Hangout Akatsuki no Yona Hangout Thread

[@Aylinn]

I don’t if you have noticed, but I was compering two main characters, not a main character to a supporting character with a considerable less pagetime. As far as I remember this manga is called Yona of the Dawn, not Su-won of the Dawn, so showing his struggles and failures is not of equal importance and since he is not the main character, it can be more easily assumed that his struggles happen mostly off-page. Although I would certainly not mind if Kusanagi showed, for example, him struggling or failing to achieve something in the past.

As for Su-won being handed-down everything on a silver plate, we were shown that he was learning in the past, so it is easy to assume that he is reaping the benefits for his past effort now. The same goes for Hak. Do you see Hak struggle with mastering his fighting skills in the present?

Besides, even if Kusanagi showed Su-won fail, which I would not mind at all if it is done well, it would only show that he is a human being that can make mistakes and that’s it. It will not magically make Yona a better ruler material, because it would be as ridicules as showing Hak make a mistake in a fight and then claiming that Yona, who didn’t do the mistake, is a better warrior than him.

 

[Brandish μ]

The recent chapter was okay. More of a set up chapter. The best parts were with Tae-Woo and Yotaka.

I take it Gobi will attend the conference. I wonder just how much he'll press Soo-Won about Yona/dragons, because what Soo-Won answers to that would be interesting. Then again, Gobi may not mention it. He probably should be tight-lipped since he'll be talking to someone who successfully took power...

At any rate I'm looking forward to Soo-Won showing his superiority as a politician.

 

[Aniela]

The recent chapter was okay. More of a set up chapter. The best parts were with Tae-Woo and Yotaka.

I take it Gobi will attend the conference. I wonder just how much he'll press Soo-Won about Yona/dragons, because what Soo-Won answers to that would be interesting. Then again, Gobi may not mention it. He probably should be tight-lipped since he'll be talking to someone who successfully took power...

At any rate I'm looking forward to Soo-Won showing his superiority as a politician.

I wonder. Gobi - Su-won meeting might be interesting, but that would mean that Kouren has to get out of the picture somehow, and I still don't see her dying... Well, maybe I'll be surprised. But so far I'm expecting the easy solution, that is, Gobi going down next chapter or the one after that to clear path for the peace, and thus the end of the arc.

 

[lightningsha]

Well it's funny you say that you dislike characters whom seem to have the author go easy on them and have them be successful no matter what. If that's your take on it then you shouldn't like Soo-won at all. He's literally being handed everything to him on a silver platter, most of with doesn't even require him to get involved or lift a finger. And so far, he hasn't failed once.

It seems like you forget that during the battle between the fire tribe and Soo-won, Yona was there to try and break things up. And she failed very early on trying to achieve that. There is your failure for the MC. Not everything that Yona does must result in failure. Otherwise why bother reading the manga if all you want is for the main character to fail over and over, and expect problems, that would require outside forces to help, to resolve themselves.

I don’t if you have noticed, but I was compering two main characters, not a main character to a supporting character with a considerable less pagetime. As far as I remember this manga is called Yona of the Dawn, not Su-won of the Dawn, so showing his struggles and failures is not of equal importance and since he is not the main character, it can be more easily assumed that his struggles happen mostly off-page. Although I would certainly not mind if Kusanagi showed, for example, him struggling or failing to achieve something in the past.

As for Su-won being handed-down everything on a silver plate, we were shown that he was learning in the past, so it is easy to assume that he is reaping the benefits for his past effort now. The same goes for Hak. Do you see Hak struggle with mastering his fighting skills in the present?

Besides, even if Kusanagi showed Su-won fail, which I would not mind at all if it is done well, it would only show that he is a human being that can make mistakes and that’s it. It will not magically make Yona a better ruler material, because it would be as ridicules as showing Hak make a mistake in a fight and then claiming that Yona, who didn’t do the mistake, is a better warrior than him.

I'm probably going to be stepping on a lot of toes here.
In my opinion, I think both Yona and Soo-won suffer from too many winning streaks so far in the story. Both characters have one too many perfections in either their character or actions for me to find appealing.

