Battle Genthru Vs Knuckle

[KingOfNight]

So, the two dudes who whooped Gon's ass respectively are now ready to duke it out.

Let's assume that the interests have to be at 21 thousand for Genthru to go bankrupt (about the same amount as Gon). Knuckle also lends as much Aura to Genthru as he did to Gon with every punch. I'm gonna leave how much AP Genthru returns with every punch to you guys (but no crazy numbers). Also, regardless of how much AP Genthru's punches return, his Little Flower returns 8x as much.

So, who will you bet on ?

EDIT: No hit and run for Knuckle.

Forgot to add this : If Genthru sets his countdown, it takes 10 minutes before it explodes and it does 8000 AP worth of damage.

 

[Phantron]

Genthru is obviously much stronger than Gon overall so I'm sure he has more than 20K, though since Morel only has 70K the range isn't that important.

But hoenstly Knuckles won't even need to use his special ability to win because he's stronger and faster than Genthru. The countdown is meaningelss because Knuckles is faster and can always catch him to defuse the bomb easily. The bomb takes about an hour to explode and it's based on your heart rate but your heart isn't beating 6 times faster even while in combat. Little Flower can be guarded normally by Ken by an equally strong user (Gon was no way equal to Genthru).

The only question is how does Potclean interact with aura-based damage that isn't directly physical. That is, suppose you're ahead by 10K and someone attempted to chop off your head with an aura blade and you didn't guard against it, does that somehow do no damage because you're 10K ahead? Or do you still die? Does having a large lead prevent from you being say set on fire by Feitan's ability? But it's fairly irrelevent because Little Flower can be guarded by Ken, so unless Knuckles gets too overconfident thinking he's got a big lead it wouldn't matter anyway.

 

[KingOfNight]

Why would you think that Knuckle is faster and stronger ? Faster maybe, but Genthru is obviously stronger and much better at hand to hand. Gon could still keep up with Knuckle in hand to hand and Knuckle's attacks barely damaged him. Genthru on the other hand, not only did he one-sidedly beat the shit out of Gon, but his attacks did tremendous damage, to the point that a single punch is enough to screw Gon completely. Little flower can't be guarded with Ken, it requires Ko.

I'm actually fairly confident that Genthru takes this one easily.

 

[kkck]

Knuckle was someone gon compared to kite though, he is quite a beast. And to be fair, knuckle did fight a significantly stronger gon than genthru did. The training gon and killua went through did result in both of them having several times the amount of nen they had earlier. I think genthru and knuckle are overall similar fighters but I give this one to knuckle.

 

[KingOfNight]

In terms of physical strength, he compared him to Kite. And we can't say that Kite is a beast in physical strength, but he always uses weapons which isn't a good sign. He fought Gon several times. Most of those times Gon was hardly that different from his fight with Genthru. In fact, he may have been considerably weaker due to being exhausted from Biscuit's cruel training.

I don't know, Genthru seems underrated.

 

[Phantron]

Err, Gon basically goes through crazy gains in a short period of time. Remember when Wing said it'd take him 5 years to beat the guy with the spinning top? Turned out it only took like 2 weeks not counting the time it took him to recover from his injury (he wasn't training while injuried). Kite was trained by one of the most powerful guys in the world, so unless the point is that Ging has no eye for talent Kite is easily near the top of his age group (looks like 30 and under) and yet we're told Knuckles is roughly as strong as him.

Now Genthru might be older but he like many characters in HXH have the 'beat the weak' techs which is 100% useless against someone who is remotely close in power. His Little Flower expands twice the AP to do normal damage, since he needs an amount of AP equal to his damage to protect his own hand. This means there's no way this technique could possibly work against anyone who's remotely as strong as you. For the most part HXH has an overabundance of such useless techs where the only way they'd win is if you can already win without the tech.

