Politics Kosovo recognized as Independent

miyi

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I'm not sure if any has been paying attention, but Kosovo declared independence this Sunday from Serbia, and they are being internationally recognized by Western states, with the exception of Russia, and a few others..(full story here).

For some background history on Kosovo, see here.

This is certainly good news, although currently there are Serbian protests going on that appears to be creating tensions, but so far it's within reasonable control of international peacekeeping forces assigned in the area.

Your thoughts..
 

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I did know this and I'm kinda nervous for Kosovo's sake. This is not going to make their neighbors happy.
 

miyi

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^yeah...a few days ago a U.S. embassy was burned in riot protests...overall the Serbs held a peaceful rally, with the exception of only a few isolated incidents that turned violent...I believe only one person died in these rallies, although at least 200 people were injured, mostly the rioters themselves and the riot police.

Serbian authorities are discouraging violence, so that's good news. Hopefully these tensions dissipate soon, so that a peaceful transition to democracy in Kosovo materializes.



Recommended readings, for those not aware about the Albanian "ethnic cleansing" (and genocide) that occured in Kosovo about a decade ago:

Ethnic cleansing in Kosovo - rape used as weapons of war, from Human Rights Watch
Ethnic Cleansing in Kosovo: An Account, from the Department of State, USA
 
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'Rape as a weapon' - disgusting. :s
 

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It's great that Kosovo can be its own country now after the atrocities that were committed years ago, but concerning that some countries - including my own, Canada - haven't yet recognized it as a nation. There are worries that Kosovo will become an example to other separatist groups around the world (even though most of those separatists have never experienced "ethnic cleansing"), which doesn't seem like a good excuse to justify the lack of support for Kosovo. It's also... unfortunate... that Russia seems to be putting pressure on countries not to support Kosovo; Russia does have some power nowadays, particularly since it's a source of oil, and who knows what they could resort to. :/

Well, if Serbia is trying to keep things peaceful, that's a good sign. If only they were alone in their lack of support for Kosovo...
 

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Yeh it's great, fantastic news for all the separatists around the world. Kosovo was created in breach of International Law. It's astonishing to see a country (guess which one) can easily ignore UN resolution 1244, interfere and separate a part of another country.
I'm fairly certain that if Mexicans achieved a majority in Texas and the UN and the EU awarded Texas independence that the US as a whole would be understandably upset. Or perhaps it's their right according to this logic.
 

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Yeh it's great, fantastic news for all the separatists around the world. Kosovo was created in breach of International Law. It's astonishing to see a country (guess which one) can easily ignore UN resolution 1244, interfere and separate a part of another country.
I'm fairly certain that if Mexicans achieved a majority in Texas and the UN and the EU awarded Texas independence that the US as a whole would be understandably upset. Or perhaps it's their right according to this logic.
The difference is that those Mexicans haven't been subjected to genocide. That's the argument for Kosovo's separation, after all. Besides, they weren't given the opportunity to secede even when the majority of Kosovars desired it. That isn't the case in most western societies with separatist groups: the Quebecois, for example, have been given the opportunity to vote for secession from Canada multiple times in the past and have chosen not to do so. I don't think the creation of Kosovo truly counts as a victory for all separatist groups since most of them were created - and their people live - under very different circumstances.
 

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let me bring some european idea to the discussion my friends :D

the independence of kosova is a MUST for europe...it is not considered as good or bad but a thing must be accomplished through time..why??

it was europe, french revolution, who spread the "sickness" called racism, (radical) nationalism etc. ideas to world and ironically it was europe who suffered from that sickness a lot more than rest of world. world wars, indepence wars etc.... but after world war 2, europe decided to heal itself with a drug which is called European Union, ignoring borders, giving european-citizenship, work permit and some rules above all rules of single countries, united army and so on...

