Most evil One Piece character?

[Bugzee]

Well for me in no particular order:

DonQuixote Doflamingo - mysterious background, smiles when not needed, plays with people lol, very evil
Thunder "god" Eneru - badass dude with one of the best DF abilities!

Captain Blackbeard - hehehe evvvvill and sinister!

The Gorousei World Leaders - ruthless mothaf*ckas!!! Void years?? they know!!!

Admiral Akainu - his worse then stupid Kizaru!! imo

Chief Jailer Shiryuu - LOL perfect right-hand man for BB!!!! Truly Oda is a perfectionist!!! loool

 

[Gecko Moria]

Definitely the Tenryuubito and Gorousei. The Gorousei are the leaders of the World Government and hence the Marines so votes towards WG personnel and Marines should are basically equal to a vote for the Gorousei.

The Tenryuubito are a group of elitist aristocrats. They can choose to make anyone their slave and treat other people terribly (even Boa Hancock suffered atrocities at the hands of the Tenryuubito). Furthermore, they believe they have the right to do anything they want just because their ancestors "built the world" and the Gorousei/WG support them.

The Tenryuubito epitomize the evils of nobility and unfortunately the "democracy" in One Piece (World Government) doesn't do anything about it, making them just as evil.

 

[Sachsenhesse]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

After that chinathing i knewed from which country you came before i even looked at your flag. ^^

There is no good or evil. Evil people from our view are good in their own view, this is all meaningless.

 

[Razh]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

Pirate crews are individual. WG is an organization based on bad deeds, and they keep doing them to preserve the stability which they believe is the right way. Any country which doesn't want to join is doomed, it's people end up building a gigantic bridge until they die.
Sengoku may be generally a good man, but if he is that good, why put up with all that crap all this time. Sure, maybe he tries to do what he can.

Also, there is as much scum in Marines as there is among pirates. Just look at Akainu.

 

[kamina]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

I agree in that I think it really depends on how you look at it, since there are a lot of marines and world government employees who do genuinely care about the safety of normal people and about bringing criminals to justice without having ambitious ulterior motives like Spandam or just going overboard with it like Akainu does, to name some examples.

If it were a story written from the viewpoint of one of those normal nice marines who just want to bring justice for the raping and pillaging type of pirates, I'd probably want to see them actually succeed through a biased view in their favor.
It's a pretty interesting idea to think about.

 

[RichardMNixon]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

The WG is evil by any standards I can imagine, I suppose the Marines are debatable.

What do you meant "they" have no control over the Tenryuubito? They're physically pathetic. If they wanted the Tenryuubito to go away, they wouldn't even have to do it themselves, just lift their protection and the TRB wouldn't last a week.

 

[LDSaint]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

The WG is evil i agree with RichardMNixon. and did they really order the buster call on robins home town cause of the threat of them finding the weapons i didnt think so from what i read they were anhilatted cause they found out to much about the lost history the blank century prof. clover (watever his name was) was ordered to be killed by the gouresin as soon as he started speaking about the old kingdom.

they just told every1 that reading the polygraphs is against the law because they r afraid of the weapons but really i think they are afraid of the people finding about the truth of how they came to power. they r rutherless killing any1 that doesnt follow them.

yeah they r good ppl in the marines but im sure none of them no the true intentions of the WG. they want to look good for the people so they dont lose the faith they have in the WG thats y sengoku ordered them to cut the transmission for the war so the people didnt see wat means they had to go through to win the war... which is to get people (i think dead) and turn them into weapons that do there biddings. its like on thriller bark when chopper found about the zombies and what hogback was donig to humans he was disgusted.

the WG is evil and the marines r working for them helping them in the evil goals

 

[Banedor]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

No longer wish to discuss my original topic.

