Oh gosh, Jellal is sooooooo overrated in this thread!
He's not as strong as people make him out to be!
He's definitely not on Gildartz's level, let alone stronger than him!
So to put him around human Irene form is ridiculous and sheer overestimation of Jellal's strength!
To me it's debeatable whether he's on the same level as Laxus, but I'm going to with no, he isn't.
Erza can beat him in a match extreme diff IMO. She has good speed, good offense, her stamina and endurance is monstrous compared to Jellal, and she's much more durable. I think she can take him down.
IMO, God Serena is stronger than jellal too. People diss Serena despite the fact that anyone in his position would also die in the hands of acnologia. Too bad we couldn't see any durability from him!
My list right now out of the top 6 characters in Ishgar
With feats mostly.
Gildartz>Laxus>Natsu>=Gray>Erza>=Jellal
Enhanced Refector/Spiral Pain nailed Jellal good. So yes, we have seen August hit Jellal.
I'm not assuming Jellal didnt land any hits, i am however assuming that the fact that it was 5v1 would have played a part in any hits Jellal might have landed. Having 4 other wizards playing decoy for you is no small advantage, and im definitely not assuming Jellal didnt make use of it, in fact im entirely certain he did.
That Spiral Pain from August didn't really faze Jellal while everyone else was screaming inside. Jellal doesn't need any on panel proof of landing hits on August because we know August's fastest speed feats comes from copying Jellal himself.
That Spiral Pain from August didn't really faze Jellal while everyone else was screaming inside. Jellal doesn't need any on panel proof of landing hits on August because we know August's fastest speed feats comes from copying Jellal himself.
He was definitely feeling the damage though, even if he wasnt knocked on his ass like Racer. Jellal was maybe slightly less fazed than Midnight.
Besides, damage isnt what i was debating, August ability to hit Jellal was.
We also dont know that August didnt already know Meteor before that. Not that it matters, its still his magic, i fail to see how August taking it from Jellal somehow proves Jellal hit him. And its not like August couldnt land hits on Jellal/Gildarts without it.
Personally, I don't think using Jellal's feats against August is an accurate representation of his power. It's pretty obvious by now that August is a hard counter to Jellal. Therefore, it's understandable that the match was one-sided. That's not to say that what Jellal did against Acnologia is a good representation of his power either... Acnologia was unharmed... Jellal used 3 average level spells...
With that said, his only real feat is one-shotting Neinhart. And I don't see how anyone can downplay this. It is a feat that is worthy of placing Jellal among the high-tier mages.
Jellal now has a barrier to compensate for his questionable dura I guess. Also spells he can perform on the fly. It's interesting to see people automatically categorize them as "mid level" or "average" though considering RL was largely believed to be Laxus' best for simply being new lol
Jellal now has a barrier to compensate for his questionable dura I guess. Also spells he can perform on the fly. It's interesting to see people automatically categorize them as "mid level" or "average" though considering RL was largely believed to be Laxus' best for simply being new lol
I'd say it is a fair assumption to say that the new spells Jellal used are his lower or middle level spells for him (apart from the barrier, I'd assume that'd be his best defensive spell because it blocked an attack from Acno). He cast them really quick and used Grand Chariot as his finisher and typically the finisher is the strongest spell in the sequence.
Natsu is on par with a "unserious" zeref so don't use that as a reason. That same base natsu couldn't beat Jacob so I guess Jacob>zeref>gildartz . Yes laxus and gildartz are on the same level but gildartz is stronger hence why I said they are on the same tier
Jellal now has a barrier to compensate for his questionable dura I guess. Also spells he can perform on the fly. It's interesting to see people automatically categorize them as "mid level" or "average" though considering RL was largely believed to be Laxus' best for simply being new lol
Natsu's power ranking will depend on his fight against Zeref.If he defeats Zeref without any major help then he is definetly the strongest in Ishgar side.If not then we will have to judge his powerlevel.
Natsu is on par with a "unserious" zeref so don't use that as a reason. That same base natsu couldn't beat Jacob so I guess Jacob>zeref>gildartz . Yes laxus and gildartz are on the same level but gildartz is stronger hence why I said they are on the same tier
He was definitely feeling the damage though, even if he wasnt knocked on his ass like Racer. Jellal was maybe slightly less fazed than Midnight.
Besides, damage isnt what i was debating, August ability to hit Jellal was.
We also dont know that August didnt already know Meteor before that. Not that it matters, its still his magic, i fail to see how August taking it from Jellal somehow proves Jellal hit him. And its not like August couldnt land hits on Jellal/Gildarts without it.