the independence of kosova is about racism, ethnic cleaning, it is not like a country wants to be independent, under invasion...so kosova is a mind war for europe's ideals, something wanted to be achieved..thats why almost every eu country recognized kosova as a country as soon as possible...unfortunately things are not so easy in world as we all know :D
 
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miyi

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The difference is that those Mexicans haven't been subjected to genocide. That's the argument for Kosovo's separation, after all.
I support Kosovo's independence, and mainly for ideological reasons, mainly due to the genocide and ethnic cleansing that occured, and also with my habit of adhering to the principles of "freedom" and "democracy", which I sometimes think is the cure to most ills. While this is not always true (i.e. in Vietnam, democracy ultimately failed), I tend to think that it might work for Kosovo.

To be fair, Americans acquired the North American territory over the indigenous people through some form of genocide. But I would also argue that genocide was equally committed by the native people against the American colonists, and so the crime went both ways. Nobody is perfect, not even the Americans. The surviving indigenous population, including the Mexicans, have largely over the years grown to accept what has happened, and we have reconciled. We live in relative peace ever since, and are both sovereign nations engaging in free trade. If Mexican Texans, hypothetically, were to desire secession and independence today, surely we will be upset over it, as would the natural reaction be in that situation. But that scenario is not even remotely close to happening today.


walkie said:
let me bring some european idea to the discussion my friends

the independence of kosova is a MUST for europe...it is not considered as good or bad but a thing must be accomplished through time..why??

it was europe, french revolution, who spread the "sickness" called racism, (radical) nationalism etc. ideas to world and ironically it was europe who suffered from that sickness a lot more than rest of world. world wars, indepence wars etc.... but after world war 2, europe decided to heal itself with a drug which is called European Union, ignoring borders, giving european-citizenship, work permit and some rules above all rules of single countries, united army and so on...

the independence of kosova is about racism, ethnic cleaning, it is not like a country wants to be independent, under invasion...so kosova is a mind war for europe's ideals, something wanted to be achieved..thats why almost every eu country recognized kosova as a country as soon as possible...unfortunately things are not so easy in world as we all know
I never actually looked at it that way...you're right, the French Revolution brought about the idea of "nationalism" which promotes the idea of separatism....however, I think racism was an unintended consequence of this revolution....I'd argue that racism existed even before the French Revolution.

In addition, I think the French Revolution in a way heightened racism and gave it new meaning in a more tangible, nationalistic way of looking at things.

So the ideals of "independence" and "democracy" truly is a double edged sword, which is why I always admit that it has it's flaws, and is not always guaranteed to work, and in some cases, have brought more harm than good. But with Kosovo, they have a legitimate reason for wanting to secede and become independent, and that is to become free from Serbian opression.
 

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let me bring some european idea to the discussion my friends :D

the independence of kosova is a MUST for europe...it is not considered as good or bad but a thing must be accomplished through time..why??

it was europe, french revolution, who spread the "sickness" called racism, (radical) nationalism etc. ideas to world and ironically it was europe who suffered from that sickness a lot more than rest of world. world wars, indepence wars etc.... but after world war 2, europe decided to heal itself with a drug which is called European Union, ignoring borders, giving european-citizenship, work permit and some rules above all rules of single countries, united army and so on...

the independence of kosova is about racism, ethnic cleaning, it is not like a country wants to be independent, under invasion...so kosova is a mind war for europe's ideals, something wanted to be achieved..thats why almost every eu country recognized kosova as a country as soon as possible...unfortunately things are not so easy in world as we all know :D
Look who's talking. Well it is very telling for Kosovo's future that one of their most ardent defenders, namely Turkey, 2 days ago marched with total impunity into Iraq to destroy the Kurdish insurrection in order to stop the Kurdish from seceding. The rest of your argument is just blah. You have to realize that Kosovo precedent will ultimately apply to Turkey as well.

