Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2019] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[Konja9]

Yes, I read the discussion, and I understand the point you are trying to make. Still, when someone says "I can't see what Jump saw in the March-May serializations that made them so worthy to be jump-started", they are expressing an opinion; and when you reply to that with "It doesn't matter if you see potential or not", it sounds like you are telling them that their opinion doesn't matter and they should just shut up.

That's how it came across to me, at least. Maybe it was just bad phrasing.

I guess you can say it's bad phrasing.

I wasn't saying the opinion ("I can't see what Jump saw in the March-May serializations that made them so worthy to be jump-started") doesn't matter.

The thing is he was using this opinion to say WSJ was doing a worse job in its selection this year than the previous (although there are many failures the previous year too).

In this context, it doesn't matter if we see potential or not, because our particular feelings about the batches don't mean WSJ is doing worse job in its selection this year.

 

[4Eyes]

Is this real??????????? Why we don't have any official announcement?

 

[Halloween]

Is this real??????????? Why we don't have any official announcement?

Honestly, I have no idea. I only saw that video because I occasionally browse gachagaming on Reddit.

If I had to guess, there was an official announcement, but it flew completely under the radar. Game looks pretty decent for a mobile game, though.

 

[Leoat12]

This is a really neat question!

Ironically, Naruto had a really slow start. I feel like if it started in 2019, there'd be several people in this thread saying that it wouldn't last the year. It's kind of funny to think about.

Naruto had a slow start? Did we read the same series? The first chapter was already spectacular, followed by great chapters and the arc where Zabuza appeared and all that stuff. Naruto had one of the best starts I've seen. It would survive with flying colors.

One that had a very slow start was Katekyo Hitman Reborn since it is the topic right now. Man... It was like 50 chapters or so of torture before it got slightly interesting, a friend had to convince me to keep going.

 

[Kharthas]

This is a really neat question!

Ironically, Naruto had a really slow start. I feel like if it started in 2019, there'd be several people in this thread saying that it wouldn't last the year. It's kind of funny to think about.

I remember being hooked from the first chapter. Early Naruto is so great that it would become an instant hit no matter the era it's published in.
I mean, the main reason Samurai 8 is having a relatively lukewarm reception is because people can't help but subconsciously compare it to Naruto, and it's just inferior in all aspects (so far)

 

[Leoat12]

One that people here will remember very well is Black Clover. The criticism over the series was so great that I don't know how it survived.

 

[Rain Spectre]

One that people here will remember very well is Black Clover. The criticism over the series was so great that I don't know how it survived.

Because the criticism was purely from people who had indoctrinated themselves into thinking shonen was some kind of genre. In other words, people who have no idea what they're talking about.

 

[Leoat12]

Because the criticism was purely from people who had indoctrinated themselves into thinking shonen was some kind of genre. In other words, people who have no idea what they're talking about.

Huh? I think we didn't discuss anything of the sort here at the time, the discussion was around plagiarism and way too many tropes conveniently set. We know that nothing is original anymore at this day and age, but the argument was that it was too fabricated or something like that.
But anyway, let's not touch in already healed scars. XD

 

[Konja9]

One that people here will remember very well is Black Clover. The criticism over the series was so great that I don't know how it survived.

The criticism seems to be more in english forums.

I don't know how popular Black Clover was in Japan at first. However, Black Clover got its own fanbase.

It likely help that some ideas could look repetitive for old readers in the Jump, but new readers won't have this problem.

Huh? I think we didn't discuss anything of the sort here at the time, the discussion was around plagiarism and way too many tropes conveniently set. We know that nothing is original anymore at this day and age, but the argument was that it was too fabricated or something like that.
But anyway, let's not touch in already healed scars. XD

I remember that the complaints were because they said that Black Clover copied too many ideas from other mangas.

Sometimes the complaints were a bit exaggerated. I remember that Black Clover has a character who hid his conflicts with a smile and some accused the author of copying a character from Rurouni Kenshin.

 

[xAsum0x]

The criticism seems to be more in english forums.

I don't know how popular Black Clover was in Japan at first. However, Black Clover got its own fanbase.

It likely help that some ideas could look repetitive for old readers in the Jump, but new readers won't have this problem.




I remember that the complaints were because they said that Black Clover copied too many ideas from other mangas.

