Mag Talk Weekly Shonen Jump [2015-2016] - Discussion and TOC Talk

[shoyoboyo]

I don't hate or outright dislike Black Clover, I only really think of it as an "okay" series that is sort of just there. That's why I would prefer it if it ended rather soon, so that another, possibly better, series could replace it. I still read it faithfully every week, but I wouldn't really miss it or be disappointed if it ended like many other series I'm reading. Its just that in the 90ish chapters that it's been alive, nothing really outstanding has happened. One Piece had the Arlong Park and the Loguetown arcs, Naruto had the Zabuza Arc and Chuunin Exams, and Hero Academia had the Villain Invasion and Tournament Arcs. In my opinion, Black a lover doesn't really deserve to be more popular than it is now.

If I had to say something good about Black Clover, I'd say its art is very nice, with excellent backgrounds. The art style is definitely unique, but I don't like that everyone only has 2-3 different facial expressions, especially Aster. He has his yelling face, sparkly eyes, and normal expression.

It doesn't matter if you don't like it. It gained a lot of first positions on TOC even not selling that good. Just accept that manga you don't like can be well accepted by (the majority of) other people.

The thing is, it's rankings might very well be just persistent editorial pushing like they did with Toriko (although to a greater extent), and most people here realize this, or at least should.

Also, I understand quite well that others have differing opinions about series, especially shounen series. However, this is a WSJ discussion thread, meaning I am allowed to voice my opinion, just like you're allowed to voice your own. Just accept that the manga you like can be disliked by other people. :^)

 

[Bigivelfhq]

The thing is, it's rankings might very well be just persistent editorial pushing like they did with Toriko (although to a greater extent), and most people here realize this, or at least should.

Also, I understand quite well that others have differing opinions about series, especially shounen series. However, this is a WSJ discussion thread, meaning I am allowed to voice my opinion, just like you're allowed to voice your own. Just accept that the manga you like can be disliked by other people. :^)

Yep, Toriko got 5.5 years of persistent editorial pushing

Why can't people understand that Magazine and Volume are 2 different things! And also that the magazine provides more money profit than the Volumes!

 

[jagman1x3]

Yep, Toriko got 5.5 years of persistent editorial pushing

Why can't people understand that Magazine and Volume are 2 different things! And also that the magazine provides more money profit than the Volumes!

Just on the off chance you're not being sarcastic, companies literally lose money on magazines since they're hoping to make it back in volume sales.

 

[Varus]

I don't hate or outright dislike Black Clover, I only really think of it as an "okay" series that is sort of just there. That's why I would prefer it if it ended rather soon, so that another, possibly better, series could replace it. I still read it faithfully every week, but I wouldn't really miss it or be disappointed if it ended like many other series I'm reading. Its just that in the 90ish chapters that it's been alive, nothing really outstanding has happened. One Piece had the Arlong Park and the Loguetown arcs, Naruto had the Zabuza Arc and Chuunin Exams, and Hero Academia had the Villain Invasion and Tournament Arcs.

The Yami arc was good and the arc prior to that was not bad in my opinion. All of MHA's arcs are good but I would only call two outstanding 1.Stain 2.Hideout Raid, which in my opinion are debatably as good or even better than some of the Naruto/One Piece arcs you've mentioned. As for Clover's current arc it is not outstanding at all, in fact it's the exact opposite. The manga has time on it's side there is still time to turn things around.

I wouldn't mind it ending but I don't think that would be a smart move. It is fairly successful and it still has a lot of potential to grow and best case scenario for Jump, it becomes a pillar. A new series could possibly be better than Clover but quality doesn't necessarily mean it will be successful. If you are seriously worried about it's popularity increasing then pray it never gets animated and if it does get an anime then pray Japanese kids don't watch it.

 

[Bigivelfhq]

Just on the off chance you're not being sarcastic, companies literally lose money on magazines since they're hoping to make it back in volume sales.

That is only the case if you count every cost of production, distribution, retailing and authoring(royalties) to the Magazine. Like the volumes don't have any costs.