Today Kosovo, tomorrow Kurdistan.
 

miyi

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Look who's talking. Well it is very telling for Kosovo's future that one of their most ardent defenders, namely Turkey, 2 days ago marched with total impunity into Iraq to destroy the Kurdish insurrection in order to stop the Kurdish from seceding. The rest of your argument is just blah. You have to realize that Kosovo precedent will ultimately apply to Turkey as well.

Today Kosovo, tomorrow Kurdistan.
again you attack people individually instead of making a proper argument.


For those who don't know, earlier this week, Turkey decided to deploy it's troops on their southeastern border crossing northwest Iraq, fighting the PKK in an attempt to take on these rebel militias head on (see here). The PKK, the Kurdish rebel guerilla forces, are internationally recognized (mostly by the US and EU), as a terrorist organization. These Kurdish militia are a separatist movement fighting for independence for years, but unfortunately they've engaged in terror tactics to obtain this goal.

The problem with this is that Turkey have crossed the border of Iraq and ignored Iraq's sovereignty, and they are now being asked by the USA and Iraq to return to Turkey as soon as possible, and being urged to resolve this diplomatically, rather than by war.

In relevance to the topic, I would argue that the Kosovar people are seceding without engaging in terror. If the Kurdish militia would put down their arms, I think they'd have a better shot at independence, as this would not alienate them the respect of the international people.
 
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again you attack people individually instead of making a proper argument.


For those who don't know, earlier this week, Turkey decided to deploy it's troops on their southeastern border crossing northwest Iraq, fighting the PKK in an attempt to take on these rebel militias head on (see here). The PKK, the Kurdish rebel guerilla forces, are internationally recognized (mostly by the US and EU), as a terrorist organization. These Kurdish militia are a separatist movement fighting for independence for years, but unfortunately they've engaged in terror tactics to obtain this goal.

The problem with this is that Turkey have crossed the border of Iraq and ignored Iraq's sovereignty, and they are now being asked by the USA and Iraq to return to Turkey as soon as possible, and being urged to resolve this diplomatically, rather than by war.
You never fail to keep quiet write about things you don't have a clue about, do you?
Originally I wanted to answer his reply by saying Turkey is not part of Europe, never was and never will be but I thought that might hurt his feelings so I stopped short of that.
Instead of going to Google finding links and giving me some article about the story (I don't know perhaps to show you know something about what you're talking about) to back up your views go read, ask, and research their backgrounds.

I rather talk about this issue with someone who knows what he's talking about, namely the guy from Turkey. Don't come back with another reply until you learn what exactly is going on over there rather than coming up with “they are terrorists” argument. I don't have time to educate you here.
 
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walkie

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Originally I wanted to answer his reply by saying Turkey is not part of Europe, never was and never will be but I thought that might hurt his feelings so I stopped short of that.
first of all this not hurt my feelings because we hear that already from some people..then again those people should answer that; if turkey is not related to europe than where is it? in asia?? well unfortunately not true either, whether people see it or not, turkish people in europes history for centuries,
we do not belong to europe completely and do not belong to asia completely either, we have cultural, historical relations with both sides, i never say we are europeans and never say we are asians or middle-easterns, because for centuries we lived in the middle become something that have both eu and asia sides... but the christian-eu ideals doesnt want to see that turkish people were&are related to europe in most points...

Look who's talking. Well it is very telling for Kosovo's future that one of their most ardent defenders, namely Turkey, 2 days ago marched with total impunity into Iraq to destroy the Kurdish insurrection in order to stop the Kurdish from seceding. The rest of your argument is just blah. You have to realize that Kosovo precedent will ultimately apply to Turkey as well.

