Anime Hunter X Hunter New Anime Discussion

[mrsticky005]

Hisoka doesn't "prepare" for an attack / opponent he just fights, Hisoka "preparing" beforehand contradicts everything we've read about him in the manga, any preparations he does are in the fight itself not before it..

Hisoka vs Kastro
Hisoka willing to take on the whole Ryodan when he changed his prophecy
Hisoka going after Kuroro when he heard about the exchange
Hisoka vs Goto
and Hisoka vs Gon is no exception..

Well I suppose that's true.

Let me put it this way. It's not like just throwing the stone along
would have tricked Hisoka. The stone throw + the shatter+ the probable
use of Zetsu was a genius move by Gon and more advanced than
what he did against Riehlvelt.

 

[TheAmericandream]

I'd argue in the 1999 version Gon stays in Heaven's Arena to continue learning about Nen and later rescue the captured Zushi, its still not a good change. But it doesn't bother me as much as Kite flashback. But I can understand how it might be worse to someone else.

 

[mrsticky005]

I'd argue in the 1999 version Gon stays in Heaven's Arena to continue learning about Nen and later rescue the captured Zushi, its still not a good change. But it doesn't bother me as much as Kite flashback. But I can understand how it might be worse to someone else.

Well I'm expecting Kite to be seen at Whale Island. Still in any case Kite flashback is a flashback. And to be honest I DON'T think it was necessary for Gon's motivation.
Though I do want to see the scene and preferably sooner than later.

The problem is then why do they leave? Basically either way you got a problem.

Kite can still be fixed is basically what I'm saying.

 

[Refraction]

The problem is then why do they leave? Basically either way you got a problem.

I can't give a truly satisfactory answer here, because I can't speak for the writers who composed that episode--but I could try offering a thought, or some justification, if it helps in any way. I'll put it in a spoiler box in case anyone's getting fed up with me and wants to talk about something else.

Spoiler

I'd suggest that they left because they'd finished up their training with Wing: I think that became the goalpost for them in that it was the one remaining plot point that'd been established at the beginning of the arc. The nature of the conclusions of those matches before the graduation effectively gave Wing reason to congratulate both of them together and graduate them simultaneously. Reordering the events to allow these fights to come before that creates an impression that the whole episode feels elegant in that the progress of both Gon and Killua at this stage is illustrated clearly to the audience, which makes the very next scene where Wing passes them both feel so natural. For the sake of the screenplay, reordering the events arguably makes the experience tighter; there's a sense of progression and a sense of coming full circle: Gon cleared up his earlier goal of decking Hisoka in the mug, but the earlier plot point of the training had yet to be resolved. Having Gon and Killua both pass after a victory makes that next scene that bit more logical--after all, Wing had already intimated that he was going to send them on their way at the beginning of the episode. In other words, the episode began and ended with the notion of Gon and Killua moving on--and that overarching theme for the episode--passing and graduating--is underscored by the victories of those reordered fights, underlining the progress made by both characters. If the episode's theme was Gon and Killua having surmounted all the obstacles posed by the Arena and Nen, then having them come out of the episode which represents that with victories really accentuates that they've conquered that last plot point--the difference being that the Riehlvelt and Gido plot-point was weaved together more transparently with the mastering of the basics of Nen plot point.

For me, it's a bit of fairly clever writing that tailors the events of the manga to get more out of the anime form; the anime staff were good at making each episode feel like something of an story in and of itself, and I think the reordering was sensitive to the manga and gives you that same sense of satisfaction that your average chapter of the manga does, despite its often limited page counts.

Those're my own observations, though, and everything I've said represents my own interpretation of what could be implied by the episode. I don't dispute at all that things were changed--because that that's the bottom line: they were--and if we're marking the 1999 series against the manga for 1:1 trueness I ain't going to rally to its defence, because I'd be absurd. I'd sooner run to the hills.

 

[Diivil]

I can't give a truly satisfactory answer here, because I can't speak for the writers who composed that episode--but I could try offering a thought, or some justification, if it helps in any way. I'll put it in a spoiler box in case anyone's getting fed up with me and wants to talk about something else.

