One Piece Mega Convo Thread, the 2nd Chapter

[fistsofrage]

Well Shadows Asgard is only as strong as the number of shadows he has and since he lost 1000 shadows at thriller bark I doubt he has very many. You have to realize for every shadow moria has there has to be a shadowless person who can't go into the light and frankly i doubt he was able to get 1000 shadows again so soon.

 

[El-Thor]

Which chapter he said that?

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/212/16/

Also, I don't know if it's an accurate translation, but he says some people have as much power as him. It's interesting how he compares the powers of others to himself, not the other way around.

 

[Lord Rayleigh]

see? you just confirmed that shadow asgard is a possiblity and while in that mode all the power of the people he stole the shadows from transported to him, so if he has 100 shadows he has 100 men power and so on, i cant really think of him being beaten so easily. although i bet he died after a long fight and some pacifistas are bound to get destroyed in that fight. maybe even dofla got his a couple of times.

" See? " ? I've only said that Moria could not use Doppelman unless he hid in a building - and that I don't think it is possible because he is surrendered by Pacifistas and Doflamingo. I never talked about whether he will survive or not.
You eventually asked some other questions that I decided to answer but if you remember, I never said that he could not use Shadow Asgard.

So, back off main discussion, if he wants to make Doppelman flee away and change their position as someone suggested, both he and Doppelman would have to hide in a building. Otherwise, as soon as he would be where Doppelman was, he would die because Doppelman - that is to say his shadow - would be far away and he would be under the sunlight.

 

[bittman]

@ Dream Catcher:

Heck, Coby could give a similar speech given he's just a chief petty officer, but we've seen a lot of marines in East Blue of a higher rank that Coby should be able to beat hands down (Nezumi, Morgan, Fullbody, etc).

It's not hard to be outranked by less skilled people who are actually looking for promotions. It happens in real life when the young intern gets a pay raise whilst the long time employee is overlooked.

And Smoker's strength is probably quite high, but I honestly wouldn't put him at vice-admiral level. From the exchange between Luffy and them, I would say Luffy is just below a vice admiral at the moment (just averaging them atm. Ignore vice admirals like Garp =P), and Smoker is probably at Luffy's level.

Sure, you can say that Smoker showed some domination of Luffy in their quick battle, but this is a fresh Smoker versus a hormone driven Luffy. Until Luffy gets haki, Smoker will sit just above Luffy. On the other hand, when Luffy does get haki it's quite likely that Luffy will surpass Smoker in one fell swoop.

Unless of course Smoker can do something useful with his smoke other than capture things? It's a bit of a dud logia to be honest, I'm hoping Oda has some plans for it outside of just using it to smother Luffy again.

 

[chess4]

just saw the animated version of chapter 0............the cloak rayleigh is wearing is the same one mihawk is currently wearing. i bet their is a connection between that cloak and being the strongest swordsman. could be possible that the cloak is the reason shanks and mihawk fought so much. i think its passes down from swordsman to swordsman who become the strongest.

i think thats why mihawk told zoro to seek him out when he is ready.

 

[Fox666]

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/212/16/

Also, I don't know if it's an accurate translation, but he says some people have as much power as him. It's interesting how he compares the powers of others to himself, not the other way around.

Good to know. I suppose the reason is very obvious, as in the next pages he tell his superiors to eat shit.

It's not hard to be outranked by less skilled people who are actually looking for promotions. It happens in real life when the young intern gets a pay raise whilst the long time employee is overlooked.

And Smoker's strength is probably quite high, but I honestly wouldn't put him at vice-admiral level. From the exchange between Luffy and them, I would say Luffy is just below a vice admiral at the moment (just averaging them atm. Ignore vice admirals like Garp =P), and Smoker is probably at Luffy's level.

During Luffy and Rob Lucci fight, the vice-admirals say something interesting, that they could do anything if Rob Lucci was the one fighting. Well, I would rank Smoker over the vice-admirals.

---

Otherwise, as soon as he would be where Doppelman was, he would die because Doppelman - that is to say his shadow - would be far away and he would be under the sunlight.

I am not sure if the effects of loosing the shadow would work if Moria use Doppelman. To think about it, Moria could just create a small of these brick bat as a shadow for himself?

 

[Uriel]

just saw the animated version of chapter 0............the cloak rayleigh is wearing is the same one mihawk is currently wearing. i bet their is a connection between that cloak and being the strongest swordsman. could be possible that the cloak is the reason shanks and mihawk fought so much. i think its passes down from swordsman to swordsman who become the strongest.

i think thats why mihawk told zoro to seek him out when he is ready.

