Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2019] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[animeexpert]

BTW, just stumbled upon this on twitter:

That push still doesn't seem to be doing much...

I see in the middle row that at least one is taken

 

[Samael Morningstar]

Seems only two things can save kishimoto now -
1 . He needs editorial assistance (if it's true he hasn't taken any)
2. A Miracle
Or else going by how a average reader is I don't see how he's surviving that long, since he didn't even give a big start to retain the readers , he might get axed soon.

 

[James Rye]

That also depends on the prints. So far Samurai 8 seems to sell less than HZ, at least for Day 1, and HZ usually gets around 20-25k in its first week when a new volume gets on sale. If Jump printed around 50k for S8 then a sale of 20k is in their expectation. If however they printed 100k or even more then that would mean they expected far better sales for S8 so this means those kinda sale numbers were outside their expectation. Which makes sense given who is making a return, their huge promotion before relase and ofc the booklets in all other Jump releases this month to raise awareness on S8. I don't think we have heard yet how many volumes they printed for both vol1 and vol2 so far, right?

 

[Serinox]

2. A Miracle
Or else going by how a average reader is I don't see how he's surviving that long, since he didn't even give a big start to retain the readers , he might get axed soon.

Or, you know, the series goes the JJK/KNY/Act-Age route of starting slow and then continually working its way up. Apparently S8 has been getting better over time, so there is always a chance.

 

[Thundercat27]

That also depends on the prints. So far Samurai 8 seems to sell less than HZ, at least for Day 1, and HZ usually gets around 20-25k in its first week when a new volume gets on sale. If Jump printed around 50k for S8 then a sale of 20k is in their expectation. If however they printed 100k or even more then that would mean they expected far better sales for S8 so this means those kinda sale numbers were outside their expectation. Which makes sense given who is making a return, their huge promotion before relase and ofc the booklets in all other Jump releases this month to raise awareness on S8. I don't think we have heard yet how many volumes they printed for both vol1 and vol2 so far, right?

They printed at least 2 millions leaflets to advertise Samurai 8. There's no ways Shueisha content with 20k. They definitely must aim for 100k at least.

 

[Samael Morningstar]

Or, you know, the series goes the JJK/KNY/Act-Age route of starting slow and then continually working its way up. Apparently S8 has been getting better over time, so there is always a chance.

Expect no profit and anticipate all loses.
Furthermore If we always have people who will just always talk trash about S8 thus putting a negative image on the manga no matter how good the manga gets then we can't expect it to grow since people over internet first check the Reviews and then think of taking up a series

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 6, 2019, Original Post Date: Oct 6, 2019 ---

They printed at least 2 millions leaflets to advertise Samurai 8. There's no ways Shueisha content with 20k. They definitely must aim for 100k at least.

2 MILLION OMG. Where did you get that figure from

 

[sakuratt91]

Or, you know, the series goes the JJK/KNY/Act-Age route of starting slow and then continually working its way up. Apparently S8 has been getting better over time, so there is always a chance.

The other series didn't get so much hate as Samurai 8 in the beginning. Because of Jump's "genius marketing", Samurai 8 is disliked much more and laughed at.

 

[101nemesis]

Eh as much as negative hate and bandwagon-ing can be damaging. There is also a limit to it. If the series truly gets good to a point that it generates buzz and hype, people will start getting into it and the bandwagon-ing would slowly become a positive thing.
But Kishi has A LOT of work to do to reach there.

Also, that interview with the editor was just fucking cringy.

2 MILLION OMG. Where did you get that figure from

Assuming they put these pamphlets in the majority of the newly released WSJ volumes;
One Piece had a new volume, TPN has about 800-900k initial print most definitely, KNY has about 600-700k in initial print or more. It's not hard to assume 1.5 - 2 million of such pamphlets were printed.

 

[supercow297]

Ohba has always been kinda sketchy to me given how he treats some women in Death Note, and how in Bakuman it's explicitly stated IIRC the roles of women etc. I'm not one of those "ugh omg so problematiccc" types but you can definitely tell Ohba's views on many issues are still lodged in the past.

 

[James Rye]

2 mio. pamphlets would be pretty expensive. If Jump wants to get that money back solely on S8 sales then they must have expected a lot of buyers for their new series by a famous mangaka.

 

[Ebrietas-]

2 MILLION OMG. Where did you get that figure from

If they are included in every Jump volume on shelves right now the number should be much higher considering just One Piece would have more than 2 million on print.

 

[101nemesis]

I just read that Platinum End stuff and it seems Ohba is presenting his version of "victim blaming". Yeash.

2 mio. pamphlets would be pretty expensive. If Jump wants to get that money back solely on S8 sales then they must have expected a lot of buyers for their new series by a famous mangaka.

In their defense, it was not wrong of them to expect that. RxL first volume did pretty well for what it was, a golf manga.
But S8 sales seems to be tracking along the lines of Illegal Rare, which would be a HUGE disappointment.

 

[Konja9]

Ohba has always been kinda sketchy to me given how he treats some women in Death Note, and how in Bakuman it's explicitly stated IIRC the roles of women etc. I'm not one of those "ugh omg so problematiccc" types but you can definitely tell Ohba's views on many issues are still lodged in the past.

When I read that in Bakuman, it annoyed me at first, but I had to admit that he was probably right with many mangas shonen (although there is also many shonen with more complex female characters).

Also, shojo probably does something similar with its male characters.

