Discussion Classic Manga and Mangaka

[Kaiten]

Does anyone read older manga? If you do come here to discuss older series, artists, styles, and the evolution of manga in general. Feel free to list favorites, both authors and artists, but please: no long list of links to Manga Editors or online readers. Linking to entries at mangaupdates is fine, considering the amount of information that site provides linking there it is preferable anyway, if one is so inclined to provide links. Discussion of all demographics is welcome.

Tatsumi Yoshihio: Pioneering artist, one of the founders of the gekiga movement in the late 50's. Tatsumi and his cohorts introduced gritty realism, violence, and sex into Japanese comics. His masterful biography, in comic form, a Drifting Life was released in America last year. Three collections: the Push Man, Good Bye, and Abandon the Old in Tokyo collect stories originally published in the legendary anthology Garo.
Miyazaki Hayao: Best known as an animator, Miyazaki is also a brilliant mangaka, basing the anime of Nausicaa off one of his own works. A cliche to mention but often sited as one of the greatest manga ever made. Hox scanlated his barely known Sabuka no Tami. Written in the late 60's for a children's publication, Sabuka is a fascinating read, pushing the boundary of how manga is read and what it looks like.

 

[Drmke]

Most of the classics I like are from the 80s or late 70s (manga is the only good thing that came outta the 80s!).

Buronson is one I really enjoy. His manga are usually pretty violent and I always loved his way of drawing. His famous works include (and their are many) Doberman Detective (1975), Fist of the North Star (1983), Mammoth (1985), Sanctuary (1990), Japan (1992), Strain (1997), Heat (1999), First of the Blue Sky (2001), and Lord (2004).

Mitsuru Adachi is another obvious classic. He has been one of the greatest sports mangaka for 30 years. He's known for mixing slice of life elements into everyone of his manga. Some of his works include Miyuki (1980), Touch (1981), Slow Step (1986), Rough (1987), Jinbe (1992), H2 (1992), Katsu! (2001), and Cross Game (2006).

And much, MUCH love for Masanori Morita. Although he didn't show up till 1987, he has still, in my opinion, created some of Jump's best series. His works are Rokudenashi Blues (1987), Rookies (1998), and Beshari Gurashi (2005). He has a very similar drawing style to Buronson. Both tend to draw their characters in a grittier fashion. Morita also leans more towards realism when writing his stories.

Those are just three of my all time favorites but of course their are many other classics I didn't mention like Akira Toriyama (Dr. Slump, Dragonball) and Tetsuya Chiba (Ashita no Joe, Ore wa Teppei). And few who just barely made it in time for this deadline who made their biggest impacts in recent decades: Yoshihiro Togashi (Yu Yu Hakusho, Level E, Hunter x Hunter), Takeshi Obata (Hikaru no Go, Death Note, Bakuman), and Takehiko Inoue (Slam Dunk, Vagabond, REAL).

 

[Dive]

My contribution would have to be Akira Toriyama (Dragon Ball), Tetsuya Chiba (Ashita no Joe), and Hirohiko Araki (Jojo's Bizarre Adventure)

 

[shaheer]

Hayao miazaki, for my all time fav Nausicaa

Fumio kono for Town of evening calm country of cherry blossom

Osamu Tezuka for Black Jack

Katsuhiro Otomo for akira

Tetsuya Chiba for Ashita no Joe

 

[Mushashi]

Japanese Comics Origins and Influences

 

[Kaiten]

I've just started scratching the surface of classic manga, still haven't read some recent classics such as Rurouni Kenshin. I did start Sayonara Japan a while back. Only two chapters are out, both enjoyable. It's a collection of shorts by Otomo Katsuhiro, mangaka of Akira, centered around the three chapter series that lends it's name to the collection. Sayonara Japan is older than Akira, preceding Otomo's shift to science fiction. Definitely recommended.

 

[Asarii]

^ I really recommend Rurouni Kenshin.

My favourite manga of all time is a classic manga: Haikara-san ga Toru (Yamato Waki). I also enjoyed reading Candy Candy (Mizuki Kyoko). Both are shoujo.

