Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2020] - Discussion and ToC Talk

[Shinuki no Reborn]

MANGAHELPERS "TOC" POLL ISSUE #51 - VOTING!​

The poll for issue #51 is now open, vote for your favorite chapters of the week clicking HERE!

Alongside the release of Sakamoto Days, the extra series this week are:

-Dragon Ball Super 66
-Boruto: Naruto Next Generations 52
-Ghost Reaper Girl 10

Good Votes!

 

[Halloween]

Moderator Notice:
Henceforth, I will be deleting posts that complain about Weekly Shonen Jump having too many/not enough gag/battle/exorcism/sports/etc series.

These posts are not insightful, and do not meaningfully contribute to this thread. Also, this decision is not up for discussion, so posts discussing this decision will also be deleted.~ Halloween

 

[Ryuusei]

Spoiler: 52 TOC & 01 Preview

呪 僕 O マ ブ S C D 破 C B 夜 C 僕 あ 灼 ぼ チ 高 ア 森 A 仄 ぼ 次号カラー ヒロアカ アンデラ 夜桜 約ネバ 道産子 GIGA 岸本先生が描くコラボポスター 爆豪クリアファイル

Spoiler: Issue #52 ToC & Preview

Jujutsu Kaisen (Cover & LCP)
My Hero Academia
One Piece
Mashle
Black Clover
Sakamoto Days (CP)
Dr. Stone
Magu-chan: God of Destruction (CP)
Build King
Mission: Yozakura Family
Me & Roboco
Ayakashi Triangle (CP)
Shakunetsu no Niraikanai
We Never Learn
Chainsaw Man
Koukousei Kazoku
Undead Unluck
Moriking
Agravity Boys
Honomieru Shounen
Bokura no Ketsumei

Issue #1
Cover & LCP: My Hero Academia
CP: Undead Unluck, Mission: Yozakura Family, The Promised Neverland, Dosanko Gyaru wa Namaramenkoi

GIGA Preview
Collab poster by Kishimoto
Bakugou clear file

 

[Halloween]

what you're using is a real life thing.

Sexual assault is a real life thing. Women experience it every second of every day. We shouldn't normalize it, regardless if it's fictional.

You guys can keep bringing up ultra violence as a counter, but that's not something that actually occurs to the vast majority of people. Suspension of disbelief is a thing, and killing devils is way easier to accept as "not real" than a girl getting groped against her will.

Like, I already said I'll check the first chapter out, but that groping definitely isn't a good look, regardless. Yes, fiction and all, but you have to remember that women in Japan are conditioned a certain way, to think a certain way. Using Japan as a barometer might not be the best strategy if you're going to resort to whataboutism.

 

[Rain Spectre]

Let me add something to this and point out this article about Japan's sexual harassment problem:

Lifting the lid on Japan's harassment problem | NHK WORLD-JAPAN News

New research from Japan has highlighted how much sexual harassment there is affecting the lives of ordinary people. Seventy percent of women responding to a survey say they have been targeted in some way in public.

www3.nhk.or.jp

Now, friends, try to argue to me that having manga characters who act like that and are still treated as heroes (Roshi and Sanji anyone) doesn't feed back into this.

Let's also not forget the stories about how Harenchi Gakuen caused such a pandemic of skirt-flipping at elementary schools that Shueisha was forced to cancel the manga.

 

[Aeneas]

English translator for Undead.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

Sexual assault is a real life thing. Women experience it every second of every day. We shouldn't normalize it, regardless if it's fictional.

You guys can keep bringing up ultra violence as a counter, but that's not something that actually occurs to the vast majority of people. Suspension of disbelief is a thing, and that killing devils is way easier to accept as "not real" than a girl getting groped against her will.

Like, I already said I'll check the first chapter out, but that groping definitely isn't a good look, regardless. Yes, fiction and all, but you have to remember that women in Japan are conditioned a certain way, to think a certain way. Using Japan as a barometer might not be the best strategy if you're going to resort to whataboutism.

