Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2020] - Discussion and ToC Talk

[Shinuki no Reborn]

MANGAHELPERS "TOC" POLL ISSUE #51 - VOTING!​

The poll for issue #51 is now open, vote for your favorite chapters of the week clicking HERE!

Alongside the release of Sakamoto Days, the extra series this week are:

-Dragon Ball Super 66
-Boruto: Naruto Next Generations 52
-Ghost Reaper Girl 10

Good Votes!

 

[Halloween]

Moderator Notice:
Henceforth, I will be deleting posts that complain about Weekly Shonen Jump having too many/not enough gag/battle/exorcism/sports/etc series.

These posts are not insightful, and do not meaningfully contribute to this thread. Also, this decision is not up for discussion, so posts discussing this decision will also be deleted.~ Halloween

 

[Ryuusei]

Spoiler: 52 TOC & 01 Preview

呪 僕 O マ ブ S C D 破 C B 夜 C 僕 あ 灼 ぼ チ 高 ア 森 A 仄 ぼ 次号カラー ヒロアカ アンデラ 夜桜 約ネバ 道産子 GIGA 岸本先生が描くコラボポスター 爆豪クリアファイル

Spoiler: Issue #52 ToC & Preview

Jujutsu Kaisen (Cover & LCP)
My Hero Academia
One Piece
Mashle
Black Clover
Sakamoto Days (CP)
Dr. Stone
Magu-chan: God of Destruction (CP)
Build King
Mission: Yozakura Family
Me & Roboco
Ayakashi Triangle (CP)
Shakunetsu no Niraikanai
We Never Learn
Chainsaw Man
Koukousei Kazoku
Undead Unluck
Moriking
Agravity Boys
Honomieru Shounen
Bokura no Ketsumei

Issue #1
Cover & LCP: My Hero Academia
CP: Undead Unluck, Mission: Yozakura Family, The Promised Neverland, Dosanko Gyaru wa Namaramenkoi

GIGA Preview
Collab poster by Kishimoto
Bakugou clear file

 

[Stivie]

This ending for Kimetsu hasn't been bad as other series I agree, but there is some things that are still questionable for how this finale was ended. I think a lot of people are more upset that the series especially with how well it was selling, would still go on for quite a while.

I think he is way above average.
In my opinion, anyone complaining just wanted a tragic ending. But even Tokyo ghoul had a happy ending and it was published in a seinen magazine.

 

[Dellinger]

Unless MHA can have an arc as big as MF then I don’t see how it will rise in popularity. OP got such a boost back then because of Odas involvement in SW and MF which was the climax of pre skip OP, like hundreds of chapters of build up. I personally don’t think MHA can do it, it’s narrative personally for me while not bad, it’s not anything great either. I don’t think people can really fawn over a bunch of teenage kids for a cast and such a lame antagonist in Shigaraki

 

[haijihusbando]

Unless MHA can have an arc as big as MF then I don’t see how it will rise in popularity. OP got such a boost back then because of Odas involvement in SW and MF which was the climax of pre skip OP, like hundreds of chapters of build up. I personally don’t think MHA can do it, it’s narrative personally for me while not bad, it’s not anything great either. I don’t think people can really fawn over a bunch of teenage kids for a cast and such a lame antagonist in Shigaraki

Thing is, MHA could have all factors stacked up in its favour - a well-written, large-scale and impactful arc, well-received movies, popular anime/franchise - in the exact same way as One Piece in 2011 and it still wouldn't be guaranteed the same success at all, even if it was on a similar pre-Marineford sales trajectory. It's been said here multiple times but the success of the like of OP and KnY can't be replicated purely by circumstances.
Obviously those factors are likely to increase sales but the extent of the increase is very unpredictable with these older series who more often than not have already hit a peak- unlike newer series, like JJK, which would experience a much more drastic and obvious growth if put under those same conditions of popularity.

