Discussion Opinions about the War Arc?

What do you think of the War Arc as a whole?

  • 0/10 - Not even worth my breath

  • 1/10 - Filler

  • 2/10 - Trash

  • 3/10 - Awful

  • 4/10 - Meh

  • 5/10 - Average

  • 6/10 - Fine

  • 7/10 - Good

  • 8/10 - Very Good

  • 9/10 - Great

  • 10/10 - Masterpiece


Results are only viewable after voting.

Shadowlord123

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
May 20, 2018
Messages
1,745
Reaction score
5,149
Gender
Male
Country
Spain
When I say "War Arc", it includes everything that happened after the Nest. So, marriage tournament, book retrieval, Sapling, etc. Figured it'd be a good time to make this thread after the arc having seemingly concluded with Traumerei's death.

What did you think of it? Do you think the different plot lines were developed and concluded satisfactorily? What would be the pros and cons of the arc for you? What score would you give it overall (see the poll above)?

Just a thread for any thoughts regarding this arc as a whole.
 

Lord V returned

Registered User
中級員 / Chuukyuuin / Member
Joined
Nov 10, 2024
Messages
149
Reaction score
418
Age
25
Country
Austria
I voted 4/10. Could have been a solid 10/10 if none of the C-rank regulars were there. They ruined the story like usual. Khun and Rak fighting High Rankers and surviving. Khun's asspull powers and sudden spell usage, BS. Rak's "awakening", BS. Endoris somehow surviving High Rankers and Family Heads fighting - BS.

All 3 of them dying and suddenly being alive again - Mega BS.

Just like with the nest war, the c-rank regulars ruined it. If none of them were there, then it would have been a solid story that actually made a lot of sense, excluding the silly marriage tournament, which is what brought Endorsi in in the first place...

There were massively good moments in the "war arc".

Seeing Urek again - Awesome
Seeing Luslec - Mega Awesome
Luslec vs Urek - Single greatest thing to happen since Floor of Death Lore drop or Bam vs Jahad
Cha/Jinsung getting some shine here and there - great stuff
I'm not a big fan of Traumerei at all, think he was a pretty disgusting character all things considered, but even he had his awesome moment.
Gustang had great moments.
Finally getting to see V in flash back, V taking over Bam for a while etc All super awesome stuff.
Practically all flash back material was great and at times better than anything happening in "present time".

All those things + some small stuff together would have made this the greatest arc easily, but Siu being Siu had to ruin it by including c-rank regulars.

Just like he is doing now with the end of this arc too. Maria and the rest of the rubbish...I definitely don't care about any of them or their stories. I can already guarantee the chapters with all of them will be beyond boring and plain bad. I mean it already started if you think about it. Maria started climbing before AA, she's more powerful than Anak, Laure etc yet still stuck in the same floor as them? Yeah that makes sense. Did she also retire and take a vacation for a few decades waiting for this sudden coincidental moment?

Already looking lame.
 

arrowofsky

Artist
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2023
Messages
1,544
Reaction score
3,725
Age
34
Gender
Male
Country
Turkey
-Yama's standing up against Yasratcha might be better imo, many things were like rushed up there. I would love to see if Yama was also resistant to be pettily controlled by Traumerei, like his father, at least. And I would expect to see Yama was dead as his target, Traumerei, was dead by other forces, and when you remove the slayer raison d'étre, and beastkin definition in LPB family altogether, why he is still here over my head, he should have gone almost like Doom or Dowon, if not that instantaneous.

-The first appearance of Traumerei was fantastic, people were suffocating just from his moderately near presence while he was just in fetal position. Then, many people and enemies were just casually walking around, and you can insert @Lord V returned 's C rank comments here, too. Other than that, even if I don't personally like the char, he was very good story-wise. Disconnection was his feels-natural power and terrifying. Valhalla, even worse.

-Gustang was, with tasking Bellerir, working with Rachel, threatening enkidu and retrieving book, up to the Prometheus from his library, (and also Hunos at time) were quite cool and a force to be reckoned with. Then, he was kept being humbled and getting his a$$ handed over him. You may expect that Gustang does not have anything inherently, he just studies and copies as much as he can, but come on, on top of everything, his indeterminacy was insufferable. And the entire thing with Blossom's fire, like getting it for protecting Enne to actually saving himself only by this and nothing else, was pathetic. Gustang did not feel like a proper FH when we are in 651.

