Fantasy Wendy vs. Lucy

[Vis]

I was being conservative, honestly if we ever see the CSK again I think he’ll be a match for a dragon god

I'd be hard pressed to put him on August's or Zeref's level, much less literally the strongest beings in this universe, on-paper at least.
I have a feeling he'd end up having some form of history with Selene that would bump him up with the top guys like the two aforementioned characters, but I extremely doubt he'd be a match for her.

Marin is literal fodder whose only strength is nerfing certain opponents. In a battle how would he down Lisanna?

Marin is fodder but so is Lisanna. I mean, Madmole was no more serious than either Natsu and Gray when they were fighting Marin when he one-shotted Lisanna as Gemini.

It literally doesn’t matter since Wendy is stronger than both Marin AND Lisanna so........?

I don't disagree which is why I only quoted the part you were saying Lisanna was the strongest Lucy has copied, which is the part I disagree with.

 

[Rigel]

Hiro's opinions are canon. They are literally as canon as it gets. If Hiro portrays a character a certain way, we can safely assume that's how he sees the character. And he has Lucy saying that she's the weakest in the group.

Also, there are events in the Alvarez Arc referenced in the crossover in the flashbacks. That means the Lucy of the crossover has the experiences and memories of the Alvarez arc.

Please stop. It's filler. There is no canonical indication that the crossover (3 mangas) is canonical.

Is Fairy Tail + Nanatsu no Taizai canonical?
Fairy Tail + Yamada-kun is canonical?

This is ridiculous. They may be related to the manga, but they are not canonical.

In Mashima's opinion, did Natsu and Haru match Shiki? Shiki is extremely weak compared to these two. But they were still fighting normally.

In fillers, Hiro has creative freedom to do whatever he wants. Eclipse is a good example.

You can insist on arguing, but it doesn't change that you have nothing to prove that this crossover is canonical (ridiculous to consider it).

 

[Jko]

Lucy
Lucy
Wendy
Wendy

We don't know how powerful CSK could be currently and his current feats are not on the level of Wendy B.

 

[Axiomus]

Please stop. It's filler. There is no canonical indication that the crossover (3 mangas) is canonical.

Is Fairy Tail + Nanatsu no Taizai canonical?
Fairy Tail + Yamada-kun is canonical?

This is ridiculous. They may be related to the manga, but they are not canonical.

In Mashima's opinion, did Natsu and Haru match Shiki? Shiki is extremely weak compared to these two. But they were still fighting normally.

In fillers, Hiro has creative freedom to do whatever he wants. Eclipse is a good example.

You can insist on arguing, but it doesn't change that you have nothing to prove that this crossover is canonical (ridiculous to consider it).

Fairy Tail never really crossovered with Nanatsu. The authors simply drew chapters from the other works. Fairy Tail X Yamada Kun is obviously not canonical because it contradicts things that happen in both mangas. Plus, they are crossovers with different manga artists, so Mashima doesn't even have the rights to use these characters outside the crossover.

But Hero's? Hero's is perfectly canon. Why? Because Mashima controls all 3 series, and his self-insert character Mashymre is the god of all 3 of these universes.
The story of Hero's is that Mashimyre created an island and warped reality from the 3 universes. Then afterwards, they all warped back to the original universes. It doesn't contradict any of the established canon.

Shiki did indeed match Natsu and Haru, though obviously Haru and Natsu weren't going all out. Shiki isn't weak though. He smashed Genesis' Sema, and Genesis is literally one of the most powerful characters in Mashima's universe.

 

[Rigel]

Fairy Tail never really crossovered with Nanatsu. The authors simply drew chapters from the other works. Fairy Tail X Yamada Kun is obviously not canonical because it contradicts things that happen in both mangas. Plus, they are crossovers with different manga artists, so Mashima doesn't even have the rights to use these characters outside the crossover.

But Hero's? Hero's is perfectly canon. Why? Because Mashima controls all 3 series, and his self-insert character Mashymre is the god of all 3 of these universes.
The story of Hero's is that Mashimyre created an island and warped reality from the 3 universes. Then afterwards, they all warped back to the original universes. It doesn't contradict any of the established canon.

Shiki did indeed match Natsu and Haru, though obviously Haru and Natsu weren't going all out. Shiki isn't weak though. He smashed Genesis' Sema, and Genesis is literally one of the most powerful characters in Mashima's universe.