 

[Tamil]

Congrats on the 60 mill Kimetsu. I was wrong and the 100 million milestone is becoming more of a reality now.

--- Double Post Merged, May 6, 2020, Original Post Date: May 6, 2020 ---

That push meme, it was annoying back in the day where ppl were saying that KnY was being pushed to death before the anime and during the anime. I never saw an attempt from them to make KnY a huge seller. It just happened.

No series has gotten pushed to death aside from like Toriko but KnY definitely got its push and was an attempt to make it a huge seller (depending on how you define a huge seller)

 

[Rain Spectre]

Writeup from famed author Tanaka Romeo (the one who gave us Cross Channel) about Jump. Specifically gives reccomendations for Kimetsu, Jigokuraku and Chainsaw:

シミルボン

shimirubon.jp

 

[pamuchi]

Congrats on the 60 mill Kimetsu. I was wrong and the 100 million milestone is becoming more of a reality now.

--- Double Post Merged, May 6, 2020, Original Post Date: May 6, 2020 ---

No series has gotten pushed to death aside from like Toriko but KnY definitely got its push and was an attempt to make it a huge seller (depending on how you define a huge seller)

Sure, but maybe their intentions were to get it to Bc or tpn/MHA level, but not to the extent of rivalizing op.

Well, if you ask me, Dr stone had more "push" during that year comparing to the rest.

 

[101nemesis]

Here's data when series hit 20 volumes and its circulation numbers back then

Togashi is a true legend. I'm more impressed by Togashi than KNY. Consistency between multiple series is hard but Togashi is a true legend. Hope he takes all the time he needs to finish HxH

Ok, so onto another question: Should Jump make a big, Strong World-push for MHA in the next two or three years? If they do, could they pull it off and finally reach that 1M seller status?

*sigh* Call it a gut feeling, but I feel that MHA may get a Strong World-like campaign at some point. That's why I said its ceiling may not be what it is now.

Here's the thing. I was rooting for MHA to hit a million per volume by Season 3. But the boost never came. S3 was (in my opinion) MHA's biggest opportunity to gain more fans. The story and fights, especially for the first half of S3, were it's absolute peak and the anime adapted these so well. But the boost never went beyond a certain amount.
It's not wrong to think MHA might be able to do more and I would have agreed if it wasn't declining in spite of a well done S4. Had it been stable, I would definitely think it needed ONE more PLUS ULTRA push to get it to that 1 million per volume mark.
However, there is no excuse for MHA's lack of growth in S4 or even lack of stabilization. It has a solid anime and people still really liked those arcs. So the fact that it declines despite a well done seasonal anime means it's definitely past it's actual peak.

Comparisons to One Piece's movie growth is not possible since OP had it's biggest and arguably the most important arc at that point in the manga with incredible reception. The attention it got from the movie came at the right time. So there was a lot of buzz around the series in general. This wouldn't have been the case had the attention from the movie come at another point in the manga.

Kingdom is another example of getting another push and succeeding but that's probably because Kingdom's original anime was pretty meh. I think Kingdom thoroughly deserves to be where it is right now, if not more. This is the bare minimum I expected Kingdom's series to have as sales and I'm happy it got that.

I think MHA lost it's opportunity to get to 1 million. It doesn't take anything away from the potential legacy of the series tho. New mangaka are already looking up to the series as their inspiration. It's legacy in WSJ and manga is set in stone.

I agree with others and think JJK and CSM deserve pushes from WSJ. JJK has every potential to be THE NEXT BIG THING in WSJ. As long as it doesn't get a Toei adaptation, it'll be fine.

 

[savethecat]

In all honesty, I don't even think it's that close.

One Piece best year is 37.9m

KNY's best year about to be way over 50 000 000 sales. I'd say somewhere between 70m and 80m.

I'm a One Piece fan, but I'm not blinded either, those numbers just don't lie...

I think Sales aren’t reflective of “what’s more popular” when when reach extremes numbers like this.