Yona, aside from her supernatural importance, has a personality that is inspiring and so sweet, it's cloying. Seriously, I can't find any instances where characters didn't find her charismatic or attractive. I'd like if there was at least one tick in her personality that wasn't so glamorous. For example Kagome from Inuyasha had a bit of a short fuse, and Miaka from Fushigi Yugi had a gluttony problem. What does Yona have? Vanity? I only saw that in the first chapter. Now it appears she enjoys traveling and can get more rough and dirty than Kija. Naivety? Naivety is something everyone has at some point in their life and it doesn't count as a personality defect. It's only a personality defect when one can't let go of their ignorance or naivety. Clearly Yona is not in this category. Stubbornness? Usually Yona's instances of stubbornness happen in a self-sacrificial manner. For example when her companions urge her to rest, but she stubbornly refuses because she wants to help someone or strive for progress. You see. She is sweet, adorable, caring, beautiful, fierce (in a majestic, heroic way), strong-minded, inspiring, self-sacrificial, I could go on...
I don't hate Yona. In fact sometimes I find her sweet and cute in a good heart-warming way, but other times her sweetness becomes a bit too overwhelming.

Soo-won's character has a different sort of problem than Yona, but no less aggravating in his perfections. As @BlackVice pointed out, Soo-won's genius and success as the new ruler of Kouka is so ridiculous in its greatness, it makes all other characters look like meandering fools in his presence. Though unlike Yona's shining grace, Soo-won has a black stain on his character for murdering Il and betraying his closest friends. You'd think that'd help my reservations with him, but it doesn't. In fact this dark task he did almost seems justified because the world needs a genius leader like him. The way it's been portrayed so far in the manga, it almost looks heroic and self-sacrificial in a twisted sort of way. You are almost supposed to pity him for making the necessary move to save the country. That sacrifice causes him to lose his friends' trust and make him morose because of it. You are supposed to admire him for burying his emotions and human attachments -a very hard thing to do- in order to become the impassive, perfect King that will save Kouka. And so far his winning streak as a leader reflects that. The generals and enemies underestimate him initially, then quell at his magnificent strategy and character. Rinse and repeat.

But Soo-won is a fascinatingly complex character. Like many other people, I can't help but try to puzzle him out. Kusanagi hides his thoughts more than other characters to add to the mystery of Soo-won and to keep you guessing on his next plans. However, what makes Soo-won unique is not because of his personality, nor his actions as a leader. What makes Soo-won unique is his position in the story from a literary perspective. Soo-won starts off as the supposed friend-betraying evil villain/antagonist that takes the throne and will need to be righteously taken down by our hero. It's what you typically see in so many other stories and is what you are initially lead to believe how the story will take off. But that's not what happens. What throws the reader for a loop is finding out later that Soo-won is not your typical antagonist, if even an antagonist at all. I do applaud Kusanagi for this masterful stroke in the manga, because this deconstruction of the typical hero vs. villain format is what really makes Akatsuki no Yona stand out as a top tier manga in my opinion. And one of the reasons why I love it.

However, I do not let this blind me to what I mentioned earlier about Soo-won. If he were the main protagonist of the story, those perfections would be far more obvious and I think would have made him less popular of a character. He is not unique because of his characteristics, he is unique because of his place in the story. As @Aylinn pointed out.

I know the manga is not over yet, and either Yona or Soo-won are bound to face failure. What I'd like is if the failure was due to a personal mistake. That would take away from their perfections and make more appealing characters in my opinion. I respect Yona and Soo-won as plot-engines but await the day I see more to their characters I like. So thus I am open to changing my opinion of both of them, and am waiting in the wings in a sense.

 

[Mini_kinkin]

@lightningsha

Yes I agree with you about Soo-Won. The fact that Soo-Won is more scarce in the manga makes him more interesting. In my opinion at least. If he was an MC and we see him all the time there would be no build up like "oh what is he going to do next." He doesn't have many interpersonal relationships so it won't be like Yona and Co where a whole manga can be written only about their adventures. So the fact that he appears once in a lot of chapters makes his appearance more worthwhile.

Also Yona's naivety and lack of calculations before getting into dangerous situations irritates me too. I wish she wasn't so straight-laced sometimes, but I feel like if she became more manipulative she would lose her essence as Yona. So it's confusing.