Let's see cost distribution:

- Authors pay per page (do you count this to the magazine or the volume, or none? ): Around 100-500 dollars per page
- Editor monthly pay (and this one?)
- Magazine cheap paper print
- Magazine distribution and retailer percentages
- Volume, better quality paper, print
- Volume distribution and retailer percentages
- Author Volume Royalties: Around 10-15%
NOTE: Assuming that Shonen Jump sells 2.1 Million copies and has 20 authors at a given time doing 20 pages, it can be seen as paying each author 4% royalties for the magazine, and this not counting the advertisement earnings, just the magazine raw sales. And that considering that creating a chapter is the cost of the magazine.

And the earning distribution:

- Magazine sales: 255 yen per issue
- Volume sales: 320 yen per issue (just 65 yen more. This is around 65 cents per volume)
- Magazine Advertisement earnings

One thing is saying that the Magazine earnings isn't able to pay all the costs, and so an extra thing is needed. Other thing different is saying that this extra thing brings more money and profit than the Magazine.
The volume like always is an extra money maker, that brings balance to the calculations, nothing more.

Example:
- Think that you create a content for 50 dollars.
- You use your main route and with it you sell 55 dollars, but the cost of distribution and retailing is 10 dollars.
- You loose 5 dollars by the end of the transaction(-50 dollars production + 55 dollars main route sales - 10 dollars cost of sales). So you have to find complementary ways of profiting with your creation.
- So you find an extra route and with it you sell 25 dollars, but the cost of distribution and retailing is 15 dollars.
- This time you get 5 dollars of profit(-50 dollars production + 55 dollars main route sales - 10 dollars main route cost of sales + 25 dollars extra route sales - 15 dollars extra route cost of sales)

Was it needed the extra route(volumes) sales for end profit? Yes. Did extra route(volumes) sold more? Nope. Did extra route(volumes) profit more' Nope.

What would happen if you eliminated the main route and just did the Extra? Something that a ton of people throughout the times talked in here and in other places of the internet.
Well you would save 10 dollars, but loose 55 dollars of earnings, ending up with 40 dollars in the negative. Note, is not because you ended the main route of profit, that your content production costs got lower.

 

[G_I_A]

That is only the case if you count every cost of production, distribution, retailing and authoring(royalties) to the Magazine. Like the volumes don't have any costs.

Let's see cost distribution:

- Authors pay per page (do you count this to the magazine or the volume, or none? ): Around 100-500 dollars per page
- Editor monthly pay (and this one?)
- Magazine cheap paper print
- Magazine distribution and retailer percentages
- Volume, better quality paper, print
- Volume distribution and retailer percentages
- Author Volume Royalties: Around 10-15%
NOTE: Assuming that Shonen Jump sells 2.1 Million copies and has 20 authors at a given time doing 20 pages, it can be seen as paying each author 4% royalties for the magazine, and this not counting the advertisement earnings, just the magazine raw sales. And that considering that creating a chapter is the cost of the magazine.

And the earning distribution:

- Magazine sales: 255 yen per issue
- Volume sales: 320 yen per issue (just 65 yen more. This is around 65 cents per volume)
- Magazine Advertisement earnings

One thing is saying that the Magazine earnings isn't able to pay all the costs, and so an extra thing is needed. Other thing different is saying that this extra thing brings more money and profit than the Magazine.
The volume like always is an extra money maker, that brings balance to the calculations, nothing more.

Example:
- Think that you create a content for 50 dollars.
- You use your main route and with it you sell 55 dollars, but the cost of distribution and retailing is 10 dollars.
- You loose 5 dollars by the end of the transaction(-50 dollars production + 55 dollars main route sales - 10 dollars cost of sales). So you have to find complementary ways of profiting with your creation.
- So you find an extra route and with it you sell 25 dollars, but the cost of distribution and retailing is 15 dollars.
- This time you get 5 dollars of profit(-50 dollars production + 55 dollars main route sales - 10 dollars main route cost of sales + 25 dollars extra route sales - 15 dollars extra route cost of sales)

Was it needed the extra route(volumes) sales for end profit? Yes. Did extra route(volumes) sold more? Nope. Did extra route(volumes) profit more' Nope.

What would happen if you eliminated the main route and just did the Extra? Something that a ton of people throughout the times talked in here and in other places of the internet.
Well you would save 10 dollars, but loose 55 dollars of earnings, ending up with 40 dollars in the negative. Note, is not because you ended the main route of profit, that your content production costs got lower.