-We killed keyboards on talking Luslec and Urek and V on and on so I will not try to speak here, but Luslec's entry and interactions were perfect, V's was a critical surprise, albeit felt guilty. On such a big scale, and probably the beginning of a great chaos period, their involvement/introduction were meaningful, and beautifully put in general.

-Revs. Some serious hype, some one-shots with completely nobody people, then complete escape with partially Luslec's interference. Had it not for Luslec, V might have inflicted more damage, maybe even towards Gustang within that fog. If Luslec does not secretly plot something with Revs or thinking about it, this was a strategic mistake. And I am expecting a serious Karaka and Ja Wangnan comment, curiosity towards this after learning it. Especially Wangnan should be a direct relation.

-Many named people died compared to the last station, but then again, so many more were introduced. Ranks should be redefined if it was a serious thing to begin with, just like how stats are being modified in each seasons in many mangas.

-Last but not least, Baam vs Dumas fight was, imho, excellent, only second to the Data Jahad and Baam fight. I did like Luslec Urek fight too, but neither of them were as serious as it would be exciting.

I just want to forget about Beastkin from now on, and even LPB completely, but Yama is still alive for whatever reason. Revs were introduced, and we gotta learn more about them, Wing Tree, and F.U.G., and also zahard princesses. I also want to see at least one more admin kill XD, just to make sure us that Enryu killing one of them alone should feel much more epic. Seriously I don't like unkillable stuff.
 

V_TheHiddenAxis

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Mar 10, 2024
Messages
1,998
Reaction score
5,237
Age
29
Country
Gotei 13
6/10 I will say.

--Luslec vs Urek was based fight
--Traum vs Gustang was also decent albeit gustang was underwhelming
--Urek hype moments here and there but SIU also prevented him from doing anything.
--Good Flashback chapters
--Introduction of goat V
--Baam vs Goat Dumas was awesome


--Main negative is treatement of gustang for me. His abilities were underwhelming and so was his planning. It went from gustang being superior fighter against traum to him needing leftovers of his wife blossom's flames to hold his own and overpower traum at the end and still it gustang could have lost at the end.

--Urek's treatment was also a negative. His motivations lacked depth. Muh yuri and baek told me to stop the fighting.

--Also I wanted traum to fight the group of people he had wronged in the past also. At least they should have contributed to his defeat like yama.

--Yama's treatment was mid.

--Revos were also treated poorly.
 

maverickframe_19

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2024
Messages
1,831
Reaction score
3,722
Age
28
Gender
Male
Country
India
I would say 7 because in a way FH died and it changed the tower dynamic forever no matter the execution of it. The introduction of some of the characters which were very awaited and some of the fights have been top tier (Ren vs Bam, Dark Change Bam, Luslec vs Urek)

Gustang vs Traumerei was meh but that is all on Gustang. Tarumerei did his thing. In a way, he outperformed how I imagined him to against Gustang.

The revs were very disappointing but we know they will be a key faction going forward.

Urek character got hurt by SIU's portrayal of him in this arc. By his admission, he failed his side and main quests.

Dumas, and Robadon are solid characters.

This arc was necessary for the stakes and future of the tower so a 7 from me.
 

Demonspeed

The Bull
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Global Moderator
Joined
Apr 30, 2012
Messages
47,684
Reaction score
61,393
Gender
Male
Country
France
7/10. I will post more later but the Book Retrieval part was garbage.

There is still no S3 arc close to the best of S2 and S1 but SIU can do it. Sometimes he is too much of a coward I think. Pacing issues are also more and more glaring.
 

Anne isn't a TT

Registered User
有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity
Joined
Mar 6, 2024
Messages
2,566
Reaction score
3,570
Age
25
Gender
Male
Country
Germany
Harsh but okay.
I want to give it a solid 7.5 but there are many inconsistencies. One such instance is UM Vs Mirchea. It was a great fight but in the last moments of the fight, it was said the blank space was created after he deactivates dark charge in 601. Fast forward to 642, he uses same technique but he is still in dark charge? This is one of the inconsistency. Not to mention how power scaling has been broken many times.