I think Genthru is underrated but that's because his tech is actually useless. If you're roughly as strong as him and have Ken up all the time, he can't possibly hurt you with Little Flower because that'd mean he has to be able to project twice the AP compared to what you have defending and that's simply not possible with the assumption two characters are roughly equal. His timed bomb is potentially deadly if he's faster than his opponent, though in this case we know Knuckle is known for his speed so there's not much use there. If he didn't have a bomb on you already, this technique is useless in combat because you can just shout "I caught the bomber" anytime he touches you, regardless of whether he's trying to set a bomb or not, because if he's touching you then by definion you're also touching him.

 

[KingOfNight]

Err, Gon basically goes through crazy gains in a short period of time. Remember when Wing said it'd take him 5 years to beat the guy with the spinning top? Turned out it only took like 2 weeks not counting the time it took him to recover from his injury (he wasn't training while injuried). Kite was trained by one of the most powerful guys in the world, so unless the point is that Ging has no eye for talent Kite is easily near the top of his age group (looks like 30 and under) and yet we're told Knuckles is roughly as strong as him.

It wasn't two weeks, it was much more than that. And with Gido, Gon turned from a non-Nen user into a Nen user. So naturally, it's a huge increase in power. But with Knuckle, he barely changed. Being only able to strengthen his Ren, not to mention that he would fight Knuckle with 10% of his power due to the immense exhaustion. Doesn't matter who trained Kite, it really doesn't. And again, he was compared to Kite's physical strength alone. Which isn't anything to go by, because his physical strength isn't that awesome seeing as he uses OP weapons all the time.

Now Genthru might be older but he like many characters in HXH have the 'beat the weak' techs which is 100% useless against someone who is remotely close in power. His Little Flower expands twice the AP to do normal damage, since he needs an amount of AP equal to his damage to protect his own hand. This means there's no way this technique could possibly work against anyone who's remotely as strong as you. For the most part HXH has an overabundance of such useless techs where the only way they'd win is if you can already win without the tech.

We don't know that. Little Flower does a certain amount of damage that cannot be avoided with Ken unless the enemy is a top class Enhancer which Knuckle is far from. An explosion to the face can easily defeat Knuckle, EASILY. Unless he guards with Ko, which wouldn't negate the damage, would only minimize it. It's not a "Beat the weak." At this rate, I may say Gon's rock is a "beat the weak" because Uvo can take it no problem. Or Netero's Kannon is a "beat the weak" because the King laughed at it. Knuckle is by no means a powerful Enhancer so him surviving LF to the face with Ken is impossible.

It's not useless. I may just say that Knuckle's ability is useless because someone like Uvogin or Youpi can send him and his interests to hell in a single punch. Also, don't make it sound like Knuckle is so ungodly fast that Genthru won't react to him when Gon could react perfectly. If he tries to undo Countdown he will be wounded with LF or simply kicked because Genthru obviously has better hand to hand.

 

[Phantron]

Of course Little Flower's damage can be guarded with Ken, or Genthru will blow up his own hand each time he uses Little Flower.

Nobody's going to let you touch their face because punching someone in the face is probably going to defeat them just fine too without any tricks. Why would Genthru be better at hand to hand when Knuckles spends basically all his time fighting people while Genthru is much more covert? Techniques like Genthru's are useless because the only way they can do significant damage is if you hit someone in a weak spot, like the face, except you can also punch someone in the face too if you get an open look like that.

Because Genthru at 50% strength must be enough to guard against Little Flower (he can only use at most 50% of his AP to attack because the other 50% has to be used to protect himself) it must follow that a comparably strong character can guard against Little Flower trivially using Ken, unless Genthru is more than twice as strong as his opponent. That may have worked for Gon but there's no way it'll work on Knuckle.

 

[mousiehamster]

It wasn't two weeks, it was much more than that. And with Gido, Gon turned from a non-Nen user into a Nen user. So naturally, it's a huge increase in power. But with Knuckle, he barely changed. Being only able to strengthen his Ren, not to mention that he would fight Knuckle with 10% of his power due to the immense exhaustion. Doesn't matter who trained Kite, it really doesn't. And again, he was compared to Kite's physical strength alone. Which isn't anything to go by, because his physical strength isn't that awesome seeing as he uses OP weapons all the time.



