Discussion New Roles and New Rules Suggestion Thread

GrySun

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Submissions for new roles need to follow the next format in order to be considered:

I. [Place Holder Name]

II. [Affiliation]

III. [Short Description]

IV. [Long Description/Idea/Premise/Scope]

V. [Priority/RoleType/Interactions/other Specifics]

I. Troublemaker

II.
Town

III. Can once per game make a Day phase lynch be the top 2 voted people instead of regular 1 top voted person. Every player has 2 votes but cannot vote the same player twice.

IV. PMs the host on the night before the day he wishes to use his power on. Host announces at start of day that the 2 top voted players will be lynched.
Everyone gets 2 votes that they can use on 2 individual players. Both can be moved once like usual. Example:
!votekill1 PlayerX
!votekill2 PlayerY
!votelock2
(locks on PlayerY).

Any other format is also fine as long as players specify who they are voting and if it's a new vote or they are changing their first one.

V. Doesn't have a Priority, happens at the end of night after all other actions. Doesn't target another player. Primary role.

Since it happens at the end of a phase, the player can be both blocked and killed to prevent it happening.


I. Psychiatrist

II. Townie

III. The Psychiatrist investigates one person per night phase to see if the player has a Secondary Role. They get a "Your target has a secondary role" if that is the case, and a "Your target does not have a secondary role" if it's not. The Psychiatrist does not find out the allegiance of the target.

IV. It's a counter for scum secondaries without outright revealing them, leaving room for guess work and player reading.

V. Priority 2, Primary Role.

Current roles Approved for testing here

Rules on including those in a game:
  • A host can take any of these roles and test them in their game. Depending on results from testing the role it will either be included into the Role list or need more changes/testing.
  • A host at the very least has to announce in the opening post of the game that new roles are being tested, or alternatively even more specifically reveal the roles that are being tested.
Link to the last update post with the roles that are either close to approval or were not approved: here.
 
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Kakoha

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change suggestion :

after playing as traitor, the role felt like you should play against mafia till you get recruited
to fix this, I suggest that it is changed that the traitor wins with mafia as long as he is alive.
this is to prevent forcing the traitor to lynch mafia to acheive wincon.

this won't make traitor OP, cauz traitor will just be like a weak mafia who can't kill, isn't counted towards mafia winning number, and mafia could misslynch him by mistake. so it balances outs.

at the current state, traitor seems to be betraying everyone XDDD
what do you think ?
 

Copy Panda

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Well, what would your strategy be to win as a traitor as per the suggested changes?

As I see it, afk players are already generally overlooked for both lynches and kills, therefore the dominant strategy for this role to "not lose" (as opposed to "win") will usually be defensive and evasive behaviour. In my view we already have cases of (winning) mafias not claiming (not just till the end but at all), afks avoiding lynches for most of the game, and non-contributing town players. Just the last handful of games provide examples of this.

Imo, the current traitor has to actively undertake action to win, like other non-towns, whereas the suggested changes take away that agency from the player. It's not even like freeman in whose best interest it is to kill mafia; this kind of traitor wouldn't want that either. They don't have to verify. They don't have to do anything to win because there's no direction their role suggests to take to win. As I see it their wincon is not doing anything damnable, which probably translates to contributing as little as possible to remain unseen by both sides. This takes skill in a hypothetical environment where 20 posts min. is the daily norm, not so much in our games with a modest 3 posts req.

Another point of note is that this traitor fears their own team. They can not resolutely take any side. Perhaps a freeman in the open draws sympathies from town doc. New Traitor has no allies, but unlike TP cannot do anything to win either. Even if the role is interesting on paper, it is probably not a lot of fun for the player to be as wishy-washy as possible by default.

Ofc I'm not saying every player will play it like this, but (town) roles tend to gravitate towards a dominant strategy. Protective roles cover claimers, Det (generally) holds out till they find contradictory results, Traitor attempts to verify their list by killing someone on it, to decide what side they are on, etc. New traitor wants for nothing but for the game to be over already since they're just a plot device for mafia to win, not someone who can do anything on their own.