 

[NeeNeen]

I just read that Platinum End stuff and it seems Ohba is presenting his version of "victim blaming". Yeash.

What do you mean? Who is he blaming?

 

[Ctkk]

Ohba has always been kinda sketchy to me given how he treats some women in Death Note, and how in Bakuman it's explicitly stated IIRC the roles of women etc. I'm not one of those "ugh omg so problematiccc" types but you can definitely tell Ohba's views on many issues are still lodged in the past.

I haven't read Bakuman, but Death Note has to be the worst handling of female characters I've seen in any manga (I haven't read that many, though). Like, even by the already not-good standards of shonen it's a whole other level of bad.

 

[tirakai]

I wonder if Bort hurt Samurai 8 too. This is supposed to be Kishi's big return but it doesn't really feel that way, since we've had a not very good sequel manga running the whole time after Naruto. Bort already got all the 'next big project' hype and gradually lost more and more of the fanbase.

Kuroko Extra Game for comparison kept up the same quality and had just enough content in-between with extra game and the final anime season to keep people excited, but with Bort we got overloaded on sub-par Naruto arcs on filler and I just wasn't excited about Kishi's next manga.

Just speaking personally it feels more like 'hey here's another companion series to Naruto that you don't really need to read' than 'here's my big entirely new story for the next generation'.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 6, 2019, Original Post Date: Oct 6, 2019 ---

Also it's lacking a twist to the MC kind of? Comparing to other modern wsj stuff

- in MHA Deku was gifted his power and also had to hurt himself badly to use it at the start
- in Black Clover Asta has anti magic that counters everyone else's powers
- in Kimetsu Tanjirou's always carrying his mute demon sister around with him (and has the weird smell thing)
- in Jujutsu Kaisen Itadori has the usual super evil mode thing (although it kind of feels like everyone's the main character here, rather than one getting the main focus)
- in Chainsawman Denji is just a complete and utter weirdo
- Samurai 8 though feels like it's lacking a core hook to the main character, the MC's backstory was unique but that was wrapped up right away, so now he's just the same as all the other samurai in the series and even though he's the main central focus of the series he doesn't really stand out among the cast

 

[shoyoboyo]

Furthermore If we always have people who will just always talk trash about S8 thus putting a negative image on the manga no matter how good the manga gets then we can't expect it to grow since people over internet first check the Reviews and then think of taking up a series

that isn't really true, black clover is a clear example of a manga that started off shaky and was trashed from the beginning, yet it was still able to grow into a solid and successful series

 

[Samael Morningstar]

To be honest if Ryuu would have been the MC of S8 that would have been great, I mean his quest to find who is really is he would have been great, Hachimaru is not a bad MC he has a nice back story and everything's fine and looking at him he isn't complete yet to match up with other MC's like you mentioned it's just shown that he's a false key and much more is still there to be discovered about him so after everything we can say what is he as a whole.

I wonder if Bort hurt Samurai 8 too. This is supposed to be Kishi's big return but it doesn't really feel that way, since we've had a not very good sequel manga running the whole time after Naruto. Bort already got all the 'next big project' hype and gradually lost more and more of the fanbase.

Kuroko Extra Game for comparison kept up the same quality and had just enough content in-between with extra game and the final anime season to keep people excited, but with Bort we got overloaded on sub-par Naruto arcs on filler and I just wasn't excited about Kishi's next manga.

Just speaking personally it feels more like 'hey here's another companion series to Naruto that you don't really need to read' than 'here's my big entirely new story for the next generation'.

--- Double Post Merged, Oct 6, 2019, Original Post Date: Oct 6, 2019 ---

Also it's lacking a twist to the MC kind of? Comparing to other modern wsj stuff

- in MHA Deku was gifted his power and also had to hurt himself badly to use it at the start
- in Black Clover Asta has anti magic that counters everyone else's powers
- in Kimetsu Tanjirou's always carrying his mute demon sister around with him (and has the weird smell thing)
- in Jujutsu Kaisen Itadori has the usual super evil mode thing (although it kind of feels like everyone's the main character here, rather than one getting the main focus)
- in Chainsawman Denji is just a complete and utter weirdo
- Samurai 8 though feels like it's lacking a core hook to the main character, the MC's backstory was unique but that was wrapped up right away, so now he's just the same as all the other samurai in the series and even though he's the main central focus of the series he doesn't really stand out among the cast

 

[Thundercat27]

2 MILLION OMG. Where did you get that figure from

Most people in this thread can calculate that easily. Under 1 mil for one piece, another 1 mil for 2 manga above 500k, kny and tpn, 200k for soma (it's still 200k seller, right?), few hundred thousands for 100k sellers, bc and jjk, and not to forget csm, bort (xd), yuuna, 20k from sumo (xd) and bazillion of jump+ releases, which means 300k for sxf. That's more than 2 million.

It's somewhat funny bort is possible to sell more than s8.

 

[Leoat12]

Most people in this thread can calculate that easily. Under 1 mil for one piece, another 1 mil for 2 manga above 500k, kny and tpn, 200k for soma (it's still 200k seller, right?), few hundred thousands for 100k sellers, bc and jjk, and not to forget csm, bort (xd), yuuna, 20k from sumo (xd) and bazillion of jump+ releases, which means 300k for sxf. That's more than 2 million.

It's somewhat funny bort is possible to sell more than s8.

One Piece print numbers are above 2 million alone, your calculation is wrong.