Getting fed up with you? pfft how could we, I enjoy your Opinion and thought very much! Very well structured,clearly state you're goal and back it up with legit reasoning

 

[futurefrog]

My biggest gripe with the restructuring of the Heaven's Arena arc in the 1999 series is that it destroys Togashi's original intent with the arc and downplays the entire arcs importance. Heaven's Arena is a pivotal moment for Gon and Killua it is all about them discovering this mystical new power and for Gon it's also about earning the right to return Hisoka's badge (which he does earn in the 1999 series). The characterisation was ruined beyond repair and ultimately left some major inconsistencies and severely messed up future events. That arc was enough of a warning sign that they would not complete the entire series, it also is a great example of how Furuhashi did not care to adapt material that wasn't Kurapika centric.

I think at this point in the series run, it is absolutely ridiculous to even dispute that the 2011 series is a better representation of Togashi's original manga and original intent.

 

[Cocoro63]

You're saying that the 2011 anime follows better the manga but I'm not seeing kite at the beginning

Spoiler

And he is very important since he is the guy that tells Gon that his father is alive

 

[mrsticky005]

I can't give a truly satisfactory answer here, because I can't speak for the writers who composed that episode--but I could try offering a thought, or some justification, if it helps in any way. I'll put it in a spoiler box in case anyone's getting fed up with me and wants to talk about something else.

Spoiler

I'd suggest that they left because they'd finished up their training with Wing: I think that became the goalpost for them in that it was the one remaining plot point that'd been established at the beginning of the arc. The nature of the conclusions of those matches before the graduation effectively gave Wing reason to congratulate both of them together and graduate them simultaneously. Reordering the events to allow these fights to come before that creates an impression that the whole episode feels elegant in that the progress of both Gon and Killua at this stage is illustrated clearly to the audience, which makes the very next scene where Wing passes them both feel so natural. For the sake of the screenplay, reordering the events arguably makes the experience tighter; there's a sense of progression and a sense of coming full circle: Gon cleared up his earlier goal of decking Hisoka in the mug, but the earlier plot point of the training had yet to be resolved. Having Gon and Killua both pass after a victory makes that next scene that bit more logical--after all, Wing had already intimated that he was going to send them on their way at the beginning of the episode. In other words, the episode began and ended with the notion of Gon and Killua moving on--and that overarching theme for the episode--passing and graduating--is underscored by the victories of those reordered fights, underlining the progress made by both characters. If the episode's theme was Gon and Killua having surmounted all the obstacles posed by the Arena and Nen, then having them come out of the episode which represents that with victories really accentuates that they've conquered that last plot point--the difference being that the Riehlvelt and Gido plot-point was weaved together more transparently with the mastering of the basics of Nen plot point.

For me, it's a bit of fairly clever writing that tailors the events of the manga to get more out of the anime form; the anime staff were good at making each episode feel like something of an story in and of itself, and I think the reordering was sensitive to the manga and gives you that same sense of satisfaction that your average chapter of the manga does, despite its often limited page counts.

Those're my own observations, though, and everything I've said represents my own interpretation of what could be implied by the episode. I don't dispute at all that things were changed--because that that's the bottom line: they were--and if we're marking the 1999 series against the manga for 1:1 trueness I ain't going to rally to its defence, because I'd be absurd. I'd sooner run to the hills.

Well I suppose that's one way of looking at it.
But as you said...it's changed and well that's
pretty much what bothers me. But it's like
if people like the manga...why give them
a different anime?

And for those who think I'm picking on the 1999 series.
I'm really not. I've picked on the 2011 series too when
it doesn't follow the manga. I would say sometimes
I'm even HARSHER on the 2011 series because I do
have great expectations for it. As for stuff like Kite not
being the first episode. It annoyed me for sure.
But I'm just waiting to see what they do. Maybe
it will work out fine and maybe it won't. Whereas
in the 1999 I know for a fact that there won't ever
be stuff like Hisoka vs Kastro. I can't really have hope for it.
And in spite of not having Kite the 2011 has managed to
stay truer to Gon's manga characterization than the 1999
which did have Kite's scene early of from the first episode.

I think in a sense what bothers me about the 1999 version
is the intent. I don't believe that the director was trying
to tell Togashi's story and that bothers me.

I DO think the 2011 is trying to tell Togashi's story
but I think they have trouble doing so at times
because of certain restrictions. Mainly censorship.
As much as I may have complained about it before,
I have to give Madhouse credit for trying to work
around the censorship as well as they do. That can't be easy.

Now I don't hate the 1999. I do like it.
But while may like it because of the filler/changes.
I like it in SPITE of the filler/changes.

