Luffy VS Jinbe

[TheLuffySmile]

Straw hat pirates captain
Monkey D. Luffy
VS

Knight of the sea
Jinbe

Battleground: Green Bit

 

[KingOfNight]

I'd go for Jinbi. Green Bit is an island surrounded by water. There's not even a ghost of a chance for Luffy against a close-to-the-sea Jinbi.

 

[TheLuffySmile]

Bump! Come on guys! Anyone?

 

[Impossibility]

I've never been a particularly big fan of Jinbei, but, to be honest, I think Jinbei takes this. If Luffy had a way to bring down Jinbei quickly, or could fight with some serious range, he'd stand a chance. However, in the setting of a small island, Jinbei has to be favoured against Luffy.

 

[vagabond87]

I've never been a particularly big fan of Jinbei, but, to be honest, I think Jinbei takes this. If Luffy had a way to bring down Jinbei quickly, or could fight with some serious range, he'd stand a chance. However, in the setting of a small island, Jinbei has to be favoured against Luffy.

I think that current Sanji can take out Jinbe. Same with Zoro.
As for Luffy his devil fruit power isnt that much of a handicap to be honest. He should be faster and stronger than Jinbe otherwise Jinbe wouldnt agree to join Luffys crew.

 

[Impossibility]

I think that current Sanji can take out Jinbe. Same with Zoro.
As for Luffy his devil fruit power isnt that much of a handicap to be honest. He should be faster and stronger than Jinbe otherwise Jinbe wouldnt agree to join Luffys crew.

I'm not sure if I agree with the sentiment that Sanji and Zoro can take out Jinbei, they haven't shown anything suggesting that. As for Luffy, I agree that Luffy is probably better than Jinbei. I just think Jinbei is someone who gets a massive boost against DF users under these conditions; the guy is next to the ocean and can almost freely manipulate water. If Jinbei gets to the water, that's pretty much it. And I don't think Luffy is good enough to stop him from doing that.

 

[vagabond87]

I'm not sure if I agree with the sentiment that Sanji and Zoro can take out Jinbei, they haven't shown anything suggesting that. As for Luffy, I agree that Luffy is probably better than Jinbei. I just think Jinbei is someone who gets a massive boost against DF users under these conditions; the guy is next to the ocean and can almost freely manipulate water. If Jinbei gets to the water, that's pretty much it. And I don't think Luffy is good enough to stop him from doing that.

Both Sanji and Zoro will have to fight Seats from Doflamingos crew. Doflamingo is imo clearly stronger than Jinbe and seats are suggested to be slightly weaker than Doflamingo so in Laws league so to say. If Sanji and Zoro will win their fights with Jokers seats than I ASSUME that fighting with Jinbe and having big chance of winning against him isnt a overestimating monster trio.

Luffy has chance of pressing Jinbe further into Green Bit instead of letting him to watter. Without water advantage do you agree that Luffy seems to be fairly stronger than Jinbe?
If yes then Zoro and Sanji that are not devil fruit users should also have chance in beating Jinbe beside sea water usage argument.

 

[DutchPhoenix]

Luffy and zoro can slice and dice jimbei for sure
Sanji most likely win too, but with trouble.

 

[Impossibility]

Both Sanji and Zoro will have to fight Seats from Doflamingos crew. Doflamingo is imo clearly stronger than Jinbe and seats are suggested to be slightly weaker than Doflamingo so in Laws league so to say. If Sanji and Zoro will win their fights with Jokers seats than I ASSUME that fighting with Jinbe and having big chance of winning against him isnt a overestimating monster trio.

Luffy has chance of pressing Jinbe further into Green Bit instead of letting him to watter. Without water advantage do you agree that Luffy seems to be fairly stronger than Jinbe?
If yes then Zoro and Sanji that are not devil fruit users should also have chance in beating Jinbe beside sea water usage argument.

