Discussion The Japanese Study Thread

[WinterLion]

Re: Kanji Readings - On & Kun in Naruto

Actually Finestela, those words have their own Japanese reading 硝子 = shoushi and 頁 = ketsu and most others of the like (unless they are 当て字 like 珈琲 - coffee) have their own JP reading. Just the foreign lang word is used to "read" it because it's more commonly known/used. But to be technically correct, the original JP reading would be used.

 

[BlitzRonin]

Re: Kanji Readings - On & Kun in Naruto

Thanks for the responses guys.

I bet translating names of manga characters can be difficult... before the anime comes out. I think in Bleach early groups translated Zangetsu as Kisuki for some reason. I imagine it was because the readings got mixed up.

I am just trying to grasp the basics on and kun readings lol, I don't even want to think about the nanori or ateji yet, for the sake of my own sanity.

Kanji is very tricky to really learn.

On readings of the kanji more or less identify the kanji by itself, for example if we took 人 "hito" the on reading of it identifies what kanji it is with just the reading. The kun readning "nin" makes it much harder to identify. Is it 任 忍 認 妊 or 人?　

That said I think the confusion that you may be coming across is that with a few exceptions if a kanji is stand-alone (not connected to any other kanji) it uses the On reading of the kanji, BUT the statement can't be applied the other way around: If there are more than 2 kanji together it uses the Kun reading. (This statement isn't true).

See this site says that when a kanji is used by itself it is usually a kun reading. And when its used with one or more other kanji it's usually an on reading.

http://www.kanjisite.com/html/wak/wak6.html
http://www.kanjisite.com/html/wak/wak7.html

So I just thought that since there were two kanji being used side by side, that the two kanji would be given the on readings.

I'm basically just using this kanji site as well as a kanji reference book to try and teach myself. Really concentrating on learning hiragana now, then katakana.

 

[WinterLion]

Re: Kanji Readings - On & Kun in Naruto

Thanks for the responses guys.

I bet translating names of manga characters can be difficult... before the anime comes out. I think in Bleach early groups translated Zangetsu as Kisuki for some reason. I imagine it was because the readings got mixed up.

Because shounen mangas have furigana (the hiragana reading) of them next to the kanji, there shouldn't be any confusion about how to read it. So I'm not sure where that one would come from. But yes, made up names are very difficult to read and even harder to guess what kanji (if any) applies to name if you just hear it. ie "Ichigo" (since we're using Bleach as an example), I could come up with bunch off the top of my head on how his name could be written.

I am just trying to grasp the basics on and kun readings lol, I don't even want to think about the nanori or ateji yet, for the sake of my own sanity.



See this site says that when a kanji is used by itself it is usually a kun reading. And when its used with one or more other kanji it's usually an on reading.

http://www.kanjisite.com/html/wak/wak6.html
http://www.kanjisite.com/html/wak/wak7.html

So I just thought that since there were two kanji being used side by side, that the two kanji would be given the on readings.

I'm basically just using this kanji site as well as a kanji reference book to try and teach myself. Really concentrating on learning hiragana now, then katakana.

Gotta love the typos >_<. Was typing it backwards... switch the "on" and "kun" in my post and you'll get the right drift.

But as far as the on readings go... that's not one that can be used with any real accuracy. "hokage" is actually a real word　and means the "a light from a fire" so it's not made up just for Naruto, though how they use it is made up. Some other common examples of words that have kun reading in a group of kanji are: 花見　(hanami) 一足 (hitoashi) 心得 (kokoroe) etc.

There's a lot more examples I could come up with, but you get the idea. So for always using the on reading when there are 2 or more kanji put together, doesn't work frequently. But using the kun reading for the kanji that is stand alone, works the majority of the time. There are only a few instances when that wouldn't work.

Hope this makes sense.

 

[BlitzRonin]

Re: Kanji Readings - On & Kun in Naruto

But as far as the on readings go... that's not one that can be used with any real accuracy. "hokage" is actually a real word　and means the "a light from a fire" so it's not made up just for Naruto, though how they use it is made up. Some other common examples of words that have kun reading in a group of kanji are: 花見　(hanami) 一足 (hitoashi) 心得 (kokoroe) etc.

There's a lot more examples I could come up with, but you get the idea. So for always using the on reading when there are 2 or more kanji put together, doesn't work frequently. But using the kun reading for the kanji that is stand alone, works the majority of the time. There are only a few instances when that wouldn't work.

Hope this makes sense.

So it seems like building japanese vocabulary is essential to knowing what reading to use, since if one is gibberish it would have to be the other reading.

Thanks.

 

[Enma Ai]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

I'm planning on getting a Textbook. Is it good to get one and stick with it? or first get one and then later on go into classes?