You have not proved anything. Anyway, your text is meaningless and the last sentence about Shiki is even more random and nonsense that I won't even answer.

I have no intention of being offensive, but it's amazing how you create a narrative based on a filler and try to put that as a fact for people.

 

[Laboon]

Scenario 1: Wendy is stuck in base form, Lucy can only summon spirits

Lucy w/ Gemini

Scenario 2: Wendy can use Dragon Force and Lucy can use Star Dresses (no Mix)

Lucy w/ Gemini

Scenario 3: Wendy Belserion 1%, Lucy has all her spirits out and has her Star Dress Mix

Wendy

Scenario 4: Wendy Belserion in Alvarez, Lucy teams up with Yukino and summons all twelve spirits and the Celestial Spirit King.

Lucy cuz CSK


btw. people here are really using crossover feats to argue? damn hahaha thats crazy

 

[Axiomus]

You have not proved anything. Anyway, your text is meaningless and the last sentence about Shiki is even more random and nonsense that I won't even answer.

I have no intention of being offensive, but it's amazing how you create a narrative based on a filler and try to put that as a fact for people.

You don't even have an argument against what I've posted. There is no reason why the Hero's crossover wouldn't be considered canon because it doesn't contradict any of the canon material found in the 3 series. That's not even my argument though. My argument is that even if the events of the crossover aren't strictly canon, the characters are still being portrayed the way Hiro Mashima sees them. Therefore, they are accurate portrayals of the characters.

The Lucy in the crossover has memories of the Alvarez arc, which means that the events of the Alvarez arc happened for her. This makes her experiences and memories virtually the same as the "canon" version of Lucy. It makes no difference if the events of the crossover are strictly canon or not, because the characters are virtually the same. Lucy isn't even scaling herself against someone else. She's scaling herself against someone from her own universe.

If you guys really want to play this game, then I'm going to flat out say Lucy can't copy Wendy. The entire argument for that is in YOUR HEADCANON. Lucy has never been stated to have greater or equal amounts of magic power as Wendy, and she's never copied someone as strong as Wendy with Gemini. Obviously, if Hiro Mashima's own crossover is non-canon, then your headcanon is also non-canon.

 

[Rigel]

You don't even have an argument against what I've posted. There is no reason why the Hero's crossover wouldn't be considered canon because it doesn't contradict any of the canon material found in the 3 series. That's not even my argument though. My argument is that even if the events of the crossover aren't strictly canon, the characters are still being portrayed the way Hiro Mashima sees them. Therefore, they are accurate portrayals of the characters.

The Lucy in the crossover has memories of the Alvarez arc, which means that the events of the Alvarez arc happened for her. This makes her experiences and memories virtually the same as the "canon" version of Lucy. It makes no difference if the events of the crossover are strictly canon or not, because the characters are virtually the same. Lucy isn't even scaling herself against someone else. She's scaling herself against someone from her own universe.

If you guys really want to play this game, then I'm going to flat out say Lucy can't copy Wendy. The entire argument for that is in YOUR HEADCANON. Lucy has never been stated to have greater or equal amounts of magic power as Wendy, and she's never copied someone as strong as Wendy with Gemini. Obviously, if Hiro Mashima's own crossover is non-canon, then your headcanon is also non-canon.

You are using a filler to substantiate an answer. Is that an argument? And Lucy was fighting throwing ordinary punches, Rebecca didn't even see her fighting skills.

As for the rest of your post, I could go on, but it's not worth it. Your to use another filler to support your convenience.

Ps: When Hiro wanted to canonize something, he inserted it in the manga. This is the case with Dragon Cry.

 

[Axiomus]

You are using a filler to substantiate an answer. Is that an argument? And Lucy was fighting throwing ordinary punches, Rebecca didn't even see her fighting skills.

As for the rest of your post, I could go on, but it's not worth it. Your to use another filler to support your convenience.

Ps: When Hiro wanted to canonize something, he inserted it in the manga. This is the case with Dragon Cry.

Rebecca wasn't the one making the comment. It was Lucy's own self-assessment.

You know what? I won't even use filler. DF Wendy already outperformed Aquarius Star Dress Lucy during Tartaros. Ezel has more than twice the defence of Jackal, and better attack power too. The only stat that Jackal beats Ezel in was speed, and Jackal's speed wasn't even a factor in any of his fights. So Wendy defeated an opponent twice as durable as Lucy's opponent, and with more attack power too.