I think DD is better than Jinbei, but I don't agree with your characterisation of the seats. I think DD is significantly better than his subordinates, and Vergo as his right-hand man supports that. Furthermore, you're suggesting that the seats are the same level as Law, if that's the case then Sanji is undoubtedly inferior; his showing against DD would suggest that he isn't on Law's level, a seriously injured Law had to step in to save Sanji. Zoro hasn't shown much since the timeskip, so it's more difficult to peg down his abilities, but I'd say its a big stretch to outright say he's superior to Jinbei, and most definitely Law.

I've already said that under different circumstances Luffy would win; I consider him to be superior to Jinbei. I just don't think he's so superior that he would be able to defeat Jinbei with the ocean at his back.

 

[kkck]

Jinbe is the only person so far to actually easily block luffy's gear second attack though. At least based on what little we have seen it would appear like base jinbe is enough of a match to gear two luffy. Luffy does have his gear third and hardened forms and other techniques but jinbe from that point onwards has his other techniques as well. Seeing how he fought that giant fish guy along with sanji it doesn't even appear as he even needs large volumes of water to use powerful attacks. I would think jinbe currently is equal or slightly stronger than luffy to be honest. Even gear third would not necessarily be enough for luffy to fight off jinbe, the water based attacks would still severely hurt luffy

 

[HereNThere]

At the most, Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji are equal in strength to Jinbe. At worst, they are weaker, which I don't see a problem with seeing as how he's still a more experienced pirate than them. Nothing has suggested that Jinbe is weaker than the three or could be easily defeated by them. Jinbe outside of water can go toe to toe with Luffy and keep up with Gear 2, even going as far as to criticize Luffy because he wasn't impressed with his training. Near water, none of them should stand a chance against Jinbe.

Both Sanji and Zoro will have to fight Seats from Doflamingos crew. Doflamingo is imo clearly stronger than Jinbe and seats are suggested to be slightly weaker than Doflamingo so in Laws league so to say. If Sanji and Zoro will win their fights with Jokers seats than I ASSUME that fighting with Jinbe and having big chance of winning against him isnt a overestimating monster trio.

Luffy has chance of pressing Jinbe further into Green Bit instead of letting him to watter. Without water advantage do you agree that Luffy seems to be fairly stronger than Jinbe?
If yes then Zoro and Sanji that are not devil fruit users should also have chance in beating Jinbe beside sea water usage argument.

While you are most likely correct in saying that Doflamingo is stronger than Jinbe, we don't know how the seats compare to Jinbe. We haven't even seen what they are capable of yet. And just because Zoro and Sanji are going to win the fights with the seats, doesn't mean they'll be able to win against Jinbe. And I think it is overestimating them, since you are saying they would have a "big chance" of winning. Unless they are fighting in a desert, I would say the fights would go either way.

Without a water advantage, Luffy is still probably somewhat equal to Jinbe in strength. We saw this in their brief fight. He shouldn't be considerably stronger than him. Lately I've begun to consider them to be overrated by some fans, which is understandable seeing as how Oda has pretty much been allowing Luffy and Zoro to fight scrubs and show off, while keeping them from getting into fights with actual opponents, not really showing us how strong they actually are. Maybe it's me who is underestimating them, but right now, I'm not buying into the hype without any proof. As for Zoro and Sanji, they are still human, so they will still be affected by his Fishman Karate seeing as how they are still human and composed of water. And if Jinbe gets Zoro and Sanji in the water, they will be done for. Sanji will probably do better in this instance, but he would still lose.

 

[vagabond87]

At the most, Luffy, Zoro, and Sanji are equal in strength to Jinbe. At worst, they are weaker, which I don't see a problem with seeing as how he's still a more experienced pirate than them. Nothing has suggested that Jinbe is weaker than the three or could be easily defeated by them. Jinbe outside of water can go toe to toe with Luffy and keep up with Gear 2, even going as far as to criticize Luffy because he wasn't impressed with his training. Near water, none of them should stand a chance against Jinbe.



