Discussion Every time V was foreshadowed

[Pro Factor]

So with the latest chapter I wanted to see where was it that V was foreshadowed to be inside Bam's body as well as some similarities between them. If somebody can help with mentioning anything I forgot or just adding some new found knowledge it would be nice.

So first foreshadow that we know about would obviously be his name changed in "Viole" and long hair way back at the start of season 2, that one is basically self explanatory.

Next big thing that happened was Hansung calling Bam - V back in hidden floor.

Biggest similarities came in the fight with White. Where not only Bam would use black shinsu he would also use same moves as V. Though a little bit less refined and likely just weaker versions:

Spoiler: Shinsu Sphere

And right after this he used shinsu blast:

Spoiler: Shinsu Blast

White also realizes that he must have awakened something:

Spoiler: White awakened "something"

Later in the story Icarus and Traumerei would describe V as somebody who was like having wings

Spoiler: Wings

And Bam was often shown with wings on his back in a lot of the fights. Interestingly enough he got those wings in his fight against data Zahard, right after he first time drew his "line".

Bam also mentioned in the chapter 560 how he lost control in his fight against White probably saying it was V that took control there:

Spoiler: Chapter 560

And last one obviously being Hwaryun and Enkidu.

Spoiler: Latest foreshadows

Also look how this line definitely looks like a crack in the floor and from the other side there are light particles that are coming over.

This is everything I could remember right now so for now I'll leave it at that. If somebody remembers more stuff please be kind to post it or mention it. Lately this is a hot topic that is spread over multiple threads so it would be nice to have it all in one place I guess.

 

[maverickframe_19]

I see the similarities but I still think dark change bam with black shinshoo is our bam, the irregular.

In both instances, the orb is condensed and then the tension is released to pack most of the destructive damage.

Bam is V's son, I don't think it's that mad of a take if their fighting style is the same especially now that we know that FUG trained him for one purpose only.

It's a pretty good thread, and I'm sure we will be re-visiting it soon enough as more things are explained about V.

 

[Pro Factor]

I see the similarities but I still think dark change bam with black shinshoo is our bam, the irregular.

In both instances, the orb is condensed and then the tension is released to pack most of the destructive damage.

Bam is V's son, I don't think it's that mad of a take if their fighting style is the same especially now that we know that FUG trained him for one purpose only.

Pretty good thread and I'm sure we will be resisting it soon enough as more things get explained about V.

I do wonder,maybe both are actually Bam,one part of him is nice and good as we know him, and the other is vengeful,one that he opened a window to when he drew the line. People have so many different theories about this and a lot of them are good ones,which could turn out to be true in the end. I wasn’t this excited for some answers in ToG since like floor of death.

 

[maverickframe_19]

I do wonder,maybe both are actually Bam,one part of him is nice and good as we know him, and the other is vengeful,one that he opened a window to when he drew the line. People have so many different theories about this and a lot of them are good ones,which could turn out to be true in the end. I wasn’t this excited for some answers in ToG since like floor of death.

The more I think about it the more it looks like classic case of personality disorder. Maybe V is the vengeful part seeing the other part as a vessel while Baam is the original part.
Moon Knight comes to mind from Marvel comics.

Believe it or not, this is still not my most important question.

1. Why was Bam locked in a cave with the Zahard symbol on it and that cave was outside the tower.
2. Why did Bam lose his memories? Was it a fail-saif attempt by OG so that the vengeful part (V) wouldn't take over the main body?

 

[Pro Factor]

The more I think about it the more it looks like classic case of personality disorder. Maybe V is the vengeful part seeing the other part as a vessel while Baam is the original part.
Moon Knight comes to mind from Marvel comics.

Believe it or not, this is still not my most important question.

1. Why was Bam locked in a cave with the Zahard symbol on it and that cave was outside the tower.
2. Why did Bam lose his memories? Was it a fail-saif attempt by OG so that the vengeful part (V) wouldn't take over the main body?

Is it possible that Arlene put that symbol there maybe to make Bam hate it as he would think of the cave in which he was trapped? There was also a cross in that cave bellow Zahard symbol.

Some people like this guy suggested Bam is V as long as 4 years ago:
On the other hand this guy actually touched on the topic of cross bellow 3 eye symbol:

As for your other question, I honestly just don’t have an idea at this time.