As I see it, traitor is difficult to play because they have to jump through lots of hoops to win. They need to be recruited, so they need to be killed. Therefore their aggro on mafia needs to be just effective enough to bait a kill but not so effective it could gain momentum for town. It's a net positive for mafia too if they kill the current traitor; it is a +2 for them, maybe a little more in esoteric terms if the traitor is a trusted townie. New traitor doesn't want to be killed, mafia does not want to kill them (though doing so is a -2 punishment for them). If their ally protects mafia for long enough they get lynched anyway (so they won't do that too much either). Therefore, I think the suggested traitor will try to do as little as possible.

Winning as this traitor means you fence-sat long enough the whole game not to be discovered by either party, which, in the current climate, isn't so much an acknowledgement of that traitor's skill as much as it is an indictment against all of town for not killing deadweight. If you want to buff traitor, I think like with TSC just tell the mafia, "hey there's a traitor around, you might want to look out for that +2". I don't think it's necessary but I don't think we should want to make this role less skill-intensive or engaging. It's one of the few roles that requires the player to really participate to win, that's valuable in and of itself.
 

Crescent Jinx

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If you want to buff traitor, I think like with TSC just tell the mafia, "hey there's a traitor around, you might want to look out for that +2".
I like this
 

kuruttakao

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Role suggestion:
Name:
Alien

Affiliation:
Third party

Short Description:
tries to guess a player's role to kill him, if he guesses wrong he dies instead.
their goal is to be the last survivor.

Long Description/Idea/Premise/Scope:
the alien PMs the host and choses a player he wants to kill instantly along with a guess of his primary role, if he guesses wrong he dies instead.
the idea is to prevent easy claims and to also add a new layers to claims which would make the game more interesting.
the alien is a high risk high reward role that can change the course of a game very fast.


Priority/RoleType/Interactions/other Specifics:
day action can be used as many times as he wants
primary role
the mafia can't kill the alien at night as if he is always protected
if the alien has the lovers secondary role he doesn't have to kill him to win
can't kill in the last hour
same as the serial killer the alien starts the game with a list of primary roles (without names or secondary roles listed) that are in the game.
 

Kakoha

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Role suggestion:
Name:
Alien

Affiliation:
Third party

Short Description:
tries to guess a player's role to kill him, if he guesses wrong he dies instead.
their goal is to be the last survivor.

Long Description/Idea/Premise/Scope:
the alien PMs the host and choses a player he wants to kill instantly along with a guess of his primary role, if he guesses wrong he dies instead.
the idea is to prevent easy claims and to also add a new layers to claims which would make the game more interesting.
the alien is a high risk high reward role that can change the course of a game very fast.


Priority/RoleType/Interactions/other Specifics:
day action can be used as many times as he wants
primary role
the mafia can't kill the alien at night as if he is always protected
if the alien has the lovers secondary role he doesn't have to kill him to win
can't kill in the last hour
same as the serial killer the alien starts the game with a list of primary roles (without names or secondary roles listed) that are in the game.
to not ruin all the games that don't have alien in it, I think this role should be declared that it exists by the hosts at the start of the game. else I think it could negatively impact all games with no alien in it.
 

Evil3ye

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I. Exorcist

II. Townie

III. Excorist may target a player each night via PMing the host. If the target is Townie, the Townie is considered blocked. Once the Excerist targets a non-Townie player that target dies and the Excorcist can no longer use a night action. Additionally after this event the Excorsist is shown as a non-Townie on investigations.

IV. So, basically the idea is to have a Townie role with a one time kill action. To have it nerfed a recoil is build in (blocking townies/investigation). Perhaps an other recoil option could be that after killing the Excorcist is considered poisoned (i.e. possessed by evil spirits) and dies the next night - like a delayed kamikaze bomb or similar.