Today Kosovo, tomorrow Kurdistan.
first: this is not first time our army went into iraq.....we did it before and doing again...first time we were in there, everybody, eu and usa, thinking that turkey will not leave north iraq because it has oil, but we did leave, because we were there to hunt down terrorist leaders, and again we will leave ,no worry...

second: if usa has right to attack any country who has relations with terrorits, for example ladin, than turkey also has right to do it...and believe me unlike usa, we are not in iraq for oil, just watch, in 1-2 months turkey will withdraw its army..pkk was directly saying "be prepare for a bloody summer", who wants to allow that??

third: kurdish people are rebelling??? this is something very questionable if you come to turkey..i have too many kurdish friends and all of them doesnt recognize pkk as an rebellion army, of course there may some of them do ,but kurdistan idea is very new idea, and may be some day it may come true, although it will have no direct connections with pkk...pkk is an internationally recognized terrorist group remember that.

fourthly: to be honest i do believe kosova stuff will apply to south-east turkey, may be called as kurdistan, a new country, but it will be like slovakia and czech republic, or like belgium or spain(who are considering about seperation), no direct wars but diplomacy and voting....if we want to stop kurdish rebellion, instead of killing some kurdish in iraq we must do some ethnic cleaning in south-east turkey right?? otherwise there is no way stopping it,isnt it?
 
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miyi

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You never fail to keep quiet write about things you don't have a clue about, do you?
Originally I wanted to answer his reply by saying Turkey is not part of Europe, never was and never will be but I thought that might hurt his feelings so I stopped short of that.
Instead of going to Google finding links and giving me some article about the story (I don't know perhaps to show you know something about what you're talking about) to back up your views go read, ask, and research their backgrounds.

I rather talk about this issue with someone who knows what he's talking about, namely the guy from Turkey. Don't come back with another reply until you learn what exactly is going on over there rather than coming up with “they are terrorists” argument. I don't have time to educate you here.

PKK have conducted terror acts, and is well documented. They don't discriminate between innocents.

I will not resort to your internet bullying, but here are the information you seek.

Source:
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1046.html

SAFETY AND SECURITY: Terrorist bombings over the past five years – some causing significant numbers of casualties – have struck religious, government, government-owned, political, tourist and business targets in a variety of locations in Turkey. The possibility of terrorist attacks, both transnational and indigenous, remains high.

In June 2004 the PKK/KADEK/Kongra-Gel announced an end to their “unilateral ceasefire” and resumed violent activities. This indigenous terrorist group continues to target Turkish officials and various civilian facilities and may use terrorist activity to make political statements. U.S. and Western interests have been targeted as well. Al Qaida-affiliated terrorists were responsible for suicide bombings in Istanbul in 2003 that targeted Western interests. In August 2005 Turkish police uncovered a planned terrorist attack by a transnational group targeting maritime interests in Turkey.

There have been several recent instances of violence against Christians, including the shooting of a Catholic priest in Trabzon in February 2006 and the murder of three Christians, one of them a German citizen, in a Bible bookstore in Malatya in April 2007.

Due to the tense military situation on the border with Iraq, the Turkish General Staff has declared portions of the provinces of Sirnak, Hakkari, and Siirt as “sensitive areas” for the period June 9 to December 10, 2007.
Istanbul: In November 2003 al Qaida-affiliated suicide bombers blew up the British Consulate, the HSBC Bank, and two synagogues, killing dozens and wounding hundreds of people. These incidents represent a significant change from prior attacks in Turkey and show an increased willingness on the part of terrorists to attack Western targets. As indicated in the State Department’s Worldwide Caution Travel Alert, it is possible that transnational terrorist attacks can occur without warning.

On April 8, 2007, Turkish police captured a PKK terrorist in Istanbul’s much-touristed Taksim Square. She was intercepted carrying a bomb made of five-kilograms of A-4 explosive. Her intended target was that day’s celebration in the square of the founding of the Turkish police.

