Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2019] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[Tamil]

He outright says "I couldn't finish this the way I wanted" in the authors notes. Not to mention the final chapter is a giant exposition dump of all the cool ideas he had for the next saga which just...never happened.

It, combined with the generally uncertain tone of his sign off letter, honestly is pretty depressing. As I've detailed elsewhere, there are some pretty solid reasons why Toriko got thrown to the wolves by Jump as it went on, but I still feel really bad for Shimabukuro, who was clearly dedicated to do a story he was deeply passionate about only to get screwed over by Jump's editorial and readerbase.

Shimabu has himself to blame mostly, not the editorial or readerbase (lmao why would the readerbase be blamed?). He simply put too much on his plate, that was his downfall. Let's take a look at how much the gourmet world saga had setup and was ultimately skipped or rushed:

Spoiler

-Toriko's rescue of Komatsu (which was the start of the timeskip. Not a good start but thankfully recovered with AIR/PAIR arcs)
-7 civilizations in the GW (remember that?)
-EARTH arc (~30 chapters worth of content)
-ATOM arc (~30 chapter worth of content)
-NEWS arc (~30 chapters worth of content)
-CENTER arc (the food utopia was shown but it could've easily been it's own arc since of Acacia dishes had gotten their own arcs)
-GOD arc (while the final battle took place in Area 2, a lot of the environments/area information was skimmed through via a few dialogue bubbles.)
-Space Arc (I think it would've been an arc to the final lands rather than a saga but given the multiverse tease idk)

etc, etc, etc.

Easily well over 15+ volumes worth of content skipped.

He seems to have understood how hard writing the timeskip was and it was a learning experience for him. With his next work, if there ever is a timeskip I expect to be handled better. Writing timeskips, especially for battle shonens are incredibly tough. HxH pulls it off the best but the hiatus definitely plays in its favor.

Toriko's rankings were good from the timeskip start to the PAIR arc even. Once he started skipping in Area 6/ANOTHER arc that's where the sales and rankings took a steep decline. The PAIR/AIR arcs sold well, around low-mid 300k's. I remember Toriko average around #6 in the ToC before it started placing in the bottom.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 6, 2019, Original Post Date: Aug 6, 2019 ---

According to Oricon leaks from 5chan, the first volume of Kimetsu no Yaiba’s anime has managed to sell 11,594 copies in total (7349 blu-rays and 4245 DVDs). A very healthy start.

I called it. 10k+ sales.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

I didn't see anyone mentioning but Shun Numa (Samon-kun wa Summoner) will publish a one shot on Jump Plus in August 10, it seems like will be comedy and romance.

 

[Rain Spectre]

Shimabu has himself to blame mostly, not the editorial or readerbase (lmao why would the readerbase be blamed?). He simply put too much on his plate, that was his downfall. Let's take a look at how much the gourmet world saga had setup and was ultimately skipped or rushed:

Spoiler

-Toriko's rescue of Komatsu (which was the start of the timeskip. Not a good start but thankfully recovered with AIR/PAIR arcs)
-7 civilizations in the GW (remember that?)
-EARTH arc (~30 chapters worth of content)
-ATOM arc (~30 chapter worth of content)
-NEWS arc (~30 chapters worth of content)
-CENTER arc (the food utopia was shown but it could've easily been it's own arc since of Acacia dishes had gotten their own arcs)
-GOD arc (while the final battle took place in Area 2, a lot of the environments/area information was skimmed through via a few dialogue bubbles.)
-Space Arc (I think it would've been an arc to the final lands rather than a saga but given the multiverse tease idk)

etc, etc, etc.

Easily well over 15+ volumes worth of content skipped.

He seems to have understood how hard writing the timeskip was and it was a learning experience for him. With his next work, if there ever is a timeskip I expect to be handled better. Writing timeskips, especially for battle shonens are incredibly tough. HxH pulls it off the best but the hiatus definitely plays in its favor.

Toriko's rankings were good from the timeskip start to the PAIR arc even. Once he started skipping in Area 6/ANOTHER arc that's where the sales and rankings took a steep decline. The PAIR/AIR arcs sold well, around low-mid 300k's. I remember Toriko average around #6 in the ToC before it started placing in the bottom.

I meant that readers screwed him over because the new audience of Jump that was forming in the latter years of the series run simply had zero interest in the series for a number of reasons. Toriko's success was, from my perspective, more or less a grab bag incident that Shimabukuro wasn't able to maintain.

I will say, one of the big issues was that of fatigue. Toriko was a manga far more interested in spectacle over plot and characters, which would've proved problematic simply because of how fatiguing that sort of thing is when taken all at once. That most likely proved a big issue for new readers who'd try to catch up on the series.

 

[Aeneas]

But how low did the sales go exactly, surely it wasn't the worst selling manga in jump right? Why axe Toriko and not whatever series is doing the worst.

