Mag Talk Weekly Shounen Jump [2009] - Discussion & TOC Talk

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xi0

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I like Naruto... pretty good manga.

But this is the ToC discussion thread, where it's cool to hate on popular mangas :x

bahhh, Psyren so low ;_; ... let's hope it can stay in the top 10 with volume sales.
That's a valid point...The exception to the rule is One Piece. I LOVE OP, but why does it not garner the same type of hate as a popular series is sometimes surprising. The most I hear from people who don't like it is that they are turned off by the art, which actually fits the series perfectly IMO. But nothing else can be said against it it seems.
 

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because One Piece kind of deserves it's high praise.

Naruto's praise is unwarranted.

I wonder how D. Gray Man's return will impact the ToC. How was it doing before it went on hiatus? I know it was incredibly boring ever since they left the arc.
 

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I think D.Gray-Man was a stable mid-tier at best, but who knows, its hiatus might bring it up in the ranks.
 

Kaiten

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That's a valid point...The exception to the rule is One Piece. I LOVE OP, but why does it not garner the same type of hate as a popular series is sometimes surprising. The most I hear from people who don't like it is that they are turned off by the art, which actually fits the series perfectly IMO. But nothing else can be said against it it seems.
The only people who hate on One Piece haven't read it. Those who don't like the art are the same. I've never met anyone who's read it all the way through and didn't love it. And those of us who have read OP are so quick to defend it I think the haters gave up ^^

I think D.Gray-Man was a stable mid-tier at best, but who knows, its hiatus might bring it up in the ranks.
D. Gray Man is like To Love Ru, but on a much grander scale. While it never polls well, it is a big seller. But where ToRa's sales are similar to Eyeshields (150 - 175,000 copies, first week sales), DGM is dead even with Reborn (350 - 400,000). It may appear to be mid - tier based on the polls, but it's actually one of the most popular in the magazine and has been for a long time. 100 episode anime are hard to come by.
 

eni

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I LOVE OP, but why does it not garner the same type of hate as a popular series is sometimes surprising. The most I hear from people who don't like it is that they are turned off by the art, which actually fits the series perfectly IMO. But nothing else can be said against it it seems.
Isn't the answer simply? People who complain so much about OP's art (like me :smile-big) won't have read deep enough into the story to actually be able to complain about the plot :p

From the little I know about OP, I can also tell you that I find the general setting and story as well as a lot of the minor characters I see here and there, extremely off. It doesn't appeal to me in the least.

As for the 'hatred', that comes mostly with a fanbase which makes a good victim for hate. Very few people actually hate a certain manga, they mostly had the fan behavior (good example: boys love manga - maybe 3 out of 10 complainers have ever read one and just a single one out of these three bothered to get a recommendation first and not just downloaded some trash oneshot for better complains).

Our mod job here at MH shows already that the OP section is far more easy to handle than the Naruto section. While our Naruto mods cry every week over the bunch of deleted posts and warnings, the OP mods tend to relax and laugh in the opposite corner.

Now why? Maybe Naruto is easier to 'get in' due to better art and beginning story? Maybe the characters appeal better for fanfics and artworks which get people to try it out? Or maybe Naruto has a better (fan) promotion? Most through and through 'Narutards' have never tried any other manga from what I hear in the forums, so they're extremely focused and protective on it. On the other hand, most OP readers seem to be at least familiar with a handful of well known series.
 
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Naruto has better art? WHAT ARE YOU ON?!

I wish there was a thread to argue about how much better One Piece is then Bleach and Naruto (Naruto is absolutely horrid. I still read it, but only for lulz.)

Honestly, I suggest you give One Piece a read. It's not about the cartoonish art (even though the art probably is more mature then Naruto's.) the story is leagues above the majority of Shonen's I've read. And I've read just about every battle manga out there. I just can't understand Naruto's appeal at this point. The art looks terrible, the 6 tail form looks like Kishimoto he had Kubo Tite come in and told him to draw the worst possible design he could think of, and the villain is as flat as a piece of paper. There was no emotion from any of Pein's killings, and the DESTRUCTION OF KONOHA was even bland and forced.

I'm sure this post will be deleted because it doesn't have to do with the ToC, but it kind of does, because I don't understand Naruto's appeal, and even though it shouldn't and wouldn't be canceled, it should be put to bed before it gets even worse.
 

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Hellz yeah Mago quite high. I knew once the awesomeness was ranked it would be out of the gutter, but I didn't realize it would be that high. And D. Gray Man somehow snaked the cover from Bleach, or were we given premature info earlier? Either way, I'm pleased with the development.
 

eni

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That is your opinion. My opinion is different on this matter.

I've read into OP, don't worry. It's one of the worst things I've tried and the number of manga I've read during the past 15 years is close to thousand by now, so I like to stand with my opinion on this single one. Tastes are luckily different and therefor no need to bash one series down to praise another. I enjoy being the Narutard I am greatly despite knowing a few hundred better manga.

And yes, this goes offtopic now and also close to bashing on your part. So, let's drop it.
 

