Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2019] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[Maxy Barnard]

I would actually give it three volumes.

I dig this. Most series have a complete opening arc by 2-3 vols, giving a proper sample of what the series is like

 

[tirakai]

Kimetsu stands out because people are posting and focusing on the sales info every week. Nobody really does that usually.

Also because it was pretty comparable to Black Clover before in popularity and sales so a lot of us were expecting a similar sized boost, where it'd grow a bit but stay as a mid-magazine series rather than catapulting to being a front runner.

Speaking of being a new front-runner WSJ is in an odd situation right now where they've essentially got a Big 5 face series. OP is #1 as ever, MHA is the clear #2, but Haikyuu's dropped while Neverland and Kimetsu have grown to the point that the 3 are all pretty much at the same level.

and then there's the all the flops at the bottom too giving the magazine a weird balance.

top - OP, MHA, Haikyuu, Neverland, Kimetsu
mid - Black Clover, Dr Stone, WNL, Yuuna
new-ish and growing - Act-age, Jujutsu, Chainsawman
new flops - Yui, Beast, Shinobi, Taisei, Samurai 8?

it's pretty even at each tier, granted OP is really it's own lever and Black Clover is I think a little bigger than the other mids but still.

 

[Koni]

Kimetsu stands out because people are posting and focusing on the sales info every week. Nobody really does that usually.

Also because it was pretty comparable to Black Clover before in popularity and sales so a lot of us were expecting a similar sized boost, where it'd grow a bit but stay as a mid-magazine series rather than catapulting to being a front runner.

Speaking of being a new front-runner WSJ is in an odd situation right now where they've essentially got a Big 5 face series. OP is #1 as ever, MHA is the clear #2, but Haikyuu's dropped while Neverland and Kimetsu have grown to the point that the 3 are all pretty much at the same level.

and then there's the all the flops at the bottom too giving the magazine a weird balance.

top - OP, MHA, Haikyuu, Neverland, Kimetsu
mid - Black Clover, Dr Stone, WNL, Yuuna
new-ish and growing - Act-age, Jujutsu, Chainsawman
new flops - Yui, Beast, Shinobi, Taisei, Samurai 8?

it's pretty even at each tier, granted OP is really it's own lever and Black Clover is I think a little bigger than the other mids but still.

I think a better way to visualize this would be:
TOP: One Piece
HIGH: Neverland, MHA, Kimetsu, Haikyuu
UPPER MID: Black Clover
LOWER MID: Dr. Stone, We Never Learn, Jujutsu Kaisen, Act-age, Yuuna
BOTTOM: Yui Kamio, TSS, Double Taisei, Beast Children
TBD: Samurai 8, Yozakura, Mitama Security

 

[Ctkk]

Digital sales numbers or not, it is a demonstrable fact that the entire manga market took a big hit back in 2016. We could argue all day about the whys, but it happened. So it's not really fair to compare sales from now to sales from the last decade (or even the first half of this decade) when we know the situation is not the same.

 

[Mankichi Togawa]

 

[Caiops]

Yes it is impressive but have you not seen OP's Strong World Boost? AOT? Magi? TG? Haikyuu? KnB? You have a KNB avatar for crying out loud. Plenty of titles have done this, this type of boost isnt new.

I dont get why people are acting like Kimetsu is the first series to get a big boost of this scale when there's clearly other titles that did so & better. Maybe its because Kimetsu started out so small but then I would point towards Magi...I think Magi is the more recent series that resembles Kimetsu's success in the fact that Magi pre-anime sales did more or less the same as Kimetsu's pre-anime sales but Magi ended up with a bigger boost. I would argue Magi is a lot more impressive given that it's a Sunday title & I believe the anime sold just as well as Kimetsu's (plus the Magi anime wasnt adapted that well but decent enough I guess lol).

Magi boost wasn't that big.

Its impressive how the boost keep going and going for weeks.

 

[101nemesis]

Digital sales numbers or not, it is a demonstrable fact that the entire manga market took a big hit back in 2016. We could argue all day about the whys, but it happened. So it's not really fair to compare sales from now to sales from the last decade (or even the first half of this decade) when we know the situation is not the same.

It's not "demonstratable" in any form. The manga industry has been transitioning from print to digital.
It did not take a hit. On the contrary, it improved from 2015. See link below;

Link - Manga Market improved year on year in 2016 from 2015

People LOVE to say digital has made an impact but how much? Is it 50% like the market value? Is it 30% like Shuiesha's chief's statement from two separate years? You know, Shueisha, the ones who have the largest print circulation in Japan? Or is it 10% or 1%?