I imagine they prioritize (potential for) growth, so I guess they determined that the series had reached its peak and it was all downhill from there.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

Talk about projecting, projecting and projecting, calling Toriko success a "incident" that Shima wasn't able to maintain is such a joke, Toriko was a success for pretty much 6/7 of the 8 years of serialization, the rankings only started to really drop in 2016 (the last year), what happened with Toriko is what happened with many and many popular mangas on Jump and many other magazines, it reached the peak of popularity and story, and so it started to drop and ended, it sucks that he wasn't able to continue and go to space but in the end the manga still feels like a complete work, at least more than many other Jump mangas.

 

[Tamil]

I meant that readers screwed him over because the new audience of Jump that was forming in the latter years of the series run simply had zero interest in the series for a number of reasons. Toriko's success was, from my perspective, more or less a grab bag incident that Shimabukuro wasn't able to maintain.

I will say, one of the big issues was that of fatigue. Toriko was a manga far more interested in spectacle over plot and characters, which would've proved problematic simply because of how fatiguing that sort of thing is when taken all at once. That most likely proved a big issue for new readers who'd try to catch up on the series.

Im pretty sure most of his fans have been following him since Takeshi so I doubt it. Toriko did get younger fans but that mainly thanks to the anime.

grab bag incident?

I doubt that for the reason I just mentioned. Toriko's plot was fine. The characters could use work but I doubt that the readers read Toriko for its character development but rather for the adventure/fight/badass/manly aspect. Toriko has been a hit since volume 1 so if the readers cared about character development and/or expected that from Toriko it would've likely flopped.

--- Double Post Merged, Aug 6, 2019, Original Post Date: Aug 6, 2019 ---

Talk about projecting, projecting and projecting, calling Toriko success a "incident" that Shima wasn't able to maintain is such a joke, Toriko was a success for pretty much 6/7 of the 8 years of serialization, the rankings only started to really drop in 2016 (the last year), what happened with Toriko is what happened with many and many popular mangas on Jump and many other magazines, it reached the peak of popularity and story, and so it started to drop and ended, it sucks that he wasn't able to continue and go to space but in the end the manga still feels like a complete work, at least more than many other Jump mangas.

Exactly. It was a hit from the start...It made Nak cry

• Toriko had a muscular protagonist and had a feeling of "The Shonen Manga" so Shueisha wanted to push it but Nakano was worried if it could gain popularity in current jump (at the time) and so when on the day the volumes went on sale and it sold out, he cried while on the train.

I agree Toriko feels complete, despite the skipping it did. Toriko's completeness is mainly thanks to the strong ending it had.

 

[Halloween]

I felt like Toriko being a sausage-fest hurt it in the long run. Look at most successful series, there's at least a few really popular females in them, usually.

Also, Shima's art really isn't the best, even though I did like some of his designs. The anime being a horrible adaptation also didn't help.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

The anime being a horrible adaptation also didn't help.

And it still gave Toriko a good boost in sales, now imagine if it was a anime with great animation and no censorship like HxH by Madhouse :P

 

[Halloween]

And it still gave Toriko a good boost in sales, now imagine if it was a anime with great animation and no censorship like HxH by Madhouse :P

Exactly. Well done anime usually give great results. Toriko's anime being aired before One Piece was likely the reason it got the modest boost it got. But, you know, it being terrible ultimately sealed it's fate.

 

[Paze]

Rather then axe series is wish wsj gave all authors the chance to move to another magazine, maybe digital only. If they fail there then axe completely.

 

[LuckyJim]

I didn't see anyone mentioning but Shun Numa (Samon-kun wa Summoner) will publish a one shot on Jump Plus in August 10, it seems like will be comedy and romance.

FINALLY! I was hoping to see him return to the magazine with a comedy series, but Jump+ might be a better place for him to really establish himself. I think it might be a straight comedy rather than a romance, all of Shun Numa's works (Moromono, Samon and Ele-ki, though there may be more) had male and female leads, but none of them were really romantic (though I guess Samon could be debatable) but I guess it could go either way.

 

[Rain Spectre]

FINALLY! I was hoping to see him return to the magazine with a comedy series, but Jump+ might be a better place for him to really establish himself. I think it might be a straight comedy rather than a romance, all of Shun Numa's works (Moromono, Samon and Ele-ki, though there may be more) had male and female leads, but none of them were really romantic (though I guess Samon could be debatable) but I guess it could go either way.

I think Jump+ is a decent solution to what to do with the more gag oriented authors whose art isn't really suited for serious plot development. This way, even if their stuff doesn't really sell, they still have a place to write, and don't have to compete for space in the main 20 title publication.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

Personally i would like to see he returning for Shonen Jump, he was already able to survive for 2 years and going against many comedies, now with the lack of comedy in the magazine i think he has the potential to fill the space and with Manga Plus it wouldn't have to wait forever for the scans to translate, but i will not be surprise if he gets a series on Plus.

 

[Rain Spectre]

Personally i would like to see he returning for Shonen Jump, he was already able to survive for 2 years and going against many comedies, now with the lack of comedy in the magazine i think he has the potential to fill the space and with Manga Plus it wouldn't have to wait forever for the scans to translate, but i will not be surprise if he gets a series on Plus.

