Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2021] - Discussion and ToC Talk

[DreamcastDazia]

Have to say, the direction of Shimabukuro's career is...quite something. He went from an author who Shueisha was legitimately trying to push on the same level of One Piece and Dragon Ball, to now being a failure who gets cancelled after 20 chapters. Almost makes me feel bad for him.

Thats normal...

 

[Blue16]

Phantom Seer...

 

[Petko Metko]

Jump rank
Fantastic
Dr. stone- One of the most brutal chapters in the series. Looking forward to what happens next
Elusive Samurai- I get fire emblem vibes from this recruitment. A new member of the party seems interesting.

Great
Mashle- Long awaited showdown is here.
Yozakura Family- The little ways Gondaira trys to spice up each encounter is nice.
Black Clover- This chapter went by quickly, Tabata never drags.
Sakamoto Days- Hope that the sniper becomes reacuring character.
Ball parade- Its good that we are seeing them play an actual game, depending of how this is executed will decide the future of this series.

OK
Undead Unluck- Shen is a fun character glad we are getting to know him better
HSF- Cute and wholesome
Witch Watch- The best thing about this series are the references, anything else is kinda meh.
Cop and Dolphin- Great backstory, shame this series is near its end because i really liked the premise.

BAD
I tell c- Not sure how to feel about this one, but i appreciate that Aoi is actually trying to become a detective
Ayakashi Triangle- Another mini arc done nothing much to say.
Phantom Seer- Never really cared all much for this series but it deserved better. The ending was serviceable all things considering.
Build King- Whole arcs of development and power ups showed in couple panles, this series is on its way out.

JJK and MHA were missed

 

[Mammo]

BK another example of Jump cancelling a series without "waiting to volume 1 sales to save it"
they obviously decided to cancel before April

anyhoo..
a question for Shimabukuro fans, do you still want him back in the magazine? why? do you think he should change anything if he wants a return?

Phantom Seer...

Matsura should wait a bit, instead of rushing their return
make sure to team up with a writer with a strong work

if they want to return so fast with any type of work maybe they should consider writing their next work themself
worse case scenario it won't be any worse than TSS or PS

 

[Serinox]

Maybe Oda can get his good buddy Shima some cushy One Piece gag spin-off manga gig to carry him into retirement.

 

[tirakai]

BK another example of Jump cancelling a series without "waiting to volume 1 sales to save it"
they obviously decided to cancel before April

anyhoo..
a question for Shimabukuro fans, do you still want him back in the magazine? why? do you think he should change anything if he wants a return?

Eh, it doesn't seem like he's really into it any more. Build King to me feels like he returned for the sake of returning and was just mixing together his previous two hits, rather than actually having much in the way of new ideas he really wanted to try. I think he'd struggle to find success again and we'd just get more series dying under 30 chapters.

I also get the feeling he'd be happier doing a silly kids gag manga in Saikyo Jump or something.

 

[thedude]

Build King was like "hey, Toriko was a cool concept, the cooking and eating powerups...what if we did that, but with kids...and building???". Ultimately, the concept was too far out and weird, and they just started throwing out advanced concepts too early. It just wasn't very good at all.

 

[Mammo]

I think he should modernize both his artystyle (or team up with an artist) this is the main and biggest issue that's stopping people from picking it up from what I'm seeing

and he should modernize his storytelling style, imo the very long childish gags gotta go and the walls of text infodumps gotta be fixed somehow (but part of the blame is probably on the editor job tho)

 

[Felcis]

Let old man Shima work on more low-profile series for some seinen magazine aimed at nostalgic adults. Would fit his style and he could do his thing in a more relaxed environment.

 

[Midak]

I think he should modernize both his artystyle (or team up with an artist) this is the main and biggest issue that's stopping people from picking it up from what I'm seeing

and he should modernize his storytelling style, imo the very long childish gags gotta go and the walls of text infodumps gotta be fixed somehow (but part of the blame is probably on the editor job tho)

Basically, and I agree, you are saying that he is a mangaka from a previous era who fills out of place in the magazine right now.

Let old man Shima work on more low-profile series for some seinen magazine aimed at nostalgic adults. Would fit his style and he could do his thing in a more relaxed environment.

Has Shima ever worked on seinen manga though? I haven't read all of his works, but the majority seems aimed towards younger teens.
I am not really sure adults would read them even if they resembled something from their youth. The humor is quite childish too.