Spoiler

Explain to me why Lucy is greater than Wendy in the first place. At best they are equal, and an argument can be made that Wendy is stronger. Gemini copying Wendy is pure headcanon.

 

[Rigel]

Rebecca wasn't the one making the comment. It was Lucy's own self-assessment.

You know what? I won't even use filler. DF Wendy already outperformed Aquarius Star Dress Lucy during Tartaros. Ezel has more than twice the defence of Jackal, and better attack power too. The only stat that Jackal beats Ezel in was speed, and Jackal's speed wasn't even a factor in any of his fights. So Wendy defeated an opponent twice as durable as Lucy's opponent, and with more attack power too.

Spoiler

Explain to me why Lucy is equal or greater than Wendy in the first place. At best they are equal, and an argument can be made that Wendy is stronger. Gemini copying Wendy is pure headcanon.

Lucy fought Jackal and Mard at the same time. Do you want to compare this to Ezel?

Aquarius Star Dress was supporting the CSK and still had magical power to use Uranometry. Lucy even gave the rest of her strength to Galaxia Blade.

 

[Axiomus]

Lucy fought Jackal and Mard at the same time. Do you want to compare this to Ezel?

Aquarius Star Dress was supporting the CSK and still had magical power to use Uranometry. Lucy even gave the rest of her strength to Galaxia Blade.

Lucy didn't fight Mard. The spirit king did, and the vast majority Spirit King's power doesn't come from Lucy. She's just keeping his gate open.

That's totally not what happened. Lucy's Aquarius star dress was giving Lucy the power to keep Spirit King's gate open. She used up all of that power to cast Urano Metria, which forced the Spirit King to fight on his own power. The Spirit King then used the last of his own power to cast Galaxia Blade.

 

[Rigel]

Lucy didn't fight Mard. The spirit king did, and the vast majority Spirit King's power doesn't come from Lucy. She's just keeping his gate open.

That's totally not what happened. Lucy's Aquarius star dress was giving Lucy the power to keep Spirit King's gate open. She used up all of that power to cast Urano Metria, which forced the Spirit King to fight on his own power. The Spirit King then used the last of his own power to cast Galaxia Blade.

Didn't Lucy fight Mard? Her magic is what? SHE IS A SUMMONER. Spirits are your magic.

Doesn't keeping a gate open consume magic power?

The King of Spirits at times showed to depend on Lucy's magical power, because his movements became slower after the use of Uranometry. Mard comments on that.

Lucy faced Jackal and Mard at the same time. The magical power of Aquarius' Star Dress was being used to defend Lucy from Jackal's attacks and maintain the King gate.

This is much more impressive than defeating Ezel. Good luck trying to make Wendy look better than that.

https://v1.mangabeast01.com/manga/Fairy-Tail/0386-004.png

 

[Axiomus]

Didn't Lucy fight Mard? Her magic is what? SHE IS A SUMMONER. Spirits are your magic.

Doesn't keeping a gate open consume magic power?

The King of Spirits at times showed to depend on Lucy's magical power, because his movements became slower after the use of Uranometry. Mard comments on that.

Lucy faced Jackal and Mard at the same time. The magical power of Aquarius' Star Dress was being used to defend Lucy from Jackal's attacks and maintain the King gate.

This is much more impressive than defeating Ezel. Good luck trying to make Wendy look better than that.

https://v1.mangabeast01.com/manga/Fairy-Tail/0386-004.png

Yes, Lucy was using magical power to keep the spirit king's gate open. However the Spirit King has his own supply of MP. We know this because spirits can summon themselves and fight even without a summoner. The vast majority of the Spirit King's magic power that he's fighting with was his own. Lucy is just keeping his gate open. When Lucy exhausted herself, he slowed down because he had to use his own power just to keep his gate open. The same thing basically happened to Loke when his first summoner died and he had to keep his own gate open. Lucy's magic wasn't being used to fuel Galaxia Blade. She was completely exhausted after Urano Metria.

Besides, Aquarius' star dress no longer has Aquarius' full power like it did during Tartaros. She only had a little bit remaining by the time she fought Kyria.

Spoiler

So the best star dress Lucy has under her belt is her Leo X Virgo star dress mix. The most hype I'm willing to give Lion Maiden is above Lisanna level, especially since Lisanna got up after that attack. So again, where are the feats of Lucy outclassing Wendy? DF Wendy is tanking shots from DF Nebal, who at the very least should scale above base Kyria given Madmole's confidence in him.

