Predictions The Raid will Fail.

Windfall Island

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Will gladly accept if i turn out to be wrong about this one.

Most of you people are more like :- "wano is so longggg...come one already...just end it" emotional camp ; or the "too big to fail" logic camp.

For me , Hyogoro saying "somehow i cant imagine us losing anymore" is a big red flag to me.
The rest of the arguments are presented here by Morj :-

If you choose to reply , please first of all watch the video & then mention your thoughts. Thank You.
 

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Of course I watch Mr. Morj.
Since his previous videos, I was a believer of this prediction.

Watching this video, And last 10chapters…I would have to say I’m very very hesistant in believing the raid is going to Fail.

Luffy getting defeated again!!! Def deserves the face the SHP made when they 1st found out Luffy lost vs Kaido. It’s inconceivable, after all these power ups, he still loses to Kaido.

It’d just to hard to imagine, but Mr.Morj makes some really good points. At this moment idk anymore, I actually use to want the raid to fail, but now I really don’t
 

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Of course I watch Mr. Morj.
Since his previous videos, I was a believer of this prediction.

Watching this video, And last 10chapters…I would have to say I’m very very hesistant in believing the raid is going to Fail.

Luffy getting defeated again!!! Def deserves the face the SHP made when they 1st found out Luffy lost vs Kaido. It’s inconceivable, after all these power ups, he still loses to Kaido.

It’d just to hard to imagine, but Mr.Morj makes some really good points. At this moment idk anymore, I actually use to want the raid to fail, but now I really don’t
So i think that irrespective of whether the raid fails or not , Kaido will 100% win this round vs Luffy. Raid failing chances are somewhat lower for me but still above 50% right now.
 

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Honestly I don't see the raid itself failing. I don't see it being all happy fun rainbows and banquets afterward, either.

I was listening in parallel to doing other things so I may have missed it but he didn't seem to address CP0. He seems to fall back a lot on "X happened for a reason so that's why Y will happen" but Lucci's whole discussion with the agents on Onigashima was very relevant and represents a fork in the plot; It could go that Kaido wins, CP0 backs off their battleships and commences trade negotiations with New Onigashima, or Kaido falls and they step in to annex Wano into the WG system as a directly managed subordinate country. I don't see how you can say "Yamato is going to disarm bombs because Onigashima IS going to fall" but not "CP0 has battle ships in tow because Kaido IS going to fall."

I think Marco's theory on the raid "failing" is a bit more fleshed out and less "I want this to happen so it will happen." Here is that video. I haven't watched in in a hot minute but I can try to summarize it. Basically he outlines that the island that Drake landed on during the time-skip (where Scotch was, Kaido's "favorite Island") and where Caribou's side-story happened, is actually kaido's original base, and where Onigashima originally came from. He notes that the island is being "built" artificially - everything from trees to mountains. He also notes that Law and Robin found poneglyphs but not THE poneglyph, thus Kaido might have it stashed away in another location. Marco was correct about Kanjuro way before the reveal ever happened, too.

I wouldn't be surprised if we see Kaido "defeated" here, but it's not a pure defeat of a Yonko by Luffy in that it doesn't equate to Luffy being able to go toe to to with say, an undamaged / unfatigued Yonko, and defeat them. It went from 1v9 to 2v5 to 1v1 to 1v1 to 1v1. Kaido's gone through a gauntlet of very strong fighters and is weakened / roughed up for Luffy now. What I could see happening is Kaido DOES get some level of a whoopin' from Luffy while also realizing CP0 is closing in, and his alliance is flipping. I could see him gathering his core group (TF6 and Calamities) to "regroup" on his "home island", with plans to move back in on Wano. This would shift the battle over to Luffy & Alliance vs. CP0. Perhaps BM will even call a temporary truce to avoid her own capture, then head back to WCI stating how things aren't settled with Luffy and that she will destroy him eventually.

