Fantasy Kyria vs Hades

[Orphan Prince]

Kyria

Vs

Hades

Conditions
Hades and Kyria are bloodlusted
Hades does not have access to his Devil's Heart

Restrictions
Blade Hypnosis

Intent
To kill

Location
Hades ship

Distance
40 feet​

 

[Jko]

Kiria took a couple punches from a healthy Laxus. Hades was fodderized in a single hit from an almost dead Laxus. Therefore Kiria should most likely obliterate Pretch.

 

[Ramen]

Kyria's defenses are much better as per my guy @Jko explained. Her offense is also much better.

 

[Hexbend]

Kyria stomps

 

[Ramen]

@Orphan Prince My guy, you resurrected the Domas Flau but this is kinda spite yk.

 

[grey matter]

It's base Hades here, Base Hades should lose this one, but it won't be some stomp. I would say Kyria wins mid-high diff here. Let me explain why.

On pure stats, base Hades is at a level where he can mid diff healthy Makarov. So, Hades scale to a level above whatever Makarov has going for him.

Natsu needed to use FDK punch to one shot crippled Makarov (possessed), and claimed that Makarov used to be much stronger.
Now, we can't use this to conclusively claim that FDK punch wouldn't have one shotted healthy Makarov, though it is certainly a possibly. BUT, this does conclusively show us that Natsu will face serious challenge and may not even be able to beat healthy Makarov, if FDK is restricted.

Natsu (no FDK) vs Kyria won't be a stomp, if you can accept this, then it should scale to Makarov and Hades as well.

Now, for the Historia fight with Laxus:
- Laxus was way more serious and angry here, while he was casual as he can get against Kyria. It should more than make up for tiredness.
- historia Hades may not be full power Hades. We know that when Neinhart summons multiple Historia, the strong ones are nerfed

 

[Ramen]

It's base Hades here, Base Hades should lose this one, but it won't be some stomp. I would say Kyria wins mid-high diff here. Let me explain why.

On pure stats, base Hades is at a level where he can mid diff healthy Makarov. So, Hades scale to a level above whatever Makarov has going for him.

Natsu needed to use FDK punch to one shot crippled Makarov (possessed), and claimed that Makarov used to be much stronger.
Now, we can't use this to conclusively claim that FDK punch wouldn't have one shotted healthy Makarov, though it is certainly a possibly. BUT, this does conclusively show us that Natsu will face serious challenge and may not even be able to beat healthy Makarov, if FDK is restricted.

Natsu (no FDK) vs Kyria won't be a stomp, if you can accept this, then it should scale to Makarov and Hades as well.

Now, for the Historia fight with Laxus:
- Laxus was way more serious and angry here, while he was casual as he can get against Kyria. It should more than make up for tiredness.
- historia Hades may not be full power Hades. We know that when Neinhart summons multiple Historia, the strong ones are nerfed

I don't see how this proves he doesn't get stomped. Hades is old news now lol.

 

[grey matter]

I don't see how this proves he doesn't get stomped. Hades is old news now lol.

I kinda did.

Makarov won't get stomped by Natsu unless he used FDK attacks. From Natsu's own words, we can see that healthy Makarov would give Natsu (no FDK) serious challenge. Hades scale above Makarov.

Natsu (no FDK) isn't gonna get stomped by Kyria, so will healthy Makarov and base Hades

What if he is old news? I don't consider power creep as big of a deal as you do. Apart from what I mentioned above, regarding Makarov and Natsu:
- 3 old news characters managed to comfortably defeat Erza in a 3 v 1 (yes, they tell she was not 100% and all, but she then went onto give Eileen a run for her money while being more injured than when she faced Neinhart).
- Ul managed to give base Gray difficulty. Gray had to use one of his strongest spells, along with Lyon's to beat her.
- Makarov is still treated as a baseline to show characters as strong (Brandish's intro in the spinoff was something along the lines of - "Inspite of how she looks, she is a mage whose magic power exceeds even Makarov's")

 

[Ramen]

I kinda did.

Makarov won't get stomped by Natsu unless he used FDK attacks. From Natsu's own words, we can see that healthy Makarov would give Natsu (no FDK) serious challenge. Hades scale above Makarov.