We don't know that. Little Flower does a certain amount of damage that cannot be avoided with Ken unless the enemy is a top class Enhancer which Knuckle is far from. An explosion to the face can easily defeat Knuckle, EASILY. Unless he guards with Ko, which wouldn't negate the damage, would only minimize it. It's not a "Beat the weak." At this rate, I may say Gon's rock is a "beat the weak" because Uvo can take it no problem. Or Netero's Kannon is a "beat the weak" because the King laughed at it. Knuckle is by no means a powerful Enhancer so him surviving LF to the face with Ken is impossible.

It's not useless. I may just say that Knuckle's ability is useless because someone like Uvogin or Youpi can send him and his interests to hell in a single punch. Also, don't make it sound like Knuckle is so ungodly fast that Genthru won't react to him when Gon could react perfectly. If he tries to undo Countdown he will be wounded with LF or simply kicked because Genthru obviously has better hand to hand.

Dude Little Flower was blocked my Gon's Gyo. Crappy Gon who couldn't hold his Ren for half an hour, who's "Paper" is a tiny slow moving capsule, whose "Scissors" can barely cut through the stem of a leaf. The technique is useless against Potclean anyway. The critical problem is that Little Flower expends 2x amount of Nen for 1x the damage. In other words, for every X amount of Nen you are repaying Knuckle, you are depleting 2x the amount of your aura reserves - in other words, your position is even worse, since the interest is incurred against your reserve i.e. If your reserve shrinks, then it's almost the same effect as incurring interest (with the minor difference that nen lent/damage taken from Knuckle is subject to the interest, while expended reserve is not). Following the same logic, abilities of a nen type that aren't the main school also fare badly against Potclean - it's like spending 2 dollars to repay 1 dollar of debt.

In terms of hand to hand combat, recall that Knuckle was several times moments away from killing Gon in one shot. He's physically as strong as Kite. In terms of Nen, 30% of Gon's Ken (which is say, generously 1500 AP at G.I) blocked Little Flower with some damage. Let's say 40% is full damage prevention. That's 600 AP worth of damage. Let's very conservatively say that Little Flower's AOP, as a hatsu, is only 2x Gensuru's normal Nen output (it has to be at least since he spends half the nen expended guarding against the explosion, which means if the AOP is less than 2x, he would do more damage throwing a punch). That's still 300AP, damage, 300 AP damage prevention, so 600 AP on each hand. With 1200 AP expended, only 10% was left for the rest of Gensuru's body. Conclusion: his Ken is only (roughly) 1333AP, even worse than Gon's. He would get the stuffing beaten out of him by Knuckle since Gensuru is somewhat like an Enhancer in that he must inflict damage via hand to hand attacks. His only hope is to use the bomb ability which takes a full minute to activate - which however btw in the context of Potclean, debits nen reserves IMMEDIATELY.

Knuckle's ability is indeed useless against guys who are better @ hand to hand than he is but then again Knuckle is atypically fast. He can probably avoid plenty of damage that way and the longer the fight goes on, the more buffer he has for taking damage.

edit:

Obviously the numbers are just close approximations. You can, for example, change Gon's Ken to 1800 and effective defense of Little Flower to require 60% of his Ken (twice the amount Gon used to cover his right hand). In this case, Little Flower will inflict 1080 AP worth of damage. x2 for both hands, and divided by 2 for the hatsu modifier, makes 2160 as 90% of Gensuru's Ken. 100% would be 2400AP. In reality, Gon's Ken is probably less than 1800 (say 1500) and Little Flower's modifier must be far greater than 2x. A conservative estimate would be 2.5x. In this case, Gensuru's Ken would come out as 1600 AP - still greater than Gon's hypothetical 1500 Ken, which would at least be consistent with the manga where it was stated that Gensuru's volume of nen was greater than Gon's.

 

[Phantron]

Actually Knuckle's ability is only vulnerable against guy who are at least as fast as he is because otherwise all he has to do is keep on running away after he lands the first hit. He was confident he can even dodge against Yupi's attack fro a while until Yupi did his centaur transformation. That said Knuckle clearly has a ton of hand to hand experience and have no reason to be the underdog in this department.