@Brandish

ooh! I feel Kouren will attend the conference THEN die if at all. Then the whole thing will fall upon Tao and by now she should have become less naive hopefully.

 

[@Aylinn]

If Su-won were the main character, I would certainly expect more from his characterization. However, he is not so I give him a pass. Yona is the main character, so I expect more from her characterization than from Su-won’s characterization.

 

[Brandish μ]

I do agree that Soo-Won/Yona as leaders have been blessed. But I don't mind. I've always viewed the 'success' of either to be assured so it makes it complicated for their relationship and perspective of the other (Hak included as well). And the drama between the trio is more appealing to me than the politics or warfare, which is more of a bonus when it's good.

Gobi - Su-won meeting might be interesting, but that would mean that Kouren has to get out of the picture somehow, and I still don't see her dying... Well, maybe I'll be surprised. But so far I'm expecting the easy solution, that is, Gobi going down next chapter or the one after that to clear path for the peace, and thus the end of the arc.

Yea I don't see her dying either. What I meant was Gobi can attend the conference as Soo-Won won't be interfering with Xing's problems. That may not be his true intentions, but we'll see. He'll want Xing to yield to Kouka, I believe.

ooh! I feel Kouren will attend the conference THEN die if at all. Then the whole thing will fall upon Tao and by now she should have become less naive hopefully.

I like Kouren and Tao working together from now on (and Gobi dying). But I can see the appeal in that scenario as well, for Tao at least (poor Kouren).

 

[Mini_kinkin]

I do agree that Soo-Won/Yona as leaders have been blessed. But I don't mind. I've always viewed the 'success' of either to be assured so it makes it complicated for their relationship and perspective of the other (Hak included as well). And the drama between the trio is more appealing to me than the politics or warfare, which is more of a bonus when it's good.

Yes for me the relationship between the three and the relationship of Yona, dragons, Hak and Yoon with each other is what makes this manga most interesting.

 

[lightningsha]

I do agree that Soo-Won/Yona as leaders have been blessed. But I don't mind. I've always viewed the 'success' of either to be assured so it makes it complicated for their relationship and perspective of the other (Hak included as well). And the drama between the trio is more appealing to me than the politics or warfare, which is more of a bonus when it's good.

Yes for me the relationship between the three and the relationship of Yona, dragons, Hak and Yoon with each other is what makes this manga most interesting.

Agreed. The relationships and interactions between all the characters is the main reason why I read this manga as well. Kusanagi does this so well. I think few other manga compare in this aspect.
The Soo-won/Yona thing are reasons why these two aren't my favorites, but I enjoy interactions with these characters nonetheless.

Yea I don't see her dying either. What I meant was Gobi can attend the conference as Soo-Won won't be interfering with Xing's problems. That may not be his true intentions, but we'll see. He'll want Xing to yield to Kouka, I believe.
I like Kouren and Tao working together from now on (and Gobi dying). But I can see the appeal in that scenario as well, for Tao at least (poor Kouren)

I keep thinking Gobi will get shanked by Mizari or something before he can be more of a problem. His ambitions are so over the top, and the fact that he has confidence in achieving such grand delusions is funny. But maybe I should take him more seriously, since Soo-won saying he will talk to anyone really who has power over Xing might be a flag for Gobi sticking around for the meeting.
Also I was reading back and saw a conversation between Kouren and Gobi, where Kouren says something along the lines of how Gobi should go back to the isolated island or something he was at 7 years ago. I took to mean there is some priesthood place on this island and their influence over Xing has been only recent. It doesn't appear to have been like Kouka where the priests have been a main pillar of Kouka's power since its foundation (until recently anyway). Gobi is apparently a 'high priest' too, but not sure if any of these things mean anything to the plot or not.

