Discussion How do you think Eduan's Shinwonryu be?

[arrowofsky]

You see the question

As for me, also considering the statement that Eduan has an attack with a cooldown period (from the vigorous debate Yirang and Eduan had, and the lore of Gustang getting a scale an okbi), I predict something along these lines:

>Eduan produce a spear with tiny thunders emitted in many directions,
>He throws the spear far above
>The spear starts to rapidly revolves in all spherical angles, so quick that our 1/24 second perceptive power can't keep up and see a sphere forming
>This sphere is the Shinwonryu, it is composed of light blue thunders, normally not a sphere but we perceive it as so.
>It generates instantaneous thunderbolts in any direction it sees fit to eliminate Eduan's targets.

Of course, imagine the sticking out parts as spear shape, i could not prompt it out from perchance.

 

[Aesanhard]

Hm, I think it would be cool if it was sound based. Thunder to his lightning. A bright flash followed by his opponents deafened permanently.

 

[Demonspeed]

Internal. He said he had more Shinsoo Attributes than his companions. He absorbs his Shinwonryu and can manifest everything at once, like the Avatar State.

 

[kkck]

I would still think that like bam family heads can simply use shinwonryu as an alternate form of shinsoo control. Bam has been throwing shinwonryu bangs for a while and data zahard used it for internal quality control or something like that. Traumerei did have his all creature though that has not been quite explained yet. Maybe it's something like an attribute but specifically to shinwonryu shinsoo control. But as I said, not explained yet. IF shinworyu has its own set of attributes or works like a sort of bankai I would guess eduan has either has more potent versions of his attributes or perhaps a big ass pipe from which spears rain down on folk.

 

[Demonspeed]

I would still think that like bam family heads can simply use shinwonryu as an alternate form of shinsoo control. Bam has been throwing shinwonryu bangs for a while and data zahard used it for internal quality control or something like that. Traumerei did have his all creature though that has not been quite explained yet. Maybe it's something like an attribute but specifically to shinwonryu shinsoo control. But as I said, not explained yet. IF shinworyu has its own set of attributes or works like a sort of bankai I would guess eduan has either has more potent versions of his attributes or perhaps a big ass pipe from which spears rain down on folk.

But Baam's Shinwonryu isn't complete yet and so was Zahard's back then. All Creatures is the only complete Shinwonryu we have seen.

 

[kkck]

But Baam's Shinwonryu isn't complete yet and so was Zahard's back then. All Creatures is the only complete Shinwonryu we have seen.

Hmm, but folk can still simply make bangs of it and throw it like they would a regular bang. Even akryung went more or less with that iirc. I don't think mastered shiwonryu necessarily is used in a single specific way at least. We have seen it used for pretty much everything.

 

[maverickframe_19]

What if it was as simple as a Big Zeus lightning bolt? Shinwonryu does not need to be a sphere, does it?

 

[arrowofsky]

What if it was as simple as a Big Zeus lightning bolt? Shinwonryu does not need to be a sphere, does it?

I understand, but I am just so used to hear it as shinsoo black hole sphere, and even though God of Guardian described in a non-spherical way, everyone up to now did it like that, even All Creatures was like that. It may change, but i find it unlikely.

From the fandom wiki part, https://towerofgod.fandom.com/wiki/Shinwonryu

• The meaning of 신원류 ("Shinwonryu") is ambiguous as SIU has not yet provided the corresponding Hanja spelling, when several alternatives are possible.[18][19] In particular, 신 ("shin") is likely 神 ("god/divine", which could also refer to Shinsu), and 원류 ("wonryu") could be either 圓 ("won") and 流 ("ryu") ("circle style") or 源流 ("wonryu") ("origin and development/source and course (of a river, spring, etc)"). It is likely that SIU is playing with several of the meanings.

In any case, it started with a singular-point definition which was still visualized in that way, than we had a great sphere of All Creatures. Nevertheless, this is your prediction, we'll see

 

[maverickframe_19]

I understand, but I am just so used to hear it as shinsoo black hole sphere, and even though God of Guardian described in a non-spherical way, everyone up to now did it like that, even All Creatures was like that. It may change, but i find it unlikely.

From the fandom wiki part, https://towerofgod.fandom.com/wiki/Shinwonryu


In any case, it started with a singular-point definition which was still visualized in that way, than we had a great sphere of All Creatures. Nevertheless, this is your prediction, we'll see

Simply put, the reason "all creatures" is a sphere shape is that Traumerei imagined his tank to be a bowl in which his animas could be contained. Many Branch heads have sent their clan fighters with animas inside a fishing bowl. I imagine this is also true for Traumerei. He's the type of FH who doesn't complicate matters. His concept of shinshoo and shapes is fairly simple.

Tu Perie is a lightbearer. I imagine his shinwonryuu to be shaped like a lighthouse with a giant eye, or something similar; you get the idea. Eduan's shinwonryu is similar to a spear, which he can throw because he is a spear bearer. So that's why I mentioned something simple, like a Zeus bolt. It only needs to be deadly/lethal.