 

[futurefrog]

You're saying that the 2011 anime follows better the manga but I'm not seeing kite at the beginning

Spoiler

And he is very important since he is the guy that tells Gon that his father is alive

As has been said multiple times now, Madhouse made the decision to relocate his introduction as to make his first appearance and reappearance after Greed Island closer together, also because they wanted to give Gon's past and Ging more mystery for new viewers. I look at it as like how One Piece relocated the Shanks back story. Relocating Kite is in no way at all on the same level as rearranging the events of Heaven's Arena, because we know we will be getting the Kite backstory soon, Heaven's Arena being rearranged fucked up future events, relocating a flashback does not do that.

 

[mrsticky005]

You're saying that the 2011 anime follows better the manga but I'm not seeing kite at the beginning
And he is very important since he is the guy that tells Gon that his father is alive

True. But the scene is a flashback. They literally could put it in the next episode and there you go (well sorta.)

They've already established that Gon wants to meet his dad and become a Hunter in the very first episode.
So we've already got the characterization for Gon and his motives and what not. We just have that mystery.

Who told him about his Dad? Obviously Aunt Mito didn't tell him. We know the story with Killua, Kurapika, and Leorio

Killua ran away from home so he could decide his own fate.
Kurapika is out for revenge.
Leorio is a wannabe philantropist.

But what about Gon?

He wants to meet his dad. Not so much out of wanting a reunion...But because if there is something worth abandoning your own kid for...Gon wants in.

Has anyone noticed how when Gon met Ging....He never asked him "Why did you abandon me?" Sure Ging sorta told him through the tape.
But still. You'd think that would be the one question dwelling on Gon's mind. But Gon didn't seem to care about any of that.
Gon seems much more interested in meeting Kite's teacher, or meeting one of the creator's of Greed Island, one of the top 5 nen users
in the world, or meeting the guy who was the only winner of the Hunter Exam in his year than he does seem to care about meeting his own dad.

 

[Crude]

^ True that. Gon seems a lot more interested in meeting Ging the person, who at the same time happens to be his father.

 

[mrsticky005]

^ True that. Gon seems a lot more interested in meeting Ging the person, who at the same time happens to be his father.

In contrast take Naruto's "reunion" with his dead dad Minato.
What was one of the first things Naruto does? He punches his dad
and asks how his own dad could put the Nine Tails was put inside him
and cause him so much misery and grief.

This is what a normal person does.
In fact I wouldn't blame Naruto if he hated Minato.


But Gon is NOTHING like this.

Gon seems to not give a crap about family except for maybe Aunt Mito.

But I think this scene speaks volumes about Gon's character and
actually I think the last part from the Viz Translation is omitted in
the adaptations (and the translation).

I'll tell the Viz translation after

Well aside from being an incredibly clumsily worded translation it's missing something
(either that or Viz added something)

Here is how the Viz version goes

"Being a hunter must be an important job. So important...that family comes second."

Now check this part out. This is what Gon says to Aunt Mito that upsets her

"Being a hunter, isn't for weaklings, Aunt Mito."

Does anyone else realize what Gon is saying here?

No wonder Mito got upset! That's a pretty cruel thing to say! Assuming it wasn't added...
Does anyone know if Viz added that line in or what? Though I don't think they did because
it matches up with the rest of Gon's behavior.

Another thing strange about Gon.

As a little kid he rescues Kon the Foxbear Cub from a Hunter (named Kite) who killed
the mother Foxbear Cub to save Gon. Gon decides to protect Kon and raise it in place
of it's deceased mother. Now this isn't the strange part. One could look it as Gon
didn't want the cub to die for his own mistake. Which makes sense.

HOWEVER.

3 years later. It's clear that Gon and Kon are best friends.
But then Gon applies to the Hunter Exam and since Hunters
and animals of the forest don't get along (Just look at the example
with Kite) Gon basically tells Kon to get lost. In a nice way. But still.
It doesn't matter they been friends for 3 years. The Hunter Exam
is more important than their friendship and so is Kon's title
as king of the forest.

But of course this is just some silly bear/boy friendship story.
Of course it can't last forever. It's time for Gon to grow up, right?
There's no parallels to anything recent....Or is there

Chapter 338

Gon and Killua's separation.