Excuse my ignorance, where did you saw that? Link please?
And why the Spoilers were removed? Where it is the latest chapter? :O

I feel lost and dumb Y_Y

 

[zerocooldx]

Excuse my ignorance, where did you saw that? Link please?
And why the Spoilers were removed? Where it is the latest chapter? :O

I feel lost and dumb Y_Y

Here and here are the RAW versions of the animated chapter 0 episode. This way you can at least see what he is talking about with the cloaks even if you can't understand much.

 

[topkomputer]

Re: One Piece 583 Discussion / 584 Prediction

And to be fair, we can't know if he had used it or not. As far as I'm concerned, Oda made 2 big mistakes. Not showing more of Ace vs. Blackbeard battle is one of them.
The other one is Blackbeard acquiring second devil fruit.

Oda show us how BB vs Ace. What he didn't show is the final blow between Ace and BB resulting in Ace' loss. Probably he'll show it again when it comes to Luffy vs BB.

Oda stated that people should wait for Dr. Vegapunk to appear because so many people has questions about devil fruits in SBS forum (in his legal mangas). But I can guess BB cover WB dead body so others wouldn't know how he acquire it from dead body (probably eating his heart). Like I said, it's BB second time. He acquire darkness fruit also from killing his buddy, thatch. Probably Thatch already eat darkness fruit, so the only way for BB is killing him rather than knocking him off and steal it.

 

[bittman]

During Luffy and Rob Lucci fight, the vice-admirals say something interesting, that they could do anything if Rob Lucci was the one fighting. Well, I would rank Smoker over the vice-admirals.

Delayed reply but: Really? You think because one vice admiral said some nice words about Rob Lucchi that all vice admirals present their backsides before mr dark assasinating justice? I don't buy it.

It also basically tells me that vice admirals are useless to the rest of the story, so introducing them was a waste of our collective time. You can argue that Luffy was tired and already quite well damaged, but I don't really see the vice admirals sweating about it.

Still, I can see exactly where you're coming from. Between Momonga almost being a bitch to Hancock, Whitebeard one-shotting about half a dozen vice admirals and the fact that collectively they've had less action than Smoker (which is saying a lot given the little amount of action Smoker has actually seen), Oda hasn't exactly done a lot for the vice-admirals image.

Still, remember that Aokoji, Akainu and Kizaru were once vice admirals. And the levels of vice admirals can be quite broad. Vice Admiral Kuzan easily dealt with Vice Admiral Saul. There are potentially strong future admirals within their ranks also.

Besides, I got the impression from the war that the vice admirals were on par with the WB division commanders given how Oda portrayed them both right at the beginning of the war. And I doubt I'd hear you say Luffy is stronger than Vista, Marco or Jozu.

 

[Razh]

Re: One Piece 583 Discussion / 584 Prediction

Probably Thatch already eat darkness fruit, so the only way for BB is killing him rather than knocking him off and steal it.

I really doubt that. Thatch was shown holding the fruit in the flashback. I don't think Blackbeard wasted time waiting for him to eat it. I was given an impression that Blackbeard acted as soon as he saw the fruit, because he knew it was the darkness fruit. We don't know if Thatch knew, he probably didn't. Most people don't just eat devil fruits as soon as they find them. Hell, if it was me, I'd first try to get my hand on that book and see which one it was.

 

[Fox666]

Still, I can see exactly where you're coming from. Between Momonga almost being a bitch to Hancock, Whitebeard one-shotting about half a dozen vice admirals and the fact that collectively they've had less action than Smoker (which is saying a lot given the little amount of action Smoker has actually seen), Oda hasn't exactly done a lot for the vice-admirals image.

You forget the two vice-admirals Doflamingo used as toys when he was introduced. Or the fat guy in Ace cover story...


Well, Vice-Admiral Deberman said something interesting:
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/422/04/
"If that guy [Rob Lucci] is on this island on a mission to take Nico Robin away, then there's nothing for us to do."
At least I fell it would be a strange comment if Lucci was weaker than himself. You can argue Rob Lucci is a professional assassin and all, but it would still be an strange comment. Would't you be pissed off if it was Akainu who said that?


But you are right in saying that vice-admiral levels range a lot.

That goes for all marines, you have "Commander" Smoker who could take down all villains from East Blue with easy, while there is "Commodore" Purin Purin that was killed in one second by Arlong subordinates.


But I wouldn't be expecting the vice-admirals we saw until now, with exception of Garp, to be stronger than Smoker or Rob Lucci. If I am not wrong, didn't Luffy defeated an giant vice-admiral right after he landed in Marineford?