Another one is Hugo survived a punch from UM while Michel who was stronger than her failed to survive. These are just few. Then again, there were some theories that Yama or a Towerborn would kill Ray. If that had happened the rating would go even lower. I would say from what Gussy showed, if he killed Ray with the help of other powers would be a bad move as well. Other is what's the purpose of Rachel in the war? Was Enki purpose just to wake up V? There are many but the one I hated the most was how SIU was fixated on having chess match when not even giving equal chess pieces to Ray as he had one less chess piece from the start. And he suddenly dropped that the IC was on the line.
 

maverickframe_19

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Aug 6, 2024
Messages
1,831
Reaction score
3,722
Age
28
Gender
Male
Country
India
I want to give it a solid 7.5 but there are many inconsistencies. One such instance is UM Vs Mirchea. It was a great fight but in the last moments of the fight, it was said the blank space was created after he deactivates dark charge in 601. Fast forward to 642, he uses same technique but he is still in dark charge? This is one of the inconsistency. Not to mention how power scaling has been broken many times.

Another one is Hugo survived a punch from UM while Michel who was stronger than her failed to survive. These are just few. Then again, there were some theories that Yama or a Towerborn would kill Ray. If that had happened the rating would go even lower. I would say from what Gussy showed, if he killed Ray with the help of other powers would be a bad move as well. Other is what's the purpose of Rachel in the war? Was Enki purpose just to wake up V? There are many but the one I hated the most was how SIU was fixated on having chess match when not even giving equal chess pieces to Ray as he had one less chess piece from the start. And he suddenly dropped that the IC was on the line.
Totally hear ya!

I would just say in the end for why the eventual war was fought, he managed to show us. A death of FH. There were many highs and lows. The flashbacks were very welcomed. You have rightly pointed out the inconsistencies throughout the arc. My major gripe was too many more questions were raised and very few answers were given.
 

AdityaG

Registered User
下級員 / Kakyuuin / Jr. Member
Joined
Aug 4, 2021
Messages
69
Reaction score
152
Gender
Male
Country
India
Rated 9/10. I generally rate higher, and start from the top, and I was like "Nah, not masterpiece", next was 9/10.

Later reading the comments, I totally agree with the C-rank regular and all other problems everyone mentioned, but honestly I don't care about that. Guess that's just SIU trying to keep everyone he had in story for whatever reason he might plan.

The lore, luslec, V, gustang and his family people, traumerai and lpb family, revs, a family head getting killed is a BIG event. They made it great/very good for me.
 

Shadowlord123

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
May 20, 2018
Messages
1,745
Reaction score
5,149
Gender
Male
Country
Spain
5-6/10 for me. It could've perfectly been 10/10. In terms of content to work with, this was easily the most interesting arc. 2 FHs involved, 2 GFs to explore, Luslec, Urek, Red Trash lore, climbing lore, V... A lot of stuff to unpack, but sadly, things didn't end up being developed very satisfactorily.

1. Characters: SIU dropped the ball with a lot of them. Either gave them practically no relevance, mistreated them, didn't follow up with their storylines, or disposed of them like the biggest chunk of garbage ever.
  • Yama: Probably the biggest example of "not following up with the storyline". Why does he even exist at this point? He got built up since the beginning of S3 to end up nowhere. Instead, he got massacred in all layers.

  • Urek: He was a walking bag of Ls. Hunt Revolution? Fail. Stop the death of a FH? Fail. Save Baam? Fail. Helplessly stopped 3 times by the same spell of Luslec? Checked. Injured by Luslec without the latter even going all-out? Checked. No relevant kill count (Hugo somehow even survived his attack), and "Yuri and Baek are gonna beat my ass after this". He was effectively turned into an incompetent clown. Generational loss of aura,

  • Gustang: Quite disappointing. The character centers around his position as "judge" of the Great Warriors, but he didn't even go into that role out of his own volition. His imagination powers were hardly explored. Instead, he mostly relied on some silly stick and the flames of his ex to hold his own against Traumerei. His motivations were made quite confusing. Sometimes, he said he'd kill Traumerei, but then no, that the Tower-born would be the ones to do it. Then he changed his mind again. He entrusted Bellerir with the planning of this war, which is kinda pepega as well. I'm hoping he got more to show us, but overall, I wasn't satisfied with his character in this arc.

