Fantasy Jacob vs Lucy

[WoWfan]

Well considering Lucy survived a nuke from Hades' magic is a given and she basically gets knocked down by attacks of someone who is not even trying, that doesn't really mean anything, Neinhart is confirmed bad in physical stats, but still have the magic power comparable to other Spriggans. remember, size does not matter, scaling does, Jacob was nerfed as confirmed by Mira so they fought evenly for a while.

 

[Axiomus]

A base Natsu who severely held back.
LFD Natsu was going to one shot her, to the point where Aquarius was worried whether Lucy would accidentally get killed lol. And LFD Natsu is probably like ~1.5-2x base Natsu

In terms of power, Yokai Lucy ~ Stardress mix IMO
It was stated to be a big powerup to the base, like stardress mix is

Jacob was = x792 base Natsu in pure stats
I consider Lucy still < x792 base Natsu in stats, and <<< x793 base Natsu.

Why <<< x793 base Natsu?
Stardress mix spell should be comparable to UM, considering both attacks exhaust her MP completely. Stardress mix spell got no sold by Elfman and Mira


In fantasy battles we consider characters without PIS/CIS, right?
In this case Jacob no diff's. Lucy has no means to deal with invis + clap. Or even directly just clapping, it takes like 0.1 sec for people of x792 base Natsu calibur to clap (even we can do it in <1 sec).
In a realistic scenario, almost nobody (unless they're like Suzaku tiers) is stopping Jacob from clapping, like like almost nobody is stopping Dimaria from clicking her teeth. The happy thing was a gag, he could've clapped the entire fight but he didn't. For normal mages, either you are strong enough to resist, or you get one shot.

Also, even without clap hax, it should be a high diff battle based on everything else Jacob can do.
Let's not forget that Lucy was no diff/one shot material for Jacob in x792 (she was going to get killed before Natsu intervened). By pure stats.
Do you think Lucy has grown so much, to go from no diff material. to actually beating him in combat?

I won't contest that Jacob has better durability than Lucy. But we can't be certain that Natsu would oneshot her with LFD.

Snake-Lucy lost to Aquarius, right? Lucy with Aquarius star-dress should, more or less, have Aquarius' stats.

How do we tell the difference from CIS/PIS and just general incompetence? Because Jacob is too consistently stupid for me to treat it as CIS, rather than a severe lack of intelligence compromising his skill. I don't deny that he could beat almost everyone by turning invisible and clapping. That's the worst part.

If we're excluding transport, I don't think Lucy was ever oneshot material for Jacob. Lucy was covering her neck, and I don't believe that knife was going to cut through her arms and then take off her head. People who are better at cutting than Jacob have done less to Lucy. It would take many, many hits for Jacob to put down Lucy. Like more hits than it would take to take down Mirajane with no takeovers.

 

[grey matter]

I won't contest that Jacob has better durability than Lucy. But we can't be certain that Natsu would oneshot her with LFD.

Snake-Lucy lost to Aquarius, right? Lucy with Aquarius star-dress should, more or less, have Aquarius' stats.

How do we tell the difference from CIS/PIS and just general incompetence? Because Jacob is too consistently stupid for me to treat it as CIS, rather than a severe lack of intelligence compromising his skill. I don't deny that he could beat almost everyone by turning invisible and clapping. That's the worst part.

If we're excluding transport, I don't think Lucy was ever oneshot material for Jacob. Lucy was covering her neck, and I don't believe that knife was going to cut through her arms and then take off her head. People who are better at cutting than Jacob have done less to Lucy. It would take many, many hits for Jacob to put down Lucy. Like more hits than it would take to take down Mirajane with no takeovers.

According to Aquarius, he would've accidentally killed her with LFD without even trying to.