Lets look at a manga from almost a decade ago and now;
Toriko - Peak sales I can see is 480k a volume. Was widely considered to be extremely popular. Fun fact, some 15 chapters in, Toriko was placed right up in the front just behind the Big 3 for WSJ's double issue Joint Cover (something I don't think has happened with any new series from any returning acclaimed mangaka).
Had a peak print number of 570k (or similar) per volume
Kimetsu No Yaiba - It's latest volume crossed 500k. It's popularity level was nowhere near Toriko. Even right now, after its anime it hasn't exploded with popularity to the levels of MHA or TPN. Yet, KNY has a higher volume peak and it's print number would probably be between 600-650k which is closer to the likes of Reborn.

How does this fair under your assumption that the industry has taken a hit?

Quality work will get popular and sell equivalent to how great it is. Kingdom basically tripled or quadrupled its print sales in the past 5 years because its a fucking stellar series.
People like to say MHA never touched 1 million because of the era. No. Maybe MHA didn't touch 1 million because it only achieved what Reborn or D-Grayman achieved in levels of popularity. Stop assuming that because a series is SUPER popular outside Japan, it experiences the same level of popularity in it. Many assume MHA deserves 1 million because of how popular it is outside Japan which is such a wrong assumption.
Nakano himself stated two years ago that he wants a new pillar that sells more than a million a volume. Why would he state that if it was not achievable in this "declining era"? He has way more information than you at hand and way more experience.

Everyone needs to stop assuming stuff about digital without any information.

 

[vinceled]

I don't like the topic of digital sales since we dont have figures especially given how Shueisha chief's numbers are below the market average.
More over, I don't think people who've bought 30+ volumes of their fav series will just stop purchasing physical prints altogether. It would make sense if they start a new series and choose to go digital for those. If you collect physical stuff of anything, you'd want the whole set especially if you've already invested so much money already.

Yeah that makes sense. I must be weird since when I bought the physical volumes of some series and decided to just go digital because it's more convenient I just bought the volumes I already had one again.

 

[chrisbj]

Yaiba is closer to peak Gintama

 

[vinceled]

Just a question, did you think the first five volumes of a manga are sufficient to determine its quality ?

I usually give a series a maximum of three volumes to really know whether I really want to keep on reading it and support the author.
Even though I say that though I make a choice by the end of the first volume usually and if I have the magazine to follow the series then I keep on reading the series to the amount of chapter that equals that of three volumes.
If the series really interests me I end up supporting the author by buying the volumes otherwise I just read the series in the magazine or just drop it after two volumes. One example would be Gigant by the author of Gantz, I bought the first two volumes of the series because there was a sales on the set and just dropped the series after.

There are some series where I buy the volumes after seeing an interesting chapter in the magazine and that I buy a set of volumes and usually I keep following the series afterwards. One example would be Black Clover after I saw a really interesting chapter a while back with awesome action for the fight scene and bought the first 5 volumes set thinking I'd just read the series. I never went past the Seabed Temple Arc. So far that's the only series whose volumes I bought that I actually regret buying.

 

[SharkBait]

Spoiler: 43 TOC

43
Kimetsu no Yaiba (Cover/LCP)
Dr. Stone
One Piece
The Promised Neverland
Black Clover
We Never Learn (CP)
Jujutsu Kaisen
Mission: Yozakura Family
Haikyuu!!
Mitama Security
Yuuna and the Haunted Hotsprings
Haken Samurai (Oneshot/CP/43p) by Maeda Ryouhei
act-age
Chainsaw Man
Samurai 8: The Tale of Hachimaru
Yui Kamio Lets Loose
Double Taisei
Tokyo Shinobi Squad
Beast Children

44
Cover & LCP: One Piece
CP: Black Clover; Haikyuu!!; Jujutsu Kaisen

Spoiler: 43 TOC Image

Really commendable job on Haikyuu!! and BLack Clover's part. Additionally it is fantastic that both are receiving color pages next issue, though we have had a HQ one recently, it is nice to see again. Am hoping we are not getting some HQ is ending soon thing, I want it to last for so many more years to come.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

Did i really read that BNHA popularity only reached Reborn and D.Gray-Man level? kkkkkkk

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 18, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 18, 2019 ---

Samurai 8 Volume #01 & Volume #02 Cover

This is like beyond of what i expected, i kinda worried that Kishi and Ohkubo would go with the generic type of covers of just having Hachimaru in a cool pose but even in a small preview it looks fantastic, in my opinion best first covers with Chainsaw Man this year.