 

[maverickframe_19]

Is it possible that Arlene put that symbol there maybe to make Bam hate it as he would think of the cave in which he was trapped? There was also a cross in that cave bellow Zahard symbol.

Some people like this guy suggested Bam is V as long as 4 years ago:
On the other hand this guy actually touched on the topic of cross bellow 3 eye symbol:

As for your other question, I honestly just don’t have an idea at this time.

Actually, that's the Zahard army symbol (The full version encompasses the cross with the 3 eyes, you can see it clearly with that Aria girl.)

Now my question to you is why would a child's first instinct would be to hate something?

A child knows no emotions aside from curiosity. He runs towards it without any fear. You must've observed human baby behaviours right? They are a blank canvas with little attention spam.

If Arlene planned to make him hate Zahard from the get-go, maybe instead of symbols, feed the kid with the knowledge of his identity and control his mindset. Mould him as a revenge weapon. (For Example, Kilua from HXH. He was taught to be an assassin from the very beginning)

What would have been the point of the symbol if V was going to take over anyway?

Something is so fishy about Arlne that I just couldn't put my finger on it.

 

[Pro Factor]

Actually, that's the Zahard army symbol (The full version encompasses the cross with the 3 eyes, you can see it clearly with that Aria girl.)

Now my question to you is why would a child's first instinct would be to hate something?

A child knows no emotions aside from curiosity. He runs towards it without any fear. You must've observed human baby behaviours right? They are a blank canvas with little attention spam.

If Arlene planned to make him hate Zahard from the get-go, maybe instead of symbols, feed the kid with the knowledge of his identity and control his mindset. Mould him as a revenge weapon. (For Example, Kilua from HXH. He was taught to be an assassin from the very beginning)

What would have been the point of the symbol if V was going to take over anyway?

Something is so fishy about Arlne that I just couldn't put my finger on it.

Just another question that SIU will give us answer once we are close to year 2075.

 

[Shadowlord123]

Hidden Floor one certainly hits like a truck.

 

[maverickframe_19]

Hidden Floor one certainly hits like a truck.

I like the payoffs but SIU overkills it with his timing. Just sometimes I would like to get away with answers after completion of an arc instead of extra bunch of questions.

How does HSY even knows about V? How does he know about the prophecy? Was he that tight with the Grace family? But given his position as an advanced ranker how can that be? He cannot have been a traveller with V in his prime, timeline wouldn't make sense. There is also this plot thread about his connection with Bloodmatter.

Like I said. QUESTIONS.

 

[Pro Factor]

I like the payoffs but SIU overkills it with his timing. Just sometimes I would like to get away with answers after completion of an arc instead of extra bunch of questions.

How does HSY even knows about V? How does he know about the prophecy? Was he that tight with the Grace family? But given his position as an advanced ranker how can that be? He cannot have been a traveller with V in his prime, timeline wouldn't make sense. There is also this plot thread about his connection with Bloodmatter.

Like I said. QUESTIONS.

Man I totally agree on the point of more questions after every arc. We really should have been given some answers by now after like 14-15 years of the story. But at this time we have way more questions than we had like 5 years ago. And all the POV switching doesn't help. I would be perfectly fine if this arc ended now with some aftermath of the battle where Traum ACTUALLY died and V answers some questions to Luslec for example (but it's actually basically answering for the audience).

Just answer some of them, no need to answer all:

How is he inside Bam?

Was it his plan from the start to get inside his dead son body?

About war between him + Arlene against other GWs.

About what's next for him.

It would still leave us with bunch of questions, like how Arlene found exit and about outside god stuff, but would give us at least some answers. This now just feels like he wants to blue balls us for whole eternity.

As far as Hansung goes, I guess on top of the fact that he knows alot he had alot of time in hidden floor to gather information from different people that would come. FUG could even specifically send some strong regular to enter the hidden floor and tell data Hansung as much about it as they would be certain that information won't be leaving hidden floor due to rules of the hidden floor. Like Karaka for example at his time of the climb. So far it seems Hansung,Hwaryun and Luslec are the only one that know about V anyway.

