Games Mafia Game 107 - ACNH: The ManHel Tale - Game End

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Farfalla

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Aight, here are the game infos (setup and actions):
IDAffiliationPrimary RoleSecondary RoleSanityPlayer
1TownDetectiveInsaneMadNat
2TownSpySaneBrandish
3TownDoctorSaneAsako
4TownBansheeGB
5TownNecromancerShad
6TownPsychiatristBaka Taichou
7TownProstituteEvil3ye
8TownBulletproofLambu
9TownMorticiandigital
10TownPsychiatristHolt
11TownProsecutorLady Pompom
12Third PartySanta ClausKat
13Town/MafiaPirateTraitorJames Rye
13Town/MafiaNobleTraitorCrescent
15MafiaMafia DetectiveSirSamuel
16MafiaStrongmanGrySun
17MafiaMafia EscortCopy Panda
18MafiaPirateMarmalade
GIFTS LIST

❄ Brewster's Gift "Drink it hot or give it up." (Hot Potato)
The Hot Potato explodes at the end of a day designated by the host before the start of the game, killing the player holding it. The holder of the Hot Potato doesn't know when it will explode, but he can pass it to another player at night, separately from any night ability he has. This passing can't be blocked. If the holder gets killed, the Potato explodes killing both the holder and the killer; if the holder is lynched, the Potato [dies with him].
❄ Kicks' Gift "You never know how things might turn out." (single-use Bar Keeper redirect)
One player ends up being the drunkest and uses his night action on a random player.
❄ CJ's Gift "A night cruise is a good way to catch night fish." (single-use Mafia Detective)
The Mafia Detective has the ability to investigate one player per Night and learn the player's Role. Only he is told the role of his target via PM. Whenever the Mafia Detective's investigation ability is performed, he cannot be chosen to go for a kill on the same night.
❄ Wisp's Gift "Tah-Dahh!" (this player's votes are worded as "Ho ho ho" during the next day)

❄ Jingle's Gift "Isn't this the best time of the year, kid?" Mandatory 5th Gift
(Santa Clause: this gift allows the game to go on. At the end of the game, Santa wins with the other winning party. Happy celebration ;)



Now first lemme thank @Erinyes for her massive participation in the game. At first, I got the November slot to host alone, and she asked me to join and I'm so happy she did! She's not only a very curious and interested person so we had a very nice and easy time discussing our ideas, but she also has the strength and endurance of a lion... I was often dead while we were hosting, but Erinchi followed everything and kept the game organized. She barely slept @.@ And that's a testimony I really needed to share with you all, 'cause her dedication and calm deserve lots of appreciation.

Also thanks @Hardy and @Vandred for double-checking the game mech (and in Poop's case, the comp as well) and giving us your honest thoughts, so we could try to present a game that would be fair and entertaining to people.

And finally, even tho some other points were addressed already, I'd like to thank all the players, from the heart. I know this game was too soon because of my availability due to local holidays, and I know you guys were tired - which for sure didn't improve during this time lol. So I really need to commend you all, because you guys were either putting in a lot of time and effort inside the game, analyzing and discussing nonstop, or in the deadpad - you guys also got no rest. As hosts, that's the biggest kind of feedback we could get: to have you guys really onboard. Some moves were questionable, but no one can't say any of those teams weren't trying... it's only natural that drained people will make some mistakes, so to me that's another sign of the praise you guys deserve.

