Discussion About Aura Combat & How Nen Works

[Phantron]

Well, killua could have about as great a ken as gon IMO. The issue would be that the two fight differently (killua is far more calculative and has a greater degree of finesse). Gon outputs more aura because his ko requires it, in turn killua burns through his nen by converting it into electricity.

As for manipulating things, it depends on the user and technique. Morel could control smoke creatures though, I would think that is quite different from controlling people. I don't think we ever saw pitou controlling thousands through his puppets though.

The Ants originally was going to create an army of 50,000 super soldiers. It'd be pretty weird to build such an army if they got no way to control them.

Pitou says Morel's puppets are fewer in number compares to his, but each are more precise.

---------- Post added at 09:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:03 PM ----------

A thought...Since Scissors requires Transformation does that means that Gon can make his aura edgy? >_>

Hisoka is kinda tricky and his ability is yet to be seen in fully function. He was almost playing with Kastro to take it as consideration.
The gum can be used in almost everything, so it's not limited by the person behind it. If Hisoka puts a point in one hand and the other in the other hand then the limit will be it's own strength.
Most awesome thing about Nen techniques is that they seem finished but they change a lot when applied and circumstances, which makes HxH cool to read. I know you know, but I always like to write it down xD

Transformation technique loses power quickly if they leave the user's hands. Thus Hisoka's technique is strictly limited by his strength because he always has to be holding it.

 

[Tombadgerlock]

Transformation technique loses power quickly if they leave the user's hands. Thus Hisoka's technique is strictly limited by his strength because he always has to be holding it.

Which is not 'strictly' true, since we know Hisoka also uses it as an emitted technique (each time we saw him fight, btw). It's way weaker, but it has its role.

 

[Phantron]

Which is not 'strictly' true, since we know Hisoka also uses it as an emitted technique (each time we saw him fight, btw). It's way weaker, but it has its role.

You mean the time he raises his fist and shoots out the aura with In? It's still attached to his arm. The 'leave user's body' refers to losing physical contact with the user. The aura itself can stretch pretty far (up to 10 meters) but one end has to be attached to his body, so he can't just say project it on in the middle of nowhere and use it as a reflective shield. It'd break immediately because it's not attached to his body. Now he can use it as a reflective shield if he's holding, similar to the fight against Razor, but it's clear in this case he still takes some damage from the impact.

 

[Uriel]

The Ants originally was going to create an army of 50,000 super soldiers. It'd be pretty weird to build such an army if they got no way to control them.
Pitou says Morel's puppets are fewer in number compares to his, but each are more precise.

That wouldn't come of the techniques itself, but rather due the ability to make Humans an ant. Exactly as they did with Palm. I'm sure they can't control with Nen 50K living things.

Transformation technique loses power quickly if they leave the user's hands. Thus Hisoka's technique is strictly limited by his strength because he always has to be holding it.

Remember that the ones that were stickied in the cards were attached to Kastro and there was ANOTHER thread from Hisoka to Kastro. And I doubt Hisoka hasn't reach the level of keeping the property on a considerable distance. Also, If He applies an spider web system the enemy is screwed up by its own force while Hisoka keeps in touch with his Gum.

 

[Phantron]

That wouldn't come of the techniques itself, but rather due the ability to make Humans an ant. Exactly as they did with Palm. I'm sure they can't control with Nen 50K living things.

Remember that the ones that were stickied in the cards were attached to Kastro and there was ANOTHER thread from Hisoka to Kastro. And I doubt Hisoka hasn't reach the level of keeping the property on a considerable distance. Also, If He applies an spider web system the enemy is screwed up by its own force while Hisoka keeps in touch with his Gum.

The cards appear to be simple objects reinforced to give extra power. Nothing special there.

If he makes a web and try to smother you with it, there are two problems. First, if you attempt to smother someone head on, they'll see it coming because his hands have to be in a certain way to hold the web. Even if it somehow works so say you cover both hands of the enemy, well Hisoka has both of his hands tied up to maintain the web. So you've gained nothing. The moment you attempt to punch them the web will break. Sure Hisoka seems to have some ranged attack capability (the cards), but that's at best manipulate (which is two away from his natural) + reinforcement, which is nothing special.

Even if this technique works, it'd be way easier to try to smother someone with say the cloak ability that Kuroro stole, since if you cover someone in the cloak you pretty much win. Of course from this you can infer that it should be practically impossible to walk up to someone while wielding a giant cloak and hope they somehow didn't notice.