Natsu (no FDK) isn't gonna get stomped by Kyria, so will healthy Makarov and base Hades

What if he is old news? I don't consider power creep as big of a deal as you do. Apart from what I mentioned above, regarding Makarov and Natsu:
- 3 old news characters managed to comfortably defeat Erza in a 3 v 1 (yes, they tell she was not 100% and all, but she then went onto give Eileen a run for her money while being more injured than when she faced Neinhart).
- Ul managed to give base Gray difficulty. Gray had to use one of his strongest spells, along with Lyon's to beat her.
- Makarov is still treated as a baseline to show characters as strong (Brandish's intro in the spinoff was something along the lines of - "Inspite of how she looks, she is a mage whose magic power exceeds even Makarov's")

The same Kyria that is relative to Erza in offensive power is stomping Hades.

It's a matter of when you'll accept that power creeps are an actual thing. All past enemies get surpassed.

Base Natsu is above Makarov and Hades lol. How you interpreted Natsu wanting to end things quickly as "needing FDK" is a mystery.

 

[grey matter]

The same Kyria that is relative to Erza in offensive power is stomping Hades.

It's a matter of when you'll accept that power creeps are an actual thing. All past enemies get surpassed.

Base Natsu is above Makarov and Hades lol. How you interpreted Natsu wanting to end things quickly as "needing FDK" is a mystery.

I'm really confused about this Kyria stuff tbh. In the beginning, I believed she would've given Erza a high diff even without her mind control hax. But then, she goes onto get no-low diff'd by Laxus, who in turn extreme diff'd Erza.
Is it a ret'conn, or is it the boosts that Erza received from dragon seal + Natsu/Gray enchantments that high? If it's the latter, then that would mean Laxus is so far ahead of Erza w/o dragon seal + Natsu/Gray swords, that she would be low diff'd by him. Something seems really fishy here, I suppose it's just typical Mashima making fights as he wants without thinking too much.
(Check this out also, Elfman managed to injured Madmole, even tho Madmole didn't even get a scratch from Natsu's FDK punch. Natsu needed HEAT to injure Madmole. And as far as we know, Elfman is pure physical. Are we supposed to believe that Elfman can hit harder than FDK Natsu? I doubt he can hit even as hard as Natsu w/o FDK)

It's more of a pattern, from what I see. The mini bosses of current arc > mini bosses of previous arcs. Main Bosses of current arc > main boss of previous arc. But main boss of previous arc and mini boss of current arc? Not necessarily true. Acno is probably never gonna get surpassed and is the exception.
But apart from Acno itself, there is Zeref who is still unsurpassed by any non dragon villain. August and Eileen aren't surpassed so far either.
The dragon eaters shown so far would lose to most Spriggans. This would likely change when black DE come up, but still.....
And if we check out arc that came before as well. Jose, TOH Jellol and Fantasia Festival Laxus would beat any mini boss until Tatarus arc IMO.

Not really. Natsu (no FDK) was struggling against (possessed) crippled Makarov. Could he have won without FDK? Likely yeah, but it would take him considerable effort to do it. And, healthy Makarov was far superior to possessed

 

[Ramen]

I'm really confused about this Kyria stuff tbh. In the beginning, I believed she would've given Erza a high diff even without her mind control hax. But then, she goes onto get no-low diff'd by Laxus, who in turn extreme diff'd Erza.
Is it a ret'conn, or is it the boosts that Erza received from dragon seal + Natsu/Gray enchantments that high? If it's the latter, then that would mean Laxus is so far ahead of Erza w/o dragon seal + Natsu/Gray swords, that she would be low diff'd by him. Something seems really fishy here, I suppose it's just typical Mashima making fights as he wants without thinking too much.
(Check this out also, Elfman managed to injured Madmole, even tho Madmole didn't even get a scratch from Natsu's FDK punch. Natsu needed HEAT to injure Madmole. And as far as we know, Elfman is pure physical. Are we supposed to believe that Elfman can hit harder than FDK Natsu? I doubt he can hit even as hard as Natsu w/o FDK)

It's not a retcon. A retcon is when the author purposely nerfs and Mashima didn't do that. She can match Erza offensively but is outclassed everywhere else. What made Erza match Laxus was stats like endurance and such. In terms of offensive power, Laxus is far ahead.

Yes, that just means that Elfman has something stronger than a FDK Demo Fist which is Natsu's weakest FDK attack.