Small-scale bombings and violent demonstrations have occurred regularly throughout 2006 and 2007. Most, but not all, of these incidents have happened in neighborhoods not generally frequented by tourists. PKK/KADEK/Kongra-Gel supporters, on a number of occasions, have set public buses on fire after ordering passengers to disembark. On April 3, 2006, an attack of this type resulted in three deaths and at least one severe wounding. Thus far, no attacks on buses have taken place in tourist areas of the city.
Mediterranean/Aegean Regions: Indigenous and transnational terrorist groups continue to target Turkish as well as U.S. and Western interests. The Kurdistan Liberation Hawks (TAK) ostensibly aligned with PKK terrorists, claimed responsibility for a number of bombings in tourist areas in the Mediterranean and Aegean coastal resorts areas (as well as in Istanbul). This group has warned tourists not to visit Turkey. Consistent with its threats, this group claimed responsibility for a bomb that ripped through a minibus in the holiday resort town of Kusadasi, killing five persons, including a British tourist and an Irish tourist in July 2005. The group also was responsible for an explosion that killed three European tourists in Manavgat, a town in Antalya Province, as well as other attacks in the Antalya and Mugla Provinces in June 2006. Ten Britons and six Turks were injured when their minibus was blown up in Marmaris, and a bomb killed three and injured 87 in a blast at a shopping area in the city of Antalya in late August 2006. Further attacks by this group could take place without warning.

Southeastern Provinces (including Adana):

The PKK/KADEK/Kongra-Gel terrorist group retains a presence in certain parts of southeastern Turkey . PKK/KADEK/ Kongra-Gel activity continues to increase in much of the region. Travel is becoming increasingly difficult and dangerous. Americans traveling in southeastern Turkey should exercise caution.

Roadside explosions caused by remote-controlled land mines or other improvised explosive devices in the Batman, Sirnak, Hakkari, Siirt, Mardin, Diyarbakir and Tunceli provinces occur regularly. Sound bombs are a frequent event throughout the region. There have also been a number of PKK/KADEK/Kongra-Gel raids on Jandarma posts and ambushes of Turkish security force vehicle patrols in rural areas in many southeastern Turkey provinces. In 2005, the PKK/KADEK/Kongra-Gel attacked two trains and kidnapped two Turkish government employees in the region. Regional civil unrest that began in late March 2006 prompted clashes involving Turkish security forces and protestors and left approximately a dozen killed and several hundred wounded. On August 25, 2006 two bombs exploded in Adana, injuring four people. On September 12 a bomb detonated in the city of Diyarbakir, killing ten and injuring 15 Turkish nationals.

Visitors to southeastern Turkey should use commercial air travel whenever possible. If road travel is necessary, travelers are advised to drive only during daylight hours and on major highways. The Turkish Jandarma and police forces monitor checkpoints on roads throughout the southeastern region. Travelers should be cooperative if stopped at any checkpoint. Drivers and all passengers in the vehicle should be prepared to provide identification cards or passports, a driver’s license and vehicle registration if stopped. At these check points, roll down the driver’s side window (passenger side, also, in vehicles with tinted windows) when stopped by security force officials. Security forces can then safely inspect the vehicle and its occupants. Remain calm, do not make any sudden movements, and obey all instructions immediately. Security officials may restrict access to some roads at times, and security force escort vehicles may be required to “convoy” visitors through troublesome areas. In some cases, this must be arranged in advance. Use of public transportation, at any time, is strongly discouraged.

Travelers are cautioned not to accept letters, parcels, or other items from strangers for delivery either in or outside of Turkey. PKK/KADEK/Kongra-Gel has attempted to use foreigners to deliver messages and packages in or outside of Turkey. If discovered, individuals could be arrested for aiding and abetting the terrorist organization – a serious charge.