Your completely ignoring factors such as inflation, and the fact that the market is completely different eras. Different kind of competition, different audience, etc.

While Demon Slayer has beat One Piece’s records, it doesn’t mean that it’s currently biggerer than One Piece has every been. and this is even ignoring the international aspect. No matter how much Demon slayer has sold this year, it’s has not beaten Dragon Ball’s international popularity. In the West you couldn’t escape dragon ball merch and kids trying to do the kamehameha in the late 90s-mid 2000s.

 

[101nemesis]

In all honesty, I don't even think it's that close.

One Piece best year is 37.9m

KNY's best year about to be way over 50 000 000 sales. I'd say somewhere between 70m and 80m.

I'm a One Piece fan, but I'm not blinded either, those numbers just don't lie...

Pretty sure KNY's legacy isn't directly correlated to its sales. Yes, it's selling huge amounts. But the impact it leaves behind will need to be studied at a later time, years later. Whereas OP's legacy as arguably the most important manga for WSJ (in competition with something like DBZ and SD) is set in stone.

KNY's legacy could be like Yu Yu Hakusho, well respected and loved but not considered as big as some other series in terms of legacy. Or it could be considered similar to Death Note. We don't know. We will need to wait and see how the Japanese considers it years later.

 

[Ctkk]

I think the Strong World boost was just another lightning in a bottle. The promotion for the film coincided with the major events in the manga which was the Marineford War arc. The story was reaching the climax of the Rescue Ace saga which I imagine many people wanted to get caught up as quick as they could to follow the latest events at the time.

We can’t say for sure another major film promotion for an established series would follow another huge sales boost since the market is unpredictable. If MHA does get something akin to Strong World hype then hopefully it can follow suit for Horikoshi and Jump.

This is it. The fact that the Kimetsu anime came with the manga at its climax is probably a big factor. Think about it. KnY was a recent series with comparatively modest sales. OP was a decade-long million seller. The two couldn't be more different when their respective boosts happened. But they do have something in common: They were in big climatic moments in the manga when they got the promotion of the anime/Strong World.

 

[Ryuusei]

Unless MHA can have an arc as big as MF then I don’t see how it will rise in popularity. OP got such a boost back then because of Odas involvement in SW and MF which was the climax of pre skip OP, like hundreds of chapters of build up. I personally don’t think MHA can do it, it’s narrative personally for me while not bad, it’s not anything great either. I don’t think people can really fawn over a bunch of teenage kids for a cast and such a lame antagonist in Shigaraki

Right, like most of the successful manga published in shounen (which is aimed at teenagers) magazines hasn't had a cast comprised mostly of teenagers. Would be too absurd, truly. Maybe I got confused and half of the Straw Hats weren't teenagers before the timeskip too.

 

[savethecat]

I personally believe a huge factor in One Piece’s hug strong world boost was the series’ length. It was in the sweet spot of having a lot of volumes that would excite ppl into jumping in, but wasn’t yet at the point where it had too many volumes and intimidated people from getting into it.

The word of mouth of the hyped arc, plus the movie, had ppl Likely buying them in bulk. Luck was still an insanely hug factor.

And not saying this will likely happen. But assuming MHA ran, for say 40+ volumes with no sign of ending yet, I could see a hyped enough arc, with the anime adapting said arc, giving it another boost. That or a well done time skip that brings ppl that fell off the series back into it

 

[redon]

Speaking about print numbers, I remembered these pages from The Asahi Shimbun newspaper with all One Piece print numbers from 1997 to 2014.