Well, maybe not all the series (the vast majority of them) can outsell jump on it's volumes. But One Piece certainly can.

You're also not taking in account the other goods that a series can make profit of like games, films, etc.

Also, this thread is 300 pages long. Don't we need a new one?

 

[Bigivelfhq]

Well, maybe not all the series (the vast majority of them) can outsell jump on it's volumes. But One Piece certainly can.

You're also not taking in account the other goods that a series can make profit of like games, films, etc.

Also, this thread is 300 pages long. Don't we need a new one?

Not even One Piece does that. Note that you get 4 volume of 4 Million copies each per year(Right now is lower than that), while you get 48 issues/volumes of 2.1 Million copies each per year of the Magazine.

Adding all the volume profit of all the series of the magazine still provides less money than what the Magazine does!

Note: The fact that the Magazine release date and the volumes are different is something normally forgotten. Normally Volumes come in 2-3 months intervals, while the magazine comes every week. This means around 8 to 12 per volume.

Goods that a series does is not earnings for the volumes nor for the Magazine alone. Just like creating the chapters isn't a Magazine sole cost either.

 

[jagman1x3]

Not even One Piece does that. Note that you get 4 volume of 4 Million copies each per year(Right now is lower than that), while you get 48 issues/volumes of 2.1 Million copies each per year of the Magazine.

Adding all the volume profit of all the series of the magazine still provides less money than what the Magazine does!

Note: The fact that the Magazine release date and the volumes are different is something normally forgotten. Normally Volumes come in 2-3 months intervals, while the magazine comes every week. This means around 8 to 12 per volume.

Goods that a series does is not earnings for the volumes nor for the Magazine alone. Just like creating the chapters isn't a Magazine sole cost either.

Volumes coming out two or three months apart is only relevant if you're focusing on a single series. They release several volumes every month, so One Piece aside you can't just say that those other ones all have no effect on anything.

 

[Bigivelfhq]

Volumes coming out two or three months apart is only relevant if you're focusing on a single series. They release several volumes every month, so One Piece aside you can't just say that those other ones all have no effect on anything.

"... you can't just say that those other ones all have no effect on anything."
Who said anything like that? Please stop putting things in other people mouths!

You have 20 series per year(20 slots. The cancelled series put together make a yearly series) releasing an average of 5 volumes per year, so you end up with 100 volumes released per year, against the 48 issues of the magazine.
Now look, the magazine has a 2.1 Million copies in print per issue(this is the latest number, some years ago it was doing from 2.4 to 2.8 million), this makes 100.8 Million copies printed per year. For 255 yen each, you get 25.7 Trillion Yen(around 235,7 Million dollars).
At 320 yen per voume you need a 803,250 copies in print per volume in average.

Looking at the magazine prints(being optimist):
1- One Piece - 4 Million
2-HxH - 1 Million
4-Haikyuu!! - 1 Million
5- Assassination Classroom - 1 Million
6- Bleach - 600k
7-My Hero Academia - 600K
9-Gintama - 500k
8-Shokugeki no Soma - 500K
11-Toriko - 500k
12-Boruto - 500k
12-World Trigger - 400K
10- Nisekoi - 400k
13-Yuuna of Yuragi Manor - 200k
14-Black Clover - 200k
15-PSI Kusuo no Sainan - 200k
16-Dance Club - 100k
17-Hinomaru Zumou - 100K
18-Samon the Summoner - 100K
19-Kimetsu no Yaiba - 100k
20-Isobee Isobee Monogatari - 100k
Red Sprite - ???
Love Rush - ???
The Promised Neverland - ???
Amalgam of Distortion - ???
Spring Weapon No.1 - ??

This is a Total of 12,100,000 copies per "round", 60,500,000 per year, average of this is 605,000 copies in print. Well that is 198,250 copies less than what was expected. And note how this is a overexageration of the print numbers of the series. A Hinomaru Zumou possible only gets 50k or maybe less. One Piece is also not doing 4 Million anymore. HxH come 1 time every blue moon. And so on.

Also try to add later the Magazine Advertisement money! And you'll get way way bigger difference.

 

[Jaja]

Finaly its not a oneshot but a new serie.