I never read these but they were popular titles in the mid-20th century: Cyborg 009 [1964], Lupin III [1967], Obake no Q-taro [1964], and Gegege no Kitaro [1959]. It doesn't matter how old you are, everyone in Japan knows about them. (Even my grandmother! XD)

 

[juUnior]

I just subscribe to this thread - I thought I'm weird that I like old mangas/animes over the newer ones <of course there are exeptions>, and what have we here: more ppl xD

I have a question though: what sites do you recommend to search for Edited Mangas of old manga? <I definitely missed a lot, and would like to read even more if there's a chance> Thx in advance for reply.

btw. Kaiten-Sama <>, nice of you to put the link to the thread in Jump topic ^^

 

[StrangerAtaru]

Just subscribed as well after you mentioned it in the Jump thread, Kaiten.

I didn't really mean to make a fuss before about it, it just felt like with all my work on the older Jump series and how much I love a lot of what I've been doing, the fact that for the most part Jump still remains a few select series plus everything in there now is a crying shame. I love a lot of the old series I've been doing and will hopefully do in the near future (got lined up a few things, in particular another 80s series once Otokojuku is over and a couple shorter series when the Bo-bobo saga is over...one of which I know hardly anyone has really heard of but turned out to be a really cute and fun series when I picked it up)

 

[Galactic Tomahawk]

Continuing on the subject that... Won't quite seem to die in the Jump thread, I started reading Houshin Engi recently and I kind of regret not getting in to it earlier.

Not the kind of manga you really see all that often anymore.

 

[Kaiten]

^ I really recommend Rurouni Kenshin.

My favourite manga of all time is a classic manga: Haikara-san ga Toru (Yamato Waki). I also enjoyed reading Candy Candy (Mizuki Kyoko). Both are shoujo.

I never read these but they were popular titles in the mid-20th century: Cyborg 009 [1964], Lupin III [1967], Obake no Q-taro [1964], and Gegege no Kitaro [1959]. It doesn't matter how old you are, everyone in Japan knows about them. (Even my grandmother! XD)

I've been lazy about Rurouni for a long time. Everyone always tells me it's brilliant. I need to get to it soon.

I'm disappointed that, unless I missed something, neither of your recommendations are in English. It's a shame, there is a limited amount of translated, classic shojo. Certainly some modern classics like Hana Kimi and Boys Over Flowers, but a limited amount of material from the 70's. Even Rose of Versailles Edited Mangas are stalled. I'd love to see the more attention paid to the 24-gumi as well as the two artists you mentioned and TADATSU Youko, at the least. Fortunately an anthology of Hagio Moto (one of the 24-gumi) one shots called a Drunken Dream goes on sale later this month.

I only no Lupin from the anime, I've never tried the manga. Gegege is a mile stone, one of the most important manga ever released. A real shame it's never been translated. Hox recently translated a doujin where the artist redid Hidamari Sketch and Fate/Stay Night in Mizuki Shigeru's art style. His war memoir Onward Towards Our Noble Death and Nononbaa to Ore were both licensed over the summer, I'm looking forward to both. I'd also be interested in seeingCyborg 009, along with Tetsujin 28, translated.

I just subscribe to this thread - I thought I'm weird that I like old mangas/animes over the newer ones <of course there are exeptions>, and what have we here: more ppl xD

I have a question though: what sites do you recommend to search for Edited Mangas of old manga? <I definitely missed a lot, and would like to read even more if there's a chance> Thx in advance for reply.

btw. Kaiten-Sama <>, nice of you to put the link to the thread in Jump topic ^^

There's a growing market for classics. Osamu Tezuka reissues are the flagship Vertical, a smaller American publisher that is finding a lot of success selling oldies and alternative manga. Those two fandoms (the latter is my primary fandom) are linked, I think the growing popularity of classics is more evident to the underground fandom. The publishers who license alternative manga are the same ones (mostly) to license classics, same goes for Manga Editors. Use mangaupdates release tracker, most classics, including the series StrangerAtaru is working on, are announced there. The Edited Manga group manga underground maintain a blog that will announce most of the releases mangaupdates misses; they mostly announce seinen/alternative but also classics and shonen the posters are interested in. Sometimes googling a specific title will yield unexpected results.

Just subscribed as well after you mentioned it in the Jump thread, Kaiten.