It may be easier for him to write something for children in another magazine, maybe together with a younger artist.

 

[WyldViolet]

Has Shima ever worked on seinen manga though?

Ring ran in Super Jump.

 

[tirakai]

There a bunch of old Jump series that ended up having long running sequels in seinen magazines without really having to change much, since the things that worked with shounen back then became a nostalgic seinen thing.

I think Otokojuku even eventually progressed to a magazine aimed at middle-aged men.

 

[ItsSamu]

My take on why Build King didn't succeed is not Shimabukuro trying to shoehorn in or replicating what worked for Toriko. I think he was too deadset on the idea of a series about 'building' since that's been his passion project for many years and didn't predict that most other people simply don't care about that premise enough if there isn't anything else to latch onto.

Totally, you can usually feel when something is a passion project or an author is genuinely having fun with what they're doing (a Bleach example I always think of is how obvious it is that Mayuri is one of Kubo's favourites by how much fun he has with his fights and the attention he gives him). But I also feel it can be a tricky balance where an author can become too self-indulgent and get lost in something they care deeply about without considering how it comes across to others who aren't on that same wavelength. But I guess that's what his editor should be there for. I'm definitely going to keep reading and hope something clicks eventually, time will tell.

Just like I thought back when it was announced last November, Build King reads like someone who loves what they are writing but appeals to almost no one else. While the world building had potential the main duo was weak from the get-go, that mini-arc we had with the upside down castle didn't do anything to grab readers, and everything since has been rushed to try and cram in ideas that were probably going to be fleshed out in several dozens of chapters. It's painful to watch a veteran fall so hard but at the same time it is (in my opinion) the worst currently running in the magazine so I think it getting cut is the best move for everyone.

I really thought there was a chance it would be promoted to the high heavens regardless but it's performed as poorly as most U19 series do (even if it seemingly escaped that title by one week), so my faith is at least a little restored. Seems like Elusive Samurai is getting the positions I thought Build King would, though I'm sure it'll have the sales to back it up.

 

[WyldViolet]

My take on why Build King didn't succeed is not Shimabukuro trying to shoehorn in or replicating what worked for Toriko. I think he was too deadset on the idea of a series about 'building' since that's been his passion project for many years and didn't predict that most other people simply don't care about that premise enough if there isn't anything else to latch onto.



Just like I thought back when it was announced last November, Build King reads like someone who loves what they are writing but appeals to almost no one else. While the world building had potential the main duo was weak from the get-go, that mini-arc we had with the upside down castle didn't do anything to grab readers, and everything since has been rushed to try and cram in ideas that were probably going to be fleshed out in several dozens of chapters. It's painful to watch a veteran fall so hard but at the same time it is (in my opinion) the worst currently running in the magazine so I think it getting cut is the best move for everyone.

I really thought there was a chance it would be promoted to the high heavens regardless but it's performed as poorly as most U19 series do (even if it seemingly escaped that title by one week), so my faith is at least a little restored. Seems like Elusive Samurai is getting the positions I thought Build King got, though I'm sure it'll have the sales to back it up.

Eh, I don't think I'd agree with that. Building/crafting video games are huge right now (even if I'm not too fond of them) so I wouldn't say that it was something that Jump readers wouldn't care about if done well. The issue is that the series and characters were extremely bland and the pacing is ass.
The series seeming so geared towards younger audiences, despite Shima's art-style mostly appealing to older readers probably didn't help. Huge identity crisis.

 

[Mammo]

There a bunch of old Jump series that ended up having long running sequels in seinen magazines without really having to change much, since the things that worked with shounen back then became a nostalgic seinen thing.

I think Otokojuku even eventually progressed to a magazine aimed at middle-aged men.