You see, exactly like i said my earlier post, everytime someone trying to bring something different that is just not the same tone and the same opinions, here it goes the "woman this and woman that" as if someone is even trying to argue that its okay to do it

Violence and murdering are as much realistic thing that sexual assault, and worse too, but of course the western society will act like is nothing anormal because this is how it's build here, specially USA, people are so used to violence and death, and the glorification of it in all forms of media that is just something "normal" and even "cool", and i doubt it will ever change.

Again, i think discussing sex and discussing violence is two completely different things.

It goes back to the rule of writing of “don’t include things like assault or rape in your stories because it tends to make people uncomfortable”.

I see nothing weird wanting to write a story about say, a guy who fights demons with chainsaws. It’s fantasy. No one ACTUALLY believes they can do that, nor does anyone actually want to live in a world where they have to survive by fighting demons with a chainsaw. It’s just a fun story. People tend to write and create stories of things they find cool or fun.

But if we’re talking say, something like Ero-Manga Sensei. A series that features a 10 year old girl who wears lingerie and talks about sex. What reason would some desire to make something like that? What’s fun and cool about that? I’m not going to necessarily say that creating such a series means they’re a predator. But it’s very questionable that someone would even think about making that as a series.

And going back to Undead Unluck to stay on topic with Jump series. The entire appeal of echii and fan service is that the writer and readers find said fan service hot. Does writing sexual assault mean that you’ll go out and sexually assault someone in real life? No. But the fact that you’re actively thinking up stories of a girl being assaulted and not writing it in a negative light means that you like find something appealing about it to include it in your story

It all just comes down to the original thing i said, the ability of separating fiction from reality, even more when we're talking about things drawn in a paper, in the end of the day its all fiction, don't exist and consuming it doesn't necessarily correlate with what you think or like in real life, most importantly, should not be used to judge people or artists.

 

[Halloween]

@Shinuki no Reborn

Do you not understand that sexual assault is closer to reality than demon killing is? Yes, in this case, both are fictional. However, again, one hits closer to home.

And I'm not arguing that reading this manga is going to increase sexual assault. It doesn't need to increase for it to be a bad thing. It just needs to normalize.

 

[Rain Spectre]

Let me say this very, very bluntly.

There is a giant goddamn difference between having gore in manga, and having a literal sex offender as a heroic protagonist.

Unless this is something like Rance where the point is that the "hero" is as unheroic as you can get, I seriously don't see how any argument can be made here. Especially in a manga directed to teenagers.

 

[savethecat]

You see, exactly like i said my earlier post, everytime someone trying to bring something different that is just not the same tone and the same opinions, here it goes the "woman this and woman that" as if someone is even trying to argue that its okay to do it

Violence and murdering are as much realistic thing that sexual assault, and worse too, but of course the western society will act like is nothing anormal because this is how it's build here, specially USA, people are so used to violence and death, and the glorification of it in all forms of media that is just something "normal" and even "cool", and i doubt it will ever change.



It all just comes down to the original thing i said, the ability of separating fiction from reality, even more when we're talking about things drawn in a paper, in the end of the day its all fiction, don't exist and consuming it doesn't necessarily correlate with what you think or like in real life, most importantly, should not be used to judge people or artists.

It’s fine to separate fiction from reality if you want.
But just because it’s fiction doesn’t many that readers are obligated to have a “everything flies because it’s fiction” mentality.
Readers not wanting their series to contain that content is a valid criticism.

And being concerned that a magazine made for children(and also has female readers) contains a manga where the lead female is assaulted against her will is a very valid concern as well. It doesn’t matter if it’s the same magazine that has Yuna and had To Love Ru. There are ppl wondering why those are in a kids magazine too. Even in Japan Yuuna caused controversy.

 

[Halloween]

Everyone, this topic of discussion is starting to get a bit too heated.

Let's call it quits for now. I'm not saying the subject is off limits, just that we should let it rest for a little while.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

@Shinuki no Reborn

Do you not understand that sexual assault is closer to reality than demon killing is? Yes, in this case, both are fictional. However, again, one hits closer to home.

And I'm not arguing that reading this manga is going to increase sexual assault. It doesn't need to increase for it to be a bad thing. It just needs to normalize.

So if the "sexual assault" was with a fairy, furry or whatever other more human looking female it wouldn't be a real problem? honestly asking.