Sometimes the complaints were a bit exaggerated. I remember that Black Clover has a character who hid his conflicts with a smile appeared and some accused the author of copying a character from Rurouni Kenshin.

dont hate Black Clover but the first page is literally a copy of the first page of Naruto lol

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

The criticism against Black Clover was forced as fuck at the time, here it was at a point that i actually stopped visiting the discussions, it was basically a trend to criticize everything and force comparisons just for the sake of it, yes, the manga wasn't any fantastic thing at the beginning, it was cliche but seriously, it was ridiculous to the point where we get stuff like this: https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/in...-2016-results-comic-con-international/.104673

I remember Yonkou being a asshole and inciting hate against Black Clover on twitter because the cover of the issue #50 of 2017 with a totally forced comparison with One Piece just because Asta's black arm, now that he actually follow the manga he is a fan -_-

Basically, it was a hard time if you didn't think that the manga was one of the worst thing ever...

 

[Aipom626]

3rd day of sales and Kamio Yui is at 141th, TSS at 258th, Saiyuki at 348th, Taisei at 390th and Beast Children dropped out of the top 500.

Surprisingly Taisei managed to rise, day 2 was at 450th

If Taisei somehow continues to rise, it'd truly be a miracle. While I was hoping it'd pull the unlikely and place above TSS, I guess I'm satisfied it didn't rank last of the ax trio.

Yui Kamio needs to survive. I don't know you guys, but I'm enjoying it right now and I want to see the harem grow because the art and the girls are fantastic.

Yui Kamio needs to revert back to its original roots. I'd also like to see the harem grow, but I literally have no idea what's going on with all the random gore and battles that just don't seem to flow well.

 

[Rain Spectre]

The criticism against Black Clover was forced as fuck at the time, here it was at a point that i actually stopped visiting the discussions, it was basically a trend to criticize everything and force comparisons just for the sake of it, yes, the manga wasn't any fantastic thing at the beginning, it was cliche but seriously, it was ridiculous to the point where we get stuff like this: https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/in...-2016-results-comic-con-international/.104673

I remember Yonkou being a asshole and inciting hate against Black Clover on twitter because the cover of the issue #50 of 2017 with a totally forced comparison with One Piece just because Asta's black arm, now that he actually follow the manga he is a fan -_-

Basically, it was a hard tome if you didn't think that the manga was one of the worst thing ever...

The folks on ANN hate Jump series in general. Reading their reviews of Kimetsu is downright cringe inducing.

 

[Stivie]

Yui Kamio needs to revert back to its original roots. I'd also like to see the harem grow, but I literally have no idea what's going on with all the random gore and battles that just don't seem to flow well.

if Kamio yui continued from the original path it would have been canceled along with saiyuki.
At least the path they're taking now has brought Nuraryhion fans back.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

Yui Kamio needs to revert back to its original roots. I'd also like to see the harem grow, but I literally have no idea what's going on with all the random gore and battles that just don't seem to flow well.

The first chapter of the manga has supernatural elements and dark Yui violently beating delinquents, the manga was bound to turn into a supernatural and dark battle shounen from the beginning, it's a Hiroshi Shiibashi manga lol

 

[Leoat12]

The criticism seems to be more in english forums.

I don't know how popular Black Clover was in Japan at first. However, Black Clover got its own fanbase.

It likely help that some ideas could look repetitive for old readers in the Jump, but new readers won't have this problem.

By what I remember the series was average in rankings, but it didn't sell that well in Japan, I think it started to change only after the anime.

Yui Kamio needs to revert back to its original roots. I'd also like to see the harem grow, but I literally have no idea what's going on with all the random gore and battles that just don't seem to flow well.

What roots? The series has 24 chapters! The series is following its natural flow, I think nobody would expect a series from Hiroshi Shiibashi to be only a lighthearted romcom. Yui has two personalities, one white and one dark, everybody assumed that he would explain the origin for that at some point, he is explaining now and I think it has been great, the first chapters on the other hand was very uninteresting to me specially because I look for darkness and something edgy on Hiroshi Shiibashi series, not a romcom.
And the battles also, I think I have a different vision, it is not about power, it is more about mind battles and relationship between characters. Yui fought all of them in the past and obliterated them with power alone, but it didn't work and they returned for vengeance, now with Kiito she is seeing another approach. Kiito really cares about Yui and about all the girls and their motives, he defeats them in a way besides strength. Ayako arc now has been interesting, she is gorgeous, sponsored by Shiibashi's art, and all the concept about music of death and the story of her sister, I don't dislike it at all, on the contrary. I think it has a lot of potential and there is a lot os mysteries to solve.

--- Double Post Merged, Sep 8, 2019, Original Post Date: Sep 8, 2019 ---

The first chapter of the manga has supernatural elements and dark Yui violently beating delinquents, the manga was bound to turn into a supernatural and dark battle shounen from the beginning, it's a Hiroshi Shiibashi manga lol

This summarized my delusions pretty well. hahaha
It is not quite delusions though, I like to have deep thought about what I'm reading.

