Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2014] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[Stark700]

That's not decent at all, ICV2 doesn't track every store either. But with those numbers their are losing money. (4-5K might be enough to break even in some cases)

Manga is a niche in the US. But even their bigger Jump titles don't seem to post numbers that are all that great.

Viz doesn't sell stuff to not lose money, silver spoon should be more costly than a typical Vertical license (the ones that gave us some numbers).

So to break even I'd say 6-7k for Silver Spoon, viz would want at the very least, to double that number.

I don't think they need to sell all that many copies to break even, or they would have been bankrupt a while back. As a side note, one of Viz's freelance letterers said that one of the series that they follow only made it into like, the hundreds of units sold. This may have been Excel Saga, though they never confirmed it. But I digress.

I know that ICv2 didn't post ALL of what was sold, because I don't think Amazon and Rightstuf and whatnot are accounted for, but brick and mortar store numbers are low.

 

[WyldViolet]

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I don't know if it's an artwork or else, however now we know that the figure in the preview it wasn't an hollow.

Where did this picture come from?
Looks like fanart to me.

 

[susanoo13]

If a dark series couldn't thrive in WSJ than how would this explain D Grayman?
Like stated above me any manga with a good enough plot could succeed without anything to do with genres, I don't think someone would have said "hmmm a cooking manga is just what jump is missing and it could really succeed right now" anytime in since this forum opened yet we have a successful cooking manga which already has a forum in the most competetive and until not to long ago action based magazine.

 

[WyldViolet]

If a dark series couldn't thrive in WSJ than how would this explain D Grayman?
Like stated above me any manga with a good enough plot could succeed without anything to do with genres, I don't think someone would have said "hmmm a cooking manga is just what jump is missing and it could really succeed right now" anytime in since this forum opened yet we have a successful cooking manga which already has a forum in the most competetive and until not to long ago action based magazine.

The occasional rare success doesn't change the fact that successful dark series in Jump are usually an anomaly.
Successful Jump series usually always have a core theme of friendship, teamwork, and/or adventure.
Dark series tend to sacrifice one or more of those elements for the sake of being edgy.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

Because anything that was dark and mature was short lasting, just look back at the series started in the past two+ years. There is a reason why nothing currently in the magazine is dark and mature. Jump readers simply dont want it.

I think that is very improper you saying about what Jump readers "want" based in this when you actually really don't know what the readers want, a manga to be popular or at least survive, just have to be good and interesting, don't matter the genre. If Jump thinks like this, they dont serialized Haikyuu, Souma, Ansatsu and so many others mangas because "in the last years we don't have nothing like this, so Jump readers don't want this"

 

[WyldViolet]

I think that is very improper you saying about what Jump readers "want" based in this when you actually really don't know what the readers want, a manga to be popular or at least survive. just have to be good and interesting, don't matter the genre. If Jump thinks like this, they dont serialized Haikyuu, Souma and so many others mangas because "in the last years we don't have nothing like this, so Jump readers don't want this"

We can't know "for sure" what Jump readers wants, but if we look at the past and see what series have been failures and what series have been successes, we can make up a pretty good idea about what Jump readers like when reading the magazine.

And I don't know what your point of bringing Haikyuu and Souma into this is.
Haikyuu is a sports manga, Jump has had lots of successful sports manga in the past and its a popular genre.
Souma is a cooking manga which is a popular niche manga genre. The fact that it's done in the style of a traditional Jump battle manga makes it even more appealing to Jump readers.

 

[SharkBait]

I think that is very improper you saying about what Jump readers "want" based in this when you actually really don't know what the readers want, a manga to be popular or at least survive. just have to be good and interesting, don't matter the genre. If Jump thinks like this, they dont serialized Haikyuu, Souma and so many others mangas because "in the last years we don't have nothing like this, so Jump readers don't want this"

What do you mean? Haikyuu!! most likely came because JUMP recognized the need for another sports series since there was a market for it. Souma could be stated that they needed another series set in school to fill that niche and that there was a market for people interesting in manga with ecchi elements and food elements (based on torikos popularity).

I dont understand why the "good and interesting" part of this needed to come up...JUMP editors serialized the series because they think its "good and interesting". Unless we are operating under the belief that they would really serialize series that are uninteresting and bad. Series need a hook and a market to appeal to be popular, and genre mustnt be overlooked.

 

[[Cross]]

What do you mean? Haikyuu!! most likely came because JUMP recognized the need for another sports series since there was a market for it. Souma could be stated that they needed another series set in school to fill that niche and that there was a market for people interesting in manga with ecchi elements and food elements (based on torikos popularity).

Can't say I agree with that 100%.
Anyway, I won't disagree with the sentiment that a "dark" series would have a harder time appealing to kids, assuming we're expecting this to be a generic "dark series."
But basing things off some art? I'd say at least start this kind of discussion after seeing the first chapter. At least. There are all kinds of trajectories a series could take, after all.