Department of State personnel are subject to travel restrictions in the provinces of Sirnak, Diyarbakir, Van, Siirt, Mus, Mardin, Batman, Bingol, Tunceli, Hakkari, Bitlis, and Elazig. U.S. military and Department of Defense civilians should consult their local area commander regarding any restrictions in effect for southeastern Turkey. Mount Ararat, in the Agri province, is a special military zone and access permission must be obtained from the Turkish government through Turkish embassies or consulates before coming to Turkey.
More background Information on PKK:

Source:
http://www.fas.org/irp/world/para/docs/mfa-t-pkk.htm

A Report on the PKK and Terrorism

Turkey is situated in the center of an area characterized by unpredictable radical changes. She has also been one of the prime targets of international terrorism in the past decades. First it was the ASALA (Armenian Secret Army for the Liberation of Armenia), claiming the lives of innocent diplomats and their families. Ironically, as ASALA terrorism subsided, PKK terrorism accelerated. At present PKK, with its Marxist-Leninist ideology and violent methods, continues to be a menace detrimental to the promotion of democratic way of living in the region.

In the annual report of the U.S. State Department published in April 1993 under the title of "Patterns of Global Terrorism" the PKK is described as a "Marxist Leninist terrorist group composed of Turkish Kurds seeking to setup a Marxist state in Southeastern Turkey"

The PKK is recognized and classified as a terrorist organization by all Western countries including the European Parliament and the Council of Europe. France and Germany, recently, banned the activities of this terror group and other West European governments, are closely monitoring the situation.

Since 1984, indiscriminate violence and terror waged by the PKK have claimed, thousands of lives. Women children and the old were not spared. People were murdered before their family members or kidnapped and summarily executed.
Turkey is situated in the center of an area characterized by unpredictable radical changes. She has also been one of the prime targets of international terrorism in the past decades. First it was the ASALA (Armenian Secret Army for the Liberation of Armenia), claiming the lives of innocent diplomats and their families. Ironically, as ASALA terrorism subsided, PKK terrorism accelerated. At present PKK, with its Marxist-Leninist ideology and violent methods, continues to be a menace detrimental to the promotion of democratic way of living in the region.

In the annual report of the U.S. State Department published in April 1993 under the title of "Patterns of Global Terrorism" the PKK is described as a "Marxist Leninist terrorist group composed of Turkish Kurds seeking to setup a Marxist state in Southeastern Turkey"

The PKK is recognized and classified as a terrorist organization by all Western countries including the European Parliament and the Council of Europe. France and Germany, recently, banned the activities of this terror group and other West European governments, are closely monitoring the situation.

Since 1984, indiscriminate violence and terror waged by the PKK have claimed, thousands of lives. Women children and the old were not spared. People were murdered before their family members or kidnapped and summarily executed.

O R I G I N S

The PKK's origins can be traced back to 1974, when Öcalan, in Ankara, led a small group of radicals out of Revolutionary Youth (DEV-GENÇ). The Kurdistan Workers Party, "Partiya Karkeren Kurdistan" (PKK) was established in 1978. Öcalan, the leader of the organization took refuge in Syria, after 1980, following the efficient struggle against such organizations by the Turkish Security Forces. The organization, whose ideology is based on Marxism-Leninism, seeks to establish an independent Kurdish state encompassing Turkey's southeastern provinces.


walkie said:
third: kurdish people are rebelling??? this is something very questionable if you come to turkey..i have too many kurdish friends and all of them doesnt recognize pkk as an rebellion army, of course there may some of them do ,but kurdistan idea is very new idea, and may be some day it may come true, although it will have no direct connections with pkk...pkk is an internationally recognized terrorist group remember that.

fourthly: to be honest i do believe kosova stuff will apply to south-east turkey, may be called as kurdistan, a new country, but it will be like slovakia and czech republic, or like belgium or spain(who are considering about seperation), no direct wars but diplomacy and voting....if we want to stop kurdish rebellion, instead of killing some kurdish in iraq we must do some ethnic cleaning in south-east turkey right?? otherwise there is no way stopping it,isnt it?
Yeah, personally I don't have any problems about peaceful Kurdish making peaceful protests and desiring independence (which btw is what the Kosovar people have done, via peaceful means of secession). The PKK on the other hand is a different case, and I can understand why Turkey is putting down their rebellion through military means, and I'm not totally against that.
 