And i'm not arguing about anything being something that have to be taken as normal, just that there are a lot of overreactions about a 2d fictional girl drawn in a paper as if it's something "Wow Oh my God, thats so terrible waaah", like seriously, is just going in circles right now since no one think is something nice to do.

It’s fine to separate fiction from reality if you want.
But just because it’s fiction doesn’t many that readers are obligated to have a “everything flies because it’s fiction” mentality.
Readers not wanting their series to contain that content is a valid criticism.

And being concerned that a magazine made for children(and also has female readers) contains a manga where the lead female is assaulted against her will is a very valid concern as well. It doesn’t matter if it’s the same magazine that has Yuna and had To Love Ru. There are ppl wondering why those are in a kids magazine too. Even in Japan Yuuna caused controversy.

Yeah its okay to people make valid criticism or be worried about certain things being published in certain places, but there's the line between making valid criticism or showing concern and trying to actively point fingers and dictate what is problematic or not and making judgements based in unrealistic and fictional stuff, thats the original meaning of my posts, for me the author of Undead Unluck could go without the groping stuff, don't really find funny but i will not try to shut him down or censor his vision because a group of people is outraged or offended over a detail of the series, thats how it happens a lot here in the west.

 

[savethecat]

You see, exactly like i said my earlier post, everytime someone trying to bring something different that is just not the same tone and the same opinions, here it goes the "woman this and woman that" as if someone is even trying to argue that its okay to do it

Violence and murdering are as much realistic thing that sexual assault, and worse too, but of course the western society will act like is nothing anormal because this is how it's build here, specially USA, people are so used to violence and death, and the glorification of it in all forms of media that is just something "normal" and even "cool", and i doubt it will ever change.



It all just comes down to the original thing i said, the ability of separating fiction from reality, even more when we're talking about things drawn in a paper, in the end of the day its all fiction, don't exist and consuming it doesn't necessarily correlate with what you think or like in real life, most importantly, should not be used to judge people or artists.

Also violence IS a concern in US media.
There was a time where Call Of Duty games caused a huge uproar in 2009 when Modern Warfare had a level where the player had to commit a mass shooting. They had to add a “warning” message before playing the level, and also gave the option for players to skip the level if they wanted before release because of the backlash. In the remaster the removed it altogether

And this wasn’t a “video games make people violent” controversy. This was something the genuinely made people uncomfortable because it was very real. It felt real, and it disturbing because mass shootings in that manner is very real.

None of the violence in any Shonen Jump series feels real. Non of the violence in ANY popular action property, whether it’s Marvel, DC, Star Wars, etc. feels real. It’s all feels like fantasy, and is an escape from the real world, which is why there’s no controversy about Goku blowing up an evil alien with a giant energy beam.

Another thing you don’t point out is that most of Jump’s action series depict a unrealistic violence between a heroic characters fighting evil. Which fulfills a lot of people’s fantasies where we could just beat up all of the evil in the world with superpowers. That or tournament arcs, where the idea of leaving in a world where your friends can have friendly fights with each other using superpowers sounds pretty fun.

 

[Rain Spectre]

Sooooo, appealing to Buranchi's request to end this debate, how about we discuss this question:

Do you guys think the lack of securiety regarding its survival is why a lot of series fail? Like, a lot of people likely don't want to invest in a series that might get axed in 3-4 volumes.

 

[101nemesis]

Sooooo, appealing to Buranchi's request to end this debate, how about we discuss this question:

Do you guys think the lack of securiety regarding its survival is why a lot of series fail? Like, a lot of people likely don't want to invest in a series that might get axed in 3-4 volumes.

Confused. Are you asking if the readers wouldn't wanna get invested? Because if readers get invested, itll show in the polls and ranking surveys and thereby extend the series. Both are linked.