 

[Mini_kinkin]

I keep thinking Gobi will get shanked by Mizari or something before he can be more of a problem. His ambitions are so over the top, and the fact that he has confidence in achieving such grand delusions is funny. But maybe I should take him more seriously, since Soo-won saying he will talk to anyone really who has power over Xing might be a flag for Gobi sticking around for the meeting.
Also I was reading back and saw a conversation between Kouren and Gobi, where Kouren says something along the lines of how Gobi should go back to the isolated island or something he was at 7 years ago. I took to mean there is some priesthood place on this island and their influence over Xing has been only recent. It doesn't appear to have been like Kouka where the priests have been a main pillar of Kouka's power since its foundation (until recently anyway). Gobi is apparently a 'high priest' too, but not sure if any of these things mean anything to the plot or not.

All I know is that Gobi needs Botox.

But in all seriousness...if priesthood wasn't prominent in Xing it would explain why Gobi is mad after power. They didn't have any influence all these years. I mean just compare this withering piece of poop to cutie Ik-Soo.

 

[@Aylinn]

I do agree that Soo-Won/Yona as leaders have been blessed. But I don't mind. I've always viewed the 'success' of either to be assured so it makes it complicated for their relationship and perspective of the other (Hak included as well). And the drama between the trio is more appealing to me than the politics or warfare, which is more of a bonus when it's good.

Yes for me the relationship between the three and the relationship of Yona, dragons, Hak and Yoon with each other is what makes this manga most interesting.

Agreed. The relationships and interactions between all the characters is the main reason why I read this manga as well.

I also like it for it, which is why I didn’t mind Sei arc so much that has those forts in the middle of nowhere.

However, this arc makes Yona feel more like Mary Sue. In previous arcs her successes were done better, since she had to put some effort to learn archery, swordsmanship before enjoying a success. However, this arc seems to be here to give her a diplomatic victory without making her put an effort to learn anything about diplomacy and politics.

And despite her actions being hazardous, thoughtless and that she mainly achieved stuff due to luck in this arc, they were all shown as badass and no character in the story is questioning them. It looks like we are supposed to admire Yona for her badassery no matter how little merit is behind this badassery of hers.

This is my main issue with this arc. I think her development was handled better in the past arcs. I didn’t mind when the plot was handled poorly, but I mind when a character is handled poorly.

 

[lightningsha]

All I know is that Gobi needs Botox.

But in all seriousness...if priesthood wasn't prominent in Xing it would explain why Gobi is mad after power. They didn't have any influence all these years. I mean just compare this withering piece of poop to cutie Ik-Soo.

These priests almost seem like a dark cult rather than a legit religion. This being because of their dark hooded cloaks. It screams shady.
But whatever the case, the people of Xing seem to be drinking the Kool-Aid and eating up whatever Gobi tells them. His original spiel was that the gods chose Tao, and with her as the leader Xing will know peace. That tells me that the Xing people are still pretty religious regardless. He has followers and the funds for mercenaries apparently.

I also like it for it, which is why I didn’t mind Sei arc so much that has those forts in the middle of nowhere.

However, this arc makes Yona feel more like Mary Sue. In previous arcs her successes were done better, since she had to put some effort to learn archery, swordsmanship before enjoying a success. However, this arc seems to be here to give her a diplomatic victory without making her put an effort to learn anything about diplomacy and politics.

And despite her actions being hazardous, thoughtless and that she mainly achieved stuff due to luck in this arc, they were all shown as badass and no character in the story is questioning them. It looks like we are supposed to admire Yona for her badassery no matter how little merit is behind this badassery of hers.

This is my main issue with this arc. I think her development was handled better in the past arcs. I didn’t mind when the plot was handled poorly, but I mind when a character is handled poorly.

Can't argue there. Yona has completely and seamlessly won over Kouren. It was pure luck that Yona happened to run into Kouren while she was being attacked by Gobi's goons. Yona was conveniently there to assist Kouren and essentially become 'men-at-arms' with one another as they fought off the assassins together. I'm not saying Kouren wouldn't have been won over anyway, but that night together certainly made it absolute.

Also I noticed fans applauding Yona's badassery when she stepped in front of the arrows and the dragon shield came. All I saw was stupidity. Though I'm hoping Yona will regret that move after seeing the consequences of it. The arc isn't over yet and she may still face drawbacks,so we shall see.

 

[Brandish μ]

I went to re-read the chapter and found there were pages I'd missed... Kouren was struck down at the very end.