  • The Regulars (AA, Rak, Endorsi, Rachel, Yura): It's been commented on, and I agree. They're the biggest set of garbage this arc has to offer if I'm being honest. It's amazing how much SIU makes a mockery of his own established lore to make these guys relevant in situations they have no business being in. To be clear, it's not the characters themselves I hate, it's the way SIU handles them.

  • Minor Characters (Cha, Dowon, Doom, Proust...): All either were mistreated or were given practically no relevance whatsoever.

  • Revolution: Finally showed up to change the Tower, only to dip 1 chapter later. Ridiculous. It makes sense they left because of Urek, but they could've done more. They were a very hyped group throughout the arc.

  • Leviathan: Nothing burger. The plot of gathering the 3 Sea Dragons went nowhere. His plot line with Traumerei was left unresolved as well.
On the other side of the spectrum, some characters got treated quite well:
  • Traumerei: Best ToG antagonist IMO. He's a character I wasn't expecting in this Season. SIU went all-out with him: his design (both his own and his Shinheuh), his story, his personality and psychology, his actions, his dialogues, and even his closure. He's such a fascinating character to me. I've got a few grips, but overall, I'm incredibly satisfied with him.

  • Luslec: SIU did the leader of FUG justice in his introduction. His design is interesting; it makes you wonder what happened to him and why he looks so different now compared to the past. His spell-casting abilities are good. Despite facing Urek, he did manage to look impressive. His laid-back and casual personality is also fine, and he accomplished what he wanted to accomplish. Big W for him. He's a menace and a force to be reckoned with.

  • Dumas: He's everything I expected from someone who's among the strongest warriors of the Great Families. Overwhelmingly strong, fairly intelligent, super loyal, and straightforward with no bullshit in between. Dumas ate and left no crumbs. He isn't particularly deep as a character, but that didn't stop me from enjoying him. He did so much in so few chapters. Gigachad.
2. Fights and power-scaling: The scale of the fights was sorely lacking. Sometimes it felt like the High Rankers were Regulars fighting. In fact, certain Regular fights looked even more impressive than some HR battles. The power-scaling was incredibly inconsistent for the Regulars, but even outside that, I can't say it was the most consistent thing ever either, especially with Baam's strength and power usage.

3. Lore: This is probably the arc's strongest point. The flashbacks that featured the climb. Traumerei's past, and the Red Trash Can were a delight to read. This is certainly where SIU excels IMO. The lore and characterization were juicy. SIU did share up a fair bit, while at the same time managing to still have me intrigued for the unrevealed parts.

Oh, and the chess game was quite a mess. A FH losing his Immortality and title from it came absolutely out of nowhere from Bellerir's mouth. It should've been clarified much sooner, alongside the explanation of the rules.

Overall, I think the arc fluctuates a lot. Its high points can be considered peak ToG. The problem is that the low points are also the lowest points ToG has ever seen. With that in mind, it probably balances out to a 5/10 to me.
 

zoradante1

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2021
Messages
996
Reaction score
1,971
Age
21
Country
Turkey
hey now rei is dead does that mean levi is also dead
 

Pro Factor

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2021
Messages
676
Reaction score
1,602
Age
33
Gender
Male
Country
Serbia
I gave it 8/10 purely basing it against other ToG arcs. Meaning if I rated it 10/10 I do not really think it's a masterpiece but just best arc in ToG series.

I gave it such high rating just due to amount of lore drops that we got from it including even Icarus. Other than lore drops it had some hype moments, but as @Blooming_Lotus pointed out it was too inconsistent. I think peaks outweigh the lows since I remember being very excited for some chapters, especially towards the end, but end did leave me disappointed.

