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@Mods: Please don't merge this into anti-Tobito threads, it's getting annoying when your post is buried in a muddied sea and gets completely overlooked. I made this thread for a completely different reason, that contrary to popular belief, there's nothing wrong with Tobito and every reason to believe it.
Long post incoming...but I am going to hopefully put a rest to the "plotholes" you guys talk about after hearing it from those youtubers.
On many Naruto forums I have debated with people over their supposed plotholes since the Tobito reveal. But they weren't plotholes. At times when I drove people into a corner, they just didn't respond. These "plotholes"...They could be explained, in fact, these "plotholes" has so much room for explanation, you almost wonder whether they are just trying to get mad at Kishimoto for not revealing Tobi to be the character they guessed or not. I've watched youtube reviews, I've heard audio-reviews, I've read hundreds of posts on the subject but they still haven't convinced me.
So what is a plothole? It's something that has been inconsistent with fact and has absolutely no room for explanation. Yes, hear that last part. NO ROOM for explanation. You see, if something can be explained with genjutsu and only genjutsu, then it was genjutsu. Use common sense for these things.
Tobi being Obito is not a plothole. Kishimoto didn't just get up and decide this, it was almost obvious from day 1. Just look at everything in retrospect. Kakashi Gaiden in between part 1 and 2. Tobi not taking his mask off after revealing himself to be Madara. The hair. The one eye hole. This wasn't decided on a whim. It was never changed. It just was... but let's get to the serious business.
Tobito theorists have been coming up with answers years prior to the reveal. Just now, some of you are coming up with "Tobi was Madara at one point" and taking credit for it, and also taking credit for "taking care of some of the plotholes"...LOL, we posted about that a million times. How did that get overlooked? The more Kishimoto opens the explanation to Obito up, the more you guys will probably take credit for theorizing things we've been guessing for YEARS!!
Okay, let's take a large portion of those "timeline plotholes" and throw them in the trash right now. Keep in mind, databook is not the highest level of canon. If Kishimoto doesn't even remain consistent with it, why should it be used in any debate? If there is anything Kishi should retcon, shouldn't it be some outside-publication nobody will read? The same databook that said Kurenai and Itachi had the same level of genjutsu? The same databook that 97% of fans don't even buy let alone read at a library? There is no reason to use the databook in arguments when 99% of average people are going to be either watching or reading Naruto to the end, not even knowing that databooks exist. You see, databooks are not relevant. Years from now, people will be watching some remastered filler-free Naruto and not even know about this crackpot "databook". With that reasoning, your plotholes don't even exist to average fans.
So the most common thing that is brought up is the personality U-turn. I still can't imagine how it is a plothole. How fast did Sasuke get changed? Why can't Obito change that fast? Why can't traumatic events change him? A disgusting truth of the ninja world? Why can't he lie about Rin being the main reason? This is no plothole, guys. It's called mental health and it changes erratically! Don't trick yourself into thinking there is no possible motive for this. How do you know Obito's parents weren't killed in front of him? How do you know he didn't meet someone like Rin during the war and she got killed? See, these might seem like crazy possibilities, but it goes back to "room for explanation". If these things are possible, then that is an explanation.
Then there's the "how can obito get that strong" plothole. Unbelievable people would even say this. Obito trained with Madara, it's that obvious. We all know how strong Madara is, there's nothing wrong with him being able to make a fine ninja like Obito. How could you be shocked at Obito's growth in power when Madara, who can summon asteroids out of nowhere, is allianced with him. Remember, if there's room for explanation then it's not a plothole.
The whole Kisame thing where he revealed both Tobi's (short hair and long hair) to be the same person can also be explained with one thing: genjutsu. Do you remember that first scene, where Kisame looked directly at Tobi's "glowing sharingan"? Do you also remember that one scene with Itachi, Kisame, Kakashi, Kurenai, and Asuma, where Kakashi specifically said not to look into Itachi's sharingan because they would be trapped in a genjutsu? It's that easy to get trapped into genjutsu and we've seen it multiple times.
I'm not even sure why this is warranted as a plothole, but I guess some people don't understand "acting". You see, when someone says they are someone else and says a bunch of things that only that someone could have done, then they were probably referring to what that person did. Did that sound confusing? I bet it did. I'm saying that whatever Obito said while he was lying about being Madara were things that Madara said and did. For instance, Obito saying he convinced Yahiko to form Akatsuki and gave Nagato the rinnegan...those were things that Madara did. Again, use common sense. This isn't rocket science!
There's one that is particularly striking to me...the one where Madara says he awakened the rinnegan shortly before his death. And it was said that Nagato was given a pair of rinnegans. So, if Nagato was born before Obito and there was a huge time gap between the time Nagato got his rinnegan and Obito's birth, then how was Madara able to meet and train Obito? I can explain this easily. Where was it said that Madara was able to awaken only one set of rinnegan? How do we know he didn't awaken two sets? What if Madara gave Nagato his eyes and told him to resurrect him later? Do we even know how you awaken the rinnegan? Exactly, we don't.
You see, if there is room for explanation, it's not a plothole. The simple fact is that many of you aren't being as open-minded as you can. So, I guess, I challenge you. I've heard of practically everything. I challenge you to give me a "plothole", I really do. Some of you need to be desensitized from this plotholes mindset, some you seriously need to!