Not necessarily.
It does seem like her spirits on their own are stronger than ones summoned by her. Mimi suggested the same as well, apparently Capricorn would've given Mimi a good fight, but because he was nerfed by Lucy, he got low diff'd
Also, Aquarius stardress got one shot by Kyria with a roar? Can't be that strong

Come on lol, it's obviously CIS. It doesn't take much intelligence to clap, even 5 year old can clap when told to. Tell 5 year olds to clap when you see an enemy, and they would do it. Jacob had enough intelligence to blackmail Mavis, as well as become advisor to Ajeel; can't be that stupid. It's just that Mashima makes his hax characters go full retard, or else they stomp.
August should technically have most Spriggan abilities (except Bradman/Wahl), yet used none. He also has Midnight's hax, meaning he's also immune to holder magic using refraction, yet didn't use. And we KNOW August is very smart, it's CIS/PIS here, not being low IQ

I thought it would've, considering Natsu blocked it. But maybe you're right, Lucy has tanked some blows in the past. I think she was still about to be low diff'd
Jacob was x792 base Natsu tier in stats. That's easily enough to dominate Lucy

 

[WoWfan]

Ax, yet Natsu was required to protect her, so her arms couldn't have protected her, and purposely was torturing them which is not really full strength, everyone has their own personalities that people can exploit, like Soi Fon doing whatever Yoruichi wants when it is inconvenient. lol

 

[Axiomus]

Ax, yet Natsu was required to protect her, so her arms couldn't have protected her, and purposely was torturing them which is not really full strength, everyone has their own personalities that people can exploit, like Soi Fon doing whatever Yoruichi wants when it is inconvenient. lol

Lucy was going to survive whether or not Natsu stepped in. Let's not pretend that a knife that doesn't even scratch Natsu is going to cut through Lucy's arms and then lop her head off. Kyria's cuts could break Erza's sword, cut Natsu up, and cut through Gray's ice....and even then Lucy can survive her attacks.

Jacob hit Natsu and Lucy a bunch of times later on, at full strength, and she survived them all.

 

[WoWfan]

Natsu is known for being able to withstand bladed weapons since Lullaby, yet he required his heat to melt it, Kyria is a blade dragon slayer, different scenario, almost anyone can cut through ice, no evidence that it was full strength, he was still torturing them

 

[Axiomus]

According to Aquarius, he would've accidentally killed her with LFD without even trying to.

Not necessarily.
It does seem like her spirits on their own are stronger than ones summoned by her. Mimi suggested the same as well, apparently Capricorn would've given Mimi a good fight, but because he was nerfed by Lucy, he got low diff'd
Also, Aquarius stardress got one shot by Kyria with a roar? Can't be that strong

Come on lol, it's obviously CIS. It doesn't take much intelligence to clap, even 5 year old can clap when told to. Tell 5 year olds to clap when you see an enemy, and they would do it. Jacob had enough intelligence to blackmail Mavis, as well as become advisor to Ajeel; can't be that stupid. It's just that Mashima makes his hax characters go full retard, or else they stomp.
August should technically have most Spriggan abilities (except Bradman/Wahl), yet used none. He also has Midnight's hax, meaning he's also immune to holder magic using refraction, yet didn't use. And we KNOW August is very smart, it's CIS/PIS here, not being low IQ

I thought it would've, considering Natsu blocked it. But maybe you're right, Lucy has tanked some blows in the past. I think she was still about to be low diff'd
Jacob was x792 base Natsu tier in stats. That's easily enough to dominate Lucy

Maybe, depending on what attack he used. A big move might have done it, but I don't think regular LFD punches was going to kill Lucy.

Mimi said that Lucy's spirits could get stronger with discipline from the summoner, and that Lucy lacked it. But like...the discipline still has to come from somewhere, and it's not like the spirits themselves are all that disciplined, even if they summon themselves. In any case, the Aquarius stardress gives Lucy most of Aquarius' powers. More than that, I was under the impression that Lucy got significantly stronger in their rematch. Whether it be POF or her getting more used to Elentir, you cannot deny that Stardress Lucy was on a completely different level in their rematch.

I don't consider trying to blackmail Mavis to be a very smart move. Coulda just killed everyone, and then wait for August. Can't speak to him becoming advisor to Ajeel. At a certain point, you have to ask yourself is this really a one-off case or is this how the character regularly fights? August can afford to not fight efficiently because he has OP stats. Whatever he does, he's still going to win.

I doubt even Erza could throw a knife like that. What's far more likely to happen is that Jacob spends all day beating up Lucy, the same way he spends all day trying to beat up Mirajane, and then Lucy just drops from exhaustion.

Natsu is known for being able to withstand bladed weapons since Lullaby, yet he required his heat to melt it, Kyria is a blade dragon slayer, different scenario, almost anyone can cut through ice, no evidence that it was full strength, he was still torturing them

He was cut by Erigor's scythe. Not like Natsu specifically tried to melt the knife, the natural body heat coming off him melted the knife. It's a regular knife. Natsu probably coulda melted it pre-TS.

