Discussion How do the Sins get stronger?

[Nico Brown]

Merlin and Meliodas both acknowledged that as they are now, the Sins stand no chance at beating the 10 Commandments. So I want to know how you guys think they can close the gap?

For me:

Meliodas- simply gets back whatever Merlin took from him and actually decides to fight seriously. Use demon side

King- fully master the true form of Chastiefol and gain complete control over the entire Fairy King forest

Escanor- already strong enough, just learn how to transform at will

Merlin- better prep. She is the greatest magician in Britannia, all she needs is to be more prepared Mayuri Kurotsuchi style.

Diane- receive training from Giant clan elders, she is still very young in relation to others

Gowther- upgrade in new body/armor and more mind hax

Ban- first get back sacred treasure then lots of training. Ban is really the only person here that isn't too special aside from his immortality.

 

[kkck]

I wouldn't bet on meliodas getting stronger only because of what merlin took from him.... If that was the soul reason for his weakness then his powerm from ten years ago would be whatever it originally was. However the sins didn't seem to be familiar with a power that would presumably be much greater than galans. And the hole he made ten years ago seemed only marginally larger than the one he just made.... It might be connected but I doubt that is all there is to it.

 

[overlordpringerx]

I think Meliodas and King need a better grip of their powers, and King might become more powerful with his wings.

 

[kkck]

As for king, the issue is not controlling the fairy king's forest but rather controlling the sacred tree. And how much power he can draw from it. As far as I can tell king for the most part even now has yet to display his full power. Overall its even weird that he could not cut the albion when meliodas with way less power could. Perhaps it has to do with the inherent sharpness of their weapons though. I think that we have yet to actually get a grasp of what it is that disaster does though, depending on how he has been using it (or not using it) it could signify an increase in offensive power from what we have seen. Although it is a tad weird that he would not have used it against the albion and instead went with the true form of chastiefol. Perhaps the situation is that disaster is too dangerous, assuming he is not using it? I mean, king has displayed insane power even by sin standards for the most part, particulalry when he defeated helbram and using chastiefol... And if he did not really use disaster or he limited it then actually using it would be huge in all contexts.

Seeing the true form of chastiefol though I get the mild impression that before king can get the hang of it he needs to increase his power to a level where he can handle it. I mean, from what we saw just activating it caused damage to king, maybe it makes sense to think of it as recoil. So king needs to be physically powerful enough to handle the power of the sacred tree he is able to call with the true form. So what we saw is not the extent of the power of the tree... its merely the most he could handle... I wouldn't be surprised that he needs more than the 11000 PL he displayed just to actually be able to handle the power.

As far as merlin goes I don't think just preparedness is enough for her to be able to deal with demons. Meliodas just went full wrath mode on galan and attacked him with what seems to be the guy's strongest move and it did precisely crap. And that was with over twice the power merlin has. Basically, no amount of preparation is going to help merlin if even twice her power does not even amount to a mosquito sting... Unless merlin can prepare in such a way that it allows her hit enemies at at least literally 8 fold of her own power (which is probably what they will need once the commandments get their power back). As far as I can tell even if merlin had the same power level as a demon she would need the mayuri levels of preparation you mention to barely pull a victory considering demons have a wider range of power than most races so far with their blackstuff which allows them insane offensive power even without weapons, an insane defense, maneuverability thanks to flying and regeneration.

 

[HereNThere]

I think the magician Merlin mentioned will play a role in both her and Gowther's power up, assuming the two are connected. I think that magician will have left behind a grimoire or something that Merlin can learn from and I think Gowther can be loaded with a bunch of upgrades like he was with Balor's eye. Also, when he learns about love and gains something to fight for, his power will increase that way as well.

I think Diane will be revealed to be someone important in the Giant clan like royalty or something. Either way, I think her power will be connected to whoever this Matrona person is. She also needs to get her spirit up.

 

[Hamy]

I've already made a post in the chapter thread itself. So more or less I'm sticking to it...