I didn't really mean to make a fuss before about it, it just felt like with all my work on the older Jump series and how much I love a lot of what I've been doing, the fact that for the most part Jump still remains a few select series plus everything in there now is a crying shame. I love a lot of the old series I've been doing and will hopefully do in the near future (got lined up a few things, in particular another 80s series once Otokojuku is over and a couple shorter series when the Bo-bobo saga is over...one of which I know hardly anyone has really heard of but turned out to be a really cute and fun series when I picked it up)

I understand. Sometimes it feels like Jump fans are more concerned with the big 3, the recent series, and the TOC then with the history and culture surrounding the magazine. Honestly I've stopped reading any current series other than the big 3 and Hunter x Hunter (when it comes back) so the TOC rarely interests me anymore. Other than Mago and Beelzebub there's nothing I'm interested in catching up on, either. I do want to start reading some of the older series, as I mentioned in the thread, particularly Nube (once more is released), City Hunter (same), and Rurouni. It's been nice to see so many more old series getting attention lately, the state of old school Jump was terrible before you started translating. Even Hokuto no Ken isn't caught up, though it was recently rebooted. If someone translated Barefoot Gen that would make my day

---

Continuing on the subject that... Won't quite seem to die in the Jump thread, I started reading Houshin Engi recently and I kind of regret not getting in to it earlier.

Not the kind of manga you really see all that often anymore.

Houshin Engi is one of my all time favorites. Taikoubou is hands down the least conventional shonen hero ever. Every stereotype about shonen action goes out the window. Bah. This thread is making me think of to many things I haven't read yet; considering how much I loved Cross Game it's almost a crime I haven't read Touch.

 

[juUnior]

Thx Kaiten for the answer.

Continuing on the subject that... Won't quite seem to die in the Jump thread, I started reading Houshin Engi recently and I kind of regret not getting in to it earlier.

Not the kind of manga you really see all that often anymore.

Houshin Engi is one of my all time favorites. Taikoubou is hands down the least conventional shonen hero ever. Every stereotype about shonen action goes out the window.

One of my favourites series of all time, too. Its really cool to place the things in such "historic" I would say events, and the characters.. I always hyped back than the characters which were put into this story - when you don't forget such characters, I think it tells that the series was at least good. <Nazza rlz forever btw., I just had to >

And also about anime: its only a "little" of manga stuff here, but generally its a good anime with normal pace 26 episodes <so the quality rather not drops> And the OST is still one of my favourites from anime series. I definitely recommend too, whether before or after the reading

 

[StrangerAtaru]

Nube is coming along but sadly it's rather slow. I'm near the end of vol. 10 but the scanslator is only near the end of vol. 3. Probably just due to how many people are tied to all their other projects but not that or the fact that they do need a proofer or cleaner who wants to really do the project. But hey, at least I'm trying to get those scripts out there. (honestly the only shock regarding scanslations of my work as of late is that the guy doing Otokojuku...actually caught up with me and now is keeping an eye on me to get the scripts done)

There are quite a few Jump and Sunday (and maybe even one or two Magazine) series I do want to read though. Houshin Engi was up there due to the anime...which wasn't that bad even if it wasn't what I've heard with the manga. Same goes for Dr. Slump...also sort of want to try some early Adachi if it weren't for the scanslation crackdown. Though personally if I could get my hands on it, I'd love to take a whack at Doberman Detective (an early Buronson series that put him on the match pre-Fist of the North Star...)

 

[Drmke]

Nube is a fun series though I need to catch back up Most older series I'm interested in tend to be from Jump simply because they get more exposure so its easier to find them. Like I'd like to read more than 2 volumes of Rising Impact or read Fuma no Kojiro. Play Ball also looks interesting but is so old I doubt I'll ever get to read it.

In fact, that might be why most people tend to focus on current series instead of caring about older ones. Besides your fantastic job translating older series StrangerAtaru, very little attention is given to older series, Jump or not. Many fans probably know this and don't even try to give older series a chance because they feel its wasted effort.

 

[Asarii]

@Kaiten: Oh, I'm sorry about that! I'll try to list more accessible titles next time.

They're all great series, and it really is a shame that they aren't translated. If the classics don't get exposure overseas, then no one will know about them. Is perhaps the lack of translations due to lack of demand?

 

[StrangerAtaru]

One problem I noticed with fanbase these days is their obsession with immediacy and instant demand. With the internet making things available right away, people can catch up to and go along with things as they run in Japan. Thus, they get the chance to see the latest anime episodes and read the latest chapters. However, the problem with immediacy is that it prevents people from realizing there is a back-story or a history that connects to all this. Everything comes from somewhere, and that somewhere, unless it's still going (like JoJo) or is connected to something else that is currently running (sort of like Kinnikuman Nisei) is for the most part going to be forgotten or ignored.