 

[maverickframe_19]

Man I totally agree on the point of more questions after every arc. We really should have been given some answers by now after like 14-15 years of the story. But at this time we have way more questions than we had like 5 years ago. And all the POV switching doesn't help. I would be perfectly fine if this arc ended now with some aftermath of the battle where Traum ACTUALLY died and V answers some questions to Luslec for example (but it's actually basically answering for the audience).

Just answer some of them, no need to answer all:

How is he inside Bam?

Was it his plan from the start to get inside his dead son body?

About war between him + Arlene against other GWs.

About what's next for him.

It would still leave us with bunch of questions, like how Arlene found exit and about outside god stuff, but would give us at least some answers. This now just feels like he wants to blue balls us for whole eternity.

As far as Hansung goes, I guess on top of the fact that he knows alot he had alot of time in hidden floor to gather information from different people that would come. FUG could even specifically send some strong regular to enter the hidden floor and tell data Hansung as much about it as they would be certain that information won't be leaving hidden floor due to rules of the hidden floor. Like Karaka for example at his time of the climb. So far it seems Hansung,Hwaryun and Luslec are the only one that know about V anyway.

It's a very bad trait for an author if we as a fanbase needs to rationalise his story.

Just like even by your explanation for HSY knowing the backstory and prophecy through data collection in HF but why do we have to rationalise this? It's the author's job and it's not like he has given us a lot of clues to sink our teeth into.

SIU needs to get better at this but i know for a fact he won't.

 

[Anne isn't a TT]

Hmm, Since we saw BT in flashback, and how FUG treated him to be the vessel for him, I wonder if BT originally belonged to V. That's why FUG didn't take it for themselves since they can't use it. Only V and J have these entities. That's why they were strongest in the group back then!

 

[Pro Factor]

Hmm, Since we saw BT in flashback, and how FUG treated him to be the vessel for him, I wonder if BT originally belonged to V. That's why FUG didn't take it for themselves since they can't use it. Only V and J have these entities. That's why they were strongest in the group back then!

It's possible that there is some connection especially given the dialogue that was in that panel. It could in the future be obvious what this panel means, but right now it's hard to guess.

 

[maverickframe_19]

It's possible that there is some connection especially given the dialogue that was in that panel. It could in the future be obvious what this panel means, but right now it's hard to guess.

We haven't seen BT shine in the series as a whole, haven't we?

Let's be honest, judging by some of his dialogues with Bam the first time he entered the rice cooker, BT might cook hard.

"YOU OR THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU MIGHT BE HURT OR EVEN KILLED AS A RESULT"

I think this sentence might refer to FHs. V didn't want to hurt them before during the climb but the rent is due now. The killing will commence and I feel like BT will be a pivotal power in this.

Hell Joe in the FOD commented why do you have a collosol soul inside of you? We saw BT's image in the next panel. We know it's a big deal.

I'm hyped.

 

[Anne isn't a TT]

YOU OR THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU MIGHT BE HURT OR EVEN KILLED AS A RESULT"

GOG also said same to V when he gave him the blue flame iirc or when he chose to share revs.

 

[Demonspeed]

It's a very bad trait for an author if we as a fanbase needs to rationalise his story.

Just like even by your explanation for HSY knowing the backstory and prophecy through data collection in HF but why do we have to rationalise this? It's the author's job and it's not like he has given us a lot of clues to sink our teeth into.

SIU needs to get better at this but i know for a fact he won't.

We barely know anything about YHS. He also has ties to Bloodmadder. SIU obviously knows what he is doing with him since he involved his data in this arc and taught Baam V's techniques.

 

[kkck]

I could buy the dark change being what first awoke V within bam, at least partially. Though it's relatively easy to argue that bam's rage which caused the line within him to react progressively took him closer to that.

 

[Pro Factor]

I think that V being inside of Bams body is an idea that SIU got around hidden floor or just a bit before that and started implementing it there. First real foreshadowing was back when Hansung said “V” while looking at Bam and that’s where he drew his line (I say line, but I‘m more and more convinced it‘s actually a window) as well as got his wings. I‘m certain at the fight Baam vs White - SIU already knew what he was going to do with Vaam situation. I remember reading SIU blogpost where he said something like “I wanted to foreshadow (certain thing) but I though it would be too obvious so I changed it“ something along those lines, so I don’t think he would want to show us too much too soon.