In regards to Potclean it's not clear if Potclean prevents 'special' damage. That is, say Knuckle fought Feitan and Feitan used Pain Packer while Knuckle is 10K AP ahead. Does being ahead by 10K (a physical damage amount far beyond human capability) prevents him from being set on fire, or does he still get burned to death since it's a special type of damage? The point of Little Flower is that it does a different kind of damage (explosion), so perhaps it'll go through Potclean's barrier. That said, it still doesn't matter because the '2 for 1' nature of Little Flower means it can be guarded trivially by an equal tier opponent. Let's say Little Flower consumes 1 AP to generate 1000 AP of damage. However, since Genthru needs to protect his own hand, he need to use 1001 AP to use this technique (1 to attack, 1000 to protect himself on Ken). Therefore, an equally strong character by definition also has 1000 AP available for Ken to guard against the said technique. Basically, as long as his opponent has a comparable Ken, there's no way Little Flower can do damage to that guy because anything that can do damage to his opponent would by definition penetrate Genthru's own Ken and hurt him. The only reason his technique worked on Gon was because his Ken was much weaker than Genthru's Ken.

 

[KingOfNight]

Dude Little Flower was blocked my Gon's Gyo. Crappy Gon who couldn't hold his Ren for half an hour, who's "Paper" is a tiny slow moving capsule, whose "Scissors" can barely cut through the stem of a leaf. The technique is useless against Potclean anyway. The critical problem is that Little Flower expends 2x amount of Nen for 1x the damage. In other words, for every X amount of Nen you are repaying Knuckle, you are depleting 2x the amount of your aura reserves - in other words, your position is even worse, since the interest is incurred against your reserve i.e. If your reserve shrinks, then it's almost the same effect as incurring interest (with the minor difference that nen lent/damage taken from Knuckle is subject to the interest, while expended reserve is not). Following the same logic, abilities of a nen type that aren't the main school also fare badly against Potclean - it's like spending 2 dollars to repay 1 dollar of debt.

That's right, Gyo. My mistake, I mistook it with Ko since they are the same with only a slight difference. Crappy Gon ? He was exactly the same when he fought Knuckle the first twenty time (in fact, he was much worse due to being tired). He won't use it against Potclean, but against Knuckle. We have no idea how much aura Genthru uses to guard his arm, so assuming it's double is a stretch. There's also no need for Genthru to worry about that since he was repeatedly shown to have a tremendous amount of aura with an astonishing control over it. We know that he can at least use it about 70 times without trouble since Abengan(?) stated he could easily kill all of those GI players with Little Flower alone. So considering he will be repaying great amount of interests with each hit, it's not a total loss. Because the interest rate will fall down much quicker than Genthru's aura reserve. Another interesting thing you said is this :

Knuckle's ability is indeed useless against guys who are better @ hand to hand

And yet, you give the battle to Knuckle despite Genthru's clear superiority in hand to hand.

In terms of hand to hand combat, recall that Knuckle was several times moments away from killing Gon in one shot. He's physically as strong as Kite. In terms of Nen, 30% of Gon's Ken (which is say, generously 1500 AP at G.I) blocked Little Flower with some damage. Let's say 40% is full damage prevention. That's 600 AP worth of damage. Let's very conservatively say that Little Flower's AOP, as a hatsu, is only 2x Gensuru's normal Nen output (it has to be at least since he spends half the nen expended guarding against the explosion, which means if the AOP is less than 2x, he would do more damage throwing a punch). That's still 300AP, damage, 300 AP damage prevention, so 600 AP on each hand. With 1200 AP expended, only 10% was left for the rest of Gensuru's body. Conclusion: his Ken is only (roughly) 1333AP, even worse than Gon's. He would get the stuffing beaten out of him by Knuckle since Gensuru is somewhat like an Enhancer in that he must inflict damage via hand to hand attacks. His only hope is to use the bomb ability which takes a full minute to activate - which however btw in the context of Potclean, debits nen reserves IMMEDIATELY.