So yeah rating it against other ToG arcs it's 8/10 for me.
Rating it in isolation (comparing with other pieces of media or other mangas) it's probably 5/10.
 

Anne isn't a TT

Registered User
有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity
Joined
Mar 6, 2024
Messages
2,566
Reaction score
3,570
Age
25
Gender
Male
Country
Germany
hey now rei is dead does that mean levi is also dead
I believe the animals that were killed but brought back to life through all creatures are only dead. The animals whose souls aren't connected to All creatures are alive. For eg: Gran Abuelo. We know Ray does not like plants so maybe he never controlled it not bc he couldn't but bc he didn't want to. One such example will be levi and haetae.
 

zoradante1

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Sep 12, 2021
Messages
996
Reaction score
1,971
Age
21
Country
Turkey
I believe the animals that were killed but brought back to life through all creatures are only dead. The animals whose souls aren't connected to All creatures are alive. For eg: Gran Abuelo. We know Ray does not like plants so maybe he never controlled it not bc he couldn't but bc he didn't want to. One such example will be levi and haetae.
i am not talking about that brother, i am talking about how levi talked about he is immortal as long his source of hatred(Rei) is alive. Since Rei is dead does that mean he is gone? I would be happy if he is gone as well, since he should develop his other powers rather than having new ones.
 

arrowofsky

Artist
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Dec 24, 2023
Messages
1,544
Reaction score
3,725
Age
34
Gender
Male
Country
Turkey
i am not talking about that brother, i am talking about how levi talked about he is immortal as long his source of hatred(Rei) is alive. Since Rei is dead does that mean he is gone? I would be happy if he is gone as well, since he should develop his other powers rather than having new ones.
I doubt if the object of hatred is dead, will it conclude with the end of hatred by itself. Levi would rather like to avenge his hatred directly, so if we only need hatred, levi can still hate by "now it is impossible to harm Traumerei" reasoning. Hence, anything can happen imo.
 

Anne isn't a TT

Registered User
有名人 / Yuumeijin / Celebrity
Joined
Mar 6, 2024
Messages
2,566
Reaction score
3,570
Age
25
Gender
Male
Country
Germany
i am not talking about that brother, i am talking about how levi talked about he is immortal as long his source of hatred(Rei) is alive. Since Rei is dead does that mean he is gone? I would be happy if he is gone as well, since he should develop his other powers rather than having new ones.
I doubt he could gain such an ability on its own. That's tower defying imo. My interpretation of that statement is like he can't be killed unless Ray is dead. So now that Ray is dead, if someone kills levi, he would die too. Also, he isn't inside tower.
He is inside abyss where none of his abilities work like it happened with Enki.
 

Demonspeed

The Bull
神のごとし / Kami no Gotoshi / Godlike
Global Moderator
Joined
Apr 30, 2012
Messages
47,684
Reaction score
61,393
Gender
Male
Country
France
hey now rei is dead does that mean levi is also dead
Leviathan belongs to Baam, not Traumerei.

I gave it 8/10 purely basing it against other ToG arcs. Meaning if I rated it 10/10 I do not really think it's a masterpiece but just best arc in ToG series.

I gave it such high rating just due to amount of lore drops that we got from it including even Icarus. Other than lore drops it had some hype moments, but as @Blooming_Lotus pointed out it was too inconsistent. I think peaks outweigh the lows since I remember being very excited for some chapters, especially towards the end, but end did leave me disappointed.

So yeah rating it against other ToG arcs it's 8/10 for me.
Rating it in isolation (comparing with other pieces of media or other mangas) it's probably 5/10.
Which arcs would you say were consistent? The peaks outweigh the lows in pretty much every big ToG arc. Even arcs like the FoD and HF have strings of boring chapters.
 

VON

Registered User
英雄メンバー / Eiyuu Menbaa / Hero Member
Joined
Jun 18, 2018
Messages
1,577
Reaction score
2,433
Country
Gotei 13
10/10

I'm a sucker for the big war arcs, like Marineford arc in OP, Coalition arc in Kingdom, TYBW in Bleach etc.
 
Top