 

[street_san]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

Sorry for my bad english. I'm not an english native speaker so...I'll do my best xD

For me I think you're right and what Oda wants to show us is that, if you want to suceed, you don't necessary need strenght, brutality and strict rules. Remember what Luffy said when Rayleigh asked Luffy if he was truly ready for the task that lay ahead in his dream of becoming the Pirate King:

http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/507/09/

My opinion is that Oda is foreshadowing Luffy as someone who accomplish his dream without any regret and without beeing a bully like Kidd. This is one of the major reason people allied with him. They see in Luffy a pirate out of ordinary. There's something in him that push you to allied with him and to be friend with him. All the actions Luffy made was with good intentions. The way he saved Nami and everybody he saved. And when he saved those peoples, he didn't made like Kidd and destroy the village he was on. He simply made a huge party, drank and eat with everyone and then left everyone with a happy smile. This is what Oda wants to show us. That, even if Luffy is a criminal in the face of the WG, there is no evidence in his actions that he deserve such a title. It is just like MLK. In his time people said that he was an imposture and whatever the insult you can find, but despite doing actions "against the law", people saw through him a good man and someone worth following. Just like Luffy.

As for the World Government, the way I see things is simple. There is the old WG and the new WG. The old one is people who think that what they did is right and that they need brutal strenght in order to make people listen their orders. If they don't do what they said they had to do...well you're a criminal and you deserve death penality. And theirs others who think of a great Justice. To punish true criminal and that everybody shall be free to go wherever they want and learn whatever they want, as long that they don't hurt others like Coby. Don't forget that his dream is to be an Admiral. With the rank that he want to achieve, he'll be really influent in the WG (I think) and he might be able to change things. He is also a "revolutionnary", but in the good way.

So basically, in both sides there is good and there is bad. Oda is just showing us that Governement and people can work together to create a better world (danm that was cute xD).

 

[RichardMNixon]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

I could be mistaken but did the Marines say that the Tebryuubito are the direct desecendants of the old world and that they wish to keep them safe and that they have some high military officials in the marines to help preserve their security.

Couldn't this be similiar to corrupt policitians currently in our Political system?

They have influence in the WG just because; tradition I guess. The marines protect them because that's one of their jobs as required by the WG.

If John B. Senator used his political power to make sure the US looked away while him and his family kept slaves, I would call the US an evil gov't as well.

 

[LDSaint]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

@banedor

the WG old or new watever u like to call it is evil i mite not no much about america and ur guys history books but im sure if peaople tred looking for the truth they wouldnt be put to death cause if they did the govt would be viewed as being evil and inhuman however that is what the WG in one piece is doing they r protecting a secret so "evil" that whoever even has the slightest ability to discover it is hunted down even if it is only a 8yr old girl. hey they even blow up a ship containg a every1 from an island just because there "might" of ben a chance that a person who could translate the polygraphs was on it... they didnt care about the innocent people that were on the ship all the WG cares about is themselves...

they dnt want to keep the balance between pirates, the marines and the shichibukai they want t end the pirate age they want the power and they get no matter wat just like i said be4 and as Razh also did if u dnt follow them then u and ur chuldren and their children are forced to build a bridge until they die.

there are only a few people in the marines that i actually consider good (every1 in WG is bad) and that is Aokiji, Smoker, Garp, Coby and maybe some others like Hina (i dnt really think kizaru is that evil) other then that every1 else is an agent of dark justice just like donflamingo said http://www.onemanga.com/One_Piece/556/10-11/

1 people only follow the WG because they r on top they decide what is considered right and wrong they decide the law, where some of them r right but most r not.

 

[bittman]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

Calling the World Government evil is a misrepresentation. Alabasta is a part of the World Government, I was not aware they were evil.

What you mean to call evil is the Gorousei, heads of the World Government. Remember, just because a head is evil it does not mean the body follows in the exact same steps.

I keep to my view that evil is subjective, and there is really no-one in One Piece I would deem pure evil without at least adding a tag of insane. Gorousei may be close to it, but all they do is dish out an extreme version of information control. Though more extreme than what most governments do nowdays, there is always information control. Is it "evil" if you've killed 5,000 people to control information compared to bribing just one?

People follow the World Government for many reasons. Whether they hope to fix it, whether they hope to bring some peace to the world regardless of the cost or whether they are just oblivious to the sins of the Gorousei, it's unclear. If I was a normal person in the One Piece world, I would approve of the World Government over pirates. Pirates stand for complete ignorance of laws and rules, the World Government attempts to dictate and enforce laws and rules.

