Final August vs Irene

[Orgastthemage]

August can do that? How?

He stated himself to know all of magic(unlikely but he certainly has an immense arsenal). He is Zeref's son and was stated to losses knowledge that made him a magic prodigy much like his parents. Ex. His regaining of memories that a child would not be able to do.

He is revered as a genius by his spriggan teammates. I say no reason as to why the magic king wouldn't be able to accomplish this, especially when he himself stated to be the strongest of the twelve.

I'm not giving him feats he doesn't have, I'm just supplying a very likely possibility that the magic king most likely possesses the ability to change her back.

 

[EmptySoul]

Also im pretty sure August is knowledgeable because of all the magic hes copied,Not that he has knowledge so he could copy/use all magic

If that makes sense to u

 

[MonkeyD-Dragon]

August is the coolest guy EVER! he can one shot anyone with his hax magic. DS or not he kills Irene. August is above everyone not named Dragon king

 

[Orgastthemage]

And she would just stand there while all of that happens?
Very realistic :/

And how would he even be able to change her back to human form,cause im pretty sure hes NEVER used that b4 and never copied it b4 since there are no dragons in this era unless he copied Zeref doing it to Irene and we all know he wasnt there

Stab her?
Only reason Irene died from that stab wound while Erza survived multiple stabs was cause it was a DS Enchanted sword which again he doesnt have

Well, why wouldn't he be able to? He subtle.magic long for a reason. He has himself stated to master all magic except for that of parental love.

Irene in human form wasn't shown to ve much faster than DF Wendy. August has shown his capacity to use meteor. A spell that grants it's user some of the best speed feats of this manga.

We could go back and forth with assumptions and we'd still disagree, so we can only go by the hints given to us readers by means of narrative. August stated himself to be the strongest of the twelve, Irene stated herself to be the strongest female.

 

[MonkeyD-Dragon]

Enchantment is Caster type magic, so even if August doesn't have DS he can copy Enchantment and undo her Dragon form, then kill her in human form

 

[Orgastthemage]

Also im pretty sure August is knowledgeable because of all the magic hes copied,Not that he has knowledge so he could copy/use all magic

If that makes sense to u

Well his MP is what gives him "knowledge", and has given him superhuman qualities. He was shown to have recollected memories that way even as a young boy. I think it's alluding to him being knowledgeable because of his MP and not because of the spells he's copied.

 

[Enima]

He stated himself to know all of magic(unlikely but he certainly has an immense arsenal). He is Zeref's son and was stated to losses knowledge that made him a magic prodigy much like his parents. Ex. His regaining of memories that a child would not be able to do.

He is revered as a genius by his spriggan teammates. I say no reason as to why the magic king wouldn't be able to accomplish this, especially when he himself stated to be the strongest of the twelve.

I'm not giving him feats he doesn't have, I'm just supplying a very likely possibility that the magic king most likely possesses the ability to change her back.

We can accept it if it's something basic.. like barrier magic. but transforming Irene back to normal is far too advanced. We can't just assume he cann do it.

I wouldn't take the writer's note too seriously. He called Makarov infallible

Spoiler

Yeah, right

Self hype isn't that reliable either. Every member of the spriggan twelve said they can't be beaten, look what happened.

 

[EmptySoul]

Well, why wouldn't he be able to? He subtle.magic long for a reason. He has himself stated to master all magic except for that of parental love.

Irene in human form wasn't shown to ve much faster than DF Wendy. August has shown his capacity to use meteor. A spell that grants it's user some of the best speed feats of this manga.

We could go back and forth with assumptions and we'd still disagree, so we can only go by the hints given to us readers by means of narrative. August stated himself to be the strongest of the twelve, Irene stated herself to be the strongest female.

We're going around in circles
August not being able to use DSM is the main Reason why he cannot beat Dragon Irene
Speed doesnt matter if he can not make any decent damage on her

Enchantment is Caster type magic, so even if August doesn't have DS he can copy Enchantment and undo her Dragon form, then kill her in human form

So I guess Igneels fire magic is easily copied by August too since fire is a caster type too :/
Monkey gtfo with ur trolling

Well his MP is what gives him "knowledge", and has given him superhuman qualities. He was shown to have recollected memories that way even as a young boy. I think it's alluding to him being knowledgeable because of his MP and not because of the spells he's copied.

I was speaking abt his knowledge regarding magic

 

[Seraph]

Enchantment is Caster type magic, so even if August doesn't have DS he can copy Enchantment and undo her Dragon form, then kill her in human form

If Irene can't enchant his Body,then why would August be allowed to do the Same if he copied it?
That would be against the Rules would it?
Since Enchanting others Body is restricted,she can't turn him into a Mouse/any Other Animal he can't copy the Enchantment and Turn her into a Human.
Just me Though.

 

[MonkeyD-Dragon]

So I guess Igneels fire magic is easily copied by August too since fire is a caster type too :/
Monkey gtfo with ur trolling

That is assuming August can't copy DS.
And Enchantment isn't DS now is it ?

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 11, 2017, Original Post Date: Jun 11, 2017 ---

If Irene can't enchant his Body,then why would August be allowed to do the Same if he copied it?
That would be against the Rules would it?
Since Enchanting others Body is restricted,she can't turn him into a Mouse/any Other Animal he can't copy the Enchantment and Turn her into a Human.
Just me Though.

I asked Brandish about it in the threesome battle, he said it counts for Zeref as a feat :> so why not count it for August ? :>

 

[Seraph]

That is assuming August can't copy DS.
And Enchantment isn't DS now is it ?