While you are most likely correct in saying that Doflamingo is stronger than Jinbe, we don't know how the seats compare to Jinbe. We haven't even seen what they are capable of yet. And just because Zoro and Sanji are going to win the fights with the seats, doesn't mean they'll be able to win against Jinbe. And I think it is overestimating them, since you are saying they would have a "big chance" of winning. Unless they are fighting in a desert, I would say the fights would go either way.

Without a water advantage, Luffy is still probably somewhat equal to Jinbe in strength. We saw this in their brief fight. He shouldn't be considerably stronger than him. Lately I've begun to consider them to be overrated by some fans, which is understandable seeing as how Oda has pretty much been allowing Luffy and Zoro to fight scrubs and show off, while keeping them from getting into fights with actual opponents, not really showing us how strong they actually are. Maybe it's me who is underestimating them, but right now, I'm not buying into the hype without any proof. As for Zoro and Sanji, they are still human, so they will still be affected by his Fishman Karate seeing as how they are still human and composed of water. And if Jinbe gets Zoro and Sanji in the water, they will be done for. Sanji will probably do better in this instance, but he would still lose.

For me its really not possible to understand why you put being close to water as such power up to Jinbe? Its clear that Fishman IN WATER gets considerably stronger but to be able to use water is like giving Jinbe ammo for a weapon in a way, not making him immortal. Lets say that Jinbe shoots ray of water so to say, same as when he was stealing Marine warship after impel down- Zoro can cut through steel like its nothing so cutting through water streams or simply avoiding them should not be problem, Sanji very likely with Hell Memories can turn those kind of attack into steam or simply he can use CoO to counter-avoid most of bigger attacks.

I didnt said beat Jinbe with ease, just have high chance of beating him in my opinion. Jinbe who isnt some young pirate in prime was able few years before current timeline to fight on par with Ace BEFORE Ace joined Whitebeard and sailed under his sign. You cant deny that it made Ace far stronger than he was before while

Jinbe being 46 years old isnt learning new tricks easily and 99% he doesnt have as good strength grow rate as Ace had.
So right now almost all of us expect Luffy to be as strong as Ace was or even slightly stronger- this means that Luffy left Jinbe behind. As for one Jet Stamp used against Jinbe it was rather way of making us doubt Luffys strength at that time than real estimation of who is stronger. Jinbe being hit by CoA jest stamp would not be so daring in commenting on Luffys training- as it was just choice of Luffy(Oda..) for him to use just base move.

Luffy wins this even with water not being far, only option with Luffy not winning it is that Jinbe jumps into water and stays there

Dont underestimate Sanji as he is good example of how strong strawhats became- if we would put current Sanji in battle with Oz he would burn him to crisp in few moments as Wadasumi was around same size as Oz and gotten crispy after one Hell Memories kick. Look how powereful was Sanjis Grill Shot move used so deep under water. Those are subtle feats that will be shown in bigger one on one battle probably within this arc and after Sanji underestimating Vergo- you loose your head you loose the fight as Sanji said ust before Kuma sended him to Okama island- will make put all of readers in Awe.

As Zoro is stronger than Sanji there is no point in elaborating resons why I think that he also has slight edge over Jinbe.

As you said Oda was not ready to show us how strong Monster Trio is but now with fights against Doflamingo and his seated underlings that are pointed to be close to Laws combat power it will be shown what they gotten during those 2 years. I point to seats being on warlord level as Doflamingo sended Vergo to deal with Law, Smoker and Luffy. Yes, Vergo lost to Law but underestimation played pretty big role in Vergos fall there. Seats should be just slightly weaker than Vergo who was said to be Jokers right hand man and longes friend/crew member. That puts them in same league as Jinbe in my opinion- medium Warlord level of combat power, same tier as Vergo basically.


Lets get back to further discussion about this when Dressrosa arc will be finished- we would have some better examples, we will know more about abilities that they have.