I keep thinking Gobi will get shanked by Mizari or something before he can be more of a problem. His ambitions are so over the top, and the fact that he has confidence in achieving such grand delusions is funny. But maybe I should take him more seriously, since Soo-won saying he will talk to anyone really who has power over Xing might be a flag for Gobi sticking around for the meeting.

I also downplay Gobi, for the same reason, his characterisation is such that I can't really respect his role (and I dislike him to boot).

This is my main issue with this arc. I think her development was handled better in the past arcs. I didn’t mind when the plot was handled poorly, but I mind when a character is handled poorly.

Also I noticed fans applauding Yona's badassery when she stepped in front of the arrows and the dragon shield came. All I saw was stupidity. Though I'm hoping Yona will regret that move after seeing the consequences of it. The arc isn't over yet and she may still face drawbacks,so we shall see.

I didn't look at it this way, but I can't disagree, it was silly. She's not Zeno, and she hasn't used a power like that before (I thought the dragon ability was badass looking).

Hak said he'll have a talk to Yona after the war (which would be about his feelings etc). But after what Yona did with the arrows he should give her a bit of a lecture. And we might get an explanation from Yona, doubt it would be logical, more along the lines of "something within me made me move"...

 

[lightningsha]

I didn't look at it this way, but I can't disagree, it was silly. She's not Zeno, and she hasn't used a power like that before (I thought the dragon ability was badass looking).

Hak said he'll have a talk to Yona after the war (which would be about his feelings etc). But after what Yona did with the arrows he should give her a bit of a lecture. And we might get an explanation from Yona, doubt it would be logical, more along the lines of "something within me made me move"...

The dragon ability was very cool. That was certainly the badass part. But people chalking it up to Yona and being proud of her because of it...I don't know. I think that would have been the case for me if it activated to protect her under a difference circumstance that was unavoidable and wasn't entirely her fault. Not to mention it costed the dragon warriors a lot too. Which isn't good either.

I liked Hak's look of desperation in that moment. You can feel his helplessness in not being able to do anything in that moment. He probably had a mini heart attack. He must really be grateful to the dragon warriors for that literal deus ex machina And yes giving her a lecture would be nice too (before or after he tells her he loves her? lol), though knowing Yona I'm sure she does feel guilty. She always does whenever someone pays a price for protecting her. I just hope we see it.

 

[Mini_kinkin]

I didn't look at it this way, but I can't disagree, it was silly. She's not Zeno, and she hasn't used a power like that before (I thought the dragon ability was badass looking).

Hak said he'll have a talk to Yona after the war (which would be about his feelings etc). But after what Yona did with the arrows he should give her a bit of a lecture. And we might get an explanation from Yona, doubt it would be logical, more along the lines of "something within me made me move"...

The dragon ability was very cool. That was certainly the badass part. But people chalking it up to Yona and being proud of her because of it...I don't know. I think that would have been the case for me if it activated to protect her under a difference circumstance that was unavoidable and wasn't entirely her fault. Not to mention it costed the dragon warriors a lot too. Which isn't good either.

I liked Hak's look of desperation in that moment. You can feel his helplessness in not being able to do anything in that moment. He probably had a mini heart attack. He must really be grateful to the dragon warriors for that literal deus ex machina And yes giving her a lecture would be nice too (before or after he tells her he loves her? lol), though knowing Yona I'm sure she does feel guilty. She always does whenever someone pays a price for protecting her. I just hope we see it.

Yeah. Actually I thought most of the arc was handled OKAY for a shoujo. I feel Yona made use of her relationships with Fire (TaeJun) and Water Tribe (Lili) and we also found out that Soo-Won knew she is Hiryuu. Plus she handled things for the most part without the dragons, and some parts without Hak.

But what irritated me was her stepping into the field of already fired arrows. No homegirl, you don't do that. Not when Dragons and Hak bend over backwards to protect your life for you. Though as you guys pointed the shield was cool.

Also do you think Hak or Yona will finally confess when they "meet" :P. I hope things speed up on the romance front. I think Hak has scolded her before right but she doesn't listen though? Maybe she will listen this time. Plus Yona looked legit confused with Hak told her he wants to "talk". I wonder Yona, I wonder why Hak wants to meet you huh? It's not like you randomly kissed him or anything.