 

[Rigel]

Yes, Lucy was using magical power to keep the spirit king's gate open. However the Spirit King has his own supply of MP. We know this because spirits can summon themselves and fight even without a summoner. The vast majority of the Spirit King's magic power that he's fighting with was his own. Lucy is just keeping his gate open. When Lucy exhausted herself, he slowed down because he had to use his own power just to keep his gate open. The same thing basically happened to Loke when his first summoner died and he had to keep his own gate open. Lucy's magic wasn't being used to fuel Galaxia Blade. She was completely exhausted after Urano Metria.

Besides, Aquarius' star dress no longer has Aquarius' full power like it did during Tartaros. She only had a little bit remaining by the time she fought Kyria.

Spoiler

So the best star dress Lucy has under her belt is her Leo X Virgo star dress mix. The most hype I'm willing to give Lion Maiden is above Lisanna level, especially since Lisanna got up after that attack. So again, where are the feats of Lucy outclassing Wendy? DF Wendy is tanking shots from DF Nebal, who at the very least should scale above base Kyria given Madmole's confidence in him.

Leon and Virgo claim that they consume a lot of magic and this is a painful process for Lucy. This confirms that spirits consume magic from the summoner, and relates to Mard's comment (which you ignored).

Spoiler

What basis did you use to differentiate the use of Star Dress in Tartarus and then in 100y? Can you prove your claims? CSK said it gave Lucy the power of Aquarius, he never specified quantity. In 100y, Lucy says she has only parts of Aquarius' powers, but that goes for all Star Dress's. That's what Virgo explains.

Spoiler

Wendy was being destroyed by Nebal, she was unable to do anything but get beaten.

The most you can get out of it is an improvement in Wendy's stamina (she used spells to improve it), and nothing indicates that Lucy would not be able to resist the same attacks.

 

[Axiomus]

Leon and Virgo claim that they consume a lot of magic and this is a painful process for Lucy. This confirms that spirits consume magic from the summoner, and relates to Mard's comment (which you ignored).

Spoiler

What basis did you use to differentiate the use of Star Dress in Tartarus and then in 100y? Can you prove your claims? CSK said it gave Lucy the power of Aquarius, he never specified quantity. In 100y, Lucy says she has only parts of Aquarius' powers, but that goes for all Star Dress's. That's what Virgo explains.

Spoiler

Wendy was being destroyed by Nebal, she was unable to do anything but get beaten.

The most you can get out of it is an improvement in Wendy's stamina (she used spells to improve it), and nothing indicates that Lucy would not be able to resist the same attacks.

Their gates take a lot of magic to maintain, yes. She's not literally feeding them magical power for their attacks.

Lucy said that the star dress only has a little bit of her power, so I naturally assumed it was weaker than Tartaros. Though fair enough about Virgo saying the same thing, so I guess you're right on that. Nonetheless, DF Wendy still scales above Aquarius' star dress. Kyria overpowers Aqua Metria and breaks Aquarius star dress with a wave of her hand. Kyria also defeats Lucy in her Virgo stardress, and to be fair base Wendy too, with a roar.

Spoiler: Kyria's slash beating Aqua Metria and cutting Lucy's star dress

Spoiler: Kyria's roar beating Lucy and base Wendy

Skullion orders the dragon eaters to retreat because Kyria and Wraith were defeated. When he hears that Nebal was going to use Dragon Force, he was confident that Nebal could take down a few members of Fairy Tail. This tells us that Skullion has more faith in DF Nebal than Kyria and Wraith. DF Wendy can tank attacks from DF Nebal. She was losing and getting outclassed, but Wendy was able to tank a bunch of hits and then return fire with a roar. So unless you consider DF Nebal's attacks weaker than base Kyria's attacks, DF Wendy still scales above Aquarius' star dress and virgo's star dress.

Spoiler: Wendy vs Nebal

 

[Rigel]

Their gates take a lot of magic to maintain, yes. She's not literally feeding them magical power for their attacks.

Lucy said that the star dress only has a little bit of her power, so I naturally assumed it was weaker than Tartaros. Though fair enough about Virgo saying the same thing, so I guess you're right on that. Nonetheless, DF Wendy still scales above Aquarius' star dress. Kyria overpowers Aqua Metria and breaks Aquarius star dress with a wave of her hand. Kyria also defeats Lucy in her Virgo stardress, and to be fair base Wendy too, with a roar.