It's more of a pattern, from what I see. The mini bosses of current arc > mini bosses of previous arcs. Main Bosses of current arc > main boss of previous arc. But main boss of previous arc and mini boss of current arc? Not necessarily true. Acno is probably never gonna get surpassed and is the exception.
But apart from Acno itself, there is Zeref who is still unsurpassed by any non dragon villain. August and Eileen aren't surpassed so far either.
The dragon eaters shown so far would lose to most Spriggans. This would likely change when black DE come up, but still.....
And if we check out arc that came before as well. Jose, TOH Jellol and Fantasia Festival Laxus would beat any mini boss until Tatarus arc IMO.

Acno is arguably already surpassed and Zeref was never the strongest so what's the point and even then, he was surpassed for a brief moment by Natsu. Spriggans have already been surpassed. You have to wait for more enemies to show. Diabolos > Spriggans (aside from Irene and August) and who's to say anything about Georg or Suzaku.

Hades was surpassed by the next main villain which was MG who was surpassed by the Spriggans. It very much is a pattern that's working.

Not really. Natsu (no FDK) was struggling against (possessed) crippled Makarov. Could he have won without FDK? Likely yeah, but it would take him considerable effort to do it. And, healthy Makarov was far superior to possessed

He wasn't struggling, he was caught off guard. Two seconds later he literally laughs it off and ends it.

Spoiler

 

[Tirl]

And as far as we know, Elfman is pure physical

Its only my thoughts cuz manga didnt show anything, but couldnt he used his Lizard soul? It is like Madmole armor - pure defence and allows him to hurt his attacker. He matched Erza lvl opponent with it.

---------

Intopic, Hades should take it easily. I consider him spriggan tier (actually with a lot more skills and knowledge), and spriggans are far strogner than DEs.
Hades was pretty much having fun with Natsu's team (who were literally immortal on their island), Laxus and Laxused Natsu without using any heart buff. Demons said that GH was the strongest dark guild, Franmalt used Hades as his strongest soul, and I will never believe that Hades is weaker than Mard who was almost two-shot by Gray who was insanely weaker than Silver who was a bit stronger than Tempesta who was two-shot by casually walking Laxus.

One Amaterasu Formula would be enough to beat Kyria. She has good attack power, but aside of that... nothing special

 

[grey matter]

It's not a retcon. A retcon is when the author purposely nerfs and Mashima didn't do that. She can match Erza offensively but is outclassed everywhere else. What made Erza match Laxus was stats like endurance and such. In terms of offensive power, Laxus is far ahead.

Yes, that just means that Elfman has something stronger than a FDK Demo Fist which is Natsu's weakest FDK attack.



Acno is arguably already surpassed and Zeref was never the strongest so what's the point and even then, he was surpassed for a brief moment by Natsu. Spriggans have already been surpassed. You have to wait for more enemies to show. Diabolos > Spriggans (aside from Irene and August) and who's to say anything about Georg or Suzaku.

Hades was surpassed by the next main villain which was MG who was surpassed by the Spriggans. It very much is a pattern that's working.



He wasn't struggling, he was caught off guard. Two seconds later he literally laughs it off and ends it.

Spoiler

I do believe he did retcon, by your standards as well. See how the DE fared in R1 and R2.
Round 1:
- Madmole took no damage from Natsu's FDK demo fist. Natsu had to resort to heat to damage Madmole
- Kyria, without her hax, was giving Erza trouble
- It was implied that Skullion would've rekt Gray with his black ash or something
Round 2:
- Madmole stalemate with Elfman, and Elfman is only capable of physical attacks
- Kyria got no/low diff'd by Laxus
- Skullion stalemate with Mira

You say Elfman had something stronger than FDK demo fist? WTF? Demo fist is one of his strongest attack.
See FDK demo fist moves Natsu used in the main series. The final one was in DF tho, but anyway it managed to completely vapourize FH Zeref's body (point is that this is indicative of demo fist's power without his DF, but that Natsu regards it as one of his strongest moves and finisher)

Spoiler

This is Natsu's Demo fist in spin off, almost vaping an entire city:

Spoiler

You expect me to believe that Elfman, who is below base Natsu, is capable of generating an attack far superior to Natsu's FDK demo fist (yes, it has to be far superior, because Madmole comfortably tanked it, clearly Madmole's limit is far higher than Natsu's FDK attack)? Yea no, I'm not buying that.