 

[Demonspeed]

The way it was explained, I don't think Shinwonryu is going to be in different shapes like this. Baam doesn't create a Shinwonryu in the shape of an Orb. He creates Shinwonryu and an Orb.

 

[maverickframe_19]

Baam doesn't create a Shinwonryu in the shape of an Orb. He creates Shinwonryu and an Orb.

Case in point. In general, it incorporates the quality of shinwionryu in the shape or quality that you are most comfortable with. For Baam, it was Orb. For Eduan, it is a lightning spear.

 

[arrowofsky]

The way it was explained, I don't think Shinwonryu is going to be in different shapes like this. Baam doesn't create a Shinwonryu in the shape of an Orb. He creates Shinwonryu and an Orb.

The real problem is All Creatures is far far cry from what God of Guardian explained. After All Creatures, it became like a signature technique of Irregulars rather than this. It feels like a massive retcon, like 90 % of it. The creatures still can have the elements of a shinwonryu and can even anti-magecraft things out of way, but yeah.

But we can definitely rephrase it like this: How do you think Eduan incorporates Shinwonryu to his unique tech?

 

[maverickframe_19]

It feels like a massive retcon,

I don't understand how it's a retcon. I believe Demon explained it well here.

 

[arrowofsky]

I don't understand how it's a retcon. I believe Demon explained it well here.

Demonspeed explained well, I don't disagree.
Just consider "Shinsoo black hole sphere", how All Creatures named as Shinwonryu - All Creatures and in many cases they were just there only for respawning and Yama was fine dealing with some of them, and the concept of owning a space and exploding it.

There is not only a terminology clash in SIU after years passing since a term - Shinwonryu came in place with some ambiguity as well, but also us discussing it here

This technique is by controlling Shinsu with in a space and making it your own, you can condense it all into a single point and make it explode. It can also be called as explosion of space itself.

Later, special techs of FHs or irregulars started to got mixed up with this. In fact, looking at this definition, Disconnection 3D feels more like Shinwonryu in it then All Creatures.

 

[kkck]

The real problem is All Creatures is far far cry from what God of Guardian explained. After All Creatures, it became like a signature technique of Irregulars rather than this. It feels like a massive retcon, like 90 % of it. The creatures still can have the elements of a shinwonryu and can even anti-magecraft things out of way, but yeah.

But we can definitely rephrase it like this: How do you think Eduan incorporates Shinwonryu to his unique tech?

To me it felt like traumerei's all creature was more of a next step for shinwonryu. Bam still only managed to use it competently following his training with eduan and even now it's inherently draining even compared to his other powers. I think shinwonryu simply is broken enough that it might allow for two things in regards to what you are asking.

The first is that eduan could simply create a shinwonryu lightning spear. Zahard was able to make a golden shinwonryu bang and apparently use it for internal quality shinsoo control (which then exploded very externally) so eduan using shinwonryu lightnight spear or lightning wouldn't be particularly different.

The second is that perhaps shinwonryu, being a different form of shinsoo control, has its own, more potent and elaborate attributes. Which gets us to traumerei's all creature. Another hint we were given by leviathan is shinwonryu having a space within it. Which seems like a generic enough statement it could apply to all users. With this in mind shinwonryu being like an attribute bankai sounds at least plausible. Hence my suggestion of eduan's shinwonryu being a massive pipe that rains down elemental spears on people.

 

[maverickframe_19]

To me it felt like traumerei's all creature was more of a next step for shinwonryu. Bam still only managed to use it competently following his training with eduan and even now it's inherently draining even compared to his other powers. I think shinwonryu simply is broken enough that it might allow for two things in regards to what you are asking.

The first is that eduan could simply create a shinwonryu lightning spear. Zahard was able to make a golden shinwonryu bang and apparently use it for internal quality shinsoo control (which then exploded very externally) so eduan using shinwonryu lightnight spear or lightning wouldn't be particularly different.

The second is that perhaps shinwonryu, being a different form of shinsoo control, has its own, more potent and elaborate attributes. Which gets us to traumerei's all creature. Another hint we were given by leviathan is shinwonryu having a space within it. Which seems like a generic enough statement it could apply to all users. With this in mind shinwonryu being like an attribute bankai sounds at least plausible. Hence my suggestion of eduan's shinwonryu being a massive pipe that rains down elemental spears on people.

Excellently said! It could be the case, and it is more likely to be what you said. It could be similar to how Baam's shinshoo rain fell on white through the dark black shinwonryuu. In Eduan's case, it will rain shinshoo spears rather than just shinshoo rain. I prefer it. I want this to be the case.

 

[kkck]

Ok, for more context, non orb related techniques which have been used with shinwonryu:

God of guardians was able to make and throw 2 shinwonryu bangs.

Bam has been shown throwing at least one shiwonryu bang at a variety of times.