Of course, I got into anime/manga just before then when Urusei Yatsura (well the anime version) on VHS by Animeigo was a thing of wonderment...and that content was from 1981! (and I got that tape in 1996)

 

[Riku]

I love classic manga, the only problem I have with those is the avaibility. It's very hard to find some in english, in internet and for real.

My favorite must be Keiji Nakazawa for Barefoot Gen. I've only read 2½ volumes of this loosely auto-biographic master piece, and I'mquite confinceded that it's the best manga ever. It tells the story of a young boy named Gen, who survives the Hiroshima atom bomb. It offers great drama and big feelings, real human feelings. Also the historical portrayal of WWII Japan is very interesting, from a very pacifistic and critical point of few. Also the way how the nasty nature of human surfaces from time to time before and after the bomb makes on really think. And it's not only the rich and bad upper class, even harmless old grannies discriminate the 'contamined' survivors. And the treatment Gen and his family get before the bomb, because his dad is a realistic pacifist and understands that Japan has already lost. People really are that cruel? I guess so.

Hard to think that that kinda series once ran in Weekly Shonen Jump.

Another one I love is Go Nagai, best known for Mazinger Z, Cutie Honey and Devilman. He is a great pioneer in the history of manga. Just come on, he invented mecha! Could be said he invented "fan-service" too. For the first time in the history of manga he used extreme violence and eroticism in children comic. That has a great meaning to emerging of shonen as it is today.

And Cutey Honey was one of the first "magic girl" series too. When talking about great historical mangaka, he is too often overlooked. And damn, in 1972 he had 5 simultaneosly running series, he even wrote and drew all of them by himself.

 

[Esc.]

Naturally, Go Nagai and Osamu Tezuka, and all the these great mangaka's were the strongest of the pioneers, inspired many people in many fields. For me, it's a shame that I can't find all of their series. I tried looking into 'The Phoenix' (which I really wanted to get into), but I couldn't find them online. Of course, Viz has them out already, I'm probably too lazy to go out and actually purchase them though.

In any case, thinking more about the oldies got me searching around for a lot of classics I haven't read yet. Stuff like 'Ashita no Joe' and 'Devilman'.

I hope people actually spot this thread and decide to pick up some of the mentioned series.

 

[Kaiten]

Try searching mediafire or megaupload. At least some of phoenix is online. When the crackdown started they got a little harder to find, sadly.

Thx Kaiten for the answer.

One of my favourites series of all time, too. Its really cool to place the things in such "historic" I would say events, and the characters.. I always hyped back than the characters which were put into this story - when you don't forget such characters, I think it tells that the series was at least good. <Nazza rlz forever btw., I just had to >

And also about anime: its only a "little" of manga stuff here, but generally its a good anime with normal pace 26 episodes <so the quality rather not drops> And the OST is still one of my favourites from anime series. I definitely recommend too, whether before or after the reading

I still haven't watched the anime, I heard it was pretty good though. Fujisaki's take on the Creation of the God was so WTF, while remaining true to the book (or so I've heard). Really makes me wish the original were easier to find in English.

Nube is coming along but sadly it's rather slow. I'm near the end of vol. 10 but the scanslator is only near the end of vol. 3. Probably just due to how many people are tied to all their other projects but not that or the fact that they do need a proofer or cleaner who wants to really do the project. But hey, at least I'm trying to get those scripts out there. (honestly the only shock regarding scanslations of my work as of late is that the guy doing Otokojuku...actually caught up with me and now is keeping an eye on me to get the scripts done)

There are quite a few Jump and Sunday (and maybe even one or two Magazine) series I do want to read though. Houshin Engi was up there due to the anime...which wasn't that bad even if it wasn't what I've heard with the manga. Same goes for Dr. Slump...also sort of want to try some early Adachi if it weren't for the scanslation crackdown. Though personally if I could get my hands on it, I'd love to take a whack at Doberman Detective (an early Buronson series that put him on the match pre-Fist of the North Star...)

I'm waiting till the Manga Editors get going a bit more. Nube is the classic Jump series I most want to read, not sure I want to wait months for one chapter. I'm used to some wait, not the type who needs a chapter a week, but I have my limits.