Not killing, defeating. And he didn't, because he couldn't, even after raining him down with punches and kicks, he could only cause minimal damage. And again, stop using Kite when we have no idea if his physical strength is that great. Gon blocked Little Flower with Gyo and still had some damage (though not much). Without Gyo his arm got burned off pretty nasty. And even if Knuckle guards with Gyo, he will leave himself exposed to great damage from another Little Flower or a powerful punch.

A conservative estimate would be 2.5x. In this case, Gensuru's Ken would come out as 1600 AP - still greater than Gon's hypothetical 1500 Ken, which would at least be consistent with the manga where it was stated that Gensuru's volume of nen was greater than Gon's

Isn't that a great understatement ? Genthru was so far above Gon, it's not even funny. It was to the point that Gon's attacks did almost no damage to him as biscuit said that Gon was nowhere near his level and his attacks won't even scratch Genthru.

 

[Phantron]

Because Little Flower does damage to Genthru himself as well as the enemy, and arguably it does more damage to himself (because that's where the explosion orginates from) it follows that whatever aura Genthru uses to protect himself from Little Flower must also be enough for his opponent to protect himself from Little Flower. There's no point to talk about hitting a weak spot because if you can grab someone's face you can punch them in the face too. Based on the description Knuckle has far more experience than Genthru and is almost certainly faster. Genthru's timed bomb has no effect against an opponent that's faster than him (that guy can always defuse it, because you don't even have to damage Genthru to defuse the bomb). Since Genthru's Hatsus are literally useless he has to lose because he's Materialization versus Knuckle being Emission, as Emission is far more potent in all forms of damage dealing ability compared to Materialization and we established that Genthru's Hatsus are useless.

If you look hard enough you'll see there's a consistent problem in HXH in that there's almost nobody who are equal tier that fought for a long time. The only notable exception is Ubogin versus Kurapika. Togashi's fight has a very distinct format of:

A way outclasses B.
Then either:
B is totally dumb and somehow lost due to his stupidity
A wins easily because he way outclasses B.

Most people's abilities are simply useless against someone that is as strong as them, let alone someone who is stronger than they are. Perhaps this is the underlying theme of HXH where people only pick fights against guys weaker than themselves. The end result is that if two guys of equal strength fought, the winner would be the guy who has the least useless moves.

 

[KingOfNight]

Because Little Flower does damage to Genthru himself as well as the enemy, and arguably it does more damage to himself (because that's where the explosion orginates from) it follows that whatever aura Genthru uses to protect himself from Little Flower must also be enough for his opponent to protect himself from Little Flower. There's no point to talk about hitting a weak spot because if you can grab someone's face you can punch them in the face too. Based on the description Knuckle has far more experience than Genthru and is almost certainly faster. Genthru's timed bomb has no effect against an opponent that's faster than him (that guy can always defuse it, because you don't even have to damage Genthru to defuse the bomb). Since Genthru's Hatsus are literally useless he has to lose because he's Materialization versus Knuckle being Emission, as Emission is far more potent in all forms of damage dealing ability compared to Materialization and we established that Genthru's Hatsus are useless.

But his opponent risks keeping the rest of his body unguarded and cannot protect two places at one (double LF). Genthru surely can punch or grap his face. So it can never be useless unless his opponent is a master Enhancer. So no, we haven't established anything. Also, don't make it sound like Knuckle's Hatsu is a more useful one, since Genthru is simply stronger and better at hand to hand. So it isn't any more useful than LF. Has more experience ? Not likely. Genthru saw through Gon in a 1 second exchange, to which Gon state it's due to how experienced he is. Not to mention that Tsezegera(?) mentioned Genthru is - unlike many Nen users - a 100% fighter. Meaning in combat experience, he should be equal or ahead of Knuckle. Conjuration or Emission doesn't really matter. We also don't know if he's a Conjurer, since LF is a Transmutation ability. And again, disregarding groups, Genthru is easily, EASILY, stronger in terms of physical strength and hand to hand. Everything show hints at that.

