kamazu apparently was strong, though we can not base his strength on anything but the fact that Zolo thought he was strong, which to me is a testament to someone's power, because I am sure Zolo does not think just anybody is strong. 3rd, we don't know how strong Gyukimaru is either but Zolo was facing two opponents, he let his guard down and was stabbed in the shoulder. Now is it fair? Not really but in the real world this doesn't matter unless, do you guys count the time Flambe pierced Luffy in the leg which caused him to get stabbed by Dogtooth? I do not count that, that was cheating. So I don't count Gyukimaru's attempted slash on Zolo. If it wasn't for that, Zolo would have not gotten that badly injured. 4th. Either way, Zolo got stabbed yet he took down Kamazu in one slash, how epic is that, even after getting stabbed, this goes for you Sanji lovers/Zolo haters, when has Sanji one shotted someone after taking heavy damage like that. 5th. To be honest, Oda has been making Zolo look bad in this arc so far. We all can agree that Oda did Zolo wrong in this chapter because, Zolo is known for tanking hits (Kuma in Thriller Bark, Mr.1 dicing him up, Kuma on Shanbody, etc.) yet he passed out after getting stabbed deeply in the shoulder and let Gyukimaru escape. This is totally wrong, Zolo should've still been able to fight or at least NOT passed out. I don't know why Oda did this but hey it happened and it's facts. Now, then someone said that Zolo fans think that Zolo is YC level, which is not true. I do not think he is YC level yet or even Sanji, maybe at the end of the arc but as of yet, neither Zolo or Sanji are YC level yet.

According to some, Sanji is now YC1 level with his suit (so OP).

And since his bounty is higher Sanji>Zoro confirmed!

 

[kcd]

This is totally wrong, Zolo should've still been able to fight or at least NOT passed out. I don't know why Oda did this but hey it happened and it's facts. Now, then someone said that Zolo fans think that Zolo is YC level, which is not true. I do not think he is YC level yet or even Sanji, maybe at the end of the arc but as of yet, neither Zolo or Sanji are YC level yet.

You also need to consider the food he's been taking.
I'm pretty sure he's been eating poison for at least three or four days. And about two days ago or so, he even told Luffy his stomach was hurting. There's definitely no way his body system will function the way it normally does, even though he seemed ok prior the fight.
I think that's what Oda took into consideration, as he's been slowly building/accumulating poison within his system. Either that, or severe blood loss may have caused him to faint.

 

[M3J]

People make big deals over Sanji for alot less. This is just balancing the scale, in my opinion.

If Sanji was in Zoro's place it would be an equally big deal. Perhaps even bigger

Yeah, and they're just as annoying/dumb, it still doesn't justify being so annoying about Zoro. I mean, when has he fainted when he couldn't afford to? Though, Gyukimaru was an enemy, so it doesn't make sense for Zoro to faint unless he didn't detect anything bad from the guy.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Yeah, and they're just as annoying/dumb, it still doesn't justify being so annoying about Zoro. I mean, when has he fainted when he couldn't afford to? Though, Gyukimaru was an enemy, so it doesn't make sense for Zoro to faint unless he didn't detect anything bad from the guy.

Yeah according to the chapter, it seems Zoro fainted the moment Gyukimaru turned his back to walk away (danger gone/about to) so it's possible he'd have prevented himself from going unconscious if the guy still meant harm. But it also seemed like Zoro wanted to chase after him before blacking out.

From what we've seen, both opponents Kamazo and Gyukimaru seem stronger than Pica. Zoro acknowledged Kamazo for his strength (virtually all Wano Samurai should be impressively strong) which isn't surprising but downplayed Pica.
He also seemed very capable of taking down Gyukimaru until hero duties made him suspend their duel which Kamazo took advantage of expectedly.
From what I could deduce, he prioritised Kamazo over Gyukimaru for obvious reasons and yes strength is one of them expecting Gyukimaru to understand. Guess he wasn't too cool with being sidelined until the Kamazo defeat.

Another Zoro vs Gyukimaru doesn't seem to interest me anymore since the outcome is presumably known except for the highly informative small talk they keep having while dueling. Probably the reason Zoro didn't take him out early.

 

[King Moe]

Regardless doubt there is aa reason to it as Oda would have put it out there more than Zoro said it's his fault for letting it happen. Us either way whether poison, blood loss, or hunger, that still hurts his durability as neither factors affected him especially in pre-timeskip before about it, but now it seems to be. Which can be due to lack of training in certain areas like his Haki for one and he never had a serious opponent or serious hit to push him out like this until now. Looking back on arcs, Zoro got it 'easy' in NW until now that is. Thus reality is hitting as Oda plans on making more struggle for his fights this time around especially against Orochi as his final opponent since the direction aiming for confrontation between than King (never hinted much in the first place with King though).

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 2, 2019, Original Post Date: Apr 2, 2019 ---

According to some, Sanji is now YC1 level with his suit (so OP).

And since his bounty is higher Sanji>Zoro confirmed!

Well Sanji did defeat a T6H as his latest feat easily. If someone has to give him a true challenge, YC is his next better being either King or Queen. He is showing results lately, not just in bounty alone as he has power to back it up.

Zoro so far need to train now while he can before the final battle before he can even think of challenging someone very high-tier as it will look BS that he can tank again later on, but yet couldn't with Kamazou guy. Think Oda is planning for a redemption more the way things are heading.

 

[Fox666]

Well Sanji did defeat a T6H as his latest feat easily. If someone has to give him a true challenge, YC is his next better being either King or Queen. He is showing results lately, not just in bounty alone as he has power to back it up.

Assuming Page One was that strong to begin with...

 

[nik87]

Assuming Page One was that strong to begin with...

Assuming PageOne is defeated.