Now, you say Kyria can match Erza in attack power. But, she failed to put even a scratch on Laxus the entire fight. Her roar also failed to put a scratch on Laxus and Jellol as well.
Either Erza would've failed to scratch Laxus as well if not for dragon seal and Natsu/Gray swords. Or it's a retcon of Kyria's powers. Because if this is the extend of Erza's attack power (w/o dragon seal and Natsu/Gray swords), then it doesn't matter if her dura is super high compared to Kyria, she still won't be able to scratch Laxus.

Mira stalemated Skullion. It was at least implied that Skullion would've low diff'd DeS Gray. I don't see Mira low diffing Gray, hell I don't see even Laxus low diffing Gray. Even Laxus would need mid diff to beat DeS mode Gray

.................................................................................

Acno isn't surpassed yet IMO.
Zeref is still the 2nd strongest human (1st being Natsu). No villain so far has surpassed him.
Hades with GH might be able to beat Mard. But it isn't the point. Mard was the main villain of the arc, I already agreed to main villains surpassing main villains, and mini villains surpassing mini villains. But mini boss surpassing main boss? Not necessarily. Hades in his base itself is GOI tier, you think he won't be Spriggan tier after jumping multiple tiers from Grimoire Heart and Devil's eye?

No, I don't think the Diabolos members we've seen so far can beat most Spriggans. For eg, do you see Kyria beating Dimaria? (so, even the trope of mini boss surpassing mini boss isn't happening here). As from Black dragon eaters and guild master, yes, I fully expect them to, but we'll see.

...................................................................................

Yes, and Natsu then claim that Makarov was way stronger. And Natsu ended it with a FDK demo fist, not some fodder spell. And like I said before, Makarov is still used as a benchmark to show characters as "strong". In Alverez arc, and in spin off. "Makarov level" hasn't become irrelevant yet.

 

[CaptainTorch]

X784 Laxus was able to give Hades a mid diff fight. The same Laxus was weaker than X784 Gildarts.

In X791 it was stated that Jura is around X784 Gildarts' strength (This same Jura was defeated by X791 Laxus).
This makes sense, given that X784 Gildarts shouldn't be too far below Hades and X791 Laxus got stronger than before, which reaffirms him being on X784 Gildarts level.

Kyria managed to fight Erza w/o enchantments the same way Ajeel did. This means that Kyria should be around Spriggan level. The level which allows a character to solo multiple characters on Jura's level (as proved by God Serena).

So we have Hades, who is a bit stronger than Jura, and Kyria who can stomp multiple Jura's. Do the math.

 

[Brandish μ]

Kyria wins, power levels have risen far too much. It took more from X793 Laxus to beat Kyria than it did for X792 near dead Laxus to beat Historia Hades.

 

[Ramen]

I do believe he did retcon, by your standards as well. See how the DE fared in R1 and R2.
Round 1:
- Madmole took no damage from Natsu's FDK demo fist. Natsu had to resort to heat to damage Madmole
- Kyria, without her hax, was giving Erza trouble
- It was implied that Skullion would've rekt Gray with his black ash or something
Round 2:
- Madmole stalemate with Elfman, and Elfman is only capable of physical attacks
- Kyria got no/low diff'd by Laxus
- Skullion stalemate with Mira

You say Elfman had something stronger than FDK demo fist? WTF? Demo fist is one of his strongest attack.
See FDK demo fist moves Natsu used in the main series. The final one was in DF tho, but anyway it managed to completely vapourize FH Zeref's body (point is that this is indicative of demo fist's power without his DF, but that Natsu regards it as one of his strongest moves and finisher)

Spoiler

This is Natsu's Demo fist in spin off, almost vaping an entire city:

Spoiler

You expect me to believe that Elfman, who is below base Natsu, is capable of generating an attack far superior to Natsu's FDK demo fist (yes, it has to be far superior, because Madmole comfortably tanked it, clearly Madmole's limit is far higher than Natsu's FDK attack)? Yea no, I'm not buying that.

Now, you say Kyria can match Erza in attack power. But, she failed to put even a scratch on Laxus the entire fight. Her roar also failed to put a scratch on Laxus and Jellol as well.
Either Erza would've failed to scratch Laxus as well if not for dragon seal and Natsu/Gray swords. Or it's a retcon of Kyria's powers. Because if this is the extend of Erza's attack power (w/o dragon seal and Natsu/Gray swords), then it doesn't matter if her dura is super high compared to Kyria, she still won't be able to scratch Laxus.