So in summary: I could see Kaido "losing" but a soft loss. Not knocked unconscious and arrested like Doflamingo. He dragons up and takes his core group out. The alliance is winded enough and has CP0 to deal with so he takes advantage of the situation knowing he can likely retake Wano if he goes and collects his strength and performs a more pointed attack. Wano gets liberated under Momo after CP0 is "repelled" and flies Luffy's flag over it as his territory now, which would mean Luffy likely has Uranus (Momo could potentially be Uranus) and Poseidon on his side for the final war. Drake will probably be less into the whole CP0 doing Tenryuubito's bidding, and thankful for Luffy's help in saving his life and flip him a bonus letting him know where Kaido likely retreated to. The SHP recognize they still lack a Road Poneglyph and regroup to go take on Kaido in a more traditional OP arc fashion. Luffy vs Kaido, Sanji and Zoro rematched vs King and Queen, and the whole group getting their own battles instead of what we've thus far experienced. Luffy takes the Poneglyph from Kaido and defeats him 100%, cementing himself as a yonko level fighter who can compete with Blackbeard, Shanks, and BM.

I also think the final Road Poneglyph is either in Blackbeard's possession or the WG (likely the former).
 

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Honestly I don't see the raid itself failing. I don't see it being all happy fun rainbows and banquets afterward, either.

I was listening in parallel to doing other things so I may have missed it but he didn't seem to address CP0. He seems to fall back a lot on "X happened for a reason so that's why Y will happen" but Lucci's whole discussion with the agents on Onigashima was very relevant and represents a fork in the plot; It could go that Kaido wins, CP0 backs off their battleships and commences trade negotiations with New Onigashima, or Kaido falls and they step in to annex Wano into the WG system as a directly managed subordinate country. I don't see how you can say "Yamato is going to disarm bombs because Onigashima IS going to fall" but not "CP0 has battle ships in tow because Kaido IS going to fall."

I think Marco's theory on the raid "failing" is a bit more fleshed out and less "I want this to happen so it will happen." Here is that video. I haven't watched in in a hot minute but I can try to summarize it. Basically he outlines that the island that Drake landed on during the time-skip (where Scotch was, Kaido's "favorite Island") and where Caribou's side-story happened, is actually kaido's original base, and where Onigashima originally came from. He notes that the island is being "built" artificially - everything from trees to mountains. He also notes that Law and Robin found poneglyphs but not THE poneglyph, thus Kaido might have it stashed away in another location. Marco was correct about Kanjuro way before the reveal ever happened, too.

I wouldn't be surprised if we see Kaido "defeated" here, but it's not a pure defeat of a Yonko by Luffy in that it doesn't equate to Luffy being able to go toe to to with say, an undamaged / unfatigued Yonko, and defeat them. It went from 1v9 to 2v5 to 1v1 to 1v1 to 1v1. Kaido's gone through a gauntlet of very strong fighters and is weakened / roughed up for Luffy now. What I could see happening is Kaido DOES get some level of a whoopin' from Luffy while also realizing CP0 is closing in, and his alliance is flipping. I could see him gathering his core group (TF6 and Calamities) to "regroup" on his "home island", with plans to move back in on Wano. This would shift the battle over to Luffy & Alliance vs. CP0. Perhaps BM will even call a temporary truce to avoid her own capture, then head back to WCI stating how things aren't settled with Luffy and that she will destroy him eventually.

So in summary: I could see Kaido "losing" but a soft loss. Not knocked unconscious and arrested like Doflamingo. He dragons up and takes his core group out. The alliance is winded enough and has CP0 to deal with so he takes advantage of the situation knowing he can likely retake Wano if he goes and collects his strength and performs a more pointed attack. Wano gets liberated under Momo after CP0 is "repelled" and flies Luffy's flag over it as his territory now, which would mean Luffy likely has Uranus (Momo could potentially be Uranus) and Poseidon on his side for the final war. Drake will probably be less into the whole CP0 doing Tenryuubito's bidding, and thankful for Luffy's help in saving his life and flip him a bonus letting him know where Kaido likely retreated to. The SHP recognize they still lack a Road Poneglyph and regroup to go take on Kaido in a more traditional OP arc fashion. Luffy vs Kaido, Sanji and Zoro rematched vs King and Queen, and the whole group getting their own battles instead of what we've thus far experienced. Luffy takes the Poneglyph from Kaido and defeats him 100%, cementing himself as a yonko level fighter who can compete with Blackbeard, Shanks, and BM.