Only thing I may be convinced of is that Ban may end up learning druid or demon related slaying abilities, considering the naming sense of his own techniques it sounds to be fairly consistent. Also given his own past etc... It helps as well that he is listed as a former human so... that may open up possibilities for him. Since he is working with the goddess' he has a fairly good shot at acquiring a boost from them I would say.

Other than that I think Eefrit brings up a good point about Merlin, only other good source likely comes from an even better magician. That or she reveals herself to be goddess of some sort, and reconciles with that.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

By doing push-ups.
Nah kidding. I think each one of them should go back to where their clan lives, for example Fairy's forest for King,wherever the giants clan village is for Diane, Druid village for Elizabeth...and they should train on their abilities, for example King could try to control Chastiefol's true form better, Elizabeth should learn to use her powers at all time, Diane should get stronger period...And for Meliodas, he should try to fix the problem of his power and if indeed Merlin stole some of it then she should return it, but I fear it won't be enough. For Arthur it's a bit more complicated. Ban should get his ST back and he should train with either the fairies or the Goddess clan. Btw I think they should seek the power of the Goddess clan, after all they should be concerned about the demons being free again, so maybe they should use the horn of Cernnunos to enter in contact with them. I'm pretty sure the Goddess could help them, even if it's just to restore Merlin's body, and I'm looking forward to their introduction.
I think that maybe only Escanor won't need training, but at the same time I'm anxious at his reintroduction, mainly if he aged as much as in the poster then it's gonna be a real problem. He's already weak in his night form, now if he became an old geezer it's gonna be worse

 

[HereNThere]

King needs to master Chastiefol's true form, but I don't think he needs to return to the Fairy Forest. My idea is that Disaster is needed to bring forth Chastifol's true form, but, for one reason or another, King can't use Disaster fully, most likely because of the strain on his own body. I think this is something that he needs to go off on his own to do.

Diane returning to the Giant's village will most likely be the key to her growth. As I've stated a couple times before, I think the base of the teams power up will come from the magic within the earth that the 10 Commandments were talking about a few chapters ago and I think the Giant clan will have access to a bit of the remaining power. With the news of Diane's Gaiden coming up, I imagine that we are actually getting ready to see them.

Elizabeth, I believe, will have the most trouble controlling her abilities as her powers are too big an advantage to master early and they would potentially makes things too simple. She will also probably receive a sacred treasure equivalent. This is a long shot, but I hope, whatever the treasure is, it's something that gives her a different personality as a side effect. I don't know what made me think of that, but I hope it happens.

Arthur, on the other hand, should be fine. Along with general training, I think once he awakens his true power, he'll be good to go. Add Excalibur and he should be very formidable.

Ban...I don't know about Ban. I can't imagine him teaming up with the Goddess Clan again and I doubt the Faeries can do much for him, unless they reveal another quality to the Fountain of Youth. Maybe he'll pull a Rogue and permanently steal the power of a strong character.

Like with Ban, I doubt they will be seeking the power of the Goddess Clan. I can't imagine the Clan will help them without asking them to kill Meliodas again. However, maybe they could look for object related to the Goddess Clan that could probably help them.

According to the databook, Escanor should be 40, so he's not that old. As a matter of fact, he should be in his prime. Unless, for some reason, he ages exceedingly fast. Either way, once noon hits, he should be powerful enough to fight without issue. We also need to see if he managed to keep Rhitta or if he's lost it.

 

[overlordpringerx]

i don't think it will be that simple. Mastering true chastiefol will just be one half of King's power up. And I don't get how the giants COULD help Diane.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

i don't think it will be that simple. Mastering true chastiefol will just be one half of King's power up. And I don't get how the giants COULD help Diane.

Well it won't be long till we know...However if she wasn't raised with the giants then she must lack some skills, she was seen not doing that well against Gowther. It's true she was in a human form, but she still ended up losing, or something close to it, when normally she's stronger in terms of PLs. There could be something to be gained from revisiting the homeland of each character, even if it's just to train with fellow members of their clan.