Zahard used a golden shinwonryu bang for internal quality control and then made a huge explosion in the area.

Akryung charged and threw a shiwonryu bang.

Bam's most common use of shinwonryu in season 3 without the orb was the floral butterfly. Which was most evident when kallavan would only dodge that and not other attacks.

Without more information I just don't see why some things could be used with shinwonryu (bangs, golden bangs, floral butterfly) but not others.

 

[Demonspeed]

To me it felt like traumerei's all creature was more of a next step for shinwonryu. Bam still only managed to use it competently following his training with eduan and even now it's inherently draining even compared to his other powers. I think shinwonryu simply is broken enough that it might allow for two things in regards to what you are asking.

The first is that eduan could simply create a shinwonryu lightning spear. Zahard was able to make a golden shinwonryu bang and apparently use it for internal quality shinsoo control (which then exploded very externally) so eduan using shinwonryu lightnight spear or lightning wouldn't be particularly different.

The second is that perhaps shinwonryu, being a different form of shinsoo control, has its own, more potent and elaborate attributes. Which gets us to traumerei's all creature. Another hint we were given by leviathan is shinwonryu having a space within it. Which seems like a generic enough statement it could apply to all users. With this in mind shinwonryu being like an attribute bankai sounds at least plausible. Hence my suggestion of eduan's shinwonryu being a massive pipe that rains down elemental spears on people.

The way I see it, Shinwonryu is kinda like Hatsu in HxH. It's a special ability, unique to the Irregular which shows some of their characteristics/traits. All Creatures fits Traumerei perfectly has an Anima. Bowl with infinite storage, which can be used as a projectile, to fuse them, to make them respawn.

I also think that Eduan's Shinwonryu won't just be lightning related. He mentioned that he had several attributes for a reason.

Leviathan didn't really say that Shinwonryu have space within them, but Traumerei's works like that. Baam's inner world is comparable because he can endlessly absorb stuff.

Case in point. In general, it incorporates the quality of shinwionryu in the shape or quality that you are most comfortable with. For Baam, it was Orb. For Eduan, it is a lightning spear.

Lightning Spear =/= Shinwonryu though. Traumerei's Shinwonryu has nothing to do with his one and only Shinsoo Attribute.

Ok, for more context, non orb related techniques which have been used with shinwonryu:

God of guardians was able to make and throw 2 shinwonryu bangs.

Bam has been shown throwing at least one shiwonryu bang at a variety of times.

Zahard used a golden shinwonryu bang for internal quality control and then made a huge explosion in the area.

Akryung charged and threw a shiwonryu bang.

Bam's most common use of shinwonryu in season 3 without the orb was the floral butterfly. Which was most evident when kallavan would only dodge that and not other attacks.

Without more information I just don't see why some things could be used with shinwonryu (bangs, golden bangs, floral butterfly) but not others.

The thing is that Baangs are circular in general.

Data Zahard said that the way Baam used Shinwonryu (External + Orb) was a way he had never seen before. Which means that even V doesn't use it this way.

 

[arrowofsky]

Data Zahard that the way Baam used Shinwonryu (External + Orb) was a way he had never seen before. Which means that even V doesn't use it this way.

Woow, very critical detail. I started to wonder that but now is not the time. Post-revolution V had "freedom" feeling and wings acc. to Traumerei, so maybe his was like Soul Gear - Limit Break (another Feng Shen Ji ref. yes ), but probably different than how Redan works or not like an internal thing.

...

or maybe like dying and entering your son's corpse and keeping it alive for 25 nights.

 

[kkck]

The way I see it, Shinwonryu is kinda like Hatsu in HxH. It's a special ability, unique to the Irregular which shows some of their characteristics/traits. All Creatures fits Traumerei perfectly has an Anima. Bowl with infinite storage, which can be used as a projectile, to fuse them, to make them respawn.

I also think that Eduan's Shinwonryu won't just be lightning related. He mentioned that he had several attributes for a reason.

Leviathan didn't really say that Shinwonryu have space within them, but Traumerei's works like that. Baam's inner world is comparable because he can endlessly absorb stuff.



Lightning Spear =/= Shinwonryu though. Traumerei's Shinwonryu has nothing to do with his one and only Shinsoo Attribute.



The thing is that Baangs are circular in general.

Data Zahard said that the way Baam used Shinwonryu (External + Orb) was a way he had never seen before. Which means that even V doesn't use it this way.

That's sort of why I suggested a pipe. A pipe could contain spears of all types.

Sure, but the shinwonryu bang was referred to as such, a bang. It's not coincidentally a circular, it's actually and factually a bang. Add to that it being used as a bang as well. And to me it's also a bit of a hard sell that bam went up against data zahard, used shinwonryu against him via the orb, and zahard didn't use his own.

At the moment it's up in the air whether V or other family heads even had an orb shinsoo attribute. Gustang didn't as far as I can tell. Add to that, data eduan only had knowledge of his peers up to the time they finished the hell train.