Quick comments about the game that I've mentioned in the deadpad already: in general, the idea with the mech was to add a simple new function (and we tried to map beforehand the main game new considerations we'd need to have it in place) but that could allow a new set of strategical moves to be exploited - now I would reconsider the priority we used since we realize it would have been more adherent to people's preference. The game also had 2 Traitors 'cause Pirate is a VERY weak mafia that can suicide and lose the ability to kill later on, so we wanted to give them better odds (lemme say it one more time in here that the notion that means town had 2 extra people to lynch is wrong, first because town had 2 killing tools in the Prosecutor and the Banshee, and second because they don't need to eliminate unrecruited traitors to win). It had 2 Psys 'cause even tho we wanted mafia to have better chances to recruit, that didn't mean we wanted them to recruit BOTH, so town had more chances to find at least one on the other hand (even if one role would get erased eventually), and at the same time the role could cause some confusion that mafia could exploit. The Mortician came in place to trace stuff like Santa and fake claims/transfers regarding any role/action that got "buried" - imo it's more effective than the SM because it can target antitown and spot unknown stuff that could still be in-game; it was a late game resource that had good chances of being effective with the role transfer mech. The Necromancer was also in there for its recycling capabilities since we'd have roles being lost, and in this setup it would be less OP than it usually is, since his options would still be reduced. The Santa was there for extra fun, imo, since the role could still be used even if the OG player and their wincon was gone: two gifts - that we expected to be the last ones - were clear signs that there was a Santa in-game in case it would fly by too successfully - and even that was just to cause some ruckus since the last gift allowed the game to go on after Santa would win - which to me it's a needed measure so we won't have sudden major frustration with an unexpected game end (I do understand why the game usually has to end when Santa is in it, so people don't ignore the role, but in this case we saw an opportunity to play around that and fix the issue regarding that); Santa's other gifts were there to provide some extra spice but unfortunately, as you can see in the night actions, I made a mistake while processing GB's action with the Hot Potato. GB got blocked by Evil when he tried to pass it to James and I overlooked it that the passing can't be blocked. It would have been simple to fix it during the day by PMing the both of them if Bran didn't spy on GB and, coincidentally, Sam hadn't claimed the exact same action and outcome. After discussing with some people, we reached the conclusion that the attitude that would cause the least interference and damage to a bigger number of players would be to just remove the Hot Potato from the game and inform that to GB, which is what we did.

GG mafia, you fought the long battle and won! GG town, it's never easy to be on the more clueless side, trying to put pieces together. GG Santa cause Santa is always fun~
 

MadNat

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I hope i find a possible vote before i go to bed... or maybe i just pick blind and lost and paranoid to anybody... :grumble
 

Shad

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All I read is james claimed he had a temp role as a secondary, doctor. But his main role is townie?
Yes he claimed not having a main role.
Jinx pointed out that claiming active was a stretch of the truth.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I hope i find a possible vote before i go to bed... or maybe i just pick blind and lost and paranoid to anybody... :grumble
Don't pick blind, vote with the confirmed townies.

Also focus on your role usage, didn't lambu tell you to target Jinx? Why did you target evil?
 

Evil3ye

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Where is @Lambu ? I need to pick that paloma brain. :bored I don't trust myself anymore.

I think we for sure need to figure out how Marmalade died, and if this ties with the Mafia Panda hypothesis or not, buddies.
 

Kat

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Kat do you have anything you want to share about your role or any usage of it?
🎤 For someone who didn't say much about their own background, you sure are curious. But I am indeed flattered by your attention, so I will give you some back. Firstly, I am a reporter as you know. That is my main job of course. When it comes to what I do when I am off-duty, well, I have already said that I am an active person, a night owl if you will. I am not afraid of nights, in fact, nights are fun. I can contribute to town more with my daily job though. I hope that satisfies your interest for now.

What about you? Care to share something?


I targeted shad bc he was being cantankerous with me, so I wanted to take his role. It's true I initially targeted hyung bc I thought he was suspect, and then thought about lambu bc he's legit, but yeah went with shad to take his shit

🎤As someone who has known you for a good while, I would not expect you to be so reckless with your decisions. You said (article #940) you didn't consider Shad being a TP, but you are one of the few who usually considers every variable, aren't you? On the other hand, it makes me think that if you were a bad guy you wouldn't make such a suspicious move and use "I wanted to troll Shad" as an explanation, but the little tension between you would fit your cards and was probably the least harmful way to sweep your mistake away.

The interviews are nice but it's all one way.

🎤 Why thank you. So you want it two-way then? Okay, let me interview you first then. You said, and I quote "My role is useful. I will promote my role should an unfortunate event befall me." That is very vague and very safe to say, sir, you can go anywhere from that, don't you think? Did you experience anything strange at night?
 

MadNat

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Yes he claimed not having a main role.
Jinx pointed out that claiming active was a stretch of the truth.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---



Don't pick blind, vote with the confirmed townies.

Also focus on your role usage, didn't lambu tell you to target Jinx? Why did you target evil?
Lambu said i should target someone else if Asako was townie... plus i think i can use my role on my own with my own thought too... Evil was the first on Asako, but suddently jumped away... that was weird to me... plus i wanted to see if i have insanity or paranoid symptoms..therefore i need to find a person 'unguilty' to my situation
--- Double Post Merged, ---

but my action didn't work anyway...so i don't think it was bc of Evil...or can somebody have an ability not being a target for himself?
 