About Whitebeard commanders, I would say Vista is probably stronger than Luffy. But I don't think Atmos, Curiel or Benhein are stronger than Luffy.

 

[Marche]

Well, Vice-Admiral Deberman said something interesting:
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/422/04/
"If that guy [Rob Lucci] is on this island on a mission to take Nico Robin away, then there's nothing for us to do."
At least I fell it would be a strange comment if Lucci was weaker than himself. You can argue Rob Lucci is a professional assassin and all, but it would still be an strange comment. Would't you be pissed off if it was Akainu who said that?


But you are right in saying that vice-admiral levels range a lot.

That goes for all marines, you have "Commander" Smoker who could take down all villains from East Blue with easy, while there is "Commodore" Purin Purin that was killed in one second by Arlong subordinates.


But I wouldn't be expecting the vice-admirals we saw until now, with exception of Garp, to be stronger than Smoker or Rob Lucci. If I am not wrong, didn't Luffy defeated an giant vice-admiral right after he landed in Marineford?


About Whitebeard commanders, I would say Vista is probably stronger than Luffy. But I don't think Atmos, Curiel or Benhein are stronger than Luffy.

I think than what the words of the VA means than with Lucci they don't have to go on the battlefield (He had only faith in Lucci, He tought than Lucci never lost against Rufy).

 

[Fox666]

Well, I may be wrong, but it does not sounds like "Rob Lucci will not left anything for us", it sounds more like "we would be useless if Rob Lucci is there".

 

[bittman]

You forget the two vice-admirals Doflamingo used as toys when he was introduced. Or the fat guy in Ace cover story...

The rank of the officers in question has not been detailed, unless I missed a reveal. As far as I was aware, the marines Doflamingo toyed with have been seen in the background here and there, but nowhere have they been linked to the vice admiral position.

Well, Vice-Admiral Deberman said something interesting:
http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/422/04/
"If that guy [Rob Lucci] is on this island on a mission to take Nico Robin away, then there's nothing for us to do."
At least I fell it would be a strange comment if Lucci was weaker than himself. You can argue Rob Lucci is a professional assassin and all, but it would still be an strange comment. Would't you be pissed off if it was Akainu who said that?

Not really.

Let's see: Luffy has probably used a line similar to that somewhere, or I could imagine a line like that. Something like:
"Shouldn't we back Zoro up?"
"No way, Zoro's strong. I believe he will win."
Don't know if Luffy's ever said something along those lines, but it would fit.

I doubt I'd be annoyed if Akainu said it, because if Akainu said it the only possible interpretation would be that "That peon isn't worth my time" since there's not much in this world he probably thinks highly of.

But yeah, point is that Doberman probably underestimated Luffy moreso than estimating Lucchi to be above him. That's how I'm interpreting it. You don't always need to send out Mewtwo to beat a Hitmonchan.

But I wouldn't be expecting the vice-admirals we saw until now, with exception of Garp, to be stronger than Smoker or Rob Lucci. If I am not wrong, didn't Luffy defeated an giant vice-admiral right after he landed in Marineford?

Luffy defeated a member of the giant squad. Though approximately two of the giants in the squad were called as vice admirals (both of which were defeated by Whitebeard personally) you may have confused giant squad to be all vice admirals. Again, perhaps I missed a call somewhere I'm not aware of. Correct me if I'm wrong with this one.

About Whitebeard commanders, I would say Vista is probably stronger than Luffy. But I don't think Atmos, Curiel or Benhein are stronger than Luffy.

Well it's fairly impossible to judge, but Atmos was thrown up against a beast like Doflamingo who also made Jozu his bitch and Luffy would doubtfully be any more effective against him. Overall, hard to say. There is a "level" the Whitebeard commanders are at, but I might even agree with you in believing that Luffy may at least be on par with the weaker of the Division Commanders.

 

[Uriel]

And I don't know, but I doubt strength alone is the reason to promote somebody. We don't know the methods or the reasons, but I'm always picky when it comes to ranks: For me, they mean nothing unless it's on the top. It's always clear on the top, confusing in the middle, disappointing in the base.

 

[topkomputer]

Re: One Piece 583 Discussion / 584 Prediction

I really doubt that. Thatch was shown holding the fruit in the flashback. I don't think Blackbeard wasted time waiting for him to eat it. I was given an impression that Blackbeard acted as soon as he saw the fruit, because he knew it was the darkness fruit. We don't know if Thatch knew, he probably didn't. Most people don't just eat devil fruits as soon as they find them. Hell, if it was me, I'd first try to get my hand on that book and see which one it was.

