Discussion Zoro Discussion Thread

[XXGenesis]

@Rmstorm @nik87

Well. Hmm. I thought about it for a second and... You must be correct. As Hyo has explained it, swordsmen are a bit special (more advanced) in how the use haki...

When & where? How are they special or advanced?

Luffy Is learning how to blow things up from the inside with his flow haki, only Rayleigh has been seen using this advanced flow....

How is Zoro haki better? Or adnvaced? Plz tell me again

 

[nik87]

Except your wrong about that. Zoro cannot cut a whole cliff off with the flick of his wrist. Only with Enma can he preform such a feat effortlessly, due to the swords abilities. Yes Zoro can cut the cliff but with a different sword it'll take much more effort..Enma is juss special.

And on whose Haki pool does Enma depend upon? Zoro's Haki pool who is training this very moment to stop Enma from doing what it just did...

 

[nik87]

I wonder if it will really be that much of a surprise if Zoro beats King?
The guy who trained for 2 years against the best guy in that line of work is out of the option to defeat some swordsman who is inferior to the guy that Zoro went against for 2 years? The guy who is destined to be WSS is going to lose to some swordsman? The opponents are only getting stronger and stronger at this point and Zoro has to be ready for what's thrown his way.

 

[XXGenesis]

And on whose Haki pool does Enma depend upon? Zoro's Haki pool who is training this very moment to stop Enma from doing what it just did...

Pay attention to how much effort Zoro used when he cut the cliff...Nothing. he wasn't trying to do anything od that effect.

I said already, Zoro can replicate the same feat with shusui. Or 1st sword.
Just with much much more effort....

 

[Pirate Queen]

People assume Zoro cant cut Kaido because Kaido's Haki is stronger than Zoro's Haki.
However, when has Kaido's Haki ever been mentioned? Not even once. It is about Kaido's scales, not about Kaido's Haki.
Enma is just a piece of metal, it doesnt allow Zoro to do anything that he wasnt able to do already.

On this we agree. I just posted this very thing.

Luffy has mentioned Kaido's scales multiple times, not his haki

 

[Shasha23]

When & where? How are they special or advanced?

Luffy Is learning how to blow things up from the inside with his flow haki, only Rayleigh has been seen using this advanced flow....

How is Zoro haki better? Or adnvaced? Plz tell me again

Hyo just told us this a few weeks ago!

Zoro has been able to use flow all along and Luffy has just trained to use advanced haki, so yes before Luffy learned the advanced form of flow Zoro haas better haki, this is not hard to understand why cant you get it?

 

[Fox666]

Prove his haki is weaker when Oda stated that Zoro is a master of COA and Sanji master COO while Luffy masters COC.
This is even proven by the fact Sanji could dodge Katakuri while Luffy couldnt, and Zoro was capable of using advanced forms of COA while Luffy just learned them now.

Hyogoro is better than Luffy in CoA, but he's still weak...

I find it hard to believe that in real combat Sanji could dodge Katakuri, since Luffy needed Gear 4 to fight him.

 

[Shasha23]

Hyogoro is better than Luffy in CoA, but he's still weak...

I find it hard to believe that in real combat Sanji could outspeed Katakuri, since Luffy needed Gear 4 to fight him.

Not anymore since Luffy has now learned and grasped a more advance version of what Hyo was using, the old man even said so.

When Sanji was about to be shot by the priest, Katakuri used future sight to see where Sanji would dodge to try and kill him but Sanji casually dodged his attack, this showed how good Sanji is at CoO, Luffy even in G4 couldnt dodge Katakuri, it took hour and hours for Luffy to advance his haki to the point of being able to dodge even 1 attack from Katakuri.

From the very beginning of the time-skip Zoro and Sanji had better haki understanding than Luffy, with Luffy slowly surpassing them as the story went on, now that hs has future sight he has gotten better at CoO than Sanji and now that he has gentle fist hi is better at CoA than Zoro

 

[nik87]

Pay attention to how much effort Zoro used when he cut the cliff...Nothing. he wasn't trying to do anything od that effect.
I said already, Zoro can replicate the same feat with shusui. Or 1st sword.
Just with much much more effort....

Sure. However, maximum effort with Enma equals to maximum effort with other swords. Unless he allows Enma to drain him completely and dies...
We already have seen in the chapter a confirmation that he has neutralized the effect Enma did on the coast, it is no longer creating that effect.

 

[TitaniumOxide]

Anyone else think this may play into the whole thing where the best swordsmen can cut anything they wish but his blade may not even slice a paper..or feather. Sorry I forgot the quote but I think you guys know what I am talking about. Enma seem to swing the user into cutting everything as best as possible vs cutting what the wielder wish to actually cut. In that sense, Enma has to be tamed.

 

[woefdram]

Anyone else think this may play into the whole thing where the best swordsmen can cut anything they wish but his blade may not even slice a paper..or feather. Sorry I forgot the quote but I think you guys know what I am talking about. Enma seem to swing the user into cutting everything as best as possible vs cutting what the wielder wish to actually cut. In that sense, Enma has to be tamed.

I was just rereading the Alabasta arc and came across this quote which made me think of this discussion. Enma seems to be a vehicle that amplifies output at the expense of draining your reserves (basically it gives you haki-diarrhea).

