Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2020] - Discussion and ToC Talk

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Shinuki no Reborn

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MANGAHELPERS "TOC" POLL ISSUE #51 - VOTING!​

The poll for issue #51 is now open, vote for your favorite chapters of the week clicking HERE!

Alongside the release of Sakamoto Days, the extra series this week are:

-Dragon Ball Super 66
-Boruto: Naruto Next Generations 52
-Ghost Reaper Girl 10


Good Votes!
 
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Halloween

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Moderator Notice:
Henceforth, I will be deleting posts that complain about Weekly Shonen Jump having too many/not enough gag/battle/exorcism/sports/etc series.

These posts are not insightful, and do not meaningfully contribute to this thread. Also, this decision is not up for discussion, so posts discussing this decision will also be deleted.~ Halloween
 
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Ryuusei

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呪 僕 O マ ブ S C D 破 C B 夜 C 僕 あ 灼 ぼ チ 高 ア 森 A 仄 ぼ 次号カラー ヒロアカ アンデラ 夜桜 約ネバ 道産子 GIGA 岸本先生が描くコラボポスター 爆豪クリアファイル
Jujutsu Kaisen (Cover & LCP)
My Hero Academia
One Piece
Mashle
Black Clover
Sakamoto Days (CP)
Dr. Stone
Magu-chan: God of Destruction (CP)
Build King
Mission: Yozakura Family
Me & Roboco
Ayakashi Triangle (CP)
Shakunetsu no Niraikanai
We Never Learn
Chainsaw Man
Koukousei Kazoku
Undead Unluck
Moriking
Agravity Boys
Honomieru Shounen
Bokura no Ketsumei

Issue #1
Cover & LCP: My Hero Academia
CP: Undead Unluck, Mission: Yozakura Family, The Promised Neverland, Dosanko Gyaru wa Namaramenkoi

GIGA Preview
Collab poster by Kishimoto
Bakugou clear file
 
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ItsSamu

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Is "where's the spokon" gonna be the new weekly complaint on this thread?

To everyone who says that, do you seriously want Jump to try pushing literally anything to fill that candidacy, even if it's Beast Children level terribad?
I mean, once you realise that WSJ has gone 2716 weeks with a sports manga and 1 week without it's kind of weird not having one. Overall, I'd rather have good new series over a bad sports one, but I'd love to at least see some new sports manga to know if they're good or not.
 
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SiMidori

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Glad to see Matsuura Kento coming back, I really like his art
and Burn the witch only 4 chapters, I expected 2 volumes
 

101nemesis

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Not sure why people expected more chapters from Burn the Witch. The movie is an adaptation of these chapters. So including the oneshot, and I'm assuming 50 pages first chapter next week, there is more than enough material for a movie.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Now with regards to the group cover, I'm surprised Asta is still in front but it makes sense since he is technically the third oldest members now and probably the most recognizable after Luffy and Deku, even if not the most loved (manga sales wise. Don't @ me BC fans). I did expect Itadori to be further up front along with Deku but when the magazine is literally full of newbies now, I guess it makes sense.
Come on WSJ, Denji deserved a spot up there as well. Give my boy some respect.

Also another CP for Mashle. New king of WSJ in the making.
 

TheEnhancedExe

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The jump debuted 7 gag manga in a year, I would not see a problem if they do the same with sports manga.
For that, they'd need 7 mangaka that are willing to make a sports manga in Jump. The only thing Jump editors can do is suggest a genre to a mangaka, but ultimately it's up to the mangaka themselves what genre they want to draw. If Jump currently doesn't have a mangaka that wants to draw a sports manga or if the small amount of sports manga they have isn't good enough to serialize yet, there's not much they can do. Plus, gag manga are easier to make, so there will always be a lot of mangaka that want to create gag manga.
 

Stivie

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For that, they'd need 7 mangaka that are willing to make a sports manga in Jump. The only thing Jump editors can do is suggest a genre to a mangaka, but ultimately it's up to the mangaka themselves what genre they want to draw. If Jump currently doesn't have a mangaka that wants to draw a sports manga or if the small amount of sports manga they have isn't good enough to serialize yet, there's not much they can do. Plus, gag manga are easier to make, so there will always be a lot of mangaka that want to create gag manga.
I fully agree.
 