Evil3ye

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Lambu said i should target someone else if Asako was townie... plus i think i can use my role on my own with my own thought too... Evil was the first on Asako, but suddently jumped away... that was weird to me... plus i wanted to see if i have insanity or paranoid symptoms..therefore i need to find a person 'unguilty' to my situation
--- Double Post Merged, ---

but my action didn't work anyway...so i don't think it was bc of Evil...or can somebody have an ability not being a target for himself?
No, we don't have such a role. They either stole your role Night 1 (we know Mafia Marmalade was a Pirate), or they blocked your action N2 (they have a role calles Escort).

The other thing that was already mentioned is the Third Party option, that you were turned into an Illusion on Night 1. Which is maybe not as likely as the two before though, because you would have been scattered if someone else targeted you, and there might have been some that did (Panda for one claimed that - but he might be lying ofc).

Also, don't let yourself get bullied into targets the others suggest. As I said yesterday you are free to choose your own and basically cannot do anything wrong, each result is helpful (provided there is one).
 

Shad

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Lambu said i should target someone else if Asako was townie... plus i think i can use my role on my own with my own thought too... Evil was the first on Asako, but suddently jumped away... that was weird to me... plus i wanted to see if i have insanity or paranoid symptoms..therefore i need to find a person 'unguilty' to my situation
--- Double Post Merged, ---

but my action didn't work anyway...so i don't think it was bc of Evil...or can somebody have an ability not being a target for himself?
I guess experience is the best teacher.
I can't say anything more without sounding negative :(
--- Double Post Merged, ---

The example is correct.
Got it, that rule wasn't fixed

🌠 Receiving a role from a different alignment will not affect your current one alignment - additionally, a player cannot receive the ability to perform "faction kills" at night;
Made the same mistake on D1.
 

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@Copy Panda I will ask you to claim one last time.
 

James Rye

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I remember rules changing and Pirate dies at Pirate or something like that, please confirm.



lol knowing Sakura she is probably cursing me right now for not voting you: nobody listens to me!!!
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

@James Rye I will consider your mentee theory but please consider mine as well and give me your opinion, town has a small brain so they can't consider any mafia moves that have more than 2 steps.
Alright, but which theory do you mean exactly? You posted some so far. I can backread and give you my thoughts.

Allora, yes but nobody raised hand, and shouldn't.

What's your thoughts on the Panda-Shad situation? And why you prefer kill James?

--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---


He said Townie and Secondary Temp Doc.
--- Double Post Merged, ---



Yeah, buddy. That's why some people think she was poisoned yesterday pre-reveal. Curious how that would prove you though. You can still be recruited Traitor.
He prefers to kill me 'cause I'm an easy kill.
Sure, but if lovers and threesome are in-game and considering the way Marm died we might have SS or Mentor-Mentee as she might have tried to do a steal this night, then isn't traitor a bit much to add to all that mix?
I think if nobody else but me is townie that I was meant as some sort of trap by the hosts though I'm glad they gave some useful role to use at least once. If they had given me a passive then I could have never let Baka investigate me a 2nd time 'cause then she would have seen my 2nd role again.

so james is just a regular townie? he would never admit to this as a townie. He would claim freeman to bait mafia or something.
I did. Didn't you saw me claiming active and going hard on Gry and not believing his passive claim 'cause I thought most of us were regular towns with temp roles? That was until I noticed everybody but Evil and Lambu claimed active then I started to get second thoughts about my theory.

All I read is james claimed he had a temp role as a secondary, doctor. But his main role is townie?
Yep and apparently I am the sole Vanilla townie in the whole game, I'm so lonely, won't anyone gimme a hug? Not even Mafia wants to kill me despite the chance of me maybe being a Sleeper and not a stinky Death Miller. :emocat
 

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@Copy Panda I will ask you to claim one last time.
Allora. Do you think he doesn't even know your role and I was making those conspiracy theory diagrams for nothing??

He prefers to kill me 'cause I'm an easy kill.
Sure, but if lovers and threesome are in-game and considering the way Marm died we might have SS or Mentor-Mentee as she might have tried to do a steal this night, then isn't traitor a bit much to add to all that mix?
I think if nobody else but me is townie that I was meant as some sort of trap by the hosts though I'm glad they gave some useful role to use at least once. If they had given me a passive then I could have never let Baka investigate me a 2nd time 'cause then she would have seen my 2nd role again.
That's true for some people here. Baka kill looks like an obvious framing too, but there is still the posibility that she was picked even Night 1. hmm.
 