Naruto vs Sasuke has got NOTHING on the magnitude of HxH Chapter 338.
As much as I like Naruto, let's be honest. The whole "friendship" between
Naruto and Sasuke is really plot device. Comrades yes. But best friends?
Yet Gon and Killua are at least on a surface level best friends in fact some
may think they are even lovers. The connection between them is unmistakable.

But now they are separating.

Why?

Because Gon wants to talk to Ging in private more than he wants to hang out with Killua

and Killua is busy taking care of Alluka.

This may be rather controversial of me to say but I sincerely think...

That Gon Freecss is the BEST WRITTEN SHONEN PROTAGONIST...EVER.

Now you may like others more. But Gon is written better.

 

[Netero]

^I agree with you 100% I've had conversations with friends multiple times saying I personally believe Gon is the best written shonen protagonist too. Of course this is just my opinion, and not everyone will agree.

 

[futurefrog]

I agree with you 100% MrSticky.

I think an interesting part of Hunter x Hunter is that there is many times when these characters need to go there separate ways. Because after all isn't that a part of growing up? Leaving behind the past, however many memories that may hold. Knowing when it's time to move on is a sign of maturity. I truly believe Hunter x Hunter to be one of the greatest coming of age stories ever told. It's all about losing innocence and learning that growing up means accepting that the older we get, the more we lose and the harsher the world becomes. It's sad, but it's ultimately true. Gon and Killua's separation is absolutely monumental because it marks a turning point for Gon, he doesn't need Killua anymore. He doesn't need anyone but himself. He beat Genthru all alone and heck he beat Pitou all alone, he doesn't need anyone, he is strong, right? No this is wrong. I think the first half of Hunter x Hunter is about Gon becoming strong enough to be alone, strong enough to not need anyone. I believe the second half which we are now seeing will be about Gon learning that he really does need people, and that no matter how old or strong you get, we always need friends and we always need connection. Gon has severed most connections and seems to want to 'go it alone' much like his father, will Gon head down the same path as Ging or will he decide upon another? We will have to wait and see.

 

[mrsticky005]

^I agree with you 100% I've had conversations with friends multiple times saying I personally believe Gon is the best written shonen protagonist too. Of course this is just my opinion, and not everyone will agree.

Sure it's an opinion. But I think there is good evidence for it. Namely, the subtle but yet
enormous amount of depth Togashi puts into Gon. Gon on the surface level is the ideal
shonen protagonist but in depth he's so much more.

Some shonen protagonists aren't even that great on a surface level. And most if they
have any depth of character it is rather forced. Also a lot of times people can read
into a character too much. Which may be the case here. But there's something
about Gon that makes him stand out from the crowd. Really I think Gon is more in
line with characters like "Pip" from "Great Expectations" and other coming of age stories
than he is to characters like Luffy, Ichigo, or Naruto. It's not that those 3 are bad
characters. Surely they are likable...Well Luffy and Naruto at least.

Despite being a Bleach fan, Ichigo hasn't exactly won me over. He needs to stop being such a wuss
when things don't go his way. But that's that. However I wouldn't say any of the
3 of them are really that amazingly written. Ichigo is flat (some think that this might
be intentional so Ichigo can act as a reader avatar. Which is alright but at the
same time kind of dull) and it's really thanks to the villains that Bleach remains
interesting if at all (I like it still.)

Naruto is kinda all over the place and has his
good and bad days. Sometimes he can be really bad ass. Sometimes he can
be inspiring. And sometimes it's just like Kishi...what are you doing? Though
perhaps the problem with Naruto is at they say. A hero is only as interesting
as the villain and while Naruto has potentially awesome villains it seems like
they are always getting discarded for the sake of the plot. Naruto is very
dynamic but it doesn't seem very organized Bleach is the opposite.
The story is rather character based but it doesn't seem like Kubo has much
direction going on. It seems like characters just run around and fight and then
somehow they stumble into a story. I mean it makes for some interesting
interactions. But I have to wonder if even Kubo knows where he's going
with the story.

Then there's Luffy. Luffy is the most difficult to comment on
because he's not really meant to be complex in the first place. He's Goku 2.0.
He eats a lot, never gains weight, isn't very smart, kicks ass and is a kid at heart.
That's really all you need to know about Luffy. Luffy is for all intents and purposes
a flat character. But if he wasn't I don't think One Piece would work as well.
The point of Luffy is that he doesn't change. No matter what. That's not to
say he has zero development but rather that at the end of the day we all
know he's going to be the same ol Luffy. It works but it's not particularly daring.
Gon on the other hand is dynamic but yet iconic, bad ass, has great depth without it seeming like the author is force feeding that "depth" to you. He is the ideal
shonen protagonist and yet a complete deconstruction of the trope at the same time.