I also think the final Road Poneglyph is either in Blackbeard's possession or the WG (likely the former).
I am really happy that you brought in Marco OP theorist's Kaido's real HQ Road poneglyph video. Because , i have viewed the Mr morj raid will fail theory in conjunction with Marco op theorist's theory. Both of these theories actually compliment each other & make much more sense when seen in combination.

Also as you might have seen in morj's video itself that the evidence in this video is just 1/3rd of the total no. of reasons why raid will fail. He had made 2 more videos on this earlier & if you find the time , then do check them out.

So in this video by morj , he did mention about cp-0 at the end. He thinks that cp-0/navy ships will engage with kaido & BM which will help SHs & samurais escape.

Now i personally think that , even if kaido wins , cp-0 could still decide to take action thinking that Kaido is not defeated but weak enough for them to get rid of 1 yonko . This might turn out to be a miscalculation , an overconfidence on Wg/cp0/navy's part but will give the chance to SHs to run away alive.

Wg/cp0/navy would probably handcuff & get rid of king,queen,jack,F6,smile users to throw them into navy ships to take them to Impel down (so that we dont get a rematch vs beast pirates...that would be too boring) but say they fail to capture kaido & then would have to back off. The raid has failed coz kaido & bm are still there. Zoro runs off with a group of samurai. SHs & alliance memebers run off in different direction.

Now in comes marco op theorist's theory. By the way in another one of Marco op theorist's theory he predicted that RA will arrive in Wano. So say the RA arrives. Kaido & BM decide to make a strategic retreat to kaido's real HQ (as shown in the marco video posted by you)by kaido flying off onigashima to his real hq far outside of wano. Say BM even exchanges her road poneglyph with kaido to further cement their alliance. BM calls in all of BMPs.

15 more days pass (1 month complete as per Hawkin's initial prediction). RA & SH samurai alliance know that Kaido & BM are going to strike again.Everyone trains even more in preparation of the storm that is to come.
This time the fight is SHs vs BMP top officers . No nerfing of nami & ussop's opponenets anymore. BMP also being taken care of in wano itself.

Zoro gets the nidai & Momo gets oden's other sword since now he has grown worthy enough.
Kaido , BM , BMPs vs Luffy & SHs , RA , Momo , Samurais.
Luffy beats Kaido 1 v 1 start to finish. Luffy takes that zoro injection & then 1v 1 beats BM.

^^ Something along those lines.

tldr:- morj's raid will fail + marco op theorist's kaido's real hq theory make up for a great final climax to the story. Onigashima raid is just a false climax.
 

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It is a huge payoff with little risk to side with Morj on this.

Either your wrong... and it was obvious so it's not that big of a deal

Or

Holy shit your right! You were one of the few who believed it.

I'd be up for this theory if I thought for a second Luffy was going to lose to Kaido once again(and I have before) . I just don't see it happening.
 

Windfall Island

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It is a huge payoff with little risk to side with Morj on this.

Either your wrong... and it was obvious so it's not that big of a deal

Or

Holy shit your right! You were one of the few who believed it.

I'd be up for this theory if I thought for a second Luffy was going to lose to Kaido once again(and I have before) . I just don't see it happening.
Haha you are right about that. How about i bet my account on this lol . If the raid doesn't fail , then i would honorably commit seppuku by refraining from commenting on One piece till the story ends. Maybe thats a bit too much ; i'll just publicly hold a L infront of everyone if the raid doesnt fail XD

Just the exciting ramifications & the way wano will be viewed if the raid fails is what makes me cheer for it. If wano were to be wrapped up just as it is now , then things will feel quite incomplete on many fronts.

There are some people who were screaming in WCI "lets get done with it, lets go to wano" & now in wano they are like "lets get done with it, lets move on to elbaf" ; so those type of people aside , Right now the climax(false climax if the raid actually failed) that we have set up here can be so much more if the raid actually failed. The true climax following that wont even require huge no. of chapters for a far more emotionally invested setup.