James Rye

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I remember rules changing and Pirate dies at Pirate or something like that, please confirm.
I found nothing about Pirate dying as Pirate in the Interaction list, neither for Townie nor Mafia:

Pirate

  • See Mafia Detective/Janitor for reveals of some stolen roles
  • Any player that has his ability stolen will have his Actions ignored by the host, as he no longer has an action.
  • Mason - stealing the Mason role makes the Pirate automatically join the Mason group
  • Innocent Child - is revealed on the correct day if stolen before the reveal, nothing happens if stolen after reveal
  • Paranoid Gun Owner - dies if he‘s the first player targeting the PGO. If the shot has already been used then PGO is stolen but the shot is already used up
  • Vigilante/Prosecutor/Bomb Defuser/Pirate - if their 1-time ability has already been used then it can‘t be used again after stealing. If it hasn't then he can use the role.
  • Kamikaze Bomb - the Pirate explodes on the same night as it was for the player he stole it from
  • Mason Recruiter - steals the role but doesn't become part of the Recruiter's group he stole the role from
  • Cannot steal secondary roles, those stay with the person he targets

Mafia Pirate

  • See Mafia Detective/Janitor for reveals of some stolen roles
  • Any player that has his ability stolen will have his Actions ignored by the host, as he no longer has an action.
  • Mason - Stealing the Mason role makes the M. Pirate automatically join the Mason group
  • Sleeper - can be targeted for a kill by a team member to turn him into a normal Mafia Member than can kill
  • Sleeper - if there is another mafia group and one mafia from that group tries killing the Mafia Pirate Sleeper, he still dies
  • Insane Apprentice - Will work the same as Sane Apprentice, dying when trying to learn a non-townie role
  • Innocent Child - revealed on the correct day if stolen before the reveal, nothing happens if stolen after reveal
  • Jesus - when he dies, he dies as regular Townie and revives like a Jesus would, while still being a mafia
  • Paranoid Gun Owner - dies if he‘s the first player targeting the PGO. If the shot has already been used, PGO is stolen but the shot is already used up
  • Vigilante/Prosecutor/Bomb Defuser/Pirate - if their 1-time ability has already been used then it can‘t be used again after stealing. If it hasn't then he can use the role
  • Kamikaze Bomb - the M. Pirate explodes on the same night as it was for the player he stole it from
  • Mason Recruiter - lets the Mafia Pirate recruit townies into his own new Mason group
  • Cannot steal secondary roles, those stay with the person he targets
Same for the Role rules:

Mafia Pirate (Mafia) At a night of his choice the Mafia Pirate may choose a Townie he wants to steal the ability from. From that point in the game, the robbed Townie's role changes to 'Townie' without him knowing it and the Mafia Pirate is free to use it as his own. The Mafia Pirate knows the ability stolen and uses it at the proper Day or Night phase that the stolen role demands. All original clauses of the stolen ability apply. If the Mafia Pirate tries to steal the ability from a Mafia or a Third Party Member as primary role, the Mafia Pirate dies. The Mafia Pirate is able to be selected as a mafia killer until he successfully steals a role - after that point, he can only kill by indirect means if he's stolen a role with killing capabilities (Insane Doctor, Daytime Vigilante, etc.). (GAME 41)

So by all means, this means Marm died with her original role and wasn't either able to steal one or simply hasn't used it yet which makes no sense for night 2 with so many potential targets.
 

Shad

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Allora. Do you think he doesn't even know your role and I was making those conspiracy theory diagrams for nothing??
He knows but I'm not taking any risks, plus I have follow up questions and I don't like how he is wasting time.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

That's true for some people here. Baka kill looks like an obvious framing too, but there is still the posibility that she was picked even Night 1. hmm.
If a recruitment happened day 1, mafia could be pushing the poisoner narrative to cover for it.

But then they would expect us to believe a kill is missing from D2.
 

Copy Panda

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🎤As someone who has known you for a good while, I would not expect you to be so reckless with your decisions. You said (article #940) you didn't consider Shad being a TP, but you are one of the few who usually considers every variable, aren't you? On the other hand, it makes me think that if you were a bad guy you wouldn't make such a suspicious move and use "I wanted to troll Shad" as an explanation, but the little tension between you would fit your cards and was probably the least harmful way to sweep your mistake away.
it was obvious to me he was town so i just took his role. Again i actually didnt consider tp but i was pirate, i back read some and just wanted to get it over with
 

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He knows but I'm not taking any risks, plus I have follow up questions and I don't like how he is wasting time.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---



If a recruitment happened day 1, mafia could be pushing the poisoner narrative to cover for it.

But then they would expect us to believe a kill is missing from D2.
Also it is night 1 and N2, I know what you mean and I'm sure we all know what you mean, but talking about recruitment and killing happening in day phase is still a bit confusing.
 
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