Neala897

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...People realise that being a comedic manga and a gag manga are different things, right?
NOPE. For justice I dont sure japanese know difference as well
 

ItsSamu

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I was curious to see what the 'most successful' batch of new manga has ever been. Looking back the past 30 years I found a few where 2 of the same batch were successes and only a couple when there were 3 successes. But I couldn't find a single time where 3/3 or 4/4 of new series ended up being the case. Happy if someone can prove otherwise if this has been done before.

1993
#31: Komorebi no Moto de...
#35: Tottemo! Luckyman
#36-37: DNA² (Only 5 volumes but got anime, not sure if cancelled?)
#38: Hell Teacher Nube

1997
#32: Joka Joker
#33: Seikimatsu Leader-den Takeshi!
#34: One Piece

1998
#10: Rookies
#11: Shonen Tantei Q
#12: Kappa Revolution
#13: Whistle!
#14: Hunter x Hunter

2004
#1: Death Note
#2: Gintama
#3: LIVE

#24: Katekyo Hitman Reborn!
#25: D-Gray Man
#26: Chijō Saisoku Seishun Takkyū Shōnen Pūyan

2006
#20: Nazo no Murasame-kun
#21: To-Love Ru
#22: Mx0

2016
#10: Yuuna and the Haunted Hot Springs
#11: Demon Slayer: Kimetsu no Yaiba

2017
#10: We Never Learn
#11: U19
#12: Demon Prince Poro's Diaries
#13: Marie the Hungry
#14: Dr. Stone
#16: Robot x Laserbeam

Kind of serves as a painful reminder that when averaged out we're probably lucky if even one of any given batch lasts long enough to become a success.
 

Ctkk

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All successful gag manga ended so now they're trying really hard to get new successful ones. I'm sure in the near future they'll also start throwing so many spokons at the wall everyone will get sick of it.
 

Ryuusei

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Hoping Kei one day joins the Big Boi squad 😔
It would be be beautiful to see her big there, but I find it hard.

Do you guys think we will have another serialisation batch in october/november?

I imagine Nak launching 10 Spokon in the next year because there should be the olympics ! x)
Well, looking at how this year has gone, I wouldn't doubt we will another two batches.

Well, it's obvious from the spoilers so I'm just gonna say it, TPGW got axed. It's crystal clear to me. It'll end in this round.
This series was a clear example of a car crash. It started off well and then it just went completely downhill and never stopped and might have caught fire in between.
 

TheEnhancedExe

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I was curious to see what the 'most successful' batch of new manga has ever been. Looking back the past 30 years I found a few where 2 of the same batch were successes and only a couple when there were 3 successes. But I couldn't find a single time where 3/3 or 4/4 of new series ended up being the case. Happy if someone can prove otherwise if this has been done before.

1993
#31: Komorebi no Moto de...
#35: Tottemo! Luckyman
#36-37: DNA² (Only 5 volumes but got anime, not sure if cancelled?)
#38: Hell Teacher Nube

1997
#32: Joka Joker
#33: Seikimatsu Leader-den Takeshi!
#34: One Piece

1998
#10: Rookies
#11: Shonen Tantei Q
#12: Kappa Revolution
#13: Whistle!
#14: Hunter x Hunter

2004
#1: Death Note
#2: Gintama
#3: LIVE

#24: Katekyo Hitman Reborn!
#25: D-Gray Man
#26: Chijō Saisoku Seishun Takkyū Shōnen Pūyan

2006
#20: Nazo no Murasame-kun
#21: To-Love Ru
#22: Mx0

2016
#10: Yuuna and the Haunted Hot Springs
#11: Demon Slayer: Kimetsu no Yaiba

2017
#10: We Never Learn
#11: U19
#12: Demon Prince Poro's Diaries
#13: Marie the Hungry
#14: Dr. Stone
#16: Robot x Laserbeam

Kind of serves as a painful reminder that when averaged out we're probably lucky if even one of any given batch lasts long enough to become a success.
This is very interesting, so I decided to look up the cases before 1990 where at least two series out of a batch became popular or long running series all the way back to the first issue.