Otokojuku , Kinnikuman, Circuit no Okami, Midori no Makibao went to Playboy

franchises that got another life away from WSJ, from the top of my head
JoJo, Ninku on Ultra Jump
Captain Tsubasa, Play Ball on Grand Jump
Prince of Tennis, Kenshin on Jump SQ
DBS, Boruto, YuGiOh, DQ on V-Jump
Beshari Gurashi on Young Jump
IShojo on Jump Plus

franchises that got another life away from Shuiesha
Whistle on Ura Sunday
Shaman King on WSM edge
Saint Seiya on Champion
Angel Heart, Cats Eye, Souten no Ken on Comic Zenon
Majima-kun on Manga Goraku

 

[SharkBait]

Otokojuku , Kinnikuman, Circuit no Okami, Midori no Makibao went to Playboy

franchises that got another life away from WSJ, from the top of my head
JoJo, Ninku on Ultra Jump
Captain Tsubasa, Play Ball on Grand Jump
Prince of Tennis, Kenshin on Jump SQ
DBS, Boruto, YuGiOh, DQ on V-Jump
Beshari Gurashi on Young Jump
IShojo on Jump Plus

franchises that got another life away from Shuiesha
Whistle on Ura Sunday
Shaman King on WSM edge
Saint Seiya on Champion
Angel Heart, Cats Eye, Souten no Ken on Comic Zenon
Majima-kun on Manga Goraku

Soul Catcher(s)

 

[tirakai]

I love architecture and building/crafting stuff and personally I thought Build King was incredibly weak in that aspect. Most of the series has been spent on bland characters, dumb dated gags, trying to replicate Toriko's sense of scale, and Tonkatsu just hitting things once with a hammer, there's been very, very little actual building in it.

There is potential in a series about that, Dr Stone is essentially a survival crafting manga after all, but Build spent so much time shoving in Takeshi's weird sense of humour and Toriko's gimmick-heavy setting and attacks that it forgot to be about its own premise.

 

[ItsSamu]

Eh, I don't think I'd agree with that. Building/crafting video games are huge right now so I wouldn't say that it was something that Jump readers wouldn't care about if done well. The issue is that the series and characters were extremely bland and the pacing is ass.

I think he could have done a lot to make it more appealing to both people who do like that stuff and those who don't care. I mean, his first big mistake was the main character not actually lending to the premise at all. And while the world did feel detailed it was always a bit ridiculous and unbelievable to me that I never bought into the world revolving around builders in the way it was made out to be. In other series where there's a 'thing' or type or person that keeps the world going (ninjas, pirates, shinigami, sorcerers, demon slayers, what have you) it at least feels balanced and cohesive with the world building but Build King felt like Shimabukuro had the idea for builders and created everything around them without making the outcome feel natural. This latest stuff with the power system is so convoluted that even if it was going to be part of the series down the line it also would have felt odd in a series supposed to be about building. I do agree thought he messed up with characters and pacing big time.

 

[Mankichi Togawa]

Otokojuku , Kinnikuman, Circuit no Okami, Midori no Makibao went to Playboy

franchises that got another life away from WSJ, from the top of my head
JoJo, Ninku on Ultra Jump
Captain Tsubasa, Play Ball on Grand Jump
Prince of Tennis, Kenshin on Jump SQ
DBS, Boruto, YuGiOh, DQ on V-Jump
Beshari Gurashi on Young Jump
IShojo on Jump Plus

franchises that got another life away from Shuiesha
Whistle on Ura Sunday
Shaman King on WSM edge
Saint Seiya on Champion
Angel Heart, Cats Eye, Souten no Ken on Comic Zenon
Majima-kun on Manga Goraku

And Mazinger Z. The first run away from Jump. Well, it was more like Go Nagai serializing in every magazine and Shueisha wanted Go Nagai only for themselves.

 

[galaxy-juice]

Otokojuku , Kinnikuman, Circuit no Okami, Midori no Makibao went to Playboy

franchises that got another life away from WSJ, from the top of my head
JoJo, Ninku on Ultra Jump
Captain Tsubasa, Play Ball on Grand Jump
Prince of Tennis, Kenshin on Jump SQ
DBS, Boruto, YuGiOh, DQ on V-Jump
Beshari Gurashi on Young Jump
IShojo on Jump Plus

franchises that got another life away from Shuiesha
Whistle on Ura Sunday
Shaman King on WSM edge
Saint Seiya on Champion
Angel Heart, Cats Eye, Souten no Ken on Comic Zenon
Majima-kun on Manga Goraku

Jump SQ also took in To Love-Ru, World Trigger, and D Grayman
There's also Hell Teacher Nūbē on Grand Jump and Saikyo Jump, Bastard! in Ultra Jump, and Tomatoypoo no Lycopene in Jump+.

Outside of Shueisha, there's Ginga in Manga Goraku. Ginga is interesting just because of its sheer size— 18 volumes in Jump and 117+ in Manga Goraku, spread across five parts. It's like JoJo but for dogs.