Spoiler: Kyria's slash beating Aqua Metria and cutting Lucy's star dress

Spoiler: Kyria's roar beating Lucy and base Wendy

Skullion orders the dragon eaters to retreat because Kyria and Wraith were defeated. When he hears that Nebal was going to use Dragon Force, he was confident that Nebal could take down a few members of Fairy Tail. This tells us that Skullion has more faith in DF Nebal than Kyria and Wraith. DF Wendy can tank attacks from DF Nebal. She was losing and getting outclassed, but Wendy was able to tank a bunch of hits and then return fire with a roar. So unless you consider DF Nebal's attacks weaker than base Kyria's attacks, DF Wendy still scales above Aquarius' star dress and virgo's star dress.

Spoiler: Wendy vs Nebal

I don't see anything relevant in Wendy being beaten by the opponent. Lucy could also withstand the same attacks. She it has several defensive methods, ways to prolong the battle (Aquarius barrier, Horologium etc) and Lucy has always had good resistance.

The result of a Lucy vs Nebal would be the same as Wendy Vs Nebal (without Irene's help), it wouldn't change much.

 

[Axiomus]

I don't see anything relevant in Wendy being beaten by the opponent. Lucy could also withstand the same attacks. She it has several defensive methods, ways to prolong the battle (Aquarius barrier, Horologium etc) and Lucy has always had good resistance.

The result of a Lucy vs Nebal would be the same as Wendy Vs Nebal (without Irene's help), it wouldn't change much.

Of course it's relevant. It shows that Wendy in Dragon Force is on a different level than Lucy in Aquarius and Virgo star dress.

Horologium doesn't have any durability feats to suggest he can tank....well anything. His only real durability feat was against Uosuke, and Uosuke is fodder incarnate. Arcadios could walk through Uosuke's lava spell and he's not even a mage. He just had some protection from a jade necklace that Hisui gave him.

Aquarius barrier would have no effect. Kyria already cut through Aqua Metria and the star dress itself, and this was underwater. Nebal in Dragon Force should be stronger than Kyria. Skullion considers him capable of taking out FT members despite knowing Kyria was defeated. He would beat Lucy worse than Kyria did, and Kyria already oneshotted her.

 

[Rigel]

Of course it's relevant. It shows that Wendy in Dragon Force is on a different level than Lucy in Aquarius and Virgo star dress.

Horologium doesn't have any durability feats to suggest he can tank....well anything. His only real durability feat was against Uosuke, and Uosuke is fodder incarnate. Arcadios could walk through Uosuke's lava spell and he's not even a mage. He just had some protection from a jade necklace that Hisui gave him.

Aquarius barrier would have no effect. Kyria already cut through Aqua Metria and the star dress itself, and this was underwater. Nebal in Dragon Force should be stronger than Kyria. Skullion considers him capable of taking out FT members despite knowing Kyria was defeated. He would beat Lucy worse than Kyria did, and Kyria already oneshotted her.

You made a lot of assumptions, with Wendy doing nothing but getting beat up. Lucy could withstand the same attacks.

You're taking Kiria's moment too seriously, as it didn't take Lucy long to get up and get help.

Do you want to climb Wendy above Lucy based on how long she was beaten? Lucy was always resistant and the defensive methods I mentioned are ways to prolong the fight, I never said that they would be efficient (in the sense of guaranteeing a solid defense).

And resistance is not the only factor in a fight. There are other attributes to be analyzed.

Anyway, all Wendy's DF did was ...... nothing? She would be killed if it weren't for Irene.

 

[Seven777]

Huh? How do you from being Mad Geer lvl to supposed Dragon God lvl?

Spirits get stronger based on the summoner. Tartaros Lucy could summon a final boss tier CSK back in Tartaros, current Lucy should be able to do the same. That and because I don't think Mashima will bring back the CSK unless he's doing some epic shit, if CSK doesn't come back Dragon God tier then he's not coming back at all.

 

[Ramen]

Spirits get stronger based on the summoner. Tartaros Lucy could summon a final boss tier CSK back in Tartaros, current Lucy should be able to do the same. That and because I don't think Mashima will bring back the CSK unless he's doing some epic shit, if CSK doesn't come back Dragon God tier then he's not coming back at all.

I highly doubt if he came back he would be at that level. Plus, we can't scale Mard Geer to Ignia

I don't think he will come back, not unless somehow she finds a key for him or something