Salam to all... my first post!
Having been lurking here for manga for a while (brilliant site btw), nothing particularly drew me into joining any of the forums, till I stumbled upon this one. I feel the urge to chip in as well, considering some of the interests shown towards my religion, Islam- especially since some were rather misconstrued and haven't been responded by any Muslim here. This is a couple of pages back, but still I'd like to clear it up
To be honest, I agree with ddadain's first post on many of the reasons that I myself am incredibly skeptical about Islam as a religion. It is the reason why I have not chosen to really participate in this thread so far, but as it is becoming an incredibly huge subject as far as world influence, I might as well say my piece about it. From having studied the origins of Islam, I ended up not seeing Muhammad as a particularly holy man since he started out as a friend of Jews and then betrayed them later on when they disagreed with him being the prophet. Contrast that with either Abraham or Jesus; to our knowledge, neither of them showed any malice towards other people. It was later people who hid behind both religions as a means of advancing their political and ambitious goals, something no true Judaist or Christian would have approved of - but they generally weren't in power because of their pacifist views. But for Islam, from all accounts, it started out as a semi-political movement that succeeded in earning Muhammad some semblance of power at Mecca.
To me, Judaism and Christainity are the true religions; there were not supposed to be any more prophets after the last one in the Bible. And no, Muhammad did not exactly act like a holy man in my thinking, especially when he massacred an entire Jewish tribe and sent all their women and children in slavery, out of spite. And he wrote some very unflattering things about Jews afterwards in the Koran as well, and he also changed the focus of worship from Jerusalem to Mecca - his home - almost to say that he is the one everybody should worship.
So I treat Muhammad as a flawed man that had some good ideas and some bad ideas, but basically as somebody who wanted to give the Arabs their own religion because he admired the Jews for their own devout worship while he lived with them in Syria. But I do not believe in the Koran as the "final words" of God, as I do not believe Muhammad was himself a genuine prophet - just a man trying to shake things up a bit for his own people. Which certainly succeeded.
Again, I mean no offense; I do not want to ruffle any feathers; I am just expressing my feelings about Islam, and why I will probably never treat it as a genuine religion. Just a man's philosphy. That does have nice things about it, but to this point, how the Muslim nations as a whole in the Middle East have historically, in the 20th century, reacted to Israel (and Palestinian refugees) does have me more than a bit skeptical about the merits of Islam. In short, it seems like overkill to me. Much as Puritanism and Catholicism, in some respects, have turned out to be throughout history, too.
And that's all I will say here about it. I hope I haven't offended anybody too deeply about what I've thought about it all this time.
First of all, the Quran was not penned by the Prophet Muhammad (PBUH), it is a divine relation from God which had been conveyed to him in parts over the course of 23 years either directly or through the angel Gabriel. Any biography on him would attest that the prophet could neither read nor write, thus disputing the claims of his authorship. Hence all the "very unflattering things about Jews" came indeed from God himself.
Muhammad did not betray the Jews- on the contrary, the Jews were the ones who broke the alliance they had made in the constitution of Madinah (wherein, amongst others, they vowed to defend the city together with their Muslim counterparts from enemies and not to inflict harm on fellow Muslims).
A prime example would be Banu Quraizah, a Jewish tribe who conspired with the Meccan pagan Arabs in the Battle of the Trench. After their plans backfired, they were besieged by the Muslims and forced to surrender unconditionally. Upon deciding the penalty for their treachery, people from the Aus tribe (an native Arab tribe in Madinah) pleaded the prophet not to impose a harsh penalty, for many people from Banu Quraizah were their friends. The prophet thus proposed that the punishment be decided by the chief of the Aus tribe, Saad ibn Muaz, to which they all agreed. Saad then ordered all the men of Banu Quraizah to be killed, the women and children put to slavery.
Point one: the prophet did not massacre the tribe out of spite- in fact he already gave a chance for the chief of the Aus tribe to decide on the penalty.
Point two: the punishment, whilst might seem harsh to some people, was crucial to maintain peace and order in Al-Madinah. Even by today's standards, treason is regarded amongst the worst of crimes, which is liable to the penalty of death.
Point three: In the Torah itself, there were verses regarding the punishment of the killing of men n putting women n children to slavery during acts of war. (sorry can't quote 'em, they're not in English).
Clearly, you got your facts from a different source than mine (more likely from a Jewish or Christion point of views), and I'd say your facts are wrong and tampered with, and you'd probably say the same thing about mine.
But there have always been conflicts in historical records, especially when elements of bias are involved, and, whilst I firmly believe in the version I've learned, I simply want to highlight the fact that what you read from one source isn't necessarily the truth. Try to dig infos from all sides before coming to your conclusion.
About the changing of direction of worship or
qiblah- I think this has been discussed earlier in the forum, but allow me to reiterate. The change was, once again, an order from God- not dictated by the prophet himself. As stated in the Quran, the initial
qiblah towards Baitul Maqdis in Jerusalem was a test of obedience from God to Muslims, for before Islam, Makkah had always been the direction of their worship, a place which they held in highest regard. Having proven their devotion (in spite of criticism concerning the similarity with the Jews), God thus ordered the change to their original sacred place of worship. I think it's rude and demeaning to carelessly comment that the prophet changed the direction as almost to say that everybody should worship him.
You probably won't be satisfied with my answers as you'd already had a very negative impression on Prophet Muhammad and the Quran. But your argument from the point of history in itself is debatable- conflicting data n all. As for Muslims not being pacifists, well, it depends on how you define the concept, and the relevance of it. We believe in non-violence, but if we are aggressed n persecuted, we are taught not to take it lying down. I think ddadain at some point earlier mentioned bout the verse in the Quran which commands killing of the non-believers. Now, I think this has been used by many a skeptic as the so-called proof that Islam condones violence. It's best if I state the translation of the verses concerning this matter for clarity:
"Fight in the way of Allah against those who fight you, but begin not hostilities. Lo! Allah loveth not, aggressors.
And slay them wherever you find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution is worse than slaughter. And fight not with them at the Inviolable Place of Worship until they attack you (there) then slay them. Such is the reward of disbelievers.
But if they desist, then lo! Allah is Forgiving, Merciful.
And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah. But if they desist, then let there be no hostility except against wrongdoers."
(Al-Baqarah: 190-193)
Clearly, the aforementioned verses refer to fighting as an act of self-defence
only. Is it equal to violence? So if by this definition, Muslims are not considered as pacifists, and don't earn merits in the eyes of some skeptics, then so be it.
Sorry for the long, long reply...
If there is any unclear part in my explanation or if there are further questions, please ask straightaway. Hope I didn't offend anyone.