 

[Shinuki no Reborn]

The point is, anyone know what will be popular or what "jump readers want" and be based on what did or didn't succeed in two years, is just the wrong way, and i'm not talking about market, appeal or whaterver, and yes about a manga be interesting and good, dont matter the genre or theme, if the manga is interesting, will survive or be popular, even if for a short time

And what i talk about Haikyuu and Souma, is not be "sports" or have a "niche", is about serializing mangas with a "theme" (volleyball and real cooking manga) without historic of success in Shonen Jump.

 

[SharkBait]

The point is, anyone know what will be popular or what "jump readers want" and be based on what did or didn't succeed in two years, is just the wrong way, and i'm not talking about market, appeal or whaterver, and yes about a manga be interesting and good, dont matter the genre or theme, if the manga is interesting, will survive or be popular, even if for a short time

About Haikyuu and Souma, is not be "sports" or have a "niche", is about serializing mangas with a "theme" (volleyball and real cooking manga) without historic of success in Shonen Jump.

I think one is able to confidently suggest which series won't be popular or appealing and accurately predict it (based on genre). I am looking forward to revisiting this whole discussion in 8 or so weeks and then in 20 or so to see which sides premonition verified.

 

[Leoat12]

If there is market for sports mangas and cooking mangas, why there isn't market for dark mangas?
The taste of the reader is quite random, I think no one here doesn't read a serious because it is this or that genre. Be good is the unique requirement to make success.
Shingeki no Kyojin, a dark series, was rejected by Jump and now it is selling 2 million in another magazine.

 

[SharkBait]

If there is market for sports mangas and cooking mangas, why there isn't market for dark mangas?

If the current generation of Jump readers wanted a dark series, wouldnt there be one in its current lineup? Wouldnt the other series released in the past year and before, and even before that still be running? Other magazines out there have darkish series so it is reasonable to believe that people are able and comfortable with getting their dark fix elsewhere.

 

[WyldViolet]

The point is, anyone know what will be popular or what "jump readers want" and be based on what did or didn't succeed in two years, is just the wrong way, and i'm not talking about market, appeal or whaterver, and yes about a manga be interesting and good, dont matter the genre or theme, if the manga is interesting, will survive or be popular, even if for a short time

And what i talk about Haikyuu and Souma, is not be "sports" or have a "niche", is about serializing mangas with a "theme" (volleyball and real cooking manga) without historic of success in Shonen Jump.

Dude... I'm not talking about just the last few years, I'm talking about Jump history in general.

Also read again what I wrote about why Haikyuu and Souma are popular.
It's pretty easy to see why.

 

[Txapeldun]

What if the dark series we've got lately have been canceled because they sucked awfully, and not because WSJ readers don't want dark stuff?

 

[[Cross]]

If the current generation of Jump readers wanted a dark series, wouldnt there be one in its current lineup? Wouldnt the other series released in the past year and before, and even before that still be running? Other magazines out there have darkish series so it is reasonable to believe that people are able and comfortable with getting their dark fix elsewhere.

Other magazines have darkish series, so it makes sense that they would want to try making their own. It's that simple. I don't think they're going to stop if they feel they can get good ideas out of different authors.

 

[SharkBait]

Other magazines have darkish series, so it makes sense that they would want to try making their own. It's that simple. I don't think they're going to stop if they think they can get good ideas out of different authors.

I think thats kind of a risky endeavor to play a game of "me too." They should instead try to capture markets and genres that their competitors dont have. I think going the dark manga route for an author looking to be serialized in JUMP currently is challenging.

 

[Leoat12]

If the current generation of Jump readers wanted a dark series, wouldnt there be one in its current lineup? Wouldnt the other series released in the past year and before, and even before that still be running? Other magazines out there have darkish series so it is reasonable to believe that people are able and comfortable with getting their dark fix elsewhere.

Not exactly. They were good enough to appeal the readers?
Remember that there is more cancelations in Jump than series that actually make success. There was cancelations of almost everything in the last two years: romance, sports, action and dark series. Dark series is also more rare to appear than other genres, right now I can't remember anything that could be called dark in the last two years. In the end, the percentage of dark series cancelled and other genres series cancelled can be the same.

 

[[Cross]]

I think thats kind of a risky endeavor to play a game of "me too." They should instead try to capture markets and genres that their competitors dont have.

But I don't think they're trying to play "me too" with this series. I mean, honestly, we don't even know how "dark" this series actually is. But also, playing the game of trying to capture markets and such might be "smart business" but if that means we keep seeing the same stuff over and over again, then that's crazy boring. I'd rather see fringe things come out of nowhere, there's always some chance that it could succeed. I don't think anything is ever dead on arrival.

 

[Kaizou 10]

Because anything that was dark and mature was short lasting, just look back at the series started in the past two+ years. There is a reason why nothing currently in the magazine is dark and mature. Jump readers simply dont want it.

I think rather than making the judgement based on just one picture; I think you should make your opinion after you actually read the series.

 

[Stark700]

If our resident Jump experts are done now, then we can change the subject.

Soma 6, Trigger 4, Catcher(S) 3, and Isobe 1 went on sale recently. I wonder how well they'll do.