1968
#1 Chichi no Tamashii
#1 Harenshi Gakuen

1970
#31 Manga Drifters
#31 Dokonjo Gaeru

1971
#32 Nekketsu-dan
#33 Black Eagle
#34 Bara no Sakamichi
#35 V no Kuchibue
#36 Samurai Giants
#37 Seishun Saizensen
#38 Kōya no Shōnen Isamu

1972
#39 Astro Kyūdan
#40 Moete Hashire
#41 Boku no Dōbutsuen Nikki Ueno Dōbutsuen
#42 Mazinger Z

1973
#25 Barefoot Gen
#26 Climb Sweeper
#27 Play Ball
#28 Hōchōnin Ajihei

1981
#40 Cat's Eye
#45 Stop Hibari-kun
#46 Black Angels
#47 Icarus no Kobushi

Cat's Eye was the only manga in its batch, but I decided to include it here, because this was one of only two cases I could find where three new manga in a row survived past 100 chapters, the other one being Whistle, HxH and Shaman King in 1998.

1985
#12 Mister Lion
#13 City Hunter
#14 Tsuide ni Tochinkan

1988
#14 Bastard!!
#15 Jungle King Tar-chan
#16 Second

#22 Kami-sama wa Southpaw
#23 Hengen Sennin Asuka
#24 Niji no Runner
#25 Rokudenashi Blues

This is probably the record of the most successes in the shortest amount of time with 4 successes in a time frame of just 12 issues.

As for 2020, I think there's a very good chance that the UxU and Mashle batch will be the next batch on the list after the 6 series batch from early 2017.
 

Brizzi

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Plus, gag manga are easier to make, so there will always be a lot of mangaka that want to create gag manga.
I think you're underestimating how hard it is to make a gag manga.

Creating jokes weekly that resonate with a great audience, that are funny, that doesn't become tiresome and repetitive to the reader is very difficult. Even though gag authors have all the freedom to do what they want without needing to rely that much on veracity and coherency, coming up with jokes constantly it's just as difficult as managing a serious story about sports / adventure / whatever, in which arcs are more frequent and you have more time to develop a single idea.
 

James Rye

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Glad I went with my guts and voted At to be in the Top spots, 3rd is a good place to start with your first chapter. Let's see how big the drop for its 2nd gonna be next week. Yeah, seems TPG is axed for good, spoiler make it pretty obvious. Meaning AB might really live much longer than expected. Sad to see Mitama finish but it lived longer than S8, so that's something.
As for the new Cover, lol about that Taiyou chibi, feels so out of place there. XD
 

101nemesis

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I think you're underestimating how hard it is to make a gag manga.

Creating jokes weekly that resonate with a great audience, that are funny, that doesn't become tiresome and repetitive to the reader is very difficult. Even though gag authors have all the freedom to do what they want without needing to rely that much on veracity and coherency, coming up with jokes constantly it's just as difficult as managing a serious story about sports / adventure / whatever, in which arcs are more frequent and you have more time to develop a single idea.
All manga is (are?) hard.


WSJ 36-37 HQ

So looking at this more clearly, the tiers are actually;

Forever God Tier - One Piece
1st Tier - Deku, Dr. Stone
1.5 Tier - Asta, Itadori
2nd Tier - Act Age, Denji
3rd Tier - WNL, Mashle, UxU
3.5 tier - Literally everything else.

3rd tier and 3.5 tier are basically almost the same. So you can just club them together if you'd like
 

Roacher

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Are we sure that Chainsawman isn't ending soon. I wish it would not, but the recent chapters could fell like an ending.
I like read Chainsawman and would read hundreds more chapters. But if really this is final arc, and author hypothetically planed to do short story, so I'm fine with that. I would hate hypothetically if Chainsawman would be drag too long and quality drop. Plus some stories benefits for being short, maybe Chainsawman is one of them.
 

TheEnhancedExe

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I think you're underestimating how hard it is to make a gag manga.

Creating jokes weekly that resonate with a great audience, that are funny, that doesn't become tiresome and repetitive to the reader is very difficult. Even though gag authors have all the freedom to do what they want without needing to rely that much on veracity and coherency, coming up with jokes constantly it's just as difficult as managing a serious story about sports / adventure / whatever, in which arcs are more frequent and you have more time to develop a single idea.
I wasn't trying to say that it is easy. I think making any kind of enjoyable manga is hard. But as you mentioned, gag manga have a lot more freedom, which imo makes it easier to come up with gags, because you can do pretty much anything. Someone who creates a sports manga needs to know as much about the sport as possible, which includes things you don't learn while watching the sport on TV. Then the characters need to be interesting, they need to have motivations, maybe some gags in between. There needs to be character development, the character/characters need to train and improve in realistic manners (assuming it's a realistic sports manga). There need to be frequent moments that keep the interest of the reader outside of matches or during training arcs.