Long post incoming...but I am going to hopefully put a rest to the "plotholes" you guys talk about after hearing it from those youtubers.
On many Naruto forums I have debated with people over their supposed plotholes since the Tobito reveal. But they weren't plotholes. At times when I drove people into a corner, they just didn't respond. These "plotholes"...They could be explained, in fact, these "plotholes" has so much room for explanation, you almost wonder whether they are just trying to get mad at Kishimoto for not revealing Tobi to be the character they guessed or not. I've watched youtube reviews, I've heard audio-reviews, I've read hundreds of posts on the subject but they still haven't convinced me.
So what is a plothole? It's something that has been inconsistent with fact and has absolutely no room for explanation. Yes, hear that last part. NO ROOM for explanation. You see, if something can be explained with genjutsu and only genjutsu, then it was genjutsu. Use common sense for these things.
Tobi being Obito is not a plothole. Kishimoto didn't just get up and decide this, it was almost obvious from day 1. Just look at everything in retrospect. Kakashi Gaiden in between part 1 and 2. Tobi not taking his mask off after revealing himself to be Madara. The hair. The one eye hole. This wasn't decided on a whim. It was never changed. It just was... but let's get to the serious business.
Tobito theorists have been coming up with answers years prior to the reveal. Just now, some of you are coming up with "Tobi was Madara at one point" and taking credit for it, and also taking credit for "taking care of some of the plotholes"...LOL, we posted about that a million times. How did that get overlooked? The more Kishimoto opens the explanation to Obito up, the more you guys will probably take credit for theorizing things we've been guessing for YEARS!!
Okay, let's take a large portion of those "timeline plotholes" and throw them in the trash right now. Keep in mind, databook is not the highest level of canon. If Kishimoto doesn't even remain consistent with it, why should it be used in any debate? If there is anything Kishi should retcon, shouldn't it be some outside-publication nobody will read? The same databook that said Kurenai and Itachi had the same level of genjutsu? The same databook that 97% of fans don't even buy let alone read at a library? There is no reason to use the databook in arguments when 99% of average people are going to be either watching or reading Naruto to the end, not even knowing that databooks exist. You see, databooks are not relevant. Years from now, people will be watching some remastered filler-free Naruto and not even know about this crackpot "databook". With that reasoning, your plotholes don't even exist to average fans.
So the most common thing that is brought up is the personality U-turn. I still can't imagine how it is a plothole. How fast did Sasuke get changed? Why can't Obito change that fast? Why can't traumatic events change him? A disgusting truth of the ninja world? Why can't he lie about Rin being the main reason? This is no plothole, guys. It's called mental health and it changes erratically! Don't trick yourself into thinking there is no possible motive for this. How do you know Obito's parents weren't killed in front of him? How do you know he didn't meet someone like Rin during the war and she got killed? See, these might seem like crazy possibilities, but it goes back to "room for explanation". If these things are possible, then that is an explanation.
Then there's the "how can obito get that strong" plothole. Unbelievable people would even say this. Obito trained with Madara, it's that obvious. We all know how strong Madara is, there's nothing wrong with him being able to make a fine ninja like Obito. How could you be shocked at Obito's growth in power when Madara, who can summon asteroids out of nowhere, is allianced with him. Remember, if there's room for explanation then it's not a plothole.
The whole Kisame thing where he revealed both Tobi's (short hair and long hair) to be the same person can also be explained with one thing: genjutsu. Do you remember that first scene, where Kisame looked directly at Tobi's "glowing sharingan"? Do you also remember that one scene with Itachi, Kisame, Kakashi, Kurenai, and Asuma, where Kakashi specifically said not to look into Itachi's sharingan because they would be trapped in a genjutsu? It's that easy to get trapped into genjutsu and we've seen it multiple times.
I'm not even sure why this is warranted as a plothole, but I guess some people don't understand "acting". You see, when someone says they are someone else and says a bunch of things that only that someone could have done, then they were probably referring to what that person did. Did that sound confusing? I bet it did. I'm saying that whatever Obito said while he was lying about being Madara were things that Madara said and did. For instance, Obito saying he convinced Yahiko to form Akatsuki and gave Nagato the rinnegan...those were things that Madara did. Again, use common sense. This isn't rocket science!
There's one that is particularly striking to me...the one where Madara says he awakened the rinnegan shortly before his death. And it was said that Nagato was given a pair of rinnegans. So, if Nagato was born before Obito and there was a huge time gap between the time Nagato got his rinnegan and Obito's birth, then how was Madara able to meet and train Obito? I can explain this easily. Where was it said that Madara was able to awaken only one set of rinnegan? How do we know he didn't awaken two sets? What if Madara gave Nagato his eyes and told him to resurrect him later? Do we even know how you awaken the rinnegan? Exactly, we don't.
You see, if there is room for explanation, it's not a plothole. The simple fact is that many of you aren't being as open-minded as you can. So, I guess, I challenge you. I've heard of practically everything. I challenge you to give me a "plothole", I really do. Some of you need to be desensitized from this plotholes mindset, some you seriously need to!