 

[Aipom626]

if Kamio yui continued from the original path it would have been canceled along with saiyuki.
At least the path they're taking now has brought Nuraryhion fans back.

I get why they did it, but in the process, it lost me pretty hard personally. That comment was more a bit of personal disappointment at the change in tone of the series.

The first chapter of the manga has supernatural elements and dark Yui violently beating delinquents, the manga was bound to turn into a supernatural and dark battle shounen from the beginning, it's a Hiroshi Shiibashi manga lol

The recent chapters have felt massively different from the first roughly dozen or so chapters. Any supernatural elements and delinquent fighting at the very beginning wasn't as serious, and reminded me more along the lines of Rokudou no Onna-tachi. There's a minor supernatural element there, but the romcom antics take center stage.

 

[Rain Spectre]

What roots? The series has 24 chapters! The series is following its natural flow, I think nobody would expect a series from Hiroshi Shiibashi to be only a lighthearted romcom. Yui has two personalities, one white and one dark, everybody assumed that he would explain the origin for that at some point, he is explaining now and I think it has been great, the first chapters on the other hand was very uninteresting to me specially because I look for darkness and something edgy on Hiroshi Shiibashi series, not a romcom.
And the battles also, I think I have a different vision, it is not about power, it is more about mind battles and relationship between characters. Yui fought all of them in the past and obliterated them with power alone, but it didn't work and they returned for vengeance, now with Kiito she is seeing another approach. Kiito really cares about Yui and about all the girls and their motives, he defeats them in a way besides strength. Ayako arc now has been interesting, she is gorgeous, sponsored by Shiibashi's art, and all the concept about music of death and the story of her sister, I don't dislike it at all, on the contrary. I think it has a lot of potential and there is a lot os mysteries to solve.

Yeeeeeaaaah...no. Were Yui designed with a clear plan in mind, it wouldn't have wasted so much time on meaningless gag chapters that established virtually nothing about the characters, introduced seeming additions to the cast who vanished as soon as they entered and didn't construct a complete lack of any narrative hints of any kind. I've seen plenty people try to argue that the series genre shift was planned from the start, but other than the first page there is virtually no hints towards such a matter.

I get why they did it, but in the process, it lost me pretty hard personally. That comment was more a bit of personal disappointment at the change in tone of the series.

The recent chapters have felt massively different from the first roughly dozen or so chapters. Any supernatural elements and delinquent fighting at the very beginning wasn't as serious, and reminded me more along the lines of Rokudou no Onna-tachi. There's a minor supernatural element there, but the romcom antics take center stage.

The "delinquent battles" element didn't even last the first volume, it was dropped after the first few chapters.

 

[Aipom626]

What roots? The series has 24 chapters! The series is following its natural flow, I think nobody would expect a series from Hiroshi Shiibashi to be only a lighthearted romcom. Yui has two personalities, one white and one dark, everybody assumed that he would explain the origin for that at some point, he is explaining now and I think it has been great, the first chapters on the other hand was very uninteresting to me specially because I look for darkness and something edgy on Hiroshi Shiibashi series, not a romcom.
And the battles also, I think I have a different vision, it is not about power, it is more about mind battles and relationship between characters. Yui fought all of them in the past and obliterated them with power alone, but it didn't work and they returned for vengeance, now with Kiito she is seeing another approach. Kiito really cares about Yui and about all the girls and their motives, he defeats them in a way besides strength. Ayako arc now has been interesting, she is gorgeous, sponsored by Shiibashi's art, and all the concept about music of death and the story of her sister, I don't dislike it at all, on the contrary. I think it has a lot of potential and there is a lot os mysteries to solve.

The series' first roughly dozen chapters were nearly 100% comedy, regardless of how much of it was hit-or-miss. From the antagonists that were originally being introduced (the martial artist gal, student council chad, those 2 stalker-ish girls, etc), it definitely felt to me like it wasn't going to take such a serious, dark approach to it. It was still early in the serialization, but since about 3 months worth of chapters had come out before the big tone change, I figured he was actually going to try his hand at a lighthearted romcom. I had just assumed that since the first rankings were quite poor, he and the editors decided to do a tonal shift back toward a genre his fans enjoy him making the most.

I do agree that the female designs are pretty nice, especially the level of detail he adds to the hair. This largely plays into why I wanted to see a straight harem romcom from him

 

[Halloween]

Guys, don't EVER use racist terms here again.

I have zero tolerance for that behavior.