 

[Aipom626]

Akagi Shun who's perhaps better known is a twitter artist released a oneshot on Jump Plus yesterday

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魔法学校に通う少女・ライラは、膨大な魔力を持つも使いこなせないのが悩み。ある日訪れた大魔法図書館にて、1冊の絵本に出会い——。

shonenjumpplus.com

also today oneshot is pretty good, kinda remind me of Bakuman and Food Wars (if they focused on painting instead of cooking)

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学業成績超優秀の天乃は美術の課題で「自分」を描くことに。だが勉学以外の能力は皆無の天乃は…!?「描くこと」を巡る劇的青春ドラマ読切32P!!

shonenjumpplus.com

seems like the artist is influenced by Araki so the art is pretty stylized, i think it's cool

Both of these oneshots were pretty interesting, and had some fascinating art styles. I really loved how clean and bubbly the first one was, while the second one had some pretty quirky art style shifts that really worked for me.

Here are today's oneshot and the 2 others from the 2 days prior to the ones Mammo posted. I believe there's one more that will be posted tomorrow from what I can tell from the preview image. Most of them seemed like they had pretty interesting art styles that didn't really feel like things you'd typically find in WSJ, which made them at least a bit interesting to tab through.

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現代日本。「孤独死」の増加により東京は地縛霊で溢れていた!!そんな迷える魂を導くのは、モテない・金ない・家もない青年・恐山風太郎!?遊玄ファンタジー、ここに開幕!!

shonenjumpplus.com

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童貞で不良な勇人には可愛い彼女がいた。そんな彼女・華奈は青春を謳歌する普通の女子高生…ではなく格闘マニアの超戦闘型！貞操争う恋のバトル開始！

shonenjumpplus.com

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自然大国で暮らす青年・オダマキは、父親を殺した「自然」を憎んでいた。そこに「庭師」のエリカと助手のナズナがやってきて…!?

shonenjumpplus.com

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

Also violence IS a concern in US media.
There was a time where Call Of Duty games caused a huge uproar in 2009 when Modern Warfare had a level where the player had to commit a mass shooting. They had to add a “warning” message before playing the level, and also gave the option for players to skip the level if they wanted before release because of the backlash. In the remaster the removed it altogether

And this wasn’t a “video games make people violent” controversy. This was something the genuinely made people uncomfortable because it was very real. It felt real, and it disturbing because mass shootings in that manner is very real.

None of the violence in any Shonen Jump series feels real. Non of the violence in ANY popular action property, whether it’s Marvel, DC, Star Wars, etc. feels real. It’s all feels like fantasy, and is an escape from the real world, which is why there’s no controversy about Goku blowing up an evil alien with a giant energy beam.

Another thing you don’t point out is that most of Jump’s action series depict a unrealistic violence between a heroic characters fighting evil. Which fulfills a lot of people’s fantasies where we could just beat up all of the evil in the world with superpowers. That or tournament arcs, where the idea of leaving in a world where your friends can have friendly fights with each other using superpowers sounds pretty fun.

Of course that i don't mean no one in the media cares about violence since the thing that media most do is arguing about gun control and stuff, what i mean is that is something seen, not only by the media but the public too, as quite normal and cool, there's a real culture of glorification of violence in the western entertainment and in the opposite, a growing rejection of sexual content (of any type), this is why the constant "double standard" comments, because is something that really happens today and is getting worse by the day.

The same argument with the "fake" violence can be made at Undead Unluck, it's a comedy and action series about a zombie guy that will probably touch the girls breast one or two times in the chapter, the girl will not like in the beginning but will blush, the zombie guy will save her and she will start to get feelings for him, what it feels "real" in any of it? it's like Meliodas with Elizabeth, it would feel much more real if this was a school series about real life people and etc, not a fantasy series, this is why i honestly can't get outraged at this.

 

[savethecat]

Of course that i don't mean no one in the media cares about violence since the thing that media most do is arguing about gun control and stuff, what i mean is that is something seen, not only by the media but the public too, as quite normal and cool, there's a real culture of glorification of violence in the western entertainment and in the opposite, a growing rejection of sexual content (of any type), this is why the constant "double standard" comments, because is something that really happens today and is getting worse by the day.

The same argument with the "fake" violence can be made at Undead Unluck, it's a comedy and action series about a zombie guy that will probably touch the girls breast one or two times in the chapter, the girl will not like in the beginning but will blush, the zombie guy will save her and she will start to get feelings for him, what it feels "real" in any of it? it's like Meliodas with Elizabeth, it would feel much more real if this was a school series about real life people and etc, not a fantasy series, this is why i honestly can't get outraged at this.