Kyria being a blade dragon slayer means she's better at cutting stuff than Jacob.

He was mad after Natsu and Lucy kicked him.

 

[WoWfan]

It was only a light cut, it still shocked why it did not do anything, and no surprise how mages can alter their stats that way, that is not natural body heat, if it were, then he would burn anything and anyone he touches that is not an enemy, it is not a question of can or can’t, but that he did so to protect lucy because she would have been hurt, kyria is hax, that is how DS powers work, anger doesn’t always translate to serious attacks, otherwise Acno was serious in his attack being angry and yet could not kill Natsu, which he is legitimately shocked by it.

 

[Seven777]

That's just it. I don't think Jacob can actually kill Lucy no matter how many times he hits her. Maybe if he cuts her neck with a knife, but certainly not with hand to hand alone. She's survived far worse than what she can dish out. Like I believe a single nuke from Hades does more damage than Jacob's entirely capable of dishing out.

I disagree about Bloodman and Dimaria have bad attack power among the Spriggans. They might not be in the same lane as Wall or God Serena, but they are probably good enough to contend with Invel or Ajeel. Jacob is like the inverse of Neinhart. Neinhart has good attack power, but poor durability. Jacob has good durability, but poor attack power. There are non-Spriggan characters from previous arcs that hit much harder than him, Makarov being on example.

Satan Soul punch did oneshot Jacob though. Yes, Jacob took shots before that, but it was from Mirajane with no takeovers. The anime makes it clear that one punch from Satan Soul beat him. Even in the manga, Mirajane wasn't using Satan Soul by the time Makarov used Fairy Law, which is hours into their fight, and the only panel of Mirajane actually using Satan Soul to fight him was when he got beat.

With respect, that's retarded and completely ignores Mashima's intention. Lucy needed Natsu to save her from Jacob, not because of Transport, but because of his basic attacks. He clearly implied that if she didn't get help, Jacob would end up cutting Lucy to pieces bit by bit in order to force Mavis to cough up Fairy Heart. I also don't think Lucy is tanking Hades nuke either, it fucked Makarov up through his strongest defense.

Ajeel is dogshit too, Erza was sitting in his attacks for the entire time it took Lucy to take a bath and she still tanked it all. He also couldn't even put down Lisanna. You think Jacob is bad for failing to beat Lucy when she had Natsu backing her up? Ajeel failed to beat Lisanna with only Elfman backing her up. They're an objectively worse team, even if you go ahead and said Elfman was outright %100 immune to Ajeel's attacks, Lisanna has no business surviving.
Neinhart's attack power is crap too. Jellal drownedt.

Anime isn't the manga, we have no idea what Mashima told them. As for her human form, sure, Natsu without fire still hits hard too, same with Gajeel without iron and who knows how many hits Mira got because of the whole titty thing.

 

[Foukun]

Jacob has thrown multiple hits after that melted knife and non of them could do any shit to Lucy
lets not kid ourself Mashima wanted Natsu to interpret the fight do he needed a way for that
even Natsu speech after that scene is so comical I don't know how ppl take that line form Jacob seriously "Lucy will be Lucy even without her head"

if Jacob was able to one shot Lucy with one knife he would have done so
since in the fight he could not do that even though he had hit her with different attacks
thats mean he dose not have the power/feat to do so

 

[WoWfan]

or simply he is not even being serious since he plans to torture them.

 

[Axiomus]

With respect, that's retarded and completely ignores Mashima's intention. Lucy needed Natsu to save her from Jacob, not because of Transport, but because of his basic attacks. He clearly implied that if she didn't get help, Jacob would end up cutting Lucy to pieces bit by bit in order to force Mavis to cough up Fairy Heart. I also don't think Lucy is tanking Hades nuke either, it fucked Makarov up through his strongest defense.

Ajeel is dogshit too, Erza was sitting in his attacks for the entire time it took Lucy to take a bath and she still tanked it all. He also couldn't even put down Lisanna. You think Jacob is bad for failing to beat Lucy when she had Natsu backing her up? Ajeel failed to beat Lisanna with only Elfman backing her up. They're an objectively worse team, even if you go ahead and said Elfman was outright %100 immune to Ajeel's attacks, Lisanna has no business surviving.
Neinhart's attack power is crap too. Jellal drowned.