 

[Lord V returned]

I don't know if you'll count it or not, but I think another solid "foreshadow" was also with Bam's fight against Jahad. Bam's talk with Viole(Sworn enemy) and Blue Demon inside of himself, Season 2 Chapter 299.

BD: It must be a really strong man.
Bam: Y es. He's completely different from the enemies I've encountered so far. This guy is the data of the person who will become teh King of this Tower, the enemy of my parents and the young data of my sworn enemy who I'll have to face even if I return to FUG.
Bam: Everyone is telling me to kill him. Regardless of what I want, everything- is making me hate and fight him.
Bam: But what... am I? Am I just a person who was born to avenge someone else or to make someone else's long-awaited wish come true? The more I find out about myself, the more faint my own existence feels. Like Bubbles floating in this water, as if I was created for someone else's desire and will disappear once that goal is reached. What... Am I...?

Another interesting thought in Bam I'll quote too, don't know if anyone would agree with it, but I find it pretty interesting given how things turned out. In Season 2 Chapter 301(Still with Bam vs Jahad), Bam again thinks about his experience in his inner world with Eduan's revolution. He says:

Bam: 'The 'me' that hasn't been defined by someone else' ... I've never thought about that. I've always just asked other people about who I am. And yet, I'm right here, whenever I met someone, I tried to find out about my past. I wanted to know why I had been born and where I'm supposed to go. When I first tried to find my power, I was so distracted by the fragments of myself that I couldn't know about the real me. And the longer that went on, the farther away I got from the 'real me'. Even though I was right here.

Bam then goes on to draw the line that represent "Him". I found it interesting that he feels that he was distracted by fragments of himself wondering who he is and the longer it went on, the farther away he got from the real him. In his conclusion to find the real him, he draws the line that represent him but taht line ultimately turned out be "V". Like everything else was just a fragment, or a distraction and the real him was always "V" and in his quest to find "himself" the longer it went on the farther he went away from realizing he was "V".

Of course that's just one way to view it I suppose. Could be dead wrong as well, especially if they're 2 different entities, I just found those chapters interesting.

 

[maverickframe_19]

I don't know if you'll count it or not, but I think another solid "foreshadow" was also with Bam's fight against Jahad. Bam's talk with Viole(Sworn enemy) and Blue Demon inside of himself, Season 2 Chapter 299.

BD: It must be a really strong man.
Bam: Y es. He's completely different from the enemies I've encountered so far. This guy is the data of the person who will become teh King of this Tower, the enemy of my parents and the young data of my sworn enemy who I'll have to face even if I return to FUG.
Bam: Everyone is telling me to kill him. Regardless of what I want, everything- is making me hate and fight him.
Bam: But what... am I? Am I just a person who was born to avenge someone else or to make someone else's long-awaited wish come true? The more I find out about myself, the more faint my own existence feels. Like Bubbles floating in this water, as if I was created for someone else's desire and will disappear once that goal is reached. What... Am I...?

Another interesting thought in Bam I'll quote too, don't know if anyone would agree with it, but I find it pretty interesting given how things turned out. In Season 2 Chapter 301(Still with Bam vs Jahad), Bam again thinks about his experience in his inner world with Eduan's revolution. He says:

Bam: 'The 'me' that hasn't been defined by someone else' ... I've never thought about that. I've always just asked other people about who I am. And yet, I'm right here, whenever I met someone, I tried to find out about my past. I wanted to know why I had been born and where I'm supposed to go. When I first tried to find my power, I was so distracted by the fragments of myself that I couldn't know about the real me. And the longer that went on, the farther away I got from the 'real me'. Even though I was right here.

Bam then goes on to draw the line that represent "Him". I found it interesting that he feels that he was distracted by fragments of himself wondering who he is and the longer it went on, the farther away he got from the real him. In his conclusion to find the real him, he draws the line that represent him but taht line ultimately turned out be "V". Like everything else was just a fragment, or a distraction and the real him was always "V" and in his quest to find "himself" the longer it went on the farther he went away from realizing he was "V".

Of course that's just one way to view it I suppose. Could be dead wrong as well, especially if they're 2 different entities, I just found those chapters interesting.

You were not the first one to say this, nor you would be the last. I have echoed these same sentiments in previous threads as well but some people ignore these contexts and will stick to their opinions.