--- Double Post Merged, Jun 11, 2017, Original Post Date: Jun 11, 2017 ---

I asked Brandish about it in the threesome battle, he said it counts for Zeref as a feat :> so why not count it for August ? :>

@Brandish I think we need a Detailed Explanation here if you don't mind concerning August copying the Enchantments,i don't think it can be counted since he would be able to enchant her Body while she is Restricted from doing so. :/

 

[Orgastthemage]

We can accept it if it's something basic.. like barrier magic. but transforming Irene back to normal is far too advanced. We can't just assume he cann do it.

I wouldn't take the writer's note too seriously. He called Makarov infallible

Spoiler

Yeah, right

Self hype isn't that reliable either. Every member of the spriggan twelve said they can't be beaten, look what happened.

Well i'd say self-hype wouldn't be reliable as Well, However that would betray August's just character(acknowledging Zeref as a better medium for FH, not challenging Acnoligia, complementing enemies and allies alike). I think his judgments are the safest out of any character.

Irene seemed more arrogant through her characterization. And even then she only called herself strongest female amongst the twelve.

Not to mention shounen manga save the stronger villains for the end. August was the last soriggan standing for a reason.

He was hinted by narrative to be the strongest more than once, and by more than just one character.

We can't assume scenarios between these two because we don't know everything about them. We only know that they are comparable. However, as the story progresses, August became the more impressive of the two and received your stereotypical shounen confirmation of being stronger by performing better and outlasting Irene.

 

[inactive lurker account]

How do we deal with the 'strongest' claims? Well, I'm not sure if Irene called herself the strongest enchantress which implies a restriction in terms of specialty, or the strongest female magician which implies a gendered restriction, but either appellation can be seen to merely refer to her magic skills, not her strength as a dragon. Similarly, August calling himself the strongest mage might be a testament to his superiority in magecraft, even if a dragon would turn out to have superior physical stats. Still, the problem is that so little is said about the nature of August's magic given his heritage, and that depending if one underestimates or overestimates what that entails, he may or may not stand a chance against dragons barring the likes of Acnologia and Igneel.

And then there's the tricky matter of coming up with scenarios whereby Irene in dragon form manages to corner August...

 

[EmptySoul]

That is assuming August can't copy DS.
And Enchantment isn't DS now is it ?

Why wouldnt it be? Who said Dragons only use elemental magic? Also Wendy Enchanted DS magic onto a sword didnt she?
And i dont think any DS has the ability to choose whether or not their magic has DSM attached to it or not :/

 

[Orgastthemage]

We're going around in circles
August not being able to use DSM is the main Reason why he cannot beat Dragon Irene
Speed doesnt matter if he can not make any decent damage on her


So I guess Igneels fire magic is easily copied by August too since fire is a caster type too :/
Monkey gtfo with ur trolling


I was speaking abt his knowledge regarding

That's why I'm saying he could just change her back and finish her off then with a surprise meteor. We know to little about the extents of both characters. Therefore I say we only have narrative portrayal to go by, August was implied to be the stronger even by Irene, and the fact that he was the last spriggan standing in a shounen manga. That kinda does imply him being superior to his fellow spriggans. Hahaha. Mind if we take a short break?

 

[MonkeyD-Dragon]

Why wouldnt it be? Who said Dragons only use elemental magic? Also Wendy Enchanted DS magic onto a sword didnt she?
And i dont think any DS has the ability to choose whether or not their magic has DSM attached to it or not :/

This is a weaker assumption than August using DS by a fair margin.
Enchantment was something she knew before becoming a DS,so its like August having many magics but his main magic is Copy magic.She also made DS by using enchantment, not that Enchantment = DS.
And Dragon Form moves her from High Enchantment to Master Enchantment, its a boost not an element.

 

[EmptySoul]

This is a weaker assumption than August using DS by a fair margin.
Enchantment was something she knew before becoming a DS,so its like August having many magics but his main magic is Copy magic.She also made DS by using enchantment, not that Enchantment = DS.
And Dragon Form moves her from High Enchantment to Master Enchantment, its a boost not an element.

So she can choose to seperate her DS magic from normal magic? :\
I dont think thats how it works :/

 

[Brandish μ]

@Brandish I think we need a Detailed Explanation here if you don't mind concerning August copying the Enchantments,i don't think it can be counted since he would be able to enchant her Body while she is Restricted from doing so. :/

A detail explanation

Well if you think August can do what Zeref can do, then you can think that. Trying to prove such a thing is another issue entirely.

As for enchantments, again if you think August can copy them then he can. And trying to prove that is on the person stating it. He won't be able to transform people into animals, since Irene cannot then August cannot copy it (for tournament purposes).

 

[MonkeyD-Dragon]

So she can choose to seperate her DS magic from normal magic? :\
I dont think thats how it works :/

Yes she can, what she used against Acno was normal enchantment, Deus Sema is normal enchantment. I say this because it was stated here

Spoiler

All she does is amplify the magic , not mix them, and what she used was Heavenly Body Magic, so that wasn't DS either. So yes, she can choose which one to use from the magics in Dragon form.

 

[Invel > Zeref]

So people are willing to assume that all non-ds magic is ineffective against dragons just because Tenrou FT, and GMG Jura, Kagura, and Lyon weren't able to damage dragons (who are all weak as hell compared to August) and yet deny August's claims that he could copy all caster magics? Seems like a double standard.