V. Priority 1 for blocking, Priority 3 for killing, protection can prevent the kill

 
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Kaminogan

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Submissions for new roles need to follow the next format in order to be considered:

I. [Place Holder Name]

II. [Affiliation]

III. [Short Description]

IV. [Long Description/Idea/Premise/Scope]

V. [Priority/RoleType/Interactions/other Specifics]
1. The Dragon

2. Mafia/Town

3. The Dragon cannot be killed by Role Actions, except by The Dragonslayer. Once per day, The Dragon can Day Kill one player. If that player is not The Dragonslayer, they can no longer use this ability.

4. The Dragon and The Dragonslayer are on opposing factions. When The Dragon wishes to Day Kill, they do so by typing out "I am The Dragon!" in the main chat, then typing the name of the player they wish to Day Kill.

5. This role does not have priority, this role is a primary role.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

1. The Dragonslayer.

2. Mafia/Town

3. The Dragonslayer Hunts a player each night, killling then. If the Dragonslayer successfully Hunts The Dragon, they gain +2 Voting Power until they die.

4. If the Dragonslayer is Maf, they cannot Hunt on the same night Mafia kills someone. When they Hunt someone, the Host(s) will send a PM telling them if they hunted The Dragon. The Dragonslayer and The Dragon will always be on opposing factions.

5. This role has priority 3, this role is a primary role.
 

Copy Panda

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If they mafia dragon publicly kills the town dragon slayer, wont they be lynched immediately afterwards though
 

Kaminogan

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If they mafia dragon publicly kills the town dragon slayer, wont they be lynched immediately afterwards though
Damn, that's true. I guess them always being on opposite factions is what makes this happen, but it also doesn't make sense for them to be on the same side anyways. Maybe the dragon can hide a player's allegiance with the day kill?
 

Faust

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I. Isukiri

II. Town

III. Whenever the Player with Jesus role is going to die in any and all circumsrances (Lynched, Killed, Prosecuted, Cowboy Duel Loss, Poisoned Etc.) the Player with Isukiri role will die instead of him.

Player with Jesus' role doesn't know if Isukiri is in the game and his identity. However Isukiri can only exist in any game if there's a Jesus.

Isukiri doesn't know which player is Jesus

IV. Lore:

When Jesus Christ was 21 years old, he came to Japan and pursued knowledge of divinity for 12 years. He went back to Judea at age 33 and engaged in his mission. However, at that time, people in Judea would not accept Christ's preaching. Instead, they arrested him and tried to crucify him on a cross. His younger brother Isukiri casually took Christ's place and ended his life on the cross.

Christ, who escaped the crucifixion, went through the ups and downs of travel, and again came to Japan. He settled right here in what is now called Herai Village and died at the age of 106.


Source

V. Passive. A Passive Bodyguard to Jesus.
 

Hardy

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I. Isukiri

II. Town

III. Whenever the Player with Jesus role is going to die in any and all circumsrances (Lynched, Killed, Prosecuted, Cowboy Duel Loss, Poisoned Etc.) the Player with Isukiri role will die instead of him.

Player with Jesus' role doesn't know if Isukiri is in the game and his identity. However Isukiri can only exist in any game if there's a Jesus.

Isukiri doesn't know which player is Jesus

IV. Lore:

When Jesus Christ was 21 years old, he came to Japan and pursued knowledge of divinity for 12 years. He went back to Judea at age 33 and engaged in his mission. However, at that time, people in Judea would not accept Christ's preaching. Instead, they arrested him and tried to crucify him on a cross. His younger brother Isukiri casually took Christ's place and ended his life on the cross.

Christ, who escaped the crucifixion, went through the ups and downs of travel, and again came to Japan. He settled right here in what is now called Herai Village and died at the age of 106.


Source

V. Passive. A Passive Bodyguard to Jesus.

So this person doesn’t take actions, doesn’t know who they’re protecting, and their optimal outcome is simply to die automatically? That’s doesn't sound very fun to play.

