Discussion Is Luffy getting... softer?

[SirJack]

Hi guys,
This morning I was revisiting my favourite arc, Alabasta, and these dialogs in peculiar stole my attention:

Spoiler

http://www.mangareader.net/one-piece/177/8
or even more
http://www.mangareader.net/one-piece/166/16 and following

Don't you think that our capitain grew "softer" in this years ? Don't you feel strange by reading again those bits? Back then, Luffy was a completely different character. A character which I LOVED, to be honest. BUt now? It's almost like he was more mature, more badass, even more cinical, in the early years of OP, way before the timeskip. Is it just me?

 

[kkck]

I am not sure that luffy has grown softer. Back then the issue was largely that vivi did not quite have her priorities straight. She wanted to stop the fighting but that wouldn't do much to stop crocodile, it was a distraction from their real objectives which they had limited resources to accomplish. This would be like having someone in dressrosa insisting the strawhats go save people instead of fighting doflamingo or holding back the bird cage. Not to mention that the context has changed a fair bit since then as well. Back then the strawhats had but a fraction of the power they have now. In turn now half of them have the power to singlehandedly destroy a country through sheer physical might. They can do much more on their own than they could before.

 

[Lady pompom]

I don't think he is necessarily "softer", but he matured during the time-skip (something needed if he wanted to go to the new world) so he probably thinks a bit before making choices and has his objective clear. I mean, this whole Big Mom arc is not about him fighting throughly to defeat Big mom, right? His objective is still to defeat Kaidou, but before he neeed to bring back Sanji (and his companion was the reason he went all the trouble invading an younkou's territory).

 

[M3J]

It's called character development. Luffy is getting more mature and thoughtful while still remaining a badass. As long as he's still willing to do things like punch a Tenryuubito again for being a horrible scum, I'm okay with it.

 

[kkck]

How exactly do the links referenced there evidence luffy having matured? I would argue the opposite, luffy behaves now very similarly to how he did back when the manga started.

 

[SirJack]

How exactly do the links referenced there evidence luffy having matured? I would argue the opposite, luffy behaves now very similarly to how he did back when the manga started.

"What's wrong about not wanting people to die?!"
"People die."
I don't know, revisiting those old arcs I got the impression that Luffy was more "hardcore", more "mature" back in Alabasta. That dialogue with Crocodile, the way in wich he addresses life and death on a battlefield, almost cynically I might say, it's something I haven't seen him doing in a while. Do you recall Luffy being this serious in a discussion AFTER the timeskip?
I really love Luffy, don't get me wrong. But nowadays it's almost like he's only "Baaka Luffy" for most of the time, while obviously switching to his epic warrior persona when in battle.

 

[costicla]

"What's wrong about not wanting people to die?!"
"People die."
I don't know, revisiting those old arcs I got the impression that Luffy was more "hardcore", more "mature" back in Alabasta. That dialogue with Crocodile, the way in wich he addresses life and death on a battlefield, almost cynically I might say, it's something I haven't seen him doing in a while. Do you recall Luffy being this serious in a discussion AFTER the timeskip?
I really love Luffy, don't get me wrong. But nowadays it's almost like he's only "Baaka Luffy" for most of the time, while obviously switching to his epic warrior persona when in battle.

Erm, did you read the latest chapter?

 

[SirJack]

Yeah, but I'm not referring to Luffy being selfless and acting like a captain, I was think more about the surprisingly way in which he addresses complex matters like Life and Death and Fate... When was the last time you saw Luffy speak in such a collected, down-to-earth and almost cold fashion?
Now he's more like shouting "IMMA NOT GONNA LET ANYONE DIE", especially after Ace's demise.

 

[kkck]

"What's wrong about not wanting people to die?!"
"People die."
I don't know, revisiting those old arcs I got the impression that Luffy was more "hardcore", more "mature" back in Alabasta. That dialogue with Crocodile, the way in wich he addresses life and death on a battlefield, almost cynically I might say, it's something I haven't seen him doing in a while. Do you recall Luffy being this serious in a discussion AFTER the timeskip?
I really love Luffy, don't get me wrong. But nowadays it's almost like he's only "Baaka Luffy" for most of the time, while obviously switching to his epic warrior persona when in battle.