 

[Ctkk]

It's not "demonstratable" in any form. The manga industry has been transitioning from print to digital.
It did not take a hit. On the contrary, it improved from 2015. See link below;

Link - Manga Market improved year on year in 2016 from 2015

People LOVE to say digital has made an impact but how much? Is it 50% like the market value? Is it 30% like Shuiesha's chief's statement from two separate years? You know, Shueisha, the ones who have the largest print circulation in Japan? Or is it 10% or 1%?

Lets look at a manga from almost a decade ago and now;
Toriko - Peak sales I can see is 480k a volume. Was widely considered to be extremely popular. Fun fact, some 15 chapters in, Toriko was placed right up in the front just behind the Big 3 for WSJ's double issue Joint Cover (something I don't think has happened with any new series from any returning acclaimed mangaka).
Had a peak print number of 570k (or similar) per volume
Kimetsu No Yaiba - It's latest volume crossed 500k. It's popularity level was nowhere near Toriko. Even right now, after its anime it hasn't exploded with popularity to the levels of MHA or TPN. Yet, KNY has a higher volume peak and it's print number would probably be between 600-650k which is closer to the likes of Reborn.

How does this fair under your assumption that the industry has taken a hit?

Quality work will get popular and sell equivalent to how great it is. Kingdom basically tripled or quadrupled its print sales in the past 5 years because its a fucking stellar series.
People like to say MHA never touched 1 million because of the era. No. Maybe MHA didn't touch 1 million because it only achieved what Reborn or D-Grayman achieved in levels of popularity. Stop assuming that because a series is SUPER popular outside Japan, it experiences the same level of popularity in it. Many assume MHA deserves 1 million because of how popular it is outside Japan which is such a wrong assumption.
Nakano himself stated two years ago that he wants a new pillar that sells more than a million a volume. Why would he state that if it was not achievable in this "declining era"? He has way more information than you at hand and way more experience.

Everyone needs to stop assuming stuff about digital without any information.

Well, I was talking about the physical market specifically, i.e the Oricon numbers which is what's usually discussed here. That same article you linked explains that the growth comes from the digital side while physical is going down. The MHA argument would work if there was anything else reaching the million, but even Kingdom is far from that. And of course Nakano wants more million-sellers. Why wouldn't he? Doesn't mean he can get them. I mean, are you saying that all the stuff that's on-going just so happens to not be as popular as all the stuff from back then? That's a little odd.

Why would you compare Toriko to Kimetsu? What about KnB, AssClass, peak Haikyuu, even Naruto and Bleach were still around in the early 2010s. I remember what people used to say about Toriko: That jump was pushing it and the sales, while good, weren't as good as expected. That's the same discourse you see nowadays with Dr. Stone., with barely 100K. And yet, Toriko's sales are still far above most stuff in the magazine, while even the top dogs not called One Piece struggle to just stay above 500K.

To make a real comparison we should list the current best-sellers in order and compare them to the best-sellers from, say, 5 year ago, and see if the situation has changed or not.

 

[ChocoBar9]

Magi boost wasn't that big.

Its impressive how the boost keep going and going for weeks.

Because the anime is still running and they just restocked it. This happens most of the time. Now if it can pull a AOT and NnT and still sell at the same rate after the anime finishes then we'll see.

 

[SharkBait]

I dont really see it getting a boost and reaching those heights as no one has shown it charting on digital marketplaces, so it might just be incredibly front loaded with no lasting value.

 

[ChocoBar9]

Let's just say that October is going to be very interesting.

 

[SharkBait]

All print sales are down so any conclusions folks make will be ill-informed at best.

 

[Halloween]

New poll is up. This idea is again thanks to our anonymous volunteer.

This poll is different than the previous polls, as I'm finally allowing users the ability to change their votes.

You still only have a single vote, but you can change that vote freely at your own discretion.

 

[Caiops]

Enigma, it was cool.

RobotxLaserbeam anime would be bonkers!

 

[Jorden Rivera]

1000% Psyren. I love that manga to death.