Also do check out marco op theorist's Kaido's real HQ theory, which has been linked by @catagon87 above. That further adds another interesting dimension to morj's theory.
 

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I don't want the raid to fail because my heart can't handle another TF6 shit show. They were underwhelming.

But if only Kaido, King, Queen and Jack withdraw, then I am ok with that. I wanted Jack to fight Jinbei.
 

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I don't want the raid to fail because my heart can't handle another TF6 shit show. They were underwhelming.

But if only Kaido, King, Queen and Jack withdraw, then I am ok with that. I wanted Jack to fight Jinbei.
King,queen,jack,F6 can all be thrown out of the story using Cp-0 . I would prefer SH vs Kaido,BM & BMP top guys in the final match to get done with BMP as well by the end of the arc.
 

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This is the 3rd video from Morj. He makes some really good points.

Where is the the "lurking legend"?

Also, it has already been leaked long ago that Jinbe and Jack will have a match of sort
 

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This is the 3rd video from Morj. He makes some really good points.

Where is the the "lurking legend"?

Also, it has already been leaked long ago that Jinbe and Jack will have a match of sort
the lurking legend being related to wb has to be rocks only. Maybe oda meant the yonko alliance to be synonymous with rox crew as the lurking legend. That would be kind of underwhelming. I hope that rocks d xebec returns though. Or maybe he is latent inside BB.

in any case , i think during kaido's flashback in wano arc itself , we will get to know more about xebec.

what would be the translation of the image that you linked ?
 

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I watched yesterday and forgot to say my piece.

Eh, I can see where he's coming from but it feels like he can't see the forest for the trees.

He's getting to into certain details and drawing conclusions from those points alone without considering narrative structure.

The pacing of this would be crap at this point. For all intents and purposes, we should be at the climax of the arc. To have all of this rev up only for it to lull back down and then switch to revving up again wouldn't really be good storytelling. If the Raid were to fail, it should've been right after the Scabbards fight or the Supernova fight at the most.

There's also the rule of three. Luffy lost against Kaido twice already. A third lost would be superfluous and repetitive. At most Luffy will be downed temporarily and get back up in the same chapter like the Rob Lucci fight.

Kaido's will assuredly have brief flashbacks before he and Luffy really get to business with the full flashback potentially being shown at the end of the fight.

As for the other characters, the seeds he says have been planted don't require failure as the catalyst or even necessarily be reaped in Wano.

Zoro's lineage doesn't really matter in the long run. Mainly because he's his own person and he's always been his own person. The parallels Oda's bring up just shows that great swordsmanship is in his blood and that's enough, IMO. I doubt Zoro himself would care.

As for the leadership, not only is there still time, but that doesn't need to be addressed in this arc. Same with his understanding CoC, but I expect that to be addressed against King.

Sanji's current developments are the cumulation and continuation of his WCI developments. It's something that'll likely follow him to the end of the series, so it doesn't necessarily have to be resolved in Wano. If anything, the Queen fight may open up more questions.

Yamato's arc depends on whether or not he joins the crew. But I expected a portion of the arc to be addressed alongside Kaido's and after the big fight. Which makes sense as the goal is to be free and explore the seas.

Momo and Hiyori arcs are somewhat intertwined and will surely intersect towards the end. Momo has stood up to one part of their family's tormentors, so I expect Hiyori to stand up to Orochi using Oden's other sword. Either way, again, it doesn't require failure to bring her into play.

As for Toki, she's dead Jim. Most we'll get is a Hiyori flashback.
 

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I watched yesterday and forgot to say my piece.

Eh, I can see where he's coming from but it feels like he can't see the forest for the trees.

He's getting to into certain details and drawing conclusions from those points alone without considering narrative structure.

The pacing of this would be crap at this point. For all intents and purposes, we should be at the climax of the arc. To have all of this rev up only for it to lull back down and then switch to revving up again wouldn't really be good storytelling. If the Raid were to fail, it should've been right after the Scabbards fight or the Supernova fight at the most.