 

[overlordpringerx]

Well it won't be long till we know...However if she wasn't raised with the giants then she must lack some skills, she was seen not doing that well against Gowther. It's true she was in a human form, but she still ended up losing, or something close to it, when normally she's stronger in terms of PLs. There could be something to be gained from revisiting the homeland of each character, even if it's just to train with fellow members of their clan.

Yeah, but Gowther is a sin, and he himself said that under normal circumstances he would have lost. I doubt there are many giants that could help her as she seems to be exceptionally powerful.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Yeah, but Gowther is a sin, and he himself said that under normal circumstances he would have lost. I doubt there are many giants that could help her as she seems to be exceptionally powerful.

And? How is Gowther being a sin making any difference? The fact is her PL normally is higher than his, now we don't know how strong she is in her human sized form, but seeing as she easily created golems I think there isn't that much difference.
She could learn to harness the power of the earth better with the giants, I think while it's true the sins could use the power of their clan by default, something could be gained from receiving a proper training with the members of their clan, as well as learning new techniques. This is actually the first time we're seeing the sins train, we haven't seen how Hendrickson managed to learn Purge, but it could be that he went back to the druid village, and learned it there. I don't think it's a coincidence they're heading to a certain place, not only will we know more about Diane's past, but we could see her get her power up there.
We don't know how powerful she is compared to other giants, because simply we haven't seen any besides her. Sure she's strong for a knight, but that means pretty much nothing compared to the demons, so clearly she's not strong enough. Who knows since she's only a teenager in terms of giants age, she can't tap into her true potentiel, so it's possible that a full grown adult Giant is stronger period. Until we actually see the other giants I'm not dismissing the idea that there could be other giants that are stronger than Diane currently.

 

[overlordpringerx]

And? How is Gowther being a sin making any difference? The fact is her PL normally is higher than his, now we don't know how strong she is in her human sized form, but seeing as she easily created golems I think there isn't that much difference.
She could learn to harness the power of the earth better with the giants, I think while it's true the sins could use the power of their clan by default, something could be gained from receiving a proper training with the members of their clan, as well as learning new techniques. This is actually the first time we're seeing the sins train, we haven't seen how Hendrickson managed to learn Purge, but it could be that he went back to the druid village, and learned it there. I don't think it's a coincidence they're heading to a certain place, not only will we know more about Diane's past, but we could see her get her power up there.
We don't know how powerful she is compared to other giants, because simply we haven't seen any besides her. Sure she's strong for a knight, but that means pretty much nothing compared to the demons, so clearly she's not strong enough. Who knows since she's only a teenager in terms of giants age, she can't tap into her true potentiel, so it's possible that a full grown adult Giant is stronger period. Until we actually see the other giants I'm not dismissing the idea that there could be other giants that are stronger than Diane currently.

While human size didn't seem to affect her magic and spirit she lost half of her strength that way. And that is almost a 3rd of her power level, meaning she was FAR BELOW Gowther back then. And I don't think Hendricksen learned purge that recently. Maybe Zaratras taught him over the years.

 

[HereNThere]

Yeah, but Gowther is a sin, and he himself said that under normal circumstances he would have lost. I doubt there are many giants that could help her as she seems to be exceptionally powerful.

Keep in mind, she is the only Giant we've seen in the series, so we don't have a direct comparison. Since a young age, she's been shown to have potential, but if she is mostly self taught, then we'd have to assume there are some techniques that she isn't aware of that only Giants can teach her. What if there are more Golem techniques she could learn? What if their are techniques that allowed them to refine their constructs?

Also Gowther didn't say he would have lost, he said he would have been at a disadvantage had it not been for his Sacred Treasure.

---------- Post added at 09:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:22 AM ----------

While human size didn't seem to affect her magic and spirit she lost half of her strength that way. And that is almost a 3rd of her power level, meaning she was FAR BELOW Gowther back then. And I don't think Hendricksen learned purge that recently. Maybe Zaratras taught him over the years.