Seinen magazine, huh? I wonder if will be a gag manga or else

 

[Mammo]

sorry I know this off topic, and I know we talked about this clown a million times before but this is way too hilarious for me not to share

Forneverworld did it again folks, he outdid himself

"Today I'm gonna talk to you about a series no one ever talk about "
"You probably never heard of"
"the most underrated anime EVER!!!!"
.......bla bla bla after all of the hipsters' talk, did you know what was he talking about?

YU YU MOTHERF***ING HAKUSHO

 

[Nakura]

Yu Yu Hakusho... generally seen as one of the best WSJ adaptations ever... underrated.

I'm not going to go onto the video, but surely the comment section is mentioning that though, right?

 

[Mammo]

yes, his viewers are giving him a ton of s*** for it, now he's backpedaling & saying he was spreading the love & what he meant is yyh wasn't as popular as dbz

 

[SharkBait]

You have to be either new to manga anime or living under a rock to think its underrated.

 

[Nakura]

You have to be either new to manga anime or living under a rock to think its underrated.

He's none of those things. He's just an idiot.

 

[Mammo]

Japs have been spreading this pic over the internet about how much Jump changed in just 2 years

Jump is doomed now that Yakenohara Jin and Hachi and Iron Knight are over

 

[jagman1x3]

He's none of those things. He's just an idiot.

Eh, not like they're mutually exclusive.

Japs have been spreading this pic over the internet about how much Jump changed in just 2 years

Jump is doomed now that Yakenohara Jin and Hachi and Iron Knight are over

And when it gets to 50 years, people will look back on today and lament the loss of Love Rush and Red Sprite. Truly the moment Jump reached the point of no return, if only they knew what they were giving up.

 

[savethecat]

Eh, not like they're mutually exclusive.


And when it gets to 50 years, people will look back on today and lament the loss of Love Rush and Red Sprite. Truly the moment Jump reached the point of no return, if only they knew what they were giving up.

I can't wait to drink the tears of salty Red Sprite fans who go on "F*** JUMP" rants once it's axed

 

[Heiji]

51号掲載順

デモンズプラン　※新連載
ワンピ
ブラクロ
トリコ　※完結Ｃカラー
アマルガム
ハイキュー
ネバラン　※Ｃカラー
左門
ヒロアカ
銀魂
火ノ丸
ボルト　※Ｃカラー
青春
鬼滅
ダンス
ゆらぎ
斉木
特別読切　※トリガーの穴埋め
ソーマ
レッスプ
磯部衛

休載：トリガー　※再開時期未定

52号
巻頭：オレゴラッソ　※新連載
Ｃカラー：デモンズプラン、左門、鬼滅

World Trigger go on hiatus. No resume date annonced

 

[jagman1x3]

51号掲載順

デモンズプラン　※新連載
ワンピ
ブラクロ
トリコ　※完結Ｃカラー
アマルガム
ハイキュー
ネバラン　※Ｃカラー
左門
ヒロアカ
銀魂
火ノ丸
ボルト　※Ｃカラー
青春
鬼滅
ダンス
ゆらぎ
斉木
特別読切　※トリガーの穴埋め
ソーマ
レッスプ
磯部衛

休載：トリガー　※再開時期未定

52号
巻頭：オレゴラッソ　※新連載
Ｃカラー：デモンズプラン、左門、鬼滅

World Trigger go on hiatus. No resume date annonced

Fuuuuuuuuck there goes one of the only things keeping me caring about the magazine. At least there's still Neverland I guess, plus Amalgam is pretty high.

--- Double Post Merged, Nov 16, 2016, Original Post Date: Nov 16, 2016 ---

51:

Demon's Plan (Cover, color, new series)
One Piece
Black Clover
Toriko (Color, end)
Amalgam of Distortion
Haikyu
The Promised Neverland (Color)
Samon the Summoner
My Hero Academia
Gintama
Hinomaru Zumo
Boruto (Color)
Spring Weapon No. 01
Kimetsu no Yaiba
Straighten Up!
Ghost Tits
Saiki
Oneshot (WT replacement)
Food Wars
Red Sprite
Isobe Isobee Monogatari

52:
Ore Golasso (New series, cover, lead color)
Center color: Demon's Plan, Samon the Summoner, Kimetsu no Yaiba