The issue there is context. At the time Vivi went "hey luffy, let's go defeat crocodile, his minions and also prevent a single person out of the 1 million that are about to fight each other from dying". And the answer was " um, ok, do you also want a pony? let me pull one out of my ass. And just so you know, I am being sarcastic, my fruit doesn't give me the ability to do that nor does anyone in my crew have the ability to do that". The issue at that specific point was vivi asking for something which everyone else acknowledged was impossible. This isn't luffy being more matured or hardcore than he is today, this is luffy merely acknowledging they couldn't do everything. If this happened, say, today things would be quite different. Luffy would be able to go solo the entirety of baroque works without breaking a sweat while zoro drunkenly stumbles into the battlefield where the alabasta folk are about to kill each other and then simply use a half ass slash to split the ground to separate both armies and preventing them from killing each other. Again, if viola or rebeca had gone to luffy and asked him to not only defeat doflamingo but also prevented the birdcage to hurt a single person or destroy homes then luffy would have likely responded something akin to "ok, NO, that's stupid. Go suck the fattest of rubbery dicks while you contemplate the magnitude of the stupidity of what you just suggested because it's staggering. I am a bonafide moron and cannot bear to look at you due to how stupid what you suggested is". When has luffy tried to do more than he could chew? Sure, they saved basically everyone in fishman island for instance but that was because their enemy was hodi, a worthless fodder backed up by other worthless fodder.

 

[I Am Atomic]

And the answer was " um, ok, do you also want a pony? let me pull one out of my ass. And just so you know, I am being sarcastic, my fruit doesn't give me the ability to do that nor does anyone in my crew have the ability to do that".

"ok, NO, that's stupid. Go suck the fattest of rubbery dicks while you contemplate the magnitude of the stupidity of what you just suggested because it's staggering. I am a bonafide moron and cannot bear to look at you due to how stupid what you suggested is".

I sure love your quotes of XD

 

[SirJack]

The issue there is context. At the time Vivi went "hey luffy, let's go defeat crocodile, his minions and also prevent a single person out of the 1 million that are about to fight each other from dying". And the answer was " um, ok, do you also want a pony? let me pull one out of my ass. And just so you know, I am being sarcastic, my fruit doesn't give me the ability to do that nor does anyone in my crew have the ability to do that". The issue at that specific point was vivi asking for something which everyone else acknowledged was impossible. This isn't luffy being more matured or hardcore than he is today, this is luffy merely acknowledging they couldn't do everything. If this happened, say, today things would be quite different. Luffy would be able to go solo the entirety of baroque works without breaking a sweat while zoro drunkenly stumbles into the battlefield where the alabasta folk are about to kill each other and then simply use a half ass slash to split the ground to separate both armies and preventing them from killing each other. Again, if viola or rebeca had gone to luffy and asked him to not only defeat doflamingo but also prevented the birdcage to hurt a single person or destroy homes then luffy would have likely responded something akin to "ok, NO, that's stupid. Go suck the fattest of rubbery dicks while you contemplate the magnitude of the stupidity of what you just suggested because it's staggering. I am a bonafide moron and cannot bear to look at you due to how stupid what you suggested is". When has luffy tried to do more than he could chew? Sure, they saved basically everyone in fishman island for instance but that was because their enemy was hodi, a worthless fodder backed up by other worthless fodder.

Quotes are LOL.

Anyway, indeed the context was different, but then again, do you ever recall Luffy being this cynical, this down-to-earth and "real" in a discussion?
If you ask me, post time skip Luffy is even more "baaka" and naive than he was before...

 

[kkck]

Quotes are LOL.

Anyway, indeed the context was different, but then again, do you ever recall Luffy being this cynical, this down-to-earth and "real" in a discussion?
If you ask me, post time skip Luffy is even more "baaka" and naive than he was before...

I would argue the more important question is: Has there been a situation where luffy should have acted as he did in alabasta but didn't? Remember, the issue there was that vivi wanted an scenario which luffy and company deemed impossible altogether. And luffy now can chew a lot more than he could back then. As I said earlier, had he had his current strength back at alabasta then the strawhats would have been able to stop the million soldiers that were about to fight along with taking on crocodile and his crew. There wouldn't have been a need to get real or anything of the sort. The issue here is necessity and circumstances, nothing else.

 

[costicla]

Quotes are LOL.

Anyway, indeed the context was different, but then again, do you ever recall Luffy being this cynical, this down-to-earth and "real" in a discussion?
If you ask me, post time skip Luffy is even more "baaka" and naive than he was before...

Can you actually give a concrete example of this?It`s pretty much what kkck said, there was never a situation where Luffy had to be so "down-to-earth", as you call him, as Alabasta.

And..