From a balance perspective, it also doesn’t create interesting interactions or choices for the town and it ends up just making the Jesus role significantly stronger by adding a guaranteed extra life (and the role itself is strong already).
 

Faust

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How about if Isukiri gets killed before Jesus. Jesus' ability to resurrect disappears?
 

Hardy

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I. Exorcist

II. Townie

III. Excorist may target a player each night via PMing the host. If the target is Townie, the Townie is considered blocked. Once the Excerist targets a non-Townie player that target dies and the Excorcist can no longer use a night action. Additionally after this event the Excorsist is shown as a non-Townie on investigations.

IV. So, basically the idea is to have a Townie role with a one time kill action. To have it nerfed a recoil is build in (blocking townies/investigation). Perhaps an other recoil option could be that after killing the Excorcist is considered poisoned (i.e. possessed by evil spirits) and dies the next night - like a delayed kamikaze bomb or similar.

V. Priority 1 for blocking, Priority 3 for killing, protection can prevent the kill

A year and a half later but this one sounds interesting. Though I'd like it to be paired along with the inclusion of the regular vigilante (that kills once at night). Could be pretty balanced in big games where there's many people dropping / it's another role for mafia to claim.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

How about if Isukiri gets killed before Jesus. Jesus' ability to resurrect disappears?
That still has the issue of the first paragraph though. I remember people disliking the time bomb because of it and that one has some agency already. This one is fully automatic.
 

Juviii

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I.Conspirator.

II.Townie

III.Can once per game select 2 players during the day phase to be added to a pad with them during the night, regardless of alignment.

IV.The objective is to give town an advantage in coordinating and exchanging ideas without mafia knowing (if they choose right). Ex: invite the doctor and BG to coordinate to save important roles when it is crucial.

V. Priority 3
 
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Faust

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Conspirator - is a lot like Barkeeper but with less people to invite and Town affiliation.

If it's once per game, then I guess that is balanced.

--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I. Introvert Mafia/Black Sheep

II. Mafia

III. A regular mafia member from the start that is not allowed to join the Mafia Pad during night phases and doesn't have the ability to do night kills if other Mafia members are still alive.

The rest of Mafia team knows the identity of the Introvert.

The Introvert Mafia knows the identity of the rest of the mafia team but doesn't know their specific Mafia roles.

The Introvert Mafia gains the ability to kill during night phases, if he becomes the only Mafia member left alive.

IV. Mechanic: How would a Mafia Member act if said member is excluded from nightly discussions?

Basically:
Good news: You're a Mafia

Bad news: But you can't talk with them. And you can only kill when you're the last Mafia standing.

V. Normal. Investigation still results as Guilty.

OPEN FOR CHANGES/ADJUSTMENT
 
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Copy Panda

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IV isn't lore but an explanation why this is gameplay and a justification for its existence
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Conspirator - is a lot like Barkeeper but with less people to invite and Town affiliation.

If it's once per game, then I guess that is balanced.

--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

I. Introvert Mafia

II. Mafia

III. A regular mafia member that is not allowed to join the Mafia Pad during night phases and doesn't have the ability to do night kills.

The Introvert Mafia doesn't know the specific roles of each of the remaining Mafia members as well.

The Introvert Mafia gains the ability to kill during night phases, if he's the only Mafia member left alive.

IV. Too shy for discussions.

V. Mechanic: How would a Mafia Member act if said member is excluded from nightly discussions?
traitor but somehow still unrecruited? 🤔
 

Faust

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Introvert Mafia is a Mafia from the start of the game.
--- Double Post Merged, , Original Post Date: ---

Edited: Added Mafia from the start.
--- Double Post Merged, ---

Rebranding Mafia Introvert to Black Sheep ⚫🐑

Thanks Copan. omo
 

James Rye

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Hm, think it's fine if I add some new suggestions?
 
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