There's also the rule of three. Luffy lost against Kaido twice already. A third lost would be superfluous and repetitive. At most Luffy will be downed temporarily and get back up in the same chapter like the Rob Lucci fight.

Kaido's will assuredly have brief flashbacks before he and Luffy really get to business with the full flashback potentially being shown at the end of the fight.

As for the other characters, the seeds he says have been planted don't require failure as the catalyst or even necessarily be reaped in Wano.

Zoro's lineage doesn't really matter in the long run. Mainly because he's his own person and he's always been his own person. The parallels Oda's bring up just shows that great swordsmanship is in his blood and that's enough, IMO. I doubt Zoro himself would care.

As for the leadership, not only is there still time, but that doesn't need to be addressed in this arc. Same with his understanding CoC, but I expect that to be addressed against King.

Sanji's current developments are the cumulation and continuation of his WCI developments. It's something that'll likely follow him to the end of the series, so it doesn't necessarily have to be resolved in Wano. If anything, the Queen fight may open up more questions.

Yamato's arc depends on whether or not he joins the crew. But I expected a portion of the arc to be addressed alongside Kaido's and after the big fight. Which makes sense as the goal is to be free and explore the seas.

Momo and Hiyori arcs are somewhat intertwined and will surely intersect towards the end. Momo has stood up to one part of their family's tormentors, so I expect Hiyori to stand up to Orochi using Oden's other sword. Either way, again, it doesn't require failure to bring her into play.

As for Toki, she's dead Jim. Most we'll get is a Hiyori flashback.
So the morj video that i linked was just his final video for the raid failing. The other 2/3rd of the more evidence for this theory is present in his previous 2 videos.

I think he made some conclusions precisely from the narrative structures that act 1 to so far had been character arcs for 9RS & its now only that yamato,sanji,zoro , momo are beginning their character arcs.

About that rule of three. Morj specifically mentions that Oda offpaneled luffy's 2nd defeat which he had not for luffy's 2nd defeat to crocodile. It would be too long to go into detail about this point but this specific point morj adressed in more detail as to why this makes a better case for the raid to fail.

Also Luffy's return this time wasnt like a much needed return when everything has become dire & hopeless ; more like yamato had stopped kaido to go berserk.

Also why cant kaido be an unprecetended villan & accomplish something no other villan could so far by defeating Luffy yet again. After all Kaido one shotting luffy was already an unprecetended villan feat.

I kind of agree on your zoro & sanji points. Oda can do it the way you mentioned. Toki is also probably dead too. But just a hiyori flashback wont do justice to her character arc. That might need some more time but maybe not require the raid to fail.

Yamato assuming is about to join would require a proper character arc ; we just got introduced to this naive person who has to become something more than "i want to be like oden".

I personally think that if oda wants to finish the entire Beast pirates & BMP (not just the smoothie crew in wano) & Kaido & BM before moving to elbaf+ if he wants to focus more on Cp-0/navy/wg ships that just arrived + SSG hyping up + Vegapunk + Dragon & RA arrival maybe + SH grandfleet + hawkins' 1 month prediction & say also giving luffy more power ups & to make the entire SH crew truly Yonko lvl crew + a mini arc around kaido's road poneglyph itself which seems to be neither on wano nor on onigashima & so many other plot points ; then maybe the raid failing will give some more breathing space.

Also a further 15 days can be done within just 2-3 chapters. The new setup need not be a brand new one coz that would take way more time. More like version 2.0 with far higher stakes.

But ok at the end oda can skip this raid will theory so lets see how this goes.
 

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Depends on what you consider the raid failing to be. I don't think odds are particularly high of luffy not defeating kaido at this point (battles of attrition are in luffy's favor usually) but for argument's sake lets say it's a possibility. Does anyone imagine this arc not ending with kaido being at a mininum repelled from wano? Can the raid be a failure if kaido is kicked out but luffy ends up barely losing his battle against him?
 

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Depends on what you consider the raid failing to be. I don't think odds are particularly high of luffy not defeating kaido at this point (battles of attrition are in luffy's favor usually) but for argument's sake lets say it's a possibility. Does anyone imagine this arc not ending with kaido being at a mininum repelled from wano? Can the raid be a failure if kaido is kicked out but luffy ends up barely losing his battle against him?
Kaido will fall, the only question is will Onigashima collapse.
 

