Discussion Zoro Discussion Thread

[nik87]

Predicting the future vs cutting steel? Lol yeah right lol

Luffy needed 11 hours to learn advanced Haki, Zoro needed under an hour to learn advanced haki.

 

[M3J]

I'd make the point that zoro and sanji did apparently begin the new world with more advanced haki than luffy. Zoro at least already had ryu and sanji might have had future sight (based on him dodging katakuri's attack during his wedding with puddin). To me it's also unclear on whether zoro would benefit from the type of haki that causes internal damage since his deal is cutting. Of course luffy's growth is explosive, that's not really debatable, but the context here is that haki can grow explosively during extreme situations so this type of powerup technically is available to everyone.

That's what I don't get about Future Sight. Didn't we see Luffy and Sanji dodge bullets, Luffy in the first arc after timeskip? And didn't the fat guy in Skypeia and Enel do the same? Like, they knew what was coming and were able to react accordingly.

 

[nik87]

Only Katakuri and Luffy can actually see the future, the others read the intent.
Sanji picking up the bean is basic CoO, doesnt get more basic than that.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Luffy needed 11 hours to learn advanced Haki, Zoro needed under an hour to learn advanced haki.

Haki every swordsman should know vs Future sight that only 2 people in the entire manga know?




Then took a week to know an even better version of CoA

Lol come on you can do better than that nik!

 

[kkck]

Awakening haki isnt mastering it.

Luffy mastered it. Zoro after Awakening haki still couldnt cut certain things until the time skip

And I doubt Sanji knows Future Sight. Him dodging Katakuri was simply a high level of CoA.

Zoro was largely able to cut metal with ease after that though. It seems fairly clear that at least the cutting metal portion relevant to haki mastery was down barring exceedingly hard materials other people couldn't cut either.

I did say might. Sanji leans towards observation haki so its not a stretch that he would have gotten this ability down during the timeskip, much like how zoro mastered projecting haki. As in, both got the advanced versions of the type of haki they leaned too. Sanji can't go around apparently not knowing hardening and only having mastered the same version of observation haki that zoro and luffy had. Add to that the absurdity luffy having future sight currently... There has to be a limit to how pathetic sanji is, at this point in the story the guy is basically his raid suit and nothing else...

 

[nik87]

aki every swordsman should know vs Future sight that only 2 people in the entire manga know?

Who learned it faster?

Then took a week to know an even better version of CoA

Better for who?

 

[Pirate Queen]

Zoro was largely able to cut metal with ease after that though. It seems fairly clear that at least the cutting metal portion relevant to haki mastery was down barring exceedingly hard materials other people couldn't cut either.

I did say might. Sanji leans towards observation haki so its not a stretch that he would have gotten this ability down during the timeskip, much like how zoro mastered projecting haki. As in, both got the advanced versions of the type of haki they leaned too. Sanji can't go around apparently not knowing hardening and only having mastered the same version of observation haki that zoro and luffy had. Add to that the absurdity luffy having future sight currently... There has to be a limit to how pathetic sanji is, at this point in the story the guy is basically his raid suit and nothing else...

Your basically saying his mastery of cutting metal could be equivelent to predicting the future... which is just nonsense.

God, I need to wake up. I'm still half asleep I think I need coffee now.

 

[kkck]

That's what I don't get about Future Sight. Didn't we see Luffy and Sanji dodge bullets, Luffy in the first arc after timeskip? And didn't the fat guy in Skypeia and Enel do the same? Like, they knew what was coming and were able to react accordingly.

As far as the story has told us there is a difference between the basic prediction abilities haki allows and actually peeking into the future. Katakuri could even predict what people were going to say based on how they'd react to what others were doing. I believe sanji used future sight against katakuri because it better explains sanji dodging that attack. You have katakuri, who can take aim at sanji and use his future sight to anticipate how and when sanji would react. And sanji dodged using his observation haki... meaning he was able to at least keep up with the degree of foresight katakuri had.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Who learned it faster?

Better for who?

For the Wano swordsman who was teaching basic Ryou to Luffy and couldn't believe Luffy knew a more advance version.

The Wano Samurai who has decades of experience and was a beast in him prime... Hyo

 

[kkck]

Your basically saying his mastery of cutting metal could be equivelent to predicting the future... which is just nonsense.

God, I need to wake up. I'm still half asleep I think I need coffee now.

Based on what? When hyogoro explained haki to luffy he mentioned cutting metal along with the ability to project haki beyond your body. Doesn't that suggest its an advanced form of haki? Add to that, zoro had zero haki at that point, contrary to luffy against katakuri who had every basic form of haki at least down. Zoro went from zero haki to some variation of haki projection (though not capable of affecting logia) while luffy went from basic observation haki to future sight.

 

[nik87]

wonder if Zoro will pick up Future Sight.

Would be way too broken considering Zoro's lethality. One hit is all he needs and with FS that one hit would come sooner than usual so his fights would be very short.

 

[Pirate Queen]

But how can you tell if he wears black clothes? Unless Oda ALWAYS adds that shiny look to hardening.

Given how Katakuri was unable to predict the new future resulting from his interference on more than one occasion, methinks it could be that.