You're right. But why BB should kill him, if he can knock Thatch down and running with the fruit. He also already know how to eat WB DF from his dead body, I only guess that this is not his first time. Thatch might already eat it, so BB has to kill him to get the fruit.

 

[Razh]

Re: One Piece 583 Discussion / 584 Prediction

You're right. But why BB should kill him, if he can knock Thatch down and running with the fruit. He also already know how to eat WB DF from his dead body, I only guess that this is not his first time. Thatch might already eat it, so BB has to kill him to get the fruit.

There could be any number of reasons for that. We know that Blackbeard is ruthless, maybe he just figured it's best to kill Thatch quickly, and disappear before anyone notices anything. I don't think there was a fight, since people would notice the commotion. Then again, a devil fruit is not something you easily forget about. I'm pretty sure Thatch would notice pretty quickly that his fruit was stolen.
If Blackbeard just knocked him out, he would still recover fast enough to warn everyone.

So, I think Blackbeard came to Thatch's quarters, killed him, because his guard was down, then took the fruit and escaped. There are still a lot of questions there, but I guess his escape isn't that important, or it will be revealed later.

---

Something has been bugging me for a while. It concerns fishmen criminals. I haven't even seen one of them in Impel Down. Aside from Jimbei, but that seemed like an emergency measure. AS we've seen, there were only 3 prisoners on level 6, which didn't have prison stripes, but had their normal clothing. Ace wasn't there for long, and was waiting for an execution. Shiryuu was probably left with his own clothes as a courtesy, or he was waiting for a trial or something.

As far as Jinbei is concerned, I think he wasn't supposed to stay in Impel Down for long. Sengoku probably sent him there to cool off a little, plus it's probably the only prison that could keep him, being one of Shichibukai.
What I'm pointing at is that fishmen don't get sent to Impel Down, at all. If I'd have to guess, I'd say they end up at a certain auction house, where they get enslaved by locals, if they're lucky, and by Tenryuubito if they are not. I would imagine that Tenryuubito are eager to punish every fishman for what Fisher Tiger did in Mariejoia.
I mean, they are either up there, slaving their asses, or they are sent to work on some project, like that bridge at Tequila Wolf. Someone has to build foundations for that thing. Now that I think about it, Impel Down construction had to include some fishmen workers.
I don't think Oda just forgot about Arlong or other fishman criminals, not after revealing the history of Sun pirates and having Jinbei recall his debt to Luffy.

Anyway, I can't remember there was a discussion about this, maybe I missed it. Didn't want to open a new thread just for that.

 

[goldb]

Re: One Piece 583 Discussion / 584 Prediction

Something has been bugging me for a while. It concerns fishmen criminals. I haven't even seen one of them in Impel Down. Aside from Jimbei, but that seemed like an emergency measure. AS we've seen, there were only 3 prisoners on level 6, which didn't have prison stripes, but had their normal clothing. Ace wasn't there for long, and was waiting for an execution. Shiryuu was probably left with his own clothes as a courtesy, or he was waiting for a trial or something.

As far as Jinbei is concerned, I think he wasn't supposed to stay in Impel Down for long. Sengoku probably sent him there to cool off a little, plus it's probably the only prison that could keep him, being one of Shichibukai.
What I'm pointing at is that fishmen don't get sent to Impel Down, at all. If I'd have to guess, I'd say they end up at a certain auction house, where they get enslaved by locals, if they're lucky, and by Tenryuubito if they are not. I would imagine that Tenryuubito are eager to punish every fishman for what Fisher Tiger did in Mariejoia.
I mean, they are either up there, slaving their asses, or they are sent to work on some project, like that bridge at Tequila Wolf. Someone has to build foundations for that thing. Now that I think about it, Impel Down construction had to include some fishmen workers.
I don't think Oda just forgot about Arlong or other fishman criminals, not after revealing the history of Sun pirates and having Jinbei recall his debt to Luffy.

Anyway, I can't remember there was a discussion about this, maybe I missed it. Didn't want to open a new thread just for that.

You're quite right Razh, good call. There hasn't been a discussion on it, maybe some people have mentioned or noticed it before but no discussion on that topic as I recall. I personally would think they get sent to the Auction House and become slaves to the Tenryubito, maybe it's something the Marines were forced to agree to by the WG in order to please the Tenryuubito?

 

[topkomputer]

I think Arlong and crew probably got arrested in other jail except ID. I don't think ID is the only jail in One Piece World, there is probably other jail, maybe they also put captain Kuro there.