 

[Phantron]

Um, the whole point is that LF requires concentrating an unusually large amount of aura that even a novice like Gon can see through. It must because you need to expand roughly twice the AP (X to attack and X to protect yourself). It's virtually impossible this move would catch someone Knuckle off guard because he can see that Genthru is using a large amount of aura around his hands. You keep making comparison to Gon as if he's the same guy in the GI arc and the Ant arc. He can't even keep up Ken for an hour prior to training again to fight Knuckle, and after that he can do at least 3 hours. The only reason he was able to beat Gon was because he has way more AP available since Gon sucks at that time. It doesn't matter what kind of ratio Genthru does. If he uses LF on both hands he has to put enough aura on both hands to not blow up either of his hands. His opponent can simply match that, and it takes them less effort because they're only defending anyway. You seem to make the assumption that Genthru somehow has more AP to use than Knuckle which is completely unfounded. Given his own Ken is always enough to block his own damage from LF, that means anybody who is as strong as him can easily do the same. In fact you really don't have to be as strong as him because the defender doesn't have to worry about doing damage, while Genthru has to defend against LF's damage plus actually doing damage.

I don't think Knuckle's ability is as good as the story puts it but it's at least not completely useless like Genthru's ability is.

 

[Demonspeed]

Knuckle wins. Knuckle is a better Hth fighter and Genthru's Hatsu requires physical contact. Knuckle needs to touch him at least once and he won't take him lightly as Gon. Even if Genthru touches him later. He will have to explain him his ability while Potclean will continue to count. Little Flower is not very powerful too, it won't affect Knuckle very much, especially with Potclean protection.

 

[mousiehamster]

Actually Knuckle's ability is only vulnerable against guy who are at least as fast as he is because otherwise all he has to do is keep on running away after he lands the first hit. He was confident he can even dodge against Yupi's attack fro a while until Yupi did his centaur transformation. That said Knuckle clearly has a ton of hand to hand experience and have no reason to be the underdog in this department.

In regards to Potclean it's not clear if Potclean prevents 'special' damage. That is, say Knuckle fought Feitan and Feitan used Pain Packer while Knuckle is 10K AP ahead. Does being ahead by 10K (a physical damage amount far beyond human capability) prevents him from being set on fire, or does he still get burned to death since it's a special type of damage? The point of Little Flower is that it does a different kind of damage (explosion), so perhaps it'll go through Potclean's barrier. That said, it still doesn't matter because the '2 for 1' nature of Little Flower means it can be guarded trivially by an equal tier opponent. Let's say Little Flower consumes 1 AP to generate 1000 AP of damage. However, since Genthru needs to protect his own hand, he need to use 1001 AP to use this technique (1 to attack, 1000 to protect himself on Ken). Therefore, an equally strong character by definition also has 1000 AP available for Ken to guard against the said technique. Basically, as long as his opponent has a comparable Ken, there's no way Little Flower can do damage to that guy because anything that can do damage to his opponent would by definition penetrate Genthru's own Ken and hurt him. The only reason his technique worked on Gon was because his Ken was much weaker than Genthru's Ken.

You interpreted it as nen efficiency? I just interpreted it as AOP generated over the normal max amount i.e. an amount exceeding your aggregate Ken. In the case of efficiency though, there's no particular reason why the Gyo Genthru uses doesn't enjoy the same efficiency when used to shield Little Flower. It would be absolutely useless otherwise if his Gyo doesn't receive the same benefit: he would be using 100 AP to generate 200 AP damage, but also an additional 200 AP to protect himself. But if he has the sufficient 200 AOP to protect himself (without the hatsu efficiency benefit) then surely it would be advantageous in every way to use Gyo to attack instead.

Also the thing with special damage is that explosions (fire + air pressure) apparently isn't "elemental damage" in HxH. Uvogin blocks a bazooka blast with one hand. Unless his body is fireproof this shows that fire is blockable by nen. Now poison and acid on the other hand...