Transformation can make some rather powerful objects out of aura, and the limitation is that you have to always be holding it in some way. Otherwise you can just project say 10 layers of the bubblegum suspended in space and completely immobilize an enemy. Or use 10 layers of bubblegum in front of you against any impending projectile attack and you'll be able to reflect them back at no cost to yourself.

Pitou can control random soldiers wielding machine guns so I don't know why he wouldn't do the same for the eventual army. Palm was their test subject and looking at her state, she wouldn't make a useful soldier without at least some minimal level of guidance. Morel thought that Pitou was a manipulate user who plan on using the eventual army to conquer the world. If that has nothing to do with manipulate, Morel wouldn't need to point out the type he thought Pitou was.

 

[Uriel]

The cards killed Kastro by pulling them from the roof to him. I wouldn't say it's nothing. I think He's completely able to throw his Gum, as was shown with Razor when He put it on the ball. That reception was MAD in strength yet the gum contained both without breaking.

You don't understand how a web works xD Being trap in a web doesn't smother and it's not the real function.
BTW, that guy who used Water (Stolen by Leol) was Transformation, right?

 

[Tombadgerlock]

Hisoka can only keep his Bungee Gum up to ten meters away WHEN IT'S NOT CONNECTED TO HIS BODY.

Now, in each fight, he uses it as emitted, and as not emitted.

Emitted examples:

Against kastro, he used it to tie the cards to kastro's body, as well as tie his cut off arm to kastro's body.

In Gon fight, he tied a rock to Gon's jaw.

In Volleyball, he ended up emiiting his bungee gum all over the ball in order to use it as 'Glue'.

 

[Antaries]

The cards killed Kastro by pulling them from the roof to him. I wouldn't say it's nothing. I think He's completely able to throw his Gum, as was shown with Razor when He put it on the ball. That reception was MAD in strength yet the gum contained both without breaking.

You don't understand how a web works xD Being trap in a web doesn't smother and it's not the real function.
BTW, that guy who used Water (Stolen by Leol) was Transformation, right?

Was it transformation? If you use the glass technique reinforcement multiplies the volume of water. Of course you're gonna have to need to materialize water then reinforce it to actually make a wave.

Ahisokas technique is formidable. I mean, that alone can cover up your airway and suffocate you. Gon chan could probably cut it with his scissor technique but I doubt Hisoka will give it a chance.

Emission types are invisible auras from the untrained eye just like pokkles arrow and razors ball. It seems pretty basic in nature like the reinforcement types. I doubt even with manipulation one can manipulate the direction of the emitted aura but it is possible to control the emitted aura we just haven't seen it yet. The only manipulation I saw was the lady's sex slave kiss, Squarras dogs, Shalnarks antenna etc. So for manipulation, they all needed an object to manipulate. Kastros double body can be considered to be more of a materialized solid object rather than aura.

 

[kkck]

^Actually zeno has been seen controlling his dragons several times. Emitters are not far from manipulation so controlling the nen once it leaves their body should be pretty easy. Just take a look at the fight between zeno and kuroro and the invasion of the ants palace.

As for kastro's body, yeah, it was in fact conjuration. That much was stated in the manga.

 

[Tombadgerlock]

^Actually zeno has been seen controlling his dragons several times. Emitters are not far from manipulation so controlling the nen once it leaves their body should be pretty easy. Just take a look at the fight between zeno and kuroro and the invasion of the ants palace.

Zeno's dragon is most likely Transformation, and it doesn't need manipulation at all- changing the shape of aura is part of Transformation's portfolio, not manipulaton.

Invasion of Ant palace, however, also uses emission.

 

[kkck]

Giving nen the rough shape of a dragon is certainly a low level form of transformation however having it fly away from the user is 100% emission. In that regard, zeno's hatsu is certainly primarily emission. Manipulation comes in when he controls it even though he is not in contact with it. He has done this twice. Once when he fought kuroro and had it change direction in midair and again during the chimera ant arc when the dragon split and arguably when the dragon took netero and mereum to the fights location.

 

[Tombadgerlock]

Giving nen the rough shape of a dragon is certainly a low level form of transformation however having it fly away from the user is 100% emission. In that regard, zeno's hatsu is certainly primarily emission. Manipulation comes in when he controls it even though he is not in contact with it. He has done this twice. Once when he fought kuroro and had it change direction in midair and again during the chimera ant arc when the dragon split and arguably when the dragon took netero and mereum to the fights location.