Yeah, it kinda doesn't matter, but August using meteor out of all the speed magic he could've copied or known leaves little room to doubt the quality of the magic for me. Jellal shouldn't be so far below with it.
Jellal now has a barrier to compensate for his questionable dura I guess. Also spells he can perform on the fly. It's interesting to see people automatically categorize them as "mid level" or "average" though considering RL was largely believed to be Laxus' best for simply being new lol
Probably because of the editor comment on red lightning. "Lightning that surpasses lightning" or something.
It is probably not much different than his regular lightning, except Wahl can't analyze it.
As for Jellal you can argue whether Kyuraishin is stronger than GC or not, but Pleiades just seem like a setup to follow up with others.
Altairis was the magic to go when GC didn't cut it. Abyss Break was the magic to go when Altairis didn't cut it. Altairis, AB, Sema should definitely be stronger than those two spells, which would make them middle of the bunch.
Yeah, it kinda doesn't matter, but August using meteor out of all the speed magic he could've copied or known leaves little room to doubt the quality of the magic for me. Jellal shouldn't be so far below with it.
Red lightning surpasses itself, it is recursive. I hope we don't see it again. Regular lightning looks better in my opinion.
Probably because of the editor comment on red lightning. "Lightning that surpasses lightning" or something.
It is probably not much different than his regular lightning, except Wahl can't analyze it.
As for Jellal you can argue whether Kyuraishin is stronger than GC or not, but Pleiades just seem like a setup to follow up with others.
Altairis was the magic to go when GC didn't cut it. Abyss Break was the magic to go when Altairis didn't cut it. Altairis, AB, Sema should definitely be stronger than those two spells, which would make them middle of the bunch.
you are right its recursive
maybe after fairy heart fail and then natsu nakama speech fail. we see red lightening again
why am i kidding natsu nakama speech never fail
Natsu is on par with a "unserious" zeref so don't use that as a reason. That same base natsu couldn't beat Jacob so I guess Jacob>zeref>gildartz . Yes laxus and gildartz are on the same level but gildartz is stronger hence why I said they are on the same tier
No, Zeref is serious.
Against Jacob Natsu wasn't full power, he was just come out the fight against Zeref
Zeref>=Natsu>Gildarts>Jacob
Gildarts & God Serena are on the same tier
Laxus is on the same tier than Jellal not Gildarts
No, Zeref is serious.
Against Jacob Natsu wasn't full power, he was just come out the fight a
Zeref>=Natsu>Gildarts>Jacob
Gildarts & God Serena are on the same tier
Laxus is on the same tier than Jellal not Gildarts
Lol if zeref is serious then he can't beat his top two spriggans with his current power level and natsu isn't even no where august and Irene. neither of them is serious yet they are warming up stop with the wanking U have not shown me proof why gildartz and laxus are not in the same tier
No, Zeref is serious.
Against Jacob Natsu wasn't full power, he was just come out the fight against Zeref
Zeref>=Natsu>Gildarts>Jacob
Gildarts & God Serena are on the same tier
Laxus is on the same tier than Jellal not Gildarts
I'm seeing some disagreeable reasons in Jellal's favour in the last few pages, so finally got time to expand on that.
Why I feel Jellal isn't top tier.
On the deal with Neinhart:
Neinhart used a casual no named beam.
Jellal was hit on the back side region.
We then see both of them fall in the ocean. Jellal has held down by an anchor, and Kagura saves him.
Point to be made:
1) We see no absolute struggle or anything that indicates that Jellal was grasping for air, so no I don't buy him "drowning" as the way he was unconscious.
I expect a top tier to atleast show signs of struggle, anything that has him opening his eyes even for a smallest of margins. I have a hard time believing that Jellal can't swim either. It's reasonable to state Jellal was knocked out before he hit the ocean.
2)The anchor may not even be that heavy, considering Kagura was able to lift Jellal so I don't buy it being the reason why Jellal couldn't swim up to ashore.
3) "There's no physical damage on Jellal". Well obviously Sherlock, there would be no visible damage on someone who was hit on the BACKSIDE of the head/Overall back region. He's also fully clothed, so it's difficult to detect.
Overall, Jellal is a glass canon. His durability is below average at best. Basically all you need is an attack potency on the equal or high level of Neinhart's casual beam to take down Jellal.
I'm not giving him benefit of doubt because characters like Jura never get any benefit of doubt, so why should he?
August
Obviously it would be unfair to downplay Jellal as fodder on the nature of August's magic, I detect a lot of damage control and repeating on this part to save Jellal's character in power..... However I expect a top tier at the very least provide even a bit of damage to August. Jellal wasn't even alone. He had most of his crew backing him up.