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Athena?

Stop attacking others here. Doesn't matter what the topic is, keep your posts conversational and more friendly, or you're not wanted here. Thanks.
 

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hmmm... after reading some of these posts i am questioning why is this a good news... if each ethics should have their own nation then for old countries such as Vietnam and China should divided into many segments due to variety of ethics...

Though, if the news was like the Native Americans wanted their own independent nation then would it then be a good news... I for once think the Native Americans suffer quite alot ... as for the ethic cleansing of Kosovo people well i guess i must educated myself more about this topic

As for rape as a weapon .. it reminded me about how in South Asian history, the Chinese try to dominate Vietnam by marrying the vietnamese women and breed more chinese ... (i only heard of this and i am not positive of this is true)
 

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It's good news, and bad news. It's good news in the sense that Kosovo deserves their independence, because they've suffered a lot. Bad news in the sense that this will encourage other separatist movements throughout the world, who will no doubt use this event as an opportunity to express their desire for independence, as well. This, obviously, is a threat to those countries who wants to keep these separatist groups from succeeding in their goals.

And yes, I admit, the USA is not exactly innocent when it comes to war crimes. It would be hypocritical..

just to name a few examples:

- the bombings in Hiroshima and Nagasaki
- under Lyndon B. Johnson and Richard Nixon during the Vietnam War, they've secretly ordered the bombings of Laos and Cambodia, respectively, which killed innocent lives.

At one way or another, each country has been guilty of something, and the USA is not an exception. Foreign policy is nasty, dirty, and is hardly based on morals.....the primary intent of foreign policy is to secure national self-interests, sometimes at the expense of morality.

In World War I, Ottoman Turkey, under the orders of the Committee of Union and Progress (CUP), otherwise known as the "Young turks", in 1915, rounded up Armenians and executed them at gunpoint. While it can be argued that the Armenians were cooperating with the enemy of Turkey (the Russians in the north east), the counter-argument is that it's an intended genocide. To this day, Turkey has denied this event.

One of the premises of why most Western countries are supporting Kosovo's independence is the fact that they've suffered genocide and they deserve to become independent. But in context, it's actually much more complicated.

I'm using Turkey and USA as an example because some of the posters above, including myself, were apparently in disagreement of some of the issues, and it needs clarifying.

In light of what has happened during World War I, and President Woodrow Wilson's "Fourteen Points", in which he argued and supported for national "self-determination", the notion of "nationalism" virtually spread like wildfire. Soon, a lot of separatist movement throughout the world were aiming at declaring independence.

And given the fact that Turkey and the USA is not exactly innocent when it comes to war crimes, the idea that we are supporting Kosovo, may seem to some people, as hypocritical, and that's a legitimate argument.

Turkey today, still has some unresolved issues between them and the Armenian people. And much more recently, they are involved in putting down the PKK Kurdish rebel forces (not to be confused with the non-separatist Kurdish general population, of whom does not identify or recognize the PKK movement).

Likewise, the USA still has a lot of unresolved issues, as well....but slowly we are trying to make things better.

And just because Turkey and the USA have these unresolved issues in the past should not preclude us from supporting Kosovo.

All countries have been guilty of some things in the past, and that is a fact about foreign politics. We have a choice: we can repent all we want, or we can do something about it, by learning from the mistakes and making our future dealings with other countries more moral and just. And I think now that we have international laws put in place to prevent further crimes to humanity, things will only get better.
 
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abu_89

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Kosovo's independence is a dangerous precedent for separatist movement everywhere. A nation's sovereignty is only strong when united. If groups could declare independence out of the blue to form their own countries, our society would collapse.

No, this is too dangerous a precedence to set. Kosovo's independence should not be recognized.
 

Vampire_Fanatic

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i agree with you, this is just going to upset the balance in the unstable region of europe, and if people start to recognize this state, why dont they recognize Kurdistan?......makes me wonder
 
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