You do realize Samon only survived because of Idolmaster fans, right? We went over this. Not saying the series didn't have fans (the 10K followers on twitter didn't come from nowhere), but there is a reason it died.

 

[revo68]

Shoseki Rankings 29/7 - 4/8

Weekly Shonen Jump
1 My Hero Academia #24
2 The Promised Neverland #15
5 Gintama #77
17 Yuuna and the Haunted Hotsprings #17
21 Chainsaw Man #03
41 Gintama Fanbook
443 Gokutei Higuma #03

Jump+
9 World's End Harem #09
97 Aharen-san wa Hakarenai #07
111 Vigilante My Hero Academia ILLEGALS #07
217 Boukyaku Battery #05
227 Summertime Render #07
308 Akuma no Memumemu-chan #08
422 Tokedase! Mizore-chan #03
444 Gunjou ni Siren #10

148 Dr. Stone #11
233 Dr. Stone #03
243 Dr. Stone #02
250 Dr. Stone #01
251 Dr. Stone #10
260 Dr. Stone #04
265 Dr. Stone #05
275 Dr. Stone #09
278 Dr. Stone #06
296 Dr. Stone #07
298 Dr. Stone #08

8 Kimetsu no Yaiba Fanbook
13 Kimetsu no Yaiba #16
27 Kimetsu no Yaiba #06
30 Kimetsu no Yaiba #05
32 Kimetsu no Yaiba #07
33 Kimetsu no Yaiba #08
34 Kimetsu no Yaiba #01
35 Kimetsu no Yaiba #09
36 Kimetsu no Yaiba #10
37 Kimetsu no Yaiba #15
38 Kimetsu no Yaiba #12
39 Kimetsu no Yaiba #11
42 Kimetsu no Yaiba #02
43 Kimetsu no Yaiba #13
45 Kimetsu no Yaiba #14
46 Kimetsu no Yaiba #03
48 Kimetsu no Yaiba #04

30位18950/50位15650/100位9000/200位5000/300位3350/400位2600/500位2100

 

[Koni]

Shoseki Rankings 29/7 - 4/8

Weekly Shonen Jump
1 My Hero Academia #24
2 The Promised Neverland #15
5 Gintama #77
17 Yuuna and the Haunted Hotsprings #17
21 Chainsaw Man #03
41 Gintama Fanbook
443 Gokutei Higuma #03

Jump+
9 World's End Harem #09
97 Aharen-san wa Hakarenai #07
111 Vigilante My Hero Academia ILLEGALS #07
217 Boukyaku Battery #05
227 Summertime Render #07
308 Akuma no Memumemu-chan #08
422 Tokedase! Mizore-chan #03
444 Gunjou ni Siren #10

148 Dr. Stone #11
233 Dr. Stone #03
243 Dr. Stone #02
250 Dr. Stone #01
251 Dr. Stone #10
260 Dr. Stone #04
265 Dr. Stone #05
275 Dr. Stone #09
278 Dr. Stone #06
296 Dr. Stone #07
298 Dr. Stone #08

8 Kimetsu no Yaiba Fanbook
13 Kimetsu no Yaiba #16
27 Kimetsu no Yaiba #06
30 Kimetsu no Yaiba #05
32 Kimetsu no Yaiba #07
33 Kimetsu no Yaiba #08
34 Kimetsu no Yaiba #01
35 Kimetsu no Yaiba #09
36 Kimetsu no Yaiba #10
37 Kimetsu no Yaiba #15
38 Kimetsu no Yaiba #12
39 Kimetsu no Yaiba #11
42 Kimetsu no Yaiba #02
43 Kimetsu no Yaiba #13
45 Kimetsu no Yaiba #14
46 Kimetsu no Yaiba #03
48 Kimetsu no Yaiba #04

30位18950/50位15650/100位9000/200位5000/300位3350/400位2600/500位2100

What a success for Yaiba! Has both strong anime sales AND a good backlog boost! HeroAca currently has the edge over Neverland, which is really interesting! Though... I have to wonder where the heck Spy x Family is. It couldn’t have just dropped from the weekly rankings like that. I went back and checked, it was still in the Top 50 for the past few days.

 

[Nakura]

I have to wonder where the heck Spy x Family is. It couldn’t have just dropped from the weekly rankings like that. I went back and checked, it was still in the Top 50 for the past few days.

It's 25th.

 

[RafGL]

What a success for Yaiba! Has both strong anime sales AND a good backlog boost! HeroAca currently has the edge over Neverland, which is really interesting! Though... I have to wonder where the heck Spy x Family is. It couldn’t have just dropped from the weekly rankings like that. I went back and checked, it was still in the Top 50 for the past few days.

It's on #25.

 

[Koni]

It's 25th.

It's on #25.

Ah, thank you! I’ll try and look at the source next time.

 

[Halloween]

21 Chainsaw Man #03