That said, pirates in this story are different to most. Really Luffy is not a pirate, just an adventurer who put the skull and crossbones on his sail. If there were no pirates, Luffy would still sail the seas. No-one sees Luffy as evil, just dangerous. Dangerous for promoting an era of rebellion and destruction.

 

[RichardMNixon]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

No-one sees Luffy as evil, just dangerous. Dangerous for promoting an era of rebellion and destruction.

I'll agree with you that the Gorousei are the evil part of the WG (hereafter when I refer to the WG, I really mean them and the WG's overall goals), but I may have to disagree with you here depending on what you mean.

The WG doesn't consider Luffy dangerous because he "promotes" the word pirate or pirate kind; they consider him dangerous because he upsets the status quo, he wants freedom and they don't want people to be free.

Roger wasn't the world's worst criminal because he stole from people or destroyed kingdoms or called himself a pirate, it's because he went places and learned things the WG didn't want him to. They don't want people to be knowledgeable/free.

 

[NoLimit89]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

After that china thing i knewed from which country you came before i even looked at your flag. ^^

There is no good or evil. Evil people from our view are good in their own view, this is all meaningless.

You know, I learned this lesson from my grandfather when I was 4-5 years old. I remember that my bedtime stories would consists of stories about history that involved heroism and politics. I would always ask him, "so who's the good guy, who's the bad guy?" and he would tell me, "there's no good guy or bad guy, they all have their own agendas". It was a wonderful lesson to learn at such an early age because it allowed me to critically analyze events and not be swayed by the bias.

Take the bombing of the twin towers for example, we all believe the suicide bombers to be bad people. However in their mind and in their world, they are the epitome of good, they are martyrs doing god's work and they will be rewarded with 72 virgins when they die. Think about that.

The stuff said by Doflamingo really applies here, whoever wins the war would be the "good guys".

P.S. I was born in China and came to Australia when I was 7. It is always interesting to see the antics of U.S people on the web. There's just such a mix of fundamental lefties and righties that balance each other out but are imo equally as crazy.

 

[RichardMNixon]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

Take the bombing of the twin towers for example, we all believe the suicide bombers to be bad people. However in their mind and in their world, they are the epitome of good, they are martyrs doing god's work and they will be rewarded with 72 virgins when they die. Think about that.

The stuff said by Doflamingo really applies here, whoever wins the war would be the "good guys".

I would agree with Doflamingo, but I wish I wouldn't have to. Yes, the winner is the good guy because their version of history will make them look good, that doesn't mean the people of the time necessarily considered them to be good. Winning the war doesn't make you good, it allows you to make yourself look good to the people of the future, potentially by distorting the facts, and being good vs. looking good is a very important distinction.

And as for the twin towers, of course there is no real evil if you define good by whatever John Doe thinks is good; the word evil becomes virtually meaningless. Ethical philosophy can however produce more objective metrics than that and I have no problem calling a government or religion evil by those metrics. If your religion tells you it is a good thing to kill thousands of unsuspecting, defenseless, strangers, your religion is evil (or at least your interpretation of it is). If your government tells you it's a good thing to kill anyone who learns about history and if it endorses slavery, it is evil.

 

[NoLimit89]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

Yes, but you're only saying that because of the shifting moral zeitgeist. It was okay to slaughter the infidels and stone women and children to death a thousand years ago.

 

[bittman]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

NoLimit's point stands: In 100 years time, if you got your great-great-grandson to read One Piece, he might have a very different idea regarding what is evil and what is not. Good and evil is a personal belief.

Also, if my government tells me it's a good thing to kill anyone who learns history and endorses slavery, who is there to tell me "it's evil"? We can't imagine it so much now, but governments have endorsed slavery and genocide for centuries, if not millenia, and it was seen as perfectly legal and right by the rest of the world except those that were persecuted against.

 

[Gats]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

NoLimit's point stands: In 100 years time, if you got your great-great-grandson to read One Piece, he might have a very different idea regarding what is evil and what is not. Good and evil is a personal belief.

Also, if my government tells me it's a good thing to kill anyone who learns history and endorses slavery, who is there to tell me "it's evil"? We can't imagine it so much now, but governments have endorsed slavery and genocide for centuries, if not millenia, and it was seen as perfectly legal and right by the rest of the world except those that were persecuted against.