 

[Brandish μ]

Also do you think Hak or Yona will finally confess when they "meet" :P. I hope things speed up on the romance front. I think Hak has scolded her before right but she doesn't listen though? Maybe she will listen this time. Plus Yona looked legit confused with Hak told her he wants to "talk". I wonder Yona, I wonder why Hak wants to meet you huh? It's not like you randomly kissed him or anything.

Hmm not sure I want to pick a side :P If a confession happens, I hope it's done well. Based on the random kiss - yea, they really have to deal with that and their relationship. I'd be disappointed if it amounted to nothing, like "it was a mistake, I didn't know what I was thinking"...

On the romance front - Hak x Yona is a pairing I really like for sake of the individual characters, but it's hard to get behind the progression of it so far. And my main issue would be with how Yona's feelings have been written. It nearly forced that she loves Hak. Now, I don't think that is the case, but it does come across that way. All it would've taken is a little more care so that we (or I xD) could understand her feelings better.

That said, Yona is a young lady, so it could easily be assumed that she is inexperienced, and therefore it comes across messily. It actually makes sense when you think about her like that.

 

[ShiKou]

tbh, I really like SooWonxYona Pair the most no matter how much I look at them when they're together.. they really have that so called chemistry esp. the matching colors of their hairs and clothes.. but I knew from the start that Hak is really the obvious main love interest whom yona will end up with so right now, I'm currently rooting for SooWonxLily or SooWonxKouren to happen or atleast I want SooWon to be happy at the end of the manga eventhough he doesn't have a love interest.. hope the mangaka will not kill him thou..

and in the recent chapters.. I can't wait for Kouren and SooWon's interactions..I want atleast for Kouren to change her views about SooWon though //sigh// chapters please hurry already!!

 

[shinobi]

tbh, I really like SooWonxYona Pair the most no matter how much I look at them when they're together.. they really have that so called chemistry esp. the matching colors of their hairs and clothes.. but I knew from the start that Hak is really the obvious main love interest whom yona will end up with so right now, I'm currently rooting for SooWonxLily or SooWonxKouren to happen or atleast I want SooWon to be happy at the end of the manga eventhough he doesn't have a love interest.. hope the mangaka will not kill him thou..

and in the recent chapters.. I can't wait for Kouren and SooWon's interactions..I want atleast for Kouren to change her views about SooWon though //sigh// chapters please hurry already!!

Yona x Hak happens to be the most boring pair in the manga, and there's no chapter as dull as a chapter full of the so called Yona x Hak moments, like really
as for Suwon , I'm not sure we'll ever see him fall in love with any girl given how he is, It would be nice to see it happen though.
about Suwon being happy at the end of the manga, I wish for it, but the odds are he'll die, or get killed, or at least he won't be happy, since Yona has to make her way to the throne for her to succeed as the Main Character.
hmmm as for Kouren, she'll become good friends with Suwon, yup yup , I'd like to think of them as more than friends but I guess Lily is a massive contender too lol !!

btw, the next chapter is coming next week??

 

[@Aylinn]

About Hak & Yona, I will be surprised if Kusanagi doesn’t throw obstacles on their way to be together so that they will only be able to end up as a proper couple in the final chapters of the manga.

As for Su-won, I would like to see him happy too. It doesn’t matter to me if he is with someone or alone. I think he should remain being the King, since he is the right person in the right place.

btw, the next chapter is coming next week??

No, the next chapter will be released on 4th November, so there are still two weeks.

 

[Aniela]

Well, I don't ship YonaxSu-won, but I do ship LilixSu-won. However, that's only because the author made them NOTP themselves, and I'm a person who'll push when she sees the sign "pull" on the door :P

On the serious note, I'd be glad if Su-won lives through the end of manga. I think it's already enough of a trope reversal to ask for more (such as him still being the king, or getting married, or whatever else). Since, you know, unfortunately the next most popular trope out there about antagonist such as Su-won - after being the Big Bad - would be for him to die a heroic death to save Yona and/or Hak to redeem himself. Which I'd hate =.=