End of 1997: One Piece Volume 1 (24/12/1997) 300,000 copies.
End of 1998: 6,000,000 copies (6 Volumes).
End of 1999: 17,000,000 copies (11 Volumes). One Piece Anime started in October 1999.
End of 2000: 37,000,000 copies (16 Volumes). First print of new One Piece Volumes around 800,000 copies thanks to the Anime.
End of 2001: 54,000,000 copies (21 Volumes).
End of 2002: 73,000,000 copies (26 Volumes).
End of 2003: 90,000,000 copies (31 Volumes).
End of 2004: 99,000,000 copies (35 Volumes). First print of new One Piece Volumes went down for the first time.
End of 2005: 112,000,000 copies (39 Volumes). One Piece reached 100,000,000 copies in February 2005 with Volume 36 (I think Dragon Ball reached 100,000,000 copies after Manga ended, but I'm not sure).
End of 2006: 125,000,000 copies (44 Volumes).
End of 2007: 139,000,000 copies (48 Volumes).
End of 2008: 153,000,000 copies (52 Volumes).
End of 2009: 177,000,000 copies (56 Volumes).
End of 2010: 216,000,000 copies (60 Volumes). One Piece reached 200,000,000 copies in November 2010 with Volume 60.
End of 2011: 257,000,000 copies (64 Volumes).
End of 2012: 281,000,000 copies (68 Volumes).
End of 2013: 302,000,000 copies (72 Volumes). One Piece reached 300,000,000 copies in November 2013 with Volume 72.
End of 2014: 320,000,000 copies (76 Volumes).

 

[Mankichi Togawa]

I'm searching for the revenues in USA for both My Hero Academia Heroes Rising, One Piece Stampede, and Dragon Ball Broly. At least, I remember MHA movie got a higher revenue than OP Stampede in USA.

Manga sales-wise, I recall MHA has been the most sold comic in USA (including american comics) at least in 2018 and 2019.

 

[Tamil]

I'd say it isn't needed. MHA is already a consolidated pillar.

Nakano should be clever and start promoting Jujutsu Kaisen once for all. Is surprising how little pushing it has had despite selling well.

Lmao KnY may end up reaching 100 million copies in print before we even find out the studio for JJK

 

[Mankichi Togawa]

I'm curious about Tabata commenting on this issue author comments. The poor guy was literally dying according to last 2 author comments.

 

[Halloween]

I'm searching for the revenues in USA for both My Hero Academia Heroes Rising, One Piece Stampede, and Dragon Ball Broly.

DBS:Broly did $30,712,119 in the US. MHA:HR did $13,304,000 in the US.

Broly also annihilated it worldwide, overall.

 

[Koni]

I find this MHA conversation really interesting, but I want to interject with one thing: MHA is extremely popular worldwide, we all know this, but worldwide popularity virtually does not translate to Japanese manga sales (at least, I don’t find it plausible for that to happen). HeroAca is very popular in Japan, but it’s way more popular across the globe. And many people around the world are just fine with seeing the anime, instead of going out and reading the manga. Demon Slayer for comparison, while gaining some footing across the globe, is also an absolute craze in Japan. And that very easily translates to manga sales, since many people there go out to buy the manga once the anime is done.

I'm searching for the revenues in USA for both My Hero Academia Heroes Rising, One Piece Stampede, and Dragon Ball Broly. At least, I remember MHA movie got a higher revenue than OP Stampede in USA.

Manga sales-wise, I recall MHA has been the most sold comic in USA (including american comics) at least in 2018 and 2019.

DBS Broly: $30,712,119
MHA Heroes Rising: $13,304,000
OP Stampede: $1,298,528

Source: Box Office Mojo

Bonus: Predict the US Box Office for KNY Mugen Train.

 

[Halloween]

To put this into perspective, the DBS:Broly movie did over 115 million worldwide.

The MHA:HR movie did just under 29 million worldwide. It's kinda crazy to think about, but Dragon Ball has actually gotten *more* popular over the years.

 

[Rain Spectre]

To put this into perspective, the DBS:Broly movie did over 115 million worldwide.

The MHA:HR movie did just under 29 million worldwide. It's kinda crazy to think about, but Dragon Ball has actually gotten *more* popular over the years.

May we compare the Japanese gross?

Because that might help put things in perspective some more.