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Depends on what you consider the raid failing to be. I don't think odds are particularly high of luffy not defeating kaido at this point (battles of attrition are in luffy's favor usually) but for argument's sake lets say it's a possibility. Does anyone imagine this arc not ending with kaido being at a mininum repelled from wano? Can the raid be a failure if kaido is kicked out but luffy ends up barely losing his battle against him?
Raid failing = SHs wont defeat Kaido & Beast Pirates over the course of onigashima battle & the SH alliance will get defeated instead.

i think that kaido will be temporarily repelled from wano but that would be more so due to say either the cp 0/navy/wg ships thinking that kaido is weak enough now to be captured & moving in or say RA arriving. Such a scenario could force Kaido to a strategic retreat from Wano temporarily.

If luffy ends up barely losing to kaido & kaido is kicked out from wano but that being due to a 3rd party factor then it is a raid failure coz that 3rd party factor (say BM's betrayal or RA arrival or CP 0/WG/Navy) ultimately ended up pushing kaido out (temporarily).

SH alliance by themselves were unable to finish the job & lost to Kaido so the raid failed even though Kaido is now pushed out of wano.
 

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Luffy may not "lose" to Kaido, but what will likely happen is the falling of Onigashima or something related to that will cause an end to the current battle. It is a raid. So it will function like but one fight in an actual war. Both sides will retreat to recover. Then, the Marines will likely be triggered into acting. I think this is the key point. What is likely is that the Alliance is forced to retreat due to Onigashima falling. Momo will maybe sweep the whole capital up in his clouds at the last second, saving the people, but the island still falls, or something. Just brainstorming.

Point is, the Marines will have cause to believe that one side or other has "lost", or sustained enough casualties. Or the Gorosei come up with a new plan and progress with the invasion.

My suspicion is that the revolutionary army will become involved and that is the plot trigger. There's lots of those, though, like me. Zeha.

But as for the raid failing in, Kaido wipes everyone out or forces a retreat? Unlikely.
 

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Luffy may not "lose" to Kaido, but what will likely happen is the falling of Onigashima or something related to that will cause an end to the current battle. It is a raid. So it will function like but one fight in an actual war. Both sides will retreat to recover. Then, the Marines will likely be triggered into acting. I think this is the key point. What is likely is that the Alliance is forced to retreat due to Onigashima falling. Momo will maybe sweep the whole capital up in his clouds at the last second, saving the people, but the island still falls, or something. Just brainstorming.

Point is, the Marines will have cause to believe that one side or other has "lost", or sustained enough casualties. Or the Gorosei come up with a new plan and progress with the invasion.

My suspicion is that the revolutionary army will become involved and that is the plot trigger. There's lots of those, though, like me. Zeha.

But as for the raid failing in, Kaido wipes everyone out or forces a retreat? Unlikely.
Agreed. I dont mean that Raid failing = Kaido wipes everyone out.(That is unlikely although ofcourse it would be a failure as well).

Looking at the current situation -> Obstacles yet to overcome are -> Kaido -> Big Mom (wants to capture Robin & ofcourse take a revenge on SHs)+ Smoothie,Daifuku & BMPs ->CP-0 -> Navy. I dont think that some of these obstacles will start to fight one another just to make it convinient enough for SHs to win it all & claim wano to be their territory at the end of this raid. They will fail in opening the borders of Wano at the end of the raid. They will be defeated by one of the 4 obstacles mentioned above & will have to make a strategic temporary retreat.
 

grey matter

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MH中毒 / MH Chuudoku / MH Addicted
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I want the raid to fail, but I doubt it will happen. Apparently the series is about to finish in 5 years? There isn't much time

I also think the final Road Poneglyph is either in Blackbeard's possession or the WG (likely the former).
Didn't Roger have one himself?

Considering Roger surrendered, I can see the following scenarios:
- Marines seized it
- Roger entrusted it to Rayleigh, who gave it to Shanks or someone else in Roger's crew
 
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