Anime isn't the manga, we have no idea what Mashima told them. As for her human form, sure, Natsu without fire still hits hard too, same with Gajeel without iron and who knows how many hits Mira got because of the whole titty thing.

But we see Lucy take multiple hits from Jacob afterwards, and she was still fine. So why would we assume the knife thrown in the beginning would have been on a completely different level than the dozen of hits they took later? Worst thing I can see that knife doing is giving Lucy a deep cut on her arm, but it most likely doesnt even do as much as Neinharts winds, which damaged Natsu's arm more than the knife did.

Im not talking about amerterasu 100. Thats a spell above Makarov's striking. Overkill for Lucy. Im talking about Hades regular ameterasu. The type of attacks Franmalth used.

Ajeel dealt a good deal of damage to Erza, and Elfman was limping by the end of their fight. Natsu and Lucy walked away from Jacob pretty much no different than they started out.

Even in the manga, Mirajane didnt use a takeover up to the point when Makarov used Fairy Law, which wad during the middle of Natsu and Grays fight. Infact, I would argue that Mirajane ended up in better shape than when she started. She started the fight exhausted, and finished the fight as soon as she could muster the strength to use Satan Soul. Jacobs rate of damage couldnt outpace Mirajane's natural recovery... Oh and Natsu and Gajeel still have the physical boost from DS magic even when they dont make fire or iron. When Mirajane isnt using takeover, its debatable if shes even still using magic.

 

[Seven777]

But we see Lucy take multiple hits from Jacob afterwards, and she was still fine. So why would we assume the knife thrown in the beginning would have been on a completely different level than the dozen of hits they took later? Worst thing I can see that knife doing is giving Lucy a deep cut on her arm, but it most likely doesnt even do as much as Neinharts winds, which damaged Natsu's arm more than the knife did.

Im not talking about amerterasu 100. Thats a spell above Makarov's striking. Overkill for Lucy. Im talking about Hades regular ameterasu. The type of attacks Franmalth used.

Ajeel dealt a good deal of damage to Erza, and Elfman was limping by the end of their fight. Natsu and Lucy walked away from Jacob pretty much no different than they started out.

Even in the manga, Mirajane didnt use a takeover up to the point when Makarov used Fairy Law, which wad during the middle of Natsu and Grays fight. Infact, I would argue that Mirajane ended up in better shape than when she started. She started the fight exhausted, and finished the fight as soon as she could muster the strength to use Satan Soul. Jacobs rate of damage couldnt outpace Mirajane's natural recovery... Oh and Natsu and Gajeel still have the physical boost from DS magic even when they dont make fire or iron. When Mirajane isnt using takeover, its debatable if shes even still using magic.

Sure, I'm not saying she gets oneshot by the knife, far from it, but to say that Jacob can't put Lucy down no matter how much he attacks her is retarded. Mashima made it clear, Lucy was going to lose, and Jacob would have used her to force Mavis's hand. Neinhart was enchanted.

Then I disagree. A mid level spell from Hades isn't eclipsing all the damage Jacob can do combined, that's ridiculous. And I probably rate Hades higher than you do too.

After she spent an extended period of time in his sand. Was Elfman limping? Where? He seemed in pretty much the same condition after his fight with Ajeel as Natsu and Lucy did after Jacob. Same with Lisanna. Besides, Elfman isn't Natsu, of course Natsu's fine, spriggans are dirt to him. Lisanna being fine is a much bigger issue.

Gray was fucking up Invel with just his fists, no demon form, no ice, still did great damage, Mirajane doing the same to Jacob is fine, in fact their fights mirror each other in a way, after kicking the shit out of their opponent with their fists for a bit, they finished them off with a spell. Does that make Invel and Jacob weak? Well... yeah, because pretty much all spriggans are fodder, but that don't mean they're losing to Lucy tiers. Besides, even if I took the anime as canon, that still doesn't really mean anything. For all we know Mira went in and out of Sitri for a single punch like she did with Satan Soul and kept alternating like that to conserve power. Lots of things could've happened in that fight. Not that it really matters, because I'd take exhausted Mirajane over Lucy any day. She's at a level that she can no-sell Star Dress Mix, they're not comparable in strength.