 

[HereNThere]

For me its really not possible to understand why you put being close to water as such power up to Jinbe? Its clear that Fishman IN WATER gets considerably stronger but to be able to use water is like giving Jinbe ammo for a weapon in a way, not making him immortal. Lets say that Jinbe shoots ray of water so to say, same as when he was stealing Marine warship after impel down- Zoro can cut through steel like its nothing so cutting through water streams or simply avoiding them should not be problem, Sanji very likely with Hell Memories can turn those kind of attack into steam or simply he can use CoO to counter-avoid most of bigger attacks.

Water for Jinbe is like the desert for Crocoboy. It's the basis for his martial arts and being near water basically gives him infinate "ammo" so to speak. Then there is the fact that being near a large body of water means that the atmosphere is thick with it, most likely enhancing the basic aspects of his martial arts. I doubt Zoro can cut through those shock waves. Sanji is just as vulnerable. Neither Diable Jiambe nor Hell's Memories is going to evaporate that large amount of vapor or the body of water. As for the move you used as an example, that is probably something that can probably be dispersed, but the impact should still be felt. It isn't solid.

I didnt said beat Jinbe with ease, just have high chance of beating him in my opinion. Jinbe who isnt some young pirate in prime was able few years before current timeline to fight on par with Ace BEFORE Ace joined Whitebeard and sailed under his sign. You cant deny that it made Ace far stronger than he was before while Jinbe being 46 years old isnt learning new tricks easily and 99% he doesnt have as good strength grow rate as Ace had.

I don't think the chances are high in this scenario. I can't deny it because I don't know how much Ace's power jumped from the time they fought and when he was under Whitebeard. Even then, how do you know that Jinbe didn't get any stronger? Look at Blackbeard, Capone, Uroge, and even Brook. They are in their late 30's/early 40's, and in Brook's case 90's, yet they are still growing in power. We were just shown Ace's story, not Jinbe's, so we can't say he didn't grow. You can't just stay still and wash your neck in this world. We've seen what happens when you let your skills decay and weaken (Moriah).

So right now almost all of us expect Luffy to be as strong as Ace was or even slightly stronger- this means that Luffy left Jinbe behind. As for one Jet Stamp used against Jinbe it was rather way of making us doubt Luffys strength at that time than real estimation of who is stronger. Jinbe being hit by CoA jest stamp would not be so daring in commenting on Luffys training- as it was just choice of Luffy(Oda..) for him to use just base move.

I'm in the same camp. I think Luffy is just below where Ace was before he died. Then again, I've never held Ace's power in high esteem anyhow. I've felt that even though he was the 2nd Division Commander, he was still weaker than Marco, Jozu, and Vista. I'm sure Luffy isn't even near their level just yet. And that sure as hell doesn't mean that Luffy left Jinbe behind. Why would it make us doubt Luffy's strength? Why can't it be a confirmation of Jinbe's strength? It was a base move, but it was still a Second Gear move, which is stronger than it was two years earlier.

Luffy wins this even with water not being far, only option with Luffy not winning it is that Jinbe jumps into water and stays there

I don't think so.

Dont underestimate Sanji as he is good example of how strong strawhats became- if we would put current Sanji in battle with Oz he would burn him to crisp in few moments as Wadasumi was around same size as Oz and gotten crispy after one Hell Memories kick. Look how powereful was Sanjis Grill Shot move used so deep under water. Those are subtle feats that will be shown in bigger one on one battle probably within this arc and after Sanji underestimating Vergo- you loose your head you loose the fight as Sanji said ust before Kuma sended him to Okama island- will make put all of readers in Awe.

I damn sure don't underestimate Sanji. He's my favorite Strawhat. That being said, Oz was most likely stronger than Wadatsumi and you can't compare Wadatsumi to Jinbe seeing as how Jinbe was stronger than his as well, even with the pills.

I too am looking forward to a good Sanji fight, however. Can't wait.

As Zoro is stronger than Sanji there is no point in elaborating resons why I think that he also has slight edge over Jinbe.

I like to think they are roughly equal but that's neither here nor there. Except, the fact that I think Jinbe would have a good chance at winning against him as well.

