Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2011 - 2012] - Discussion and TOC Talk

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Negative Syndicate

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Yes, I averaged from every Issue :D
Then, there going to be bias in data for 2011. The series that started in 2011 doesn't have same number of scores as a series that has been serialized for more than a year; in other word, the ranking doesn't really tell anything. When you doing average, you have to same number of scores for all of them.

For example, how can you compare average ranking between Medaka and Kagami, since Medaka has 47 chapters in this year and Kagami only has 20 chapters. The more number of scores will make difference in average score.
 
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SSJWill4

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Yes, I averaged from every Issue :D
I was going to do something similar once Issue 52's data was out lol. Did you do all the calculations by hand? I have an excel sheet with all the data of series rankings from 2010 and 2011 with formulas for the averages if you would want it for future use. Just pm me if you are interested (won't be home until Sunday though).

Then, there going to be bias in data for 2011. The series that started in 2011 doesn't have same number of scores as a series that has been serialized for more than a year; in other word, the ranking doesn't really tell anything. When you doing average, you have to same number of scores for all of them.

For example, how can you compare average ranking between Medaka and Kagami, since Medaka has 47 chapters in this year and Kagami only has 20 chapters. The more number of scores will make difference in average score.
Even series that lasted a year may have different amont of chapters depending on if there were any absences or double chapters (like this last jump w/ Kochikame). It won't be perfect, but it's still fun to see a year's ToC so to speak. :)
 

Negative Syndicate

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Even series that lasted a year may have different amont of chapters depending on if there were any absences or double chapters (like this last jump w/ Kochikame). It won't be perfect, but it's still fun to see a year's ToC so to speak. :)
But isn't it better to have data that is very close to perfect? All of series chapters are very different because some series have absents, more color pages than others, and like having double chapters. In mathematics, a small difference in score can make very big difference on the average ranking. :(

This site provide very different mathematical approach as compared to Zeromcd.
http://hamada.tsukaeru.info/jump/2011/jump1150.html
 
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SSJWill4

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

But isn't it better to have data that is very close to perfect? All of series chapters are very different because some series have absents, more color pages than others, and like having double chapters. In mathematics, a small difference in score can make very big difference on the average ranking. :(

This site provide very different mathematical approach as compared to Zeromcd.
http://hamada.tsukaeru.info/jump/2011/jump1150.html
Thanks for the link. :) It is nice to see that they only use a sample of 10 chapters, but it still runs into the absences problem (One Piece is an average of 8 scores compared to HxH's 10 scores for instance). If we just remove series that did not last the whole year then the year summary data would be very similar to this website's approach to calculating averages.
 

Negative Syndicate

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Thanks for the link. :) It is nice to see that they only use a sample of 10 chapters, but it still runs into the absences problem (One Piece is an average of 8 scores compared to HxH's 10 scores for instance). If we just remove series that did not last the whole year then the year summary data would be very similar to this website's approach to calculating averages.
I know that webiste is not perfect, but I think it is very near perfect. When we try to calculate the average for whole year, then there going to be big error because of very large sample size. However, calculating the average for 10 weeks reduce large amount of error as compared to averaging whole year.
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

I know that webiste is not perfect, but I think it is very near perfect. When we try to calculate the average for whole year, then there going to be big error because of very large sample size. However, calculating the average for 10 weeks reduce large amount of error as compared to averaging whole year.
You do realize that a larger sample size leads to more accurate results right?
 

Negative Syndicate

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

You do realize that a larger sample size leads to more accurate results right?
However, in Jump ranking's case, if we try to calculate the average for whole year, it is very difficult to get near perfect average comparison since the number of chapters in each series are different from another. In order to compare the rankings, the sample size for each of them have to be equal; there is no point to compare ranking if one has 40 chapters and other has only 20 chapters.
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

However, in Jump ranking's case, if we try to calculate the average for whole year, it is very difficult to get near perfect average comparison since the number of chapters in each series are different from another. In order to compare the rankings, the sample size for each of them have to be equal; there is no point to compare ranking if one has 40 chapters and other has only 20 chapters.
Yeah...that's why I said, "If we just remove series that did not last the whole year then the year summary data would be very similar to this website's approach to calculating averages." :P
 

Negative Syndicate

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Yeah...that's why I said, "If we just remove series that did not last the whole year then the year summary data would be very similar to this website's approach to calculating averages." :P
Did you consider the differences on the absenses and color pages between series that lasted whole year?
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Did you consider the differences on the absenses and color pages between series that lasted whole year?
Yes. I don't think it impacts the data as much as you are claiming. Since this is just us going back and forth we should probably take this to PMs from here...didn't realize how many posts we have accumulated.
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Wasn't One Piece suppose to celebrate 15 years of serialization with a "special page"? What happened with that?
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Wasn't One Piece suppose to celebrate 15 years of serialization with a "special page"? What happened with that?
I think it was a mistake, since iirc OP's serialization started in August '97.
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Series from the main magazine that will be appearing in Jump Next!