Looking at Haikyuu for example, there are so many elements about it that elevate it far above your average sports manga in another magazine or the sports manga in Jump that got cancelled. Even a cancelled gag manga will usually still get a good laugh out of lots of readers. But from the cancelled sports manga from Jump I've seen so far, the majority of them were pretty boring. Meanwhile I haven't really seen a gag manga that bored me out. Might be just me, but there's always usually at least one funny joke, even in the worse ones.

I agree that it gets harder the longer the series goes on, because it might get boring if jokes are repeated too often. But to me, it seems a lot harder to keep readers interested in a serious narrative over a long time. Jokes usually follow certain patterns, while you can't really use too many patterns for serious development, otherwise the manga wouldn't be its own thing anymore.
 

101nemesis

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I wasn't trying to say that it is easy. I think making any kind of enjoyable manga is hard. But as you mentioned, gag manga have a lot more freedom, which imo makes it easier to come up with gags, because you can do pretty much anything. Someone who creates a sports manga needs to know as much about the sport as possible, which includes things you don't learn while watching the sport on TV. Then the characters need to be interesting, they need to have motivations, maybe some gags in between. There needs to be character development, the character/characters need to train and improve in realistic manners (assuming it's a realistic sports manga). There need to be frequent moments that keep the interest of the reader outside of matches or during training arcs.

Looking at Haikyuu for example, there are so many elements about it that elevate it far above your average sports manga in another magazine or the sports manga in Jump that got cancelled. Even a cancelled gag manga will usually still get a good laugh out of lots of readers. But from the cancelled sports manga from Jump I've seen so far, the majority of them were pretty boring. Meanwhile I haven't really seen a gag manga that bored me out. Might be just me, but there's always usually at least one funny joke, even in the worse ones.

I agree that it gets harder the longer the series goes on, because it might get boring if jokes are repeated too often. But to me, it seems a lot harder to keep readers interested in a serious narrative over a long time. Jokes usually follow certain patterns, while you can't really use too many patterns for serious development, otherwise the manga wouldn't be its own thing anymore.
All genre are hard to make in their own way. Not one is easier than the other.

Sports manga, you need compelling characters to get attached to so that you are invested in the matches shown in the series. Character development, interaction are all important. Interesting match ups are also VERY important.
All of this applies to all other genre as well.

Battle manga, you need all of the above (aside from matches, obviously) and equally interesting antagonists. Hero Academia had a full arc for the antagonists just to make them more compelling.

Comedies often rely on their characters to make jokes land. If your character is not compelling, your jokes will just miss. There's a reason why the first few chapters of Hard Boiled Cop seemed super bland. The characters seemed hollow and didn't feel like they had any substance in them. But 4 chapters in and it's monumentally better because the characters are more defined, the jokes and settings are more defined and therefore jokes land.

Tons of gag manga fail all the time. Also, gag/comedy is a VERY subjective thing. And that automatically limits your audience based on the type of comedy you go for. Whereas, there could be multiple things about a battle manga or a sports manga that makes you read it (art, characters, setting, the sport itself etc. etc.) which helps you ignore the other shortcomings (in your eyes).
Comedy manga don't really have that freedom.

It's why more than just pure gag manga, the more successful ones in WSJ are comedy manga mixed with battle. It gives them more freedom with how they can present jokes and not just completely rely on jokes. Mashle right now is a prime example of this.
 

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Forever God Tier - One Piece
1st Tier - Deku, Dr. Stone
1.5 Tier - Asta, Itadori
2nd Tier - Act Age, Denji
3rd Tier - WNL, Mashle, UxU
3.5 tier - Literally everything else.

3rd tier and 3.5 tier are basically almost the same. So you can just club them together if you'd like
Oi don’t group Mash and his mighty CPs together with those peasants :hip
 

Mankichi Togawa

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All manga is (are?) hard.



So looking at this more clearly, the tiers are actually;

Forever God Tier - One Piece
1st Tier - Deku, Dr. Stone
1.5 Tier - Asta, Itadori
2nd Tier - Act Age, Denji
3rd Tier - WNL, Mashle, UxU
3.5 tier - Literally everything else.

3rd tier and 3.5 tier are basically almost the same. So you can just club them together if you'd like
I't put Yozakura on 3rd Tier tbh. Taiyou looks as big as Andy
 
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