The dragon didn't leave Zeno when fighting against Kuroro.

Only during the ant arc.

Zeno didn't need manipulation either against Kuroro- though he possibly did when he had his dragon transport Netero/Mereum.

 

[Phantron]

Totally random thought: Knuckle's ability is basically an invincible support ability. Here's what you do.

Hit a friend for minimal damage.

Potclean is a physical object that can be moved around (we see numerous depiction of people trying to hit it and it can be moved, just not damaged).

Friend uses Potclean to block to any attack of any arbitarily power.

Note that Potclean exists even if Knuckles isn't in range, so if multiple Potcleans can exist at the same time, you should just give one to everyone on your side. Even if you somehow got the debt rolled to too high, Knuckles can cancel this ability at any given time.

Unfortunately the enemy can do the same thing if he is fighting multiple enemies at once. Actually, he can even use Potclean to block attack from Knuckles himself.

 

[Tombadgerlock]

Yeah, no.

Potclean can't be hurt, nor can it block anything. It is strongly implied it can't be hurt because it can't do anything but the countdown.

 

[Uriel]

As a note, since Killua knew about the Dragons even before knowing Nen and the fact that He used to fly over the palace means that He also uses SERIOUS materialization.

 

[Phantron]

Potclean can be interacted physically. Multiple characters have tried to hit it, and it shows that it moves and reacts to being physically hit. That means you can say, pick Potclean up and throw it at someone.

Now if Potclean carries no force when you throw it at someone, then that means it can dissapiate any amount of force so you can use it to block because the force will not transmit past Potclean.

If it does carries force with it, you can just throw it at someone as a weapon.

The problem is that there is no such thing as a physically interactable object that can be invulnerable and yet also useless. If Potclean cannot be physcially interacted with, then it'd be okay, but it definitely can be. If you can move it, it either carries physical force or it does not, and both cases will lead to something useful in combat.

 

[Tombadgerlock]

Potclean can be interacted physically. Multiple characters have tried to hit it, and it shows that it moves and reacts to being physically hit. That means you can say, pick Potclean up and throw it at someone.

The problem is that there is no such thing as a physically interactable object that can be invulnerable and yet also useless. If Potclean cannot be physcially interacted with, then it'd be okay, but it definitely can be. If you can move it, it either carries physical force or it does not, and both cases will lead to something useful in combat.

Or maybe it 'dodges' to annoy the opponent.

Or maybe it's a rule of the hatsu for it to not be usable for that, ever (hence it will dodge use by friendlies too).

 

[Uriel]

The problem is that there is no such thing as a physically interactable object that can be invulnerable and yet also useless. If Potclean cannot be physcially interacted with, then it'd be okay, but it definitely can be. If you can move it, it either carries physical force or it does not, and both cases will lead to something useful in combat.

I think that the same condition that makes Potclean immune to any attack makes him unable to attack or be used as an attack. So using it would be impossible to have him as a weapon.

 

[Phantron]

Potclean doesn't dodge opponent's attack, since multiple people have shown the ability to hit it for no effect. It'd have no reason to since it's invulnerable. What's stopping the opponent from picking his Potclean up and use it as a shield?

I doubt you'll actually see this happen in HXH, no more than Goreinu can push his black gorilla off a cliff and then teleport it with his enemy and instantly killing them, but it's fun to think about what could happen. Speaking of Goreinu, one thing he could do is wait until Razor throws the ball at his black gorilla, and then teleport Razor with the gorilla and that'd probably kill Razor since he wouldn't be expecting it. Of course, if he can teleport the gorilla more than once, then he can do it by thinking of an ally (say, Gon) as an enemy to teleport the black gorilla with Gon, and then do it again with Razor. But even if you limit to one teleport, it's still a ridiculously powerful ability.

 

[Tombadgerlock]

Potclean doesn't dodge opponent's attack, since multiple people have shown the ability to hit it for no effect. It'd have no reason to since it's invulnerable. What's stopping the opponent from picking his Potclean up and use it as a shield?

It's very Nature. Potclean will dodge and cannot be grabbed. Also, can i have a pic of potclean being hit.

I can't remember anyone managing such a feat.