- Medaka Box (Good Loser Kumagawa)
- Sket Dance
- Nurarihyon no Mago
- Enigma (Final Chapter)
- PSI Kusou Saiki
- Magico
- ST&RS
- Kurogane
- Nisekoi
- Packy
Does it means that Harisugawa will be canceled soon? Like when Oumagadoki wasnt included in the Spring edition and Light Wing in the Winter edition.
 

SSJWill4

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Does it means that Harisugawa will be canceled soon? Like when Oumagadoki wasnt included in the Spring edition and Light Wing in the Winter edition.
It does feel like a bad omen. I actually like Harisugawa better than all the other 2011 new series, so I will definitely be bummed if it's canceled. :/
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Does it means that Harisugawa will be canceled soon? Like when Oumagadoki wasnt included in the Spring edition and Light Wing in the Winter edition.
It does feel like a bad omen. I actually like Harisugawa better than all the other 2011 new series, so I will definitely be bummed if it's canceled. :/
Sure guys... Harisugawa had one bottom 5 rating since its rating started. We don't know what the current ToC is and the last chapter says it will have a center colour page. You don't give a soon to be axed series a center colour page. Harisugawa has already "survived" the upcoming round of axes. If you even can speak about survival, knowing that some other recent series are doing worse
 

Negative Syndicate

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Sure guys... Harisugawa had one bottom 5 rating since its rating started.
Actually, Harisugawa dropped to bottom 5 three times; even it has gotten color page, there is a chance that it'll return to bottom 5 after the color page. Harisuagawa is currently one of leading candidates to be axed on next round (along with St&rs).
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Sure guys... Harisugawa had one bottom 5 rating since its rating started. We don't know what the current ToC is and the last chapter says it will have a center colour page. You don't give a soon to be axed series a center colour page. Harisugawa has already "survived" the upcoming round of axes. If you even can speak about survival, knowing that some other recent series are doing worse
Do you remember Bokke-san? It was promoted right before the end as well. I'll agree with you that it's not over yet, but I doubt anyone will really be shocked to see it go. Being excluded from Jump Next! may not spell a death sentence, but it definitely isn't a good thing either...
 

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

It is to early to be proclaiming any series doom, especially with new series premiering less than a month ago and no real idea when the next round of cancellations are coming. There is also the Hunter x Hunter factor: a series will be saved from cancellation whenever it goes on hiatus again, assuming it does. There is a minimum of four more issues before HxH can go back on hiatus.

Kagami has not fared well in the TOC recently, that much is true. Three recent issues in the bottom five as well as a number of issues where (for all intensive purposes) unranked series like Hunter x Hunter and Kochikame pushed it out of the bottom five. Kagami has ranked in the middle frequently enough that nothing can be assumed. Medaka yo-yo'ed between the bottom five and middle when it was new and was not canceled. Jump seems to cut new, non-action manga a lot of slack as there are so few examples at any given time. It should also be remembered that the TOC is not a one person - one vote poll. Votes are weighted by age and gender. No matter what the actual composition of readers, votes from middle school boys who may be embarrassed to vote for a romantic comedy will always outweigh votes from readers over sixteen. Thus action manga tend to be artificially inflated while slice of life and romcon tend to be artificially low. A series like Kagami may be getting enough votes to survive but the editors are pushing it down the TOC to make room for manga that most appeal to Jump's target audience. I would not take a color page as sign of survival but unless Kagami becomes a fixture in the bottom five I would delay proclamations of doom. Always remember: Medaka Box and Akaboshi each had early rankings similar to Kagami. The vast majority of thread regulars declared that Medaka would be canceled and Akaboshi survive based on the logic that Jump gives preference to action and there is never much room for anything else. The actual fact is that action manga are a dime a dozen while it is a real challenge to find comedy, slice of life, and romcon manga. With even a little support the editors will not cancel non-action, it is to hard to find publishable replacements. As long as Kagami continues making occasional visits to the middle of the magazine (sixth from bottom or above) it will survive.

---------- Post added at 03:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:19 PM ----------

Do you remember Bokke-san? It was promoted right before the end as well. I'll agree with you that it's not over yet, but I doubt anyone will really be shocked to see it go. Being excluded from Jump Next! may not spell a death sentence, but it definitely isn't a good thing either...
Bokke bottomed out as soon as Asklepius and Meister were canceled. Both series cushioned Bokke, which rarely ranked higher than sixth or seventh from bottom. That was also the period when To Love Ru and Neuro were permanent bottom five for six months or more, without being canceled. A lot of new series seemed to be safer than they were, as only the most pathetic fell into the bottom five immediately. Bokke is also a case of an easily replaced action/fantasy manga.
 
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Negative Syndicate

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Re: Weekly Shonen Jump [2011] - Discussion and TOC Talk - Part 2

Always remember: Medaka Box and Akaboshi each had early rankings similar to Kagami. The vast majority of thread regulars declared that Medaka would be canceled and Akaboshi survive based on the logic that Jump gives preference to action and there is never much room for anything else.
Actually, Akaboshi did even worse that Kagami; it only manage to escape bottom 5 just once, after that it stayed bottom 5 for whole time. Also, Medaka had slightly better ranking than Akaboshi, so Akaboshi was in more danger than Medaka.
 
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