The way I envision it (using a very lame real world analogy) is that if I were to be a strong, skilled boxer with the potential to become world class and I'd step in the ring with Ali in his prime I might be able to land a hit or two and these hits might even have a bit of impact, but in the end I wouldn't last the full fight let alone beat him.

That's what I think Zoro will add (if he even gets to fight Kaido) to this fight. He might land a hit or maybe more than one, these could even damage Kaido, but they won't defeat him nor will Zoro be able to keep it up. Enma will allow him a few gigantic bursts of power after which he will be out for the count until he properly masters the sword later down the line.

 

[Brandish μ]

Anyone else think this may play into the whole thing where the best swordsmen can cut anything they wish but his blade may not even slice a paper..or feather. Sorry I forgot the quote but I think you guys know what I am talking about. Enma seem to swing the user into cutting everything as best as possible vs cutting what the wielder wish to actually cut. In that sense, Enma has to be tamed.

This arc I believe the quote was from Hyogoro, when he was telling Luffy about Wano's haki... and it was something like (haki transferred from the user to the sword) "when we want to cut something like steel; and when we don't want to cut something it won't cut paper".

 

[woefdram]

I didn't even notice it was repeated again in this arc... That's nice and consistent

I was referring to this: https://www.mangapanda.com/one-piece/194/16

Also, adding into this is the fact that currently Zoro + Enma is still only the sword that harms anything (wanting to slash a tree and ending up taking the coastline with it) so he will need to learn how to master using Enma and become a sword that can protect and destroy what it wants

 

[ShadowHeart]

Anyone else who like Zoro to get a sword with a df?

 

[nik87]

Anyone else who like Zoro to get a sword with a df?

It would take away from his greatness as a swordsman and the best swordsmen in the world dont have a DF, pure skill.

 

[Brandish μ]

Yea no DF for Zoro-sama.

Just sinking in right now that he might get a shot at the big dude Kaido.

When & where? How are they special or advanced?

I think it's explained when Hyogoro talks about haki from Wano.

The technique Hyogoro calls Gyoken(?) is the projection of haki from the invisible armour, so that you can do internal damage or something to that effect. This technique was learned from a Wano swordsmen, as they specialise in projecting their haki onto their blade. The way Hyogoro explained it, this form of haki was an advancement of the invisible armour kind, and noted that Luffy had mastered that type of haki.

I wonder if it will really be that much of a surprise if Zoro beats King?

I wanna ride the hype train too and answer no, but you'd have to say Zoro goes all out like Luffy did vs Kata to beat King.

Though, Zoro could go in Orochi's direction to make sure his bae Hiyori okay, as she'll be assassinating Orochi. Zoro can then fight Kyoshiro, who imo, is YC level.

 

[nik87]

I wanna ride the hype train too and answer no, but you'd have to say Zoro goes all out like Luffy did vs Kata to beat King.
Though, Zoro could go in Orochi's direction to make sure his bae Hiyori okay, as she'll be assassinating Orochi. Zoro can then fight Kyoshiro, who imo, is YC level.

Sure, going all out against someone like King is expected but Luffy was always too strong for Katakuri, however, he couldn't dominate him because of the Future Sight but those 2-3 Boundman hits that landed have damaged Katakuri very badly.
The same could apply to Zoro vs King too, maybe Zoro is stronger/better swordsman but there will be something that prevents him to dominate the fight, perhaps King can use the Foxfire style from Kinemon and spread fire through his strikes, it would force Zoro into evasive combat until he learns to cut fire just like Luffy learned FS...

I see Orochi as a side task and Kyoshiro could be a good warm-up before King, who I also rank among YC's considering that his swordsmanship is hinted to be above the Scabbards. The wielder of 2nd Oden's sword has a strong claim on killing Orochi as the meaning is Snake slayer.
Oda has holding Zoro back all this time and understandable, it is an arc of swordsmen and the best time for Zoro to achieve great things.
So far the only opponents who would have been a challenge for Zoro were Fujitora(who he most likely cannot defeat, it would be too much at this point) and Kyoshiro but it ended in an exchange of few sword strikes only. All other opponents were literally not worthy.

Zoro is the 2nd most important character in the entire story and has been sidelined for way too long, it is time for Oda to unleash the beast.

 

[Brandish μ]

The same could apply to Zoro vs King too, maybe Zoro is stronger/better swordsman but there will be something that prevents him to dominate the fight, perhaps King can use the Foxfire style from Kinemon and spread fire through his strikes, it would force Zoro into evasive combat until he learns to cut fire just like Luffy learned FS...

I guess, we could factor in King's flying ability. King does have some fire around him or something like that, might be tied to his race.

So far the only opponents who would have been a challenge for Zoro were Fujitora(who he most likely cannot defeat, it would be too much at this point)

Towards endgame, Zoro will be able to take an admiral. Not yet tho lol.

Zoro is the 2nd most important character in the entire story and has been sidelined for way too long, it is time for Oda to unleash the beast.

I cannot wait for this. All out fighting. I've been running on fumes of a few badass feats, like oneshotting Hody, and they have been few and far between. Shower us with greatness, Oda-sama.

 

[Sachsenhesse]

Towards endgame, Zoro will be able to take an admiral. Not yet tho lol.

The SH are fighting 2 Yonkous.

This is the endgame.

 

[Brandish μ]

The SH are fighting 2 Yonkous.

This is the endgame.

I think a big fight vs the government happens last. Then Zoro can solo 2 x admirals and the gorosei dude with the sword.