Mira stalemated Skullion. It was at least implied that Skullion would've low diff'd DeS Gray. I don't see Mira low diffing Gray, hell I don't see even Laxus low diffing Gray. Even Laxus would need mid diff to beat DeS mode Gray

Erza contended with Laxus because of her physicals. She still matched Erza offensively for a bit.

I don't know why people are irked by Elfman improving lmao. Dude was up there with Gajeel/Gray/Natsu at the beginning as a side character lol.

Acno isn't surpassed yet IMO.
Zeref is still the 2nd strongest human (1st being Natsu). No villain so far has surpassed him.
Hades with GH might be able to beat Mard. But it isn't the point. Mard was the main villain of the arc, I already agreed to main villains surpassing main villains, and mini villains surpassing mini villains. But mini boss surpassing main boss? Not necessarily. Hades in his base itself is GOI tier, you think he won't be Spriggan tier after jumping multiple tiers from Grimoire Heart and Devil's eye?

Lmao no. Any Spriggan can solo GH with him in it. They have superior feats and the power of the author.

It's all speculation right now, I think Acno is surpassed and there you go, Zeref is surpassed by Natsu.

No, I don't think the Diabolos members we've seen so far can beat most Spriggans. For eg, do you see Kyria beating Dimaria? (so, even the trope of mini boss surpassing mini boss isn't happening here). As from Black dragon eaters and guild master, yes, I fully expect them to, but we'll see.

Easily. Either hax ends or if hax is allowed, matching Erza offensively >>>> getting beat down by TO Sherria and Wendy lol.

Yes, and Natsu then claim that Makarov was way stronger. And Natsu ended it with a FDK demo fist, not some fodder spell. And like I said before, Makarov is still used as a benchmark to show characters as "strong". In Alverez arc, and in spin off. "Makarov level" hasn't become irrelevant yet.

His FDK is the weakest of the FDK attacks. The dude clearly wanted to end it quickly.

--- Double Post Merged, Dec 3, 2020, Original Post Date: Dec 3, 2020 ---

Kyria wins, power levels have risen far too much. It took more from X793 Laxus to beat Kyria than it did for X792 near dead Laxus to beat Historia Hades.

Yea pretty much this. Even if you don't believe in power creeps, 8 years is too much.

 

[Ronin31]

healthy Makarov was far superior to possessed

No. It is said that when Wraith choose a support he is related with, the magic power is far more superior of the addition of the two. And his relative with Makarov was incredible to the point he was thinking he was blood relative.

By analogy, it is the same procede to "Fusion" in Dragon Ball : when two people are relative and with same power level, they can fuse to create a new character far stronger than both, multiple times.

Natsu used FDK punch because he couldn't accept to see his gramps serving as a vassal. He unraged to push Wraith away of his body and then, managed to ko'ed titanic Makarov. If Natsu can OS a "Perfect Fusion" Makarov, he can do the same as "Karyu no Tekken" on healthy classic Makarov. Or perhaps, Goten is stronger than Gotenks and Goku is stronger than Bejito ?

Makarov was very strong until the first part of the Manga, but he is old and now weakened by his sickness. He stayed at the same level since the beginning, where the younglings have grown so far stronger. Wizards of the new Generation are far stronger than Saints Wizards of Makarov's Prime.

I think Natsu said Makarov is stronger because the fusion Makarov possessed by Wraith only used his Magic as Physical, meanwhile the prime Makarov, far below, used Magic from his Heart. It's only meaning, for me, that Makarov is far more than only a Titanic Brute. He is a Grand Father and not a violent heartless brute.


For the subject, I see Kyria around Spriggan Level (without Irene and August). Makarov and Precht were strong period, but are far below them, to the point, Makarov was clearly afraid of them.

Kyria for the win here

 

[GL_Nova]

Its only my thoughts cuz manga didnt show anything, but couldnt he used his Lizard soul? It is like Madmole armor - pure defence and allows him to hurt his attacker. He matched Erza lvl opponent with it.

---------

Intopic, Hades should take it easily. I consider him spriggan tier (actually with a lot more skills and knowledge), and spriggans are far strogner than DEs.
Hades was pretty much having fun with Natsu's team (who were literally immortal on their island), Laxus and Laxused Natsu without using any heart buff. Demons said that GH was the strongest dark guild, Franmalt used Hades as his strongest soul, and I will never believe that Hades is weaker than Mard who was almost two-shot by Gray who was insanely weaker than Silver who was a bit stronger than Tempesta who was two-shot by casually walking Laxus.