Here's the thing...

With Ichigo I'm not sure where he is headed as a character because
I'm not sure if Kubo is sure himself. But so far the destination seems like: Nowhere.

With Naruto I think he will end up as a solid good character but it will
be a bumpy ride. I think the good will (hopefully) outweigh the bad.
He will probably not change much anymore as he's already gone
plenty of development already. It's just a matter of stabilizing the character.

With Luffy he will remain as Luffy no matter the situation.
The only thing that will much change him is 1. his power level
2. his bank account 3. the number of friends/allies/enemies he has

With Gon...

I don't know what he will become because he could become almost anything
He has the potential to be a villain. But also the potential to be a hero.
He could end up as a tragic character or as a character of great inspiration.
No thing is for sure. I think it will be a while before Togashi ceases to amaze
and entertain with Hunter x Hunter.

---------- Post added at 12:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:02 AM ----------

^I agree with you 100% I've had conversations with friends multiple times saying I personally believe Gon is the best written shonen protagonist too. Of course this is just my opinion, and not everyone will agree.

I agree with you 100% MrSticky.

I think an interesting part of Hunter x Hunter is that there is many times when these characters need to go there separate ways. Because after all isn't that a part of growing up? Leaving behind the past, however many memories that may hold. Knowing when it's time to move on is a sign of maturity. I truly believe Hunter x Hunter to be one of the greatest coming of age stories ever told. It's all about losing innocence and learning that growing up means accepting that the older we get, the more we lose and the harsher the world becomes. It's sad, but it's ultimately true. Gon and Killua's separation is absolutely monumental because it marks a turning point for Gon, he doesn't need Killua anymore. He doesn't need anyone but himself. He beat Genthru all alone and heck he beat Pitou all alone, he doesn't need anyone, he is strong, right? No this is wrong. I think the first half of Hunter x Hunter is about Gon becoming strong enough to be alone, strong enough to not need anyone. I believe the second half which we are now seeing will be about Gon learning that he really does need people, and that no matter how old or strong you get, we always need friends and we always need connection. Gon has severed most connections and seems to want to 'go it alone' much like his father, will Gon head down the same path as Ging or will he decide upon another? We will have to wait and see.

That would be an interesting development. I wonder if Ging would learn the lesson too?



Also I was thinking for Kite Flashback....What if we got filler of basically just Gon and Kite hanging out? How long was Kite at Whale Island?
For a character that is pivotal to Gon's characterization in the Chimera Ant Arc it sure seems like Gon and Kite hardly even know each other.

 

[futurefrog]

With Gon...

I don't know what he will become because he could become almost anything
He has the potential to be a villain. But also the potential to be a hero.
He could end up as a tragic character or as a character of great inspiration.
No thing is for sure. I think it will be a while before Togashi ceases to amaze
and entertain with Hunter x Hunter.

I personally believe this is the main point of Gon's characterisation, at his age, this fragile age, he can be anything or anyone. He can be corrupted and go the path of Gyro or he can grow up to be a good man. Childhood is a time of great influence, we see all of the characters Gon interacts with influences who he is, who will this young boy grow up to be? That is the exciting thing about this excellent coming of age story.

 

[Demonspeed]

With Gon...

I don't know what he will become because he could become almost anything
He has the potential to be a villain. But also the potential to be a hero.
He could end up as a tragic character or as a character of great inspiration.
No thing is for sure.

I agree with you. For me Gon has the potential to be the darkest character in the manga. And many characters think that he is inhuman(Hisoka,Zepile,Meleoron).

It's one of the reason why i really want to see his encounter with Jairo because Gon could really change a lot!

Spoiler

Togashi... I am waiting for you!!

 

[Beans]

I only wanna know why was Rehlevlt using his scooter all the time in the old version.

 

[futurefrog]

I only wanna know why was Rehlevlt using his scooter all the time in the old version.

Obviously because it's so friggen cool!

Oh wait...

 

[SHINOBI-03]

Obviously because it's so friggen cool!

Cooler than MONSTER WHEELCHAIR?!