Houshin is sensational, give it a try if you haven't yet. Dr. Slump is also great, Toriyama was as good at comedy as he was with action. The humor of One Piece is pure Dr. Slump. I need to read more Adachi, I keep meaning to read Touch but it's buried on my list right now, same with H2. Cross Game was a masterpiece, some of the best storytelling in manga.

Nube is a fun series though I need to catch back up Most older series I'm interested in tend to be from Jump simply because they get more exposure so its easier to find them. Like I'd like to read more than 2 volumes of Rising Impact or read Fuma no Kojiro. Play Ball also looks interesting but is so old I doubt I'll ever get to read it.

In fact, that might be why most people tend to focus on current series instead of caring about older ones. Besides your fantastic job translating older series StrangerAtaru, very little attention is given to older series, Jump or not. Many fans probably know this and don't even try to give older series a chance because they feel its wasted effort.

There's some good, old Sunday being scanlated now. Kenji and Kyou kara Ore wa!! for example. Classics by Adachi and Rumiko Takahashi are widely available too. Sad that drifting classroom isn't fully scnalated.

@Kaiten: Oh, I'm sorry about that! I'll try to list more accessible titles next time.

They're all great series, and it really is a shame that they aren't translated. If the classics don't get exposure overseas, then no one will know about them. Is perhaps the lack of translations due to lack of demand?

Forgive

Promoting untranslated series is a good thing. No other way to get them some attention. I wouldn't have known about them if you didn't say anything.

One problem I noticed with fanbase these days is their obsession with immediacy and instant demand. With the internet making things available right away, people can catch up to and go along with things as they run in Japan. Thus, they get the chance to see the latest anime episodes and read the latest chapters. However, the problem with immediacy is that it prevents people from realizing there is a back-story or a history that connects to all this. Everything comes from somewhere, and that somewhere, unless it's still going (like JoJo) or is connected to something else that is currently running (sort of like Kinnikuman Nisei) is for the most part going to be forgotten or ignored.

Of course, I got into anime/manga just before then when Urusei Yatsura (well the anime version) on VHS by Animeigo was a thing of wonderment...and that content was from 1981! (and I got that tape in 1996)

Older fans and seinen/shojo/josei fans are used to patience. Most of the series I read are from tankobon scans anyway. Expectations are a bit different for fans primarily into the big series; the big 3, Fairy Tail, etc.

I love classic manga, the only problem I have with those is the avaibility. It's very hard to find some in english, in internet and for real.

My favorite must be Keiji Nakazawa for Barefoot Gen. I've only read 2½ volumes of this loosely auto-biographic master piece, and I'mquite confinceded that it's the best manga ever. It tells the story of a young boy named Gen, who survives the Hiroshima atom bomb. It offers great drama and big feelings, real human feelings. Also the historical portrayal of WWII Japan is very interesting, from a very pacifistic and critical point of few. Also the way how the nasty nature of human surfaces from time to time before and after the bomb makes on really think. And it's not only the rich and bad upper class, even harmless old grannies discriminate the 'contamined' survivors. And the treatment Gen and his family get before the bomb, because his dad is a realistic pacifist and understands that Japan has already lost. People really are that cruel? I guess so.

Hard to think that that kinda series once ran in Weekly Shonen Jump.

Another one I love is Go Nagai, best known for Mazinger Z, Cutie Honey and Devilman. He is a great pioneer in the history of manga. Just come on, he invented mecha! Could be said he invented "fan-service" too. For the first time in the history of manga he used extreme violence and eroticism in children comic. That has a great meaning to emerging of shonen as it is today.

And Cutey Honey was one of the first "magic girl" series too. When talking about great historical mangaka, he is too often overlooked. And damn, in 1972 he had 5 simultaneosly running series, he even wrote and drew all of them by himself.

I'd love to read Barefoot Gen. It used to be available from VIZ but hasn't been in stores for a long time. While it used to surprise me that it was in Jump, learning a bit about the era makes it a little less shocking. The late 60's/early 70's was the peak of the Gekiga movement, even mainstream anthologies wanted grittier, more serious series of their own.

 

[R4n]

GOOD NEWS people!

http://www.mangafox.com/manga/eroica_yori_ai_wo_komete/

Edited Manga for Eroica yori ai wo komete is available! I would really recommend this classic action comedy. You can skip the entire volume one since it is kinda unrelated to the main storyline.

-----------------------------------------

btw Ashita no Joe is my favourite boxing manga. *___*