Acnologia's temperament, Jellal's level of spells
vs Jellal
1) Acnologia was first caught off-guard, but was laughing at Jellal and his spells
vs Irene
2) Acnologia was first caught off guard, but was able to acknowledge Irene's strength
This shows that while Acnologia wasn't serious against either opponent, Acnologia laughed at a character, while acknowledging another,.
Irene's feat is more impressive because she also made Acnologia irrelevant until 20 chapters later.
Jellal's level of spells
Hard to indicate
1) Obviously Jellal is serious as hell when it comes to matters of protecting Erza, and he's facing the strongest level, so he's not stupid enough to use mid level spells
2) For caster type characters like Jellal, the more time they charge their magic power to produce attacks, the stronger the attack will be.
So through that conclusion, Jellal didn't have enough time to charge, but merely to buy some time I guess? So it can be considered average level spells being used if the marker is @Bold:
In conclusion, I'd rank it anywhere from medium, medium-high or perhaps high as maybe Jellal can just spam his high level attacks to target home-incoming opponents.
Altarias's best feats are killing a fodder, so I'm not going to hype it that much if at all.
Jellal's placement
What's stopping me from putting Jellal in Laxus's tier is mainly because of his stamina, endurance and most importantly durability.
I can not rank Jellal at this point but I don't see him giving Laxus tiers more than medium level of difficulty in battle to battle basis because of his glaring weakness. He's definitely not ahead of Laxus, or anywhere near Gildartz that's for sure.
On the other he has a boost in defense, with his barrier that puts him ahead of Mirajane at the very least.
At this point people are putting Jellal in Laxus's tier because of benefit of doubt, and previous portrayal.
Zeref's words for Jellal can be taken into any context.
He merely believed Jellal would be ahead because of his top level speed, and vendetta. (Keep in mind Zeref know about Jellal's vendetta since he researches all of his enemies. ) Laxus for his speed, and power standing.
Personally, I don't think using Jellal's feats against August is an accurate representation of his power. It's pretty obvious by now that August is a hard counter to Jellal. Therefore, it's understandable that the match was one-sided. That's not to say that what Jellal did against Acnologia is a good representation of his power either... Acnologia was unharmed... Jellal used 3 average level spells...
With that said, his only real feat is one-shotting Neinhart. And I don't see how anyone can downplay this. It is a feat that is worthy of placing Jellal among the high-tier mages.
I disagree. I fail to see it's a worthy feat that puts Jellal among high tier mages. Neinhart didn't even defend himself properly, didn't even put up a defense when Jellal unleashed his grand chariot.
He oneshotted basically someone who has glass canon durability.
We're talking about someone who's enhanced version was taken down by two punches from Base Natsu.
Jellal's best feat so far is that barrier he used to protect Erza.
I disagree. I fail to see it's a worthy feat that puts Jellal among high tier mages. Neinhart didn't even defend himself properly, didn't even put up a defense when Jellal unleashed his grand chariot.
He oneshotted basically someone who has glass canon durability.
We're talking about someone who's enhanced version was taken down by two punches from Base Natsu.
Jellal's best feat so far is that barrier he used to protect Erza.
Well, personally, I think there was a fair amount of PoF in Natsu's fight against Neinhart. Honestly, the whole scene was meant to make the plot move forward. In a way, it's kind of like Ajeel being defeated by Elfman and Lisanna. To put into perspective, Ajeel was on Erza's level, who ended destroying Deus Sema. An attack power on that scale should be able to one-shot any average Spriggan. Yet, Erza barely won against Ajeel... As you can see, there is a lot of inconsistency in power levels this arc, which is why I'm also taking portrayal + hype into account, rather than just feats.
Had Jellal used his strongest spell, then I would agree with you. But Grand Chariot is one of his average spells. So I think it's fair to say Jellal is among the high-tier mages, given his feats in the past. Also, one thing that many people don't realize is that Jellal is a fairly balanced character. So far, he hasn't used any form of PoF in his fights. He lost to the strongest Spriggan and one-shotted the weakest one.
Well, personally, I think there was a fair amount of PoF in Natsu's fight against Neinhart. Honestly, the whole scene was meant to make the plot move forward. In a way, it's kind of like Ajeel being defeated by Elfman and Lisanna. To put into perspective, Ajeel was on Erza's level, who ended destroying Deus Sema. An attack power on that scale should be able to one-shot any average Spriggan. Yet, Erza barely won against Ajeel... As you can see, there is a lot of inconsistency in power levels this arc, which is why I'm also taking portrayal + hype into account, rather than just feats.