As you said Oda was not ready to show us how strong Monster Trio is but now with fights against Doflamingo and his seated underlings that are pointed to be close to Laws combat power it will be shown what they gotten during those 2 years. I point to seats being on warlord level as Doflamingo sended Vergo to deal with Law, Smoker and Luffy. Yes, Vergo lost to Law but underestimation played pretty big role in Vergos fall there. Seats should be just slightly weaker than Vergo who was said to be Jokers right hand man and longes friend/crew member. That puts them in same league as Jinbe in my opinion- medium Warlord level of combat power, same tier as Vergo basically.

Vergo lost to Law's ability. Vergo was pretty much a monster that had to be disabled as they couldn't keep him down with brute force. Also, being the right hand doesn't necessarily mean that he was stronger than the seats. I'm not saying he wasn't, but it's a possibility. Again, whose to say that Jinbe isn't equal in strength to the M3? Wouldn't that mean that he would also be capable of beating the Seats?

Lets get back to further discussion about this when Dressrosa arc will be finished- we would have some better examples, we will know more about abilities that they have.

Alrighty then.

 

[vagabond87]

Alrighty then.

At the moment Im assuming a lot- estimating things by logic without enough to fully back it up so thats why I wrote about waiting
Our exchange would turn more into whos more patient in posting than who is closer to truth

 

[M3J]

Jinbei has too many ways to win. He took Luffy's attacks like it was nothing but was able to knock him down with Fishman karate. I don't think there was water anywhere close, even. If Jinbei can use armament haki, then that increases his chances of winning even quicker.

 

[SoloGG]

I think all the M3 members can kick Jinbe's ass now, Sanji with more troubles than Zoro and Rufy but neverthless.

 

[BASED Shinigami]

Jinbei has too many ways to win. He took Luffy's attacks like it was nothing but was able to knock him down with Fishman karate. I don't think there was water anywhere close, even. If Jinbei can use armament haki, then that increases his chances of winning even quicker.

Luffy wasn't fighting very seriously. He attacked Jinbe with his standard second gear attacks without using his haki abilities. We've seen Luffy deal serious damage to Hody by applying Busoshoku Haki to his second gear techniques a few times during their fight. Furthermore, I'm still having a hard seeing Jinbe being able to fend off Luffy's gear third techniques imbued with haki. What does Jinbe have in his current arsenal that can withstand the power of a Busoshoku Haki imbued Elephant Gun Gatling?

 

[kkck]

Luffy wasn't fighting very seriously. He attacked Jinbe with his standard second gear attacks without using his haki abilities. We've seen Luffy deal serious damage to Hody by applying Busoshoku Haki to his second gear techniques a few times during their fight. Furthermore, I'm still having a hard seeing Jinbe being able to fend off Luffy's gear third techniques imbued with haki. What does Jinbe have in his current arsenal that can withstand the power of a Busoshoku Haki imbued Elephant Gun Gatling?

There is no reason for us to think luffy did not use his haki against jinbe though. By now I would think we should just assume he is using it unless there is a specific circumstance that says otherwise. Luffy certainly did not use hardening but standard haki is pretty much invisible.

 

[M3J]

Proof Jinbei was fighting seriously? Luffy still barely did damage to Jinbei and got taken down by one attack.....

 

[kkck]

Well, it is safe to say jinbe has no trouble keeping up with luffy's speed at gear 2 which is quite something. Honestly though, it even seems like jinbe exceeded luffy at that stage. The issue here is that gear 2 alone is not quite the true extent of luffy's strength. Luffy still has his armament haki and gear 3 which while slower exhibits considerably higher offensive power than gear 2 and covers a wider area. Jinbe also appears to have a number of techniques which would appear to be exceptionally dangerous even if he does not have more powerups per say. There is also the issue of whether fishman karate would be effective or more effective on gear 3 luffy. Luffy becomes bigger but only because of the air he uses, the amount of water remains constant within him. Perhaps attacks which target the water he is made out of would be equally effective whether he is using gear 3 or not because the amount of water does not change. In turn perhaps he goes get larger but would be more vulnerable to attacks which use an outer source of water.