 

[Phantron]

You interpreted it as nen efficiency? I just interpreted it as AOP generated over the normal max amount i.e. an amount exceeding your aggregate Ken. In the case of efficiency though, there's no particular reason why the Gyo Genthru uses doesn't enjoy the same efficiency when used to shield Little Flower. It would be absolutely useless otherwise if his Gyo doesn't receive the same benefit: he would be using 100 AP to generate 200 AP damage, but also an additional 200 AP to protect himself. But if he has the sufficient 200 AOP to protect himself (without the hatsu efficiency benefit) then surely it would be advantageous in every way to use Gyo to attack instead.

Also the thing with special damage is that explosions (fire + air pressure) apparently isn't "elemental damage" in HxH. Uvogin blocks a bazooka blast with one hand. Unless his body is fireproof this shows that fire is blockable by nen. Now poison and acid on the other hand...

Little Flower generates X amount of damage. For the sake of simplicity let's say it takes X AP of aura to withstand this damage. There's no way Genthru can generate this defense more effectively than anyone else, because there's nothing special about his aura. That is his aura doesn't have some kind of 'explolsion defense property' that nobody else can do. Therefore his opponent also only need to use X AP of aura to withstand the same damage, except Genthru also expanded some AP to do the damage in the first place so he's always coming out behind. The explosion damage isn't quite as special as say, fire or electricity which pierces normal defense (e.g. Pufu's clones are imprevious to physical attacks but can be killed by electricity), so we can also rule out that Genthru has some kind of special explosion damage defense. Note that in the case of Feitan and Killua, it's clear both of them have some kind of special resistance against fire/electricity to prevent their own tech from blowing themselves up, so in these cases you cannot assume the opponent can simply match their defenses as both characters have taken time to figure out how to best defend against fire/electricity. We can see that Genthru's tech can be defended by your standard aura defense, and since he must defend against his own attack as well, this puts him behind against someone who is as strong as him.

 

[mousiehamster]

Little Flower generates X amount of damage. For the sake of simplicity let's say it takes X AP of aura to withstand this damage. There's no way Genthru can generate this defense more effectively than anyone else, because there's nothing special about his aura. That is his aura doesn't have some kind of 'explolsion defense property' that nobody else can do. Therefore his opponent also only need to use X AP of aura to withstand the same damage, except Genthru also expanded some AP to do the damage in the first place so he's always coming out behind.

Right, which is why it doesn't really make sense. It doesn't matter how AP efficient his Little Flower is if he has to exert a bog-standard Gyo to cover himself. Mathematically, it would be - and always would be - more effective to just use a Gyo infused punch. It's not like Little Flower has any special properties, status effects, or better range. So it only makes sense for Little Flower to exist as a move if his Gyo has the same AP efficiency, but presumably only when using Little Flower.

 

[Phantron]

Right, which is why it doesn't really make sense. It doesn't matter how AP efficient his Little Flower is if he has to exert a bog-standard Gyo to cover himself. Mathematically, it would be - and always would be - more effective to just use a Gyo infused punch. It's not like Little Flower has any special properties, status effects, or better range. So it only makes sense for Little Flower to exist as a move if his Gyo has the same AP efficiency, but presumably only when using Little Flower.

Little Flower does relatively unrecoverable damage. That is if you break someone's arm it's relatively easy to put it back together with the abilities of HXH but if you blow it up, it's not going to come back without an ability like Breath of the Archangel. He probably uses this ability to intimdiate guys significantly weaker than he is, because he can never come out ahead against someone that is as strong as him.

That said perhaps when he has better mastery of aura he can use it without giving it away and potentially leave some kind of burn damage behind. Currently, it's said that whenever he uses Little Flower it's so obvious that even Gon can see it coming. Perhaps with better aura mastery he can do it so that people can't tell he'll use Little Flower. Still, the fact that he probably has to expand twice the AP (X to attack and X to protect himself) to do damage makes it pretty unlikely to succeed. That is suppose he uses 25% of his AP to attack and 25% to defend against his own damage, then his opponent only needs to use 25% of their aura to defend if they're equally strong as him. Will an equally strong user really miss the fact that Genthru is concentrating 50% of his aura on his hand and defend with less than 25%? And if they're that bad at judging why not just punch them directly? 50% of your aura against someone defending with only 25% is always a pretty advantageous situation for the attacker.