I don’t want to linger on the topic too much longer since it was requested that it be stopped.

But in this case the action is what feels real. Not the setting.
In the COD example I gave. If you replaced the human people with Vampires wielding machine guns, it would still be upsetting because mass shootings is a very real act of violence.
And even then, again, violence is different than sex. Violence can be included in a story with the narrative purpose of making readers uncomfortable. There aren’t many scenarios where assault can have narrative purpose within the story, especially when it’s a comical gag.

But that’ll be my final statement on this.

 

[Ryuusei]

#1 The Promised Neverland 17
#2 One Piece 95
#3 Haikyuu!! 41
#4 Spy x Family 3
#7 Kimetsu no Yaiba 17
#8 Kimetsu no Yaiba 16
#9 Kimetsu no Yaiba 15
#10 Kimetsu no Yaiba 14
#11 Kimetsu no Yaiba 13
#12 Kimetsu no Yaiba 1
#13 Kimetsu no Yaiba 12
#14 Black Clover 23
#15 Kimetsu no Yaiba 2
#16 Jujutsu Kaisen 8
#17 Jujutsu Kaisen 9
#18 Kimetsu no Yaiba 3
#19 Kimetsu no Yaiba 4
#20 Boruto 10
#22 World's End Harem 10
#26 We Never Learn 15
#27 Kimetsu no Yaiba 5
#29 Kimetsu no Yaiba 6
#31 Chainsaw Man 5
#32 Kimetsu no Yaiba 18
#35 Kimetsu no Yaiba 11
#36 Kimetsu no Yaiba 10
#37 Kimetsu no Yaiba 9
#38 Kimetsu no Yaiba 7
#39 Kimetsu no Yaiba 8
#40 Spy x Family 2
#42 Spy x Family 1
#43 Kimetsu no Yaiba Official Fanbook

 

[TxxT]

Oricon Weekly Ranking - 01/06~01/12

Even with less days Volume 41 is doing much better than the previous 2 volumes

Haikyu!! #39: 356,785 (12 days)
Haikyu!! #40: 329,923 (10 days)
Haikyu!! #41: 372,767 (9 days)

Also another big drop for this One Piece volume, I'm gonna say Kimetsu surpasses it next month

 

[Ryuusei]

TPN 17 is doing slightly better than the previous volume so it'll probably cross the 500k figure within weeks. HQ 41 is also doing better than the previous volume, the difference being 43k so things are looking better for this one for now at least. It looks like OP 95 will have a similar performance to OP 92, but it could be worse, it all depends on the upcoming weeks (and KNY 18 and this year's new volumes will orobably all pass it). Nothing to say on KNY, still a beast. SXF 3 did in 2 weeks what SXF 2 did in over 5 weeks, this series really is huge already. The difference between JJK and BC this week ended up being minimal, but while BC is slightly behind the previous volume (6k), JJK is ahead by almost 30k with both new volumes. WNL is doing better than the previous volume (10k difference) and so is CSM (17k difference), hopefully the latter will be hitting the 100k figure within 2 weeks soon.

 

[Rain Spectre]

TPN 17 is doing slightly better than the previous volume so it'll probably cross the 500k figure within weeks. HQ 41 is also doing better than the previous volume, the difference being 43k so things are looking better for this one for now at least. It looks like OP 95 will have a similar performance to OP 92, but it could be worse, it all depends on the upcoming weeks (and KNY 18 and this year's new volumes will orobably all pass it). Nothing to say on KNY, still a beast. SXF 3 did in 2 weeks what SXF 2 did in over 5 weeks, this series really is huge already. The difference between JJK and BC this week ended up being minimal, but while BC is slightly behind the previous volume, JJK is ahead by almost 30k with both new volumes. WNL is doing better than the previous volume (10k difference) and so is CSM (17k difference), hopefully the latter will be hitting the 100k figure within 2 weeks soon.

Good news for everyone then!

 

[Ryuusei]

Good news for everyone then!

Yeah, a good week for Jump series in general, only BC and OP are depending more on the following weeks.