Spoiler

In the recent chapter, Pedro died to save them and Luffy pretty much told them to go so as not to make his sacrifice meaningless. he never went "oh noez my friend died, noez", so I don`t know how he is more naive now than before.

 

[M3J]

When has Luffy ever been naive? if anything, he's been ignorant, at worst, but otherwise he's usually pretty confident in his strength. Luffy may be idealistic, but he's not naive.

 

[Shobu_Yoruichi]

I've to say... i'd prefer the Luffy of the beginning, that one was coherent enough and for sure i liked him when gave the most simple anwser to complex situations.

Another thing is that he shows reason here:

Spoiler

And, 20 chapters before he does this:

Spoiler

There is a way to write that involves characters doing what made them characters, let them speak and act like themselves instead for the plot to go to a specific point, it is very hard ofcourse, because the author needs to keep the balance between everything, Oda had that touch with Luffy, this chapter it felt like only said to move on to fight with Katakuri rather than escaping, badass without a doubt, but i felt that too forced, much more when reading Totland since it's beginning.

EDIT: @Brandish i did not answered the title, so... nope, to me Luffy is the same, but only when Oda wants.

 

[Brandish μ]

Hmm I don't believe Luffy is getting softer though I understand the sentiment, his badass moments have been fewer and further between in the New World. Possible reasons:

• He's only been in the new world for a few weeks(?) maybe we should give him more time?
• Arcs have dragged out, so it feels like he's a lesser entity
• Dressrosa: Luffy is someone who does what he wants, and that's when he's at his most awesome. But to go after a Yonkou, Kaido, he felt the need to team up. So there was more 'planning' involved, rather than him being off the cuff. He was wearing a disguise for example. He was uncompromising when facing Doffy iirc.
• WCI: A rescue mission, not exactly a situation that allows Luffy to make a badass stand. The Katakuri moment is probably it.

I will say that he needs to stand up and reach those highs he did before the timeskip, e.g when he punched the Celestial Dragon. I'm putting all my chips behind Wano Arc, there we'll see epic Luffy.

Upon re-reading that^ I may have misunderstood the topic a bit...

 

[keeper1h]

Character development for me too.
Most kids never ever contemplates the idea of losing a loved one, until reality hits...
New Luffy is same Luffy, plus some brain!
Now he's more prone to use some strategy when he knows his enemy is waaaaay too much for him to handle.

 

[caliboy]

SPOILERS!!!

Same Luffy

There are moments during the new world like Luffy with Princess Shirahoshi, Rebecca about her father, Kozuki Oden and his resolve that are similar

 

[SirJack]

Hmm I don't believe Luffy is getting softer though I understand the sentiment, his badass moments have been fewer and further between in the New World. Possible reasons:

• He's only been in the new world(?) maybe we should give him more time?
• Arcs have dragged out, so it feels like he's a lesser entity
• Dressrosa: Luffy is someone who does what he wants, and that's when he's at his most awesome. But to go after a Yonkou, Kaido, he felt the need to team up. So there was more 'planning' involved, rather than him being off the cuff. He was wearing a disguise for example. He was uncompromising when facing Doffy iirc.
• WCI: A rescue mission, not exactly a situation that allows Luffy to make a badass stand. The Katakuri moment is probably it.

I will say that he needs to stand up and reach those highs he did before the timeskip, e.g when he punched the Celestial Dragon. I'm putting all my chips behind Wano Arc, there we'll see epic Luffy.

Upon re-reading that^ I may have misunderstood the topic a bit...

Nah, I think you understood me very well

I agree with your post, even if I was referring in particular to the attitude Luffy used to have back in Alabasta. It's like there was a shade of cynicism and fatalism in the character... I dont' think Luffy is like that anymore.
I don't know, I might just be me. Doesn't feel like the same Mugiwara who calmly strolled to Arlong Park after witnessing Nami injuring herself out of desperation.

 

[BetaRuler]

some of this i think is to contrast the serious tones and characters, like we had some pretty dark subjects lately from aces death, fishmen racism, mink torturing, and child experiments, with pretty serious characters like law and smoker in the picture, perhaps keeping some characters behaving goofy keeps the atmosphere friendly enough for many to still read otherwise the atmosphere might get a bit heavy on the more bright and cheerful readers. You gotta balance some things even though it may be writing luffy into a typecasted role!

Maybe it is a maturity thing, many guys i can think of, as they became older, became 'softer' in different ways, more open and understanding to stress, illnesses and mental health problem, and while not gay, just showing more love to their other male friends,,, luffy may also just be maturing in such a way, that he cares more about his friends that he still has, than proving how tough he is.