Anyways, wonder if Zoro will pick up Future Sight. Seems kinda apt if he's going up against stronger swordsmen and eventually Mihawk.

Mihawk's epiphet was supposed to be "Thr Clairvoyant" so either he has Future Sight or CoO that focus on the detail of an opponents fighting style.... So I expect Zoro to develop it eventually.

I'd much prefer he and Sanji develop CoC tho.

 

[M3J]

Would be way too broken considering Zoro's lethality. One hit is all he needs and with FS that one hit would come sooner than usual so his fights would be very short.

Given Mihawk and Shiryu, at the very least, Future Sight could be helpful. Zoro's gonna start going up against top tier opponents, and it doesn't look like power alone will cut it.

Mihawk's epiphet was supposed to be "Thr Clairvoyant" so either he has Future Sight or CoO that focus on the detail of an opponents fighting style.... So I expect Zoro to develop it eventually.

I'd much prefer he and Sanji develop CoC tho.

He did manage to see and attack Luffy as he was running around Mihawk to get to Ace.

Why not both at the same time? I think Zoro developing CoC is a given though.

 

[Pirate Queen]

Given Mihawk and Shiryu, at the very least, Future Sight could be helpful. Zoro's gonna start going up against top tier opponents, and it doesn't look like power alone will cut it.




He did manage to see and attack Luffy as he was running around Mihawk to get to Ace.

Why not both at the same time? I think Zoro developing CoC is a given though.

I think the focus is going to be on Zoro's cutting ability in Wano.... Fire splitting, Kaido skin piercing, increased control of CoA


Fire splitting I am expecting he learned offscreen from Kinemon.

I think Zoro wont get CoC until final Arc... he's going to awaken it in his battle against Mihawk.

 

[kkck]

Odds are that when it comes to high tier characters we will see more and more of them with advanced haki abilities. I wouldn't be surprised if all yonko an admirals have the more advanced version of haki. As in projection and future sight. Kizaru keeping up with rayleigh who definitely had the ability is a pretty strong point in his favor. Marco fights with his fists and claws so its hard to imagine him being competitive without at least the haki technique that deals internal damage. Mihawk at a minimum has projection and as someone said earlier it wouldn't be strange if observation haki plays a significant role in his hawkeye nickname. And then..... its not like these advanced haki skills are exclusive to high tier characters.

 

[HereNThere]

I think Zoro wont get CoC until final Arc... he's going to awaken it in his battle against Mihawk.

I think he has a decent chance of awakening it in Wano.

I feel Zoro not having CoC by the time he reaches Mihawk would be a complete failure on his part. His goal is to be the Greatest Swordsman in the world, so walking up to Mihawk without the will of a conqueror means he isn't up to snuff. In my opinion at least.

In Wano, his peers are people who live by the sword the same way he does, so he needs to differiate himself from them and stand above them by the end.

 

[Pirate Queen]

I think he has a decent chance of awakening it in Wano.

I feel Zoro not having CoC by the time he reaches Mihawk would be a complete failure on his part. His goal is to be the Greatest Swordsman in the world, so walking up to Mihawk without the will of a conqueror means he isn't up to snuff. In my opinion at least.

In Wano, his peers are people who live by the sword the same way he does, so he needs to differiate himself from them and stand above them by the end.

But we dont even have proof Mihawk has it.

 

[M3J]

I think the focus is going to be on Zoro's cutting ability in Wano.... Fire splitting, Kaido skin piercing, increased control of CoA


Fire splitting I am expecting he learned offscreen from Kinemon.

I think Zoro wont get CoC until final Arc... he's going to awaken it in his battle against Mihawk.

I feel Zoro will get it waaaay before the final arc or his fight against Mihawk, possibly by the next arc.

Isn't Zoro's cutting ability pretty top tier though?

 

[Pirate Queen]

I feel Zoro will get it waaaay before the final arc or his fight against Mihawk, possibly by the next arc.

Isn't Zoro's cutting ability pretty top tier though?

Oda doesnt think so or he wouldnt have needed Enma to cut Kaido....

CoC MIGHT not be required to be the WSS

WSS aren't Conqueror's... their goal is to be the best in their given field not rule over all swordsmen like a king... where as the CoC users we have seen have some type of leadership quality.

Mihawk has no desire or disposition to rule or lead.

That being said, it would make sense that all top tiers have CoC by default... we just happen to know that many top tiers don't in fact have it.

 

[M3J]

Or Kaidou has a super tough skin, seeing as how not even Gear 4 did much to him.

I don't think it is, but if Rayleigh has it as first mate, then why shouldn't Zoro as one of the top fighters of the crew? Zoro can be a leader when needed and has been a decent leader in the moments when he needed to be (which is extremely rare). If wanting to rule was a requirement, then Luffy wouldn't have CoC as he doesn't care to rule, he just wants to be free. Hell, Shanks seems to be in the same boat as well, no desire to rule or do much leading, but he still has CoC.

But yeah, would rather have CoC be extremely rare. Zoro is a great candidate though, unless his killing intent/murderous aura is supposed to make up for it.