Just because she overpowered Gowther in one aspect, physicality, which was also Gowther's weakest, it doesn't mean she doesn't have any room to grow. For someone capable of controlling the elements as she does, she still seems woefully underdeveloped in the power stat.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

While human size didn't seem to affect her magic and spirit she lost half of her strength that way. And that is almost a 3rd of her power level, meaning she was FAR BELOW Gowther back then. And I don't think Hendricksen learned purge that recently. Maybe Zaratras taught him over the years.

That's only one aspect of her power, we can't base our entire analysis on it, plus she was last seen using the golems, so she wasn't fighting him directly, so it's not like strength would be involved(the other stats would). And I do think he learned it recently, because of the demonic blood, I'm not entirely sure if Hendrickson needed the help of Zaratras specifically, Purge is a druid technique by definition so he should be able to know it, whether all by himself, or with the help of Zaratras or the Druids from the village.

 

[Incognitop]

I don't see why people are bringing up Gowther's strength so often. He is not the type of character to have an epic 1 on 1 fist fight on type of a cliff to decide the fate of humanity. His fighting style is completely different than that.

In fact, if you have a bunch of characters that fight by charging in head first and relying on their strength, it makes for a boring shonen. Case in point, the sins each have a unique way of fighting.

Even Meliodas, who is the MC, has as his main ability full counter. This means that a lot of the time, he is spent reacting to what his opponent does. this also means the pace of the battle is always set by his opponent, which has made some interesting dynamics in the series so far.

 

[overlordpringerx]

That's only one aspect of her power, we can't base our entire analysis on it, plus she was last seen using the golems, so she wasn't fighting him directly, so it's not like strength would be involved(the other stats would). And I do think he learned it recently, because of the demonic blood, I'm not entirely sure if Hendrickson needed the help of Zaratras specifically, Purge is a druid technique by definition so he should be able to know it, whether all by himself, or with the help of Zaratras or the Druids from the village.

Yeah, so? Just because it's a druid technique that doesn't mean he won't need to take time mastering it. And why would the druids help him now? They were the ones to banish him in the first place! I also don't see the connection with the demon blood.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Yeah, so? Just because it's a druid technique that doesn't mean he won't need to take time mastering it. And why would the druids help him now? They were the ones to banish him in the first place! I also don't see the connection with the demon blood.

While he had the demon blood (past 10 years or so) he wouldn't have been able to learn a druid technique, that is incompatible with demon blood. If he wanted to learn it he would have needed to be free of the demon blood, especially Purge because it purges all evil intention. I can't see him having demon blood and using Purge.
Plus we didn't hear him say he trained with Zaratras, and seeing how everyone thought that Purge was Zaratras ability I doubt it.

---------- Post added at 10:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:04 PM ----------

Also this:

10 years ago, before Zaratras was killed, Hendrickson didn't know Purge, so he couldn't have learned it with Zaratras who was killed a little while after this.

 

[overlordpringerx]

While he had the demon blood (past 10 years or so) he wouldn't have been able to learn a druid technique, that is incompatible with demon blood. If he wanted to learn it he would have needed to be free of the demon blood, especially Purge because it purges all evil intention. I can't see him having demon blood and using Purge.
Plus we didn't hear him say he trained with Zaratras, and seeing how everyone thought that Purge was Zaratras ability I doubt it.

---------- Post added at 10:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:04 PM ----------

Also this:

10 years ago, before Zaratras was killed, Hendrickson didn't know Purge, so he couldn't have learned it with Zaratras who was killed a little while after this.

Purge isn't a passive ability. It has to be activated as far as we've seen. And I doubt purge would have worked against Fraudrin.

 

[Notice me Escanor senpai]

Purge isn't a passive ability. It has to be activated as far as we've seen. And I doubt purge would have worked against Fraudrin.

Dude seriously he said that himself , and I'm pretty sure that's the reason he had Dreyfus and Hendrickson kill Zaratras, because he could use Purge and once he would have noticed the demon presence inside Dreyfus he would have used it on him.