If what are you saying was entirely true we would practice slavery even now. :/

 

[NoLimit89]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

Have you heard about the different theories of morality? In the west now, we usually adopt a strong morality of autonomy, meaning that it is morally righteous to allow freedom for all. This of course results in capitalism and economic expansion and growth, hence allowing the countries that adopt this morality to expand their influence. One can also make the easy link between morality of autonomy with the abolishment of slavery.

However, this was not always the case. Prior to now, many countries adopt the morality of community or morality of divinity. In fact, some countries still do now. For example for a country with morality of community, the thing that they value most is not freedom, but social order and that everyone has a designated role to fill. They easily adapt to the model of social hierarchy and it would be justifiable to keep lower classes insofar as slaves so that social order is maintained.

In terms of morality of divinity then it is even easier, if you believe yourself to be people of god and you demonize those who do not share your belief, then you could rob them of their perceived humanity. It would then be very easy then to keep people as slaves if you don't perceive them as human, just like how one do not perceive keeping a chicken for the sole purpose of egg laying to be slavery or a morally wrong act.

These different moral systems could be one way to explain why the complete abolishment of slavery took so long to implement (thousands of years). In fact, slavery wasn't completely abolished in the whole world until 1981 and even so, we still have illegal skin trade business that mimics that of slavery (although most of which are results of socio-economical issues).

 

[Lord Rayleigh]

Re: Could Luffy really be the antagonist?

But from Sengoku's perspective, he's doing a good job is he not?

He ordered the destruction of Nico Robin's home island because they were researching the ancient glyphs of the world weapon, letting it get in Pirates hand would prove disastrous. (Think in realtive terms when China stole USA's nuclear secrets of Los Almos and the subsequent Spy missions that are still very shady used to try and stop China's progression in Nuclear Weapons.) Did Sengoku not make the right decision? I think so.

He formed the Shichibukai: Notorious Pirates working for the Government as Mercenaries to provide a huge military threat and ward Pirates off from piracy. (Think Hessian Soldiers used by the British as Mercenaries to try and help stop the revolting colony that would eventually become the USA.) Was this not a good move for the better of One Piece citizens? I think so.

He ordered the execution of Gol D. Roger, the Pirate King. Tried killing the leader of the Piracy era hoping that the lab dogs of piracy would go into hiding and slowly die out without their leader. Great idea, didn't work out too great but it did as the Government was able to take control of almost everything with the exception of the New World.

He's currently ordering the execution of Ace, Gol D.s Son. Now yes, Ace wants Blackbeard to become Pirate King but recently as we see, thanks to Squardo, it looks like the WB pirates would turn to Ace as their new leader and subsequently a new Gol D. Roger is born, but Sengoku looks like he knew that in advance and is trying to stop it before it gets to the new pirate era. (Like when Saddam Hussein was executed followed by his Sons so they had no one to retake command.)

You can support your country if you want. Building a parallel with some chosen actions of United States, you explain the WG's actions are thus acceptable ; but who tells us your country's actions are acceptable ?
Anyway, using the Saddam Hussein execution as an argument to demonstrate the WG is good is not what I'd call a great idea. I must remind you that Hussein's execution is a shame for United States, which call themselves the defender of democracy. I'm talking about the trial regarding the defendant's rights and the execution itself which was not conventional at all : filmed and broadcasted and put on the net, chiites claiming the name of one of their military boss, insults etc. How lucky Hussein was to be found by US'army ...


The Gorusei are really a strange group. They seem to want to establish an order for the sake of the people (which is good) and yet they let the tenryubitos do whatever they want on the WG's territory. If you want a system based on order, the first thing you do is to make you be legitimate to make everyone listens and carries out your decisions. After that, you put an end to the ones that are dangers for the stability and that provoke conspiration : opponents to the system, anarchists etc ...
The tenryubitos create problems in these two spheres :
- they can do what they want and also force the marines to do things (Kizaru has to capture Luffy for them, it was said again at MHQ) : they represent another power that can decide things without the Gorusei, and they are above the law.
- they give a negative vision of the WG to the people, which is dangerous for the stability of the system, all the more so as they are revolutionaries that gather countries and people.
I don't understand why the Gorusei has not put an end to the tenryubitos yet.