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D. Gray Man is like To Love Ru, but on a much grander scale. While it never polls well, it is a big seller. But where ToRa's sales are similar to Eyeshields (150 - 175,000 copies, first week sales), DGM is dead even with Reborn (350 - 400,000). It may appear to be mid - tier based on the polls, but it's actually one of the most popular in the magazine and has been for a long time. 100 episode anime are hard to come by.
Yeah I've considered that, I'm just speaking about D.GM's potential of improving their mid-tier ranking on the toc. Though you're right, when considering it's popularity, it's rank on the toc is moot.
 

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[Cross];1253300 said:
Yeah I've considered that, I'm just speaking about D.GM's potential of improving their mid-tier ranking on the toc. Though you're right, when considering it's popularity, it's rank on the toc is moot.
Gotcha!

DGM's such an odd one as it's one of the only series that can get away with yo - yoing as much as it does. I've never really figured out what keeps it from being as consistantly high as Reborn and Gintama. I've seen a lot of theories, all of which could be true. The only thing I know from observation is that fighting arcs always rank low. For how popular it is with international fans the ark was consistantly in the back half of the magazine. But plot oriented arcs generally do better. The arc about Allen's history and identity from last summer, and even the zombie arc, was always in middle or higher. Scary as it may sound, maybe DGM's fans expect more from it. Maybe they expect it to be a plot oriented actions series, more Full Metal Alchemist and less Dragonball. And when it becomes, if briefly, a tournament manga it's fans penalize it.
 

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DGM's such an odd one as it's one of the only series that can get away with yo - yoing as much as it does. I've never really figured out what keeps it from being as consistantly high as Reborn and Gintama. I've seen a lot of theories, all of which could be true. The only thing I know from observation is that fighting arcs always rank low. For how popular it is with international fans the ark was consistantly in the back half of the magazine. But plot oriented arcs generally do better. The arc about Allen's history and identity from last summer, and even the zombie arc, was always in middle or higher. Scary as it may sound, maybe DGM's fans expect more from it. Maybe they expect it to be a plot oriented actions series, more Full Metal Alchemist and less Dragonball. And when it becomes, if briefly, a tournament manga it's fans penalize it.
Agreed. It seems that DGM just has a different fanbase, one that likes plot. As I was saying earlier in the thread, it's not a generic action manga - it can't be. Perhaps if it found its niche, it'd take a more stable position, although it might also enjoy an audience more outside Jump than Reborn.

Strangely enough, the level 4 arc wasn't even a tournament, and it didn't even last twenty chapters for what was essentially two fights, but...
 

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The ending to the Level 4 fight was amazing, whatever it's rank.

My theory is that DGM's audience is primarily between 15 - 18, an audience large enough to make it a hit in terms of sales, anime, cosplay, etc. but more particular when voting in the magazine. I would guess they would be less willing to vote for their favorite series if they don't like the chapter, whereas an middle schooler would be more loyal.
 

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Oh snap a DGM cover. O_O

Toc for Jump 15.Translated by me.



Others dates.

Firsts sales ranking from Japan, after the first day of the volumes of shueisha.

1-One Piece #53
2-Bakuman #02
3-Eyeshield 21 #34
4-Pluto #07
5-Steel Ball Run #17
6-Shaman King #26
7-Shaman King #25
8-Sket Dance #07
9-Team Medical Dragon #20
10-Psyren #05

From: http://www.jbook.co.jp/p/p.aspx/bun_realrank_02/
Throws hands up high for Shaman King!

Bakuman and ES21 sold very well too and Psyren rounds out the bottom.

1 One Piece
2 Naruto
3 BakuMan
4 Reborn
5 Mago
6 Toriko
7 Gintama
8 To Love
9 Kuroko
10 Inumaru
11 Psyren
12 Bokke-san
13 Sket Dance
14 Eyeshield 21
15 Neuro
I like this ToC for the most part. Bakuman is high and Toriko just barely missed the top 5 which isn't bad in itself. To Love isn't in the basement for the 2nd straight week and One Piece on top as usual.

Wish Psyren would get higher though. ES21 and Neuro at the bottom makes me wonder if their endings will be rushed or not.

and I wonder how Naruto, probably one of the worst written mangas in JUMP manages to stay in the top.

I guess it's just because it's about ninjas.
looooool. So true seeing how most of Part 2 has had some of the most horrendous writing I've seen.
 

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yay for an awesome BB title page!

also d.gray's colour style appears to have changed AGAIN
 

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The cover looks pretty swell, actually. Yeah, Katsura-san is (notorious?) pretty fickle with her artwork, she changes it up a lot. This time no surprise because she disappeared for five months. :sweat

On another note, we did have Ichigo yelling on the cover of Jump after all. :XD
 

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ahahaha well spotted! knew it was 1:1 by any means
 

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My favorite cover in recent memory. Absolutely love it. So glad we got a D. Grey cover as opposed to a Bleach one even more now. :D
 

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yay for an awesome BB title page!

also d.gray's colour style appears to have changed AGAIN
I agree the BB title page is awesome

but what do you mean with change? Just the cover art or the complete D.g-m art (last one is kinda usual in D.g-m)?
 

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style. i'm aware there was the big change around volume 10, then again for the zombie arc onwards (best style yet) but this cover looks different AGAIN. hopefully the chapter will not
 
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