Had Jellal used his strongest spell, then I would agree with you. But Grand Chariot is one of his average spells. So I think it's fair to say Jellal is among the high-tier mages, given his feats in the past. Also, one thing that many people don't realize is that Jellal is a fairly balanced character. So far, he hasn't used any form of PoF in his fights. He lost to the strongest Spriggan and one-shotted the weakest one.
There was actually more POF in Jellal vs Neinhart than there ever was Natsu-Neinhart. I'm not favouring Natsu or anything or like that especially when I hate him but it's fair to say there was less POF in his slight skirmish with Neinhart than there was ever for Jellal-Neinhart. Natsu found Neinhart more of a nuisance more than anything. I feel like Ajeel wasn't fully recovered when he lost to lisanna-elfman, because that's the only thing that can make sense here.
Ajeel was not on Erza level, he's above her, as we can see that clearly when he stomped her and she needed assistance to take him down.
Grand chariot is one of his more stronger token to go by moves (a signature) at this point now unless he shows something greater in feats.
What? There was a lot of POF in Jellal vs Neinhart. We're talking about a character who's waifu was being torn down by Neinhart.
This enraged Jellal
There was actually more POF in Jellal vs Neinhart than there ever was Natsu-Neinhart. I'm not favouring Natsu or anything or like that especially when I hate him but it's fair to say there was less POF in his slight skirmish with Neinhart than there was ever for Jellal-Neinhart. Natsu found Neinhart more of a nuisance more than anything. I feel like Ajeel wasn't fully recovered when he lost to lisanna-elfman, because that's the only thing that can make sense here.
Ajeel was not on Erza level, he's above her, as we can see that clearly when he stomped her and she needed assistance to take him down.
Grand chariot is one of his more stronger token to go by moves (a signature) at this point now unless he shows something greater in feats.
What? There was a lot of POF in Jellal vs Neinhart. We're talking about a character who's waifu was being torn down by Neinhart.
This enraged Jellal
The context in which PoF was used is a little different though. While Jellal was angry because of what happened to Erza, we saw magic emanating from his body which indicates a significant increase in power. Not to mention, the atmosphere changed along with it. Meanwhile, in Natsu's case, we didn't see any change in power. Instead, he just charged towards Neinhart, tanking every single attack along the way, and one-shotted him. There was also an obvious nakama speech that came with it. My point is that Jellal's feat actually had credibility while Natsu's didn't.
Again, I'm going to use Erza as an example. Except this time, I'm comparing her to Gray. When Gray defeated Invel, many people called it PoF. And while that may be true, it didn't come out of nowhere. He released his maximum power as a result of Juvia's "death". On the other hand, Erza charging towards a meteor and screaming how she will protect everyone didn't make sense at all. Truth be told, I don't mind PoF, provided there is a reason behind it and the way it's executed has some sense to it. What I dislike is when there is a random power-up that is not necessary.
jellal has some of the best durability feats pre-pre-ts, he took all natsu's spells with zero damage, seeing how the manga progressed since then power-levels wise, jellal's durability will be better and better, jellal was been off-guard when he took neinhart attack, the same case can be said when erza and natsu got knocked out By wally fodder gun, and brandish by cana.
defense wise jellal still have Mirror water which can reflect any spell like he did to jura's, and that barrier.
speed wise he still has meteor (made august speed blitze cana and gildarts at the same time.
offensive wise, he can use a lot of spells in a short amount of time.
his endurance is top tier for me, after getting beaten by august, he still got up and attacked acnolgia and used three spells, in OS arc he casts Self destruction spell on himself & nirvana, got beaten by macbeth, took a shot from zero, and still has a magical power allowed natsu to go dragon force.
obviously, jellal didn't have a long fight in this arc like other characters did... but he definitely has what it takes to be top tier.
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it's funny how people still use logic in power level in this manga. feats aren't very consistent, actually mashima don't give a crap about power levels.
spriggans looked at the beggining of this arc the strongest wizards out there, natsu and gray shat their pants after witnessing brandish's mp.
ajeel was overpowering erza easly, then afterward lost to elfman & lissana, and erza blocked End's & des gray's punch with one hand each.
does that means ELfman & lissana > end & gray? (even tho i know i'm using a>b>c logic here lel)
mest one of the most op magic in the serie, manupilate brandish's memories with easy., and marin is as op as jacob (since he too, sent lucy and erza to tht dimension)
I hope we don't see it again. Regular lightning looks better in my opinion.