One Amaterasu Formula would be enough to beat Kyria. She has good attack power, but aside of that... nothing special

What fight did you watch bro?

Hades is no longer relevant. His Historia being relevant is no different from burn boy & the Tartarus demons being effective. Only the Spriggans were nerfed, it was a boost for everyone else.

 

[grey matter]

No. It is said that when Wraith choose a support he is related with, the magic power is far more superior of the addition of the two. And his relative with Makarov was incredible to the point he was thinking he was blood relative.

By analogy, it is the same procede to "Fusion" in Dragon Ball : when two people are relative and with same power level, they can fuse to create a new character far stronger than both, multiple times.

Natsu used FDK punch because he couldn't accept to see his gramps serving as a vassal. He unraged to push Wraith away of his body and then, managed to ko'ed titanic Makarov. If Natsu can OS a "Perfect Fusion" Makarov, he can do the same as "Karyu no Tekken" on healthy classic Makarov. Or perhaps, Goten is stronger than Gotenks and Goku is stronger than Bejito ?

Makarov was very strong until the first part of the Manga, but he is old and now weakened by his sickness. He stayed at the same level since the beginning, where the younglings have grown so far stronger. Wizards of the new Generation are far stronger than Saints Wizards of Makarov's Prime.

I think Natsu said Makarov is stronger because the fusion Makarov possessed by Wraith only used his Magic as Physical, meanwhile the prime Makarov, far below, used Magic from his Heart. It's only meaning, for me, that Makarov is far more than only a Titanic Brute. He is a Grand Father and not a violent heartless brute.


For the subject, I see Kyria around Spriggan Level (without Irene and August). Makarov and Precht were strong period, but are far below them, to the point, Makarov was clearly afraid of them.

Kyria for the win here

I didn't say Kyria wouldn't win here. I said it wouldn't be a stomp

Natsu himself said that "real gramp is way stronger"

I see your point about fusion. But, consider that this is crippled Makarov. The guy is on wheelchair lmao. And Wraith himself later on noticed this, and said that inspite of his high magic power, this battered body can't do much.

Well, you said it yourself, Makarov WAS strong, but now he's battered and crippled, from old age and from his injuries in Alverez arc. Hades was at a level where he could mid diff peak Makarov.

And lastly, I don't think Kyria can defeat a single Spriggan without her hypnosis. So, there is that.

 

[Ronin31]

I didn't say Kyria wouldn't win here. I said it wouldn't be a stomp

Natsu himself said that "real gramp is way stronger"

I see your point about fusion. But, consider that this is crippled Makarov. The guy is on wheelchair lmao. And Wraith himself later on noticed this, and said that inspite of his high magic power, this battered body can't do much.

Well, you said it yourself, Makarov WAS strong, but now he's battered and crippled, from old age and from his injuries in Alverez arc. Hades was at a level where he could mid diff peak Makarov.

And lastly, I don't think Kyria can defeat a single Spriggan without her hypnosis. So, there is that.

Well, I do not underestimate wizards such as Makarov and Precht. They are strong.

Sure, Makarov is now the shadow of himself on wheelchair but Wraith could regain the body his mobility. The Magic fused was far stronger than even Wraith was expecting. But, yes, as Natsu said, Makarov is way stronger, I think, in durability because of his old and his injuries from Arbaleth, and his heart. Still, Natsu could stop his crazy amped attack without any problem. I think Natsu, even in his base, is now stronger than him. Not without any trouble .

Yes, Precht was above Makarov, but still, during their encounter, Makarov had heart sickness and was certainly reduce. We can't struggle against the old. Precht was older but protected by his Grimoire Heart who could regen him.

As I see Precht and Kyria, we need to take same foe by analogy : Laxus. In Arbaleth, a weakened Laxus (exaust) took on Precht (Historia) without any problem. In 100YQ, a fresh Laxus took on Kyria without any trouble but used Ougi to destroy her. Then, during his fight vs Erza, she didn't expected Laxus to grow that strong since Arbaleth, and in every stats : Power, Strength and Durability. When Erza said "how much stronger have you become", that make sense to the gap since a year. Laxus is now a monster way stronger than he was, perhaps on Arbaleth Gildarts level. So I can see Kyria around God Serena as historia (far weaker than his living). I still think Kyria is above wizards like Precht and we had to see that we haven't seen Kyria's 100% yet : her forbidden Dragon Force.

But still, I understand your point