 

[Celestial Spirit Queen Lu]

About how believing Yokai Lucy was significant yet wasn’t, that was referring to another person, don‘t know why you were taking his place. https://v2.mangapark.net/manga/fairy-tail/i1628868/21 That is still not impressive considering that he did not even oneshot Ajeel who was outside FT guild hall, and they are on the same level. Magic based on one’s physical capacity too whether it is attack or durability, just like how Natsu and Wendy without any access to Magic did not even defeat a single fodder soldier in Edolas, it did with Jacob as he was not in best condition to concentrate so he can’t focus his magic, using Axiomus point again, he did bump into a tree, that only proves how powerful enchantments are compared to the standard elite wizard, she is no dumb when it comes to powersful spells cast, yet she did it, and that is that. I do listen, you are simply to stubborn to acknowledge other points. Episode 105, around -7:49, yet she knows she is a Demon nonetheless and that e basically grouped all demons together indiscriminately, that is the point, she makes an assumption with no canon confirmation, Etherious are harder than most, I don’t know how that is relevant here. The fact that she lets her spirits still exist instead of destroying outright is sign she does hold back.

My bad sorry.

Ok and? That doesn't mean anything. And I literally still don't see how closing your eyes lowers your MP in the same way that losing your magic does. Jacob still got oneshotted and that means Jacob has worse durability than Ajeel so again I still don't see what you're trying to prove.

Send the proof.

Dude I give up here. Arguing with you is like a brick wall. I can literally spell out the fact that she couldn't handle them in Base SS which is why she transformed yet you still continue to argue otherwise.

I'm not continuing to argue with someone who doesn't listen.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 29, 2021, Original Post Date: Sep 29, 2021 ---

Send scans of Jacob coming back this arc kicking the shit out of Lucy lmao? Sure, I'll get right on that. That said, it's not like I need them, because current Lucy doesn't scale above Base Natsu from Alvarez.

Again Base Natsu was holding back in the guild hall. And I never said that too.

It's like you're purposely putting words in my mouth that I have zero recollection of saying.

 

[Seven777]

Again Base Natsu was holding back in the guild hall. And I never said that too.

It's like you're purposely putting words in my mouth that I have zero recollection of saying.

So? He literally punched Zeref in the face the same way he was punching Jacob, should I start comparing current Lucy to Base Zeref?

You asked me to send scans of Jacob kicking the shit out of current Lucy lmao. If you don't want words put in your mouth, stop making statements that obviously suggest what you don't mean.

 

[WoWfan]

Lu, Closing your eyes does hamper your fighting capabilities via mental concentration, because you focus your magic to your stats, Jacob was stated to be nerfed serval times already, yet Ajeel was stated to be below other Spriggans despite being in the same area of strength, so that is wrong. What proof? She couldn’t handle them because they were Irene’s enchantments, not average wizards like members of the Spriggan squads, you have to know that by now, yet you reply so you do continue, unless you actually don’t.

 

[Lucy>Wendy&Elfman]

Lucy mid/high-diffs, and that's being generous. Horologium counters Transport. Loke counters Stealth.

She can summon three spirits and overwhelm him by switching around Star Dresses.

Y'all can argue that Jacob was overwhelming Base Natsu and Lucy but should I recall you that Lucy stayed in Leo Star Dress the whole fight (she only kicked Jacob with Taurus Form at the beginning and nullified his magic at the end with Gemini Form) and that Natsu was literally in his Base Form. They both didn't even tried during this fight.

While Star Dress Mix might not be able to take him down, combo attacks between spirits should be more powerful (Star Dress Mix being only a part on both spirits' power) and do at least 2x more damage.

She can send two of her spirits fight Jacob, including Loke to counter Stealth while she chants Urano Metria with Gemini to clap the sh*t out of Jacob.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 21, 2021, Original Post Date: Dec 21, 2021 ---

Anyway, most of Lucy's outfit are enough to defeat Jacob quickly.

 

[WoWfan]

Yet Jacob can make quick work of Loke with his invisible weapons and energy attacks, and he tanked Taurus dress which is her superstrength form from behind with no relative damage, Gemini is only useful if it has Marin Hollow, otherwise it is useless. And even her Loke dress did not even counter his stealth before. And he is capable of fighting multiple people at once.

 

[Lucy>Wendy&Elfman]

Lucy whoops Jacob's ass

 

[WoWfan]

sorry, still don't see how Lucy can win, when even a spell that has the power from the light of the sun, moon and stars has less damage than that of Jacob's own attacks.