 

[boemshiika]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

I'm planning on getting a Textbook. Is it good to get one and stick with it? or first get one and then later on go into classes?

one of the study techniques that work for me the most is to read through the book first, that way when i get to class things will start making more sense when the teacher is explaining them.

so before i start taking classes i better make sure i've got the kanas down + a couple hundred kanjis(grade 1-3) and some basic grammer like topic particles, regular/iregular verbs, plain/ polite forms etc.

 

[Enma Ai]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

one of the study techniques that work for me the most is to read through the book first, that way when i get to class things will start making more sense when the teacher is explaining them.

so before i start taking classes i better make sure i've got the kanas down + a couple hundred kanjis(grade 1-3) and some basic grammer like topic particles, regular/iregular verbs, plain/ polite forms etc.

So how many textbooks do you recommend i get? and which ones?

 

[boemshiika]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=817282#post817282

you'll find more help here since i don't use any text books. i don't really use my time wisely so this website;http://www.nihongoresources.com/ is just about enough for me. but if your someone who reads whilst travelling or in waiting rooms and stuff like that then a text book would be much better.

 

[Enma Ai]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

http://mangahelpers.com/forums/showthread.php?p=817282#post817282

you'll find more help here since i don't use any text books. i don't really use my time wisely so this website;http://www.nihongoresources.com/ is just about enough for me. but if your someone who reads whilst travelling or in waiting rooms and stuff like that then a text book would be much better.

There was this website that shows you all of the different textbooks, i think it's from wikipedia, you know it? i forgot what it's called.

 

[sabret00the]

Re: Teach me Japanese, please..

I tried rosetta stone out and now i'm getting pretty good at japanese.. I highly recommend it to anyone who wants to learn another language

I started my Rosetta Stone training today. I got levels 1, 2 and 3. Does anyone know how long it will take me before I'm able to watch anime without the subtitles? Or read unscanlated manga?

 

[boemshiika]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

this software looks good =o.. i might have to get one when i get bored with this self teach book im studying. the more vocab/grammer i learn the more words i recognize when im listening to/reading japanese

 

[sabret00the]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

Can someone recommend a good dictionary? Or something similar I can read while on the move in order to facilitate my recognition and understanding of characters?

 

[4ghost]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

This is the or something that I have used, Kanji & Kana A Handbook of the Japanese Writing System.



Ill ask my brother what he would recommend.

 

[sabret00the]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

Much appreciated 4ghost.

 

[Amzy]

Re: Help with learning japanese

Ooh, this thread is really awesome. So many interesting links! I'll definitely check these out. Anyway, I dunno if anyone still visits this thread, but I thought I'd add to the list...

http://lrnj.com/
"Main product: a retro-console style RPG which teaches kanji recognition and readings, and has modes to help you learn to read katakana and hiragana, as well as other basic skills needed for Japanese." Kill the monsters, level up, save the princess. All while learning kanji. Although I only used this program for about a week, I found it a unique and fun way to learn kanji. I found the mnemonics (omg, I was spelling this as "pneumonic"...) for the kanji very helpful and I thought they actually worked. The free version includes about 200 kanji while the paid version includes about 2000 kanji and other stuff.

 

[pirateninjahunter]

Re: Help with learning japanese

I started to study japanese about 2 months ago. I use the book "Japanese for Busy people". I think it is good.

 

[Nin042]

Re: Learn how to read Manga: The Japanese Study Thread

uh.. I haven't looked through all the pages of this thread so I don't know if a Japanese person came up, but if anyone needs help I can help since I'm Japanese. and wow last post August 14.

 

[Metal D. Reaper]

Re: Help with learning japanese

I want to become a translator but my basic understanding of japanese is kindergarten level at best. Is there any suggestions to help me learn the language to profiency?

My level is also kindergarten I know my hiragana and katakana but because I have exams in like 8 days I really can't start kanji but I translate some text of manga it takes quite a time but little stuff like aiki and now doing my first bleach and then the kanji I let blank on my sheet
Going to by a book for cristmas kanji the 2000 signs or something like that

 

[degozaru]

Re: Help with learning japanese

JapanesePod101.com is one site I'd really recommend to anyone interested in learning Japanese

 

[Sharaku]

Hiragana Dictionary

I couldn't find a site on this forum for introductions to other members and I'm sorry for asking this a bit early but I was wondering if anyone knows of a hiragana dictionary. I've been translating books for a while now and the only real thing I can translate in them are the kanji and few hiragana words from two of my Japanese to English dictionaries. While it would be easy to use a computer for my translation needs I'm not always around a computer to translate the hiragana in my books. It's become kind of annoying to me because I feel as though I'm missing something because I can't translate the hiragana. If anyone knows of book on translating hiragana or a hiragana dictionary, I would be very greatful. Thank you for your time.

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I'm sorry for posting again. I meant to ask what do the translators for this site use to translate hiragana a book or a website.