Discussion Could Zeldris beat Escanor?

[MrSchmitty7]

I can't believe that some people compare Zeldoris to either Meliodas and Escanor.

Zeldoris can deal with any Escanor before the 11am or 11:30am version ( depend on which one was true ), basically, the one who dominated Estarossa badly.

Zeldoris is nothing compared to current AM Meliodas, he used the DK magic and it didn't do shit. that is what he finds " unbelievable and impossible " lmao.
He is at best 75-80K with that second mark. And that is being generous, Meliodas who is in base ( 60K ) is literally equal to him ( 61K ) with his regular Demon King.

Basically, the only characters who broke the 100K are: Meliodas, Escanor ( Mael ), DK, and SD so far in this manga.

Literally it would take him 50K+ just for Assault Mel to qualify it as fun. Who casually gets 50K from one demon mark? Even Mel had to spend years upon years of death to get his power back

 

[Arjuna]

I personally feel the statement of Mel that he had fun with his fight is slight different

1)Obviously he didn't fight Zeldris with the intention of killing him.

2)He probably fought without AM.

3)When he fought Zeldris in AM how we saw he basically no diffe'd Zel & Estarossa. Obviously that can't give him any enjoyment.

 

[Mythoclast]

Again you can’t have that effect on the water. It’s too high up. Plus isn’t it funny how there’s only two of those splashes the entire time in spite of the fact that it traveled over the entire lake? Does the pattern magically stop because Nakaba forgot how to science?

This is fiction.It can.
We barely got a glimpse at the water but it seems like a safe assumption even though it doesn't make sense considering their trajectory.But it's fiction,so I guess it can happen.

Again, do you have any scans of the fight or are you just going to assume stuff? Because last time someone went off of hype quotes from another without fight feats. they ended up looking like Arthur. (Because they were Arthur)

Aren't you doing the exact same thing?Assuming?
You're the one that claimed that he didn't fight Mel at his strongest when the quote came exactly fron Assault mode Mel's mouth.It's not up to me to prove that,it up to you..

I still can’t believe you would think that Zel causally gets around 40K point of magic with a basic mark. Do you know how absurd that sounds?

It really isn't that crazy when looking at it from a proportionated view.
32k Mel gain 24k from his demon mark.24k is 75% of his base form powerlevel.Doing the same for Zel would mean he'd gain around 45k.I don't see him breaking 100k tho.90k is the most.

Also what POV? There’s very little information there.

Bruh...Are you reading what I post?
Estarossa's hype originally came from the readers pov.Zeldris' comes from multiple things inverse.From characters to his title.

Last chapter confirms that Mel thinks that Zel could potentially fall behind the AA without his commandment. That ends your argument about him being close to Escanor. Zel never states he doesn’t have to fight seriously.

A simple inquiry isn't a solid basis to make such a conclusion.He himself confirmed that he'll be fine.
But if that's how you interpreted it,then so that be it.

Again you’re saying Zeldris though he is weaker cannot get blitzed, but then you go onto say that he can somehow touch Escanor. The only way Escanor was able to hit Mel was because Mel wasn’t even serious.

What's your point?

Mel got this power back because he spent 3000 years dying. Did you not read the manga? It’s already been stated. He couldn’t have done this without the curse.

There is literally no difference in morality between Holy war Mel and 3k Mel.The only difference between them is the huge difference in power.
Mel was able to regain all his power after 1 trip to Purgatory.

Again Mel thinks that Zel could have issues wouthout his commandment against the 4AA. They are currently nerfed to a certain degree. Zel is stronger than them, but no by much according to Mel. Or are you just gonna pick and choose what Mel quotes matter. I didn’t know we had a professional Mel interpreter here

I'm not going to contest your interpretation of Mel's inquiry.

This is my last reply to the topic.
To answer the op's question,yes Zeldris does actually have a chance at beating 114k Escanor.
He's not getting blitzed and a curse pretty much stops Escanor dead in his tracks.

 

[MrSchmitty7]

This is fiction.It can.
We barely got a glimpse at the water but it seems like a safe assumption even though it doesn't make sense considering their trajectory.But it's fiction,so I guess it can happen.


Aren't you doing the exact same thing?Assuming?
You're the one that claimed that he didn't fight Mel at his strongest when the quote came exactly fron Assault mode Mel's mouth.It's not up to me to prove that,it up to you..

It really isn't that crazy when looking at it from a proportionated view.
32k Mel gain 24k from his demon mark.24k is 75% of his base form powerlevel.Doing the same for Zel would mean he'd gain around 45k.I don't see him breaking 100k tho.90k is the most.


Bruh...Are you reading what I post?
Estarossa's hype originally came from the readers pov.Zeldris' comes from multiple things inverse.From characters to his title.

A simple inquiry isn't a solid basis to make such a conclusion.He himself confirmed that he'll be fine.
But if that's how you interpreted it,then so that be it.


What's your point?


There is literally no difference in morality between Holy war Mel and 3k Mel.The only difference between them is the huge difference in power.
Mel was able to regain all his power after 1 trip to Purgatory.


I'm not going to contest your interpretation of Mel's inquiry.

This is my last reply to the topic.
To answer the op's question,yes Zeldris does actually have a chance at beating 114k Escanor.
He's not getting blitzed and a curse pretty much stops Escanor dead in his tracks.

Something being fiction isn't an excuse to throw common sense out the window. It's not magic water and Nakaba isn't an idiot that he can't understand the water cycle or how a liquid works.

I'm not assuming anything. My whole point is that we don't know what form Mel fought him in, therefore we shouldn't say anything. You're trying to claim assault mode Mel did it, I'm saying we have no idea. Now if I said that Mel definitely fought Zeldris 100% in his 80K form then I'd be assuming. I'm saying we have no idea what form he was fought in.

The demon marks don't follow a math pattern. You can't just make up an equation that Nakaba doesn't even use. Plus people tried the same thing with Escanor's power and they were wrong. Plus that 75% thing is literal b.s in math terms because you're trying to use the base form to boost the number and not the actual power itself. Thats like saying since Escanor goes from around 60K to 114K and 60 divided by 114K is 52 percent, therefore Escanor's 114K power must increase by 52%. Therefore Escanor has a power level of 219,000.

Again, people hyped Zeldris in the past from their own POV only to find out that they were wrong. They used a quote from Merlin to justify "in verse feats" and then ended up looking like idiots. They legit tried to say he could beat Mel, so no, in verse doesn't really help.

Ok so Mel worried about him and so far your whole argument is "Mel said this in AM therefore it must be true." Now you're trying to say that Mel's words might not be true? Make up your mind. If Mel says Zel could struggle, it should stand to reason that the others are a threat because Mel said so. And according to you so far, what Mel said is undisputed since it's in AM.

Mel has been to purgatory more than once. Mel flat out says that's how the curse works in earlier chapters. Your theory doesn't add up. The DK said that Mel chose to die and went to purgatory. He then said that he'll once again devour his emotions. The DK can't devour his emotions from the living world, therefore he's been to purgatory more than once.

Honestly assuming that Zeldris casually gains 40K points of power from some formula that doesn't exist in the manga is pretty illogical. A 20K difference is enough to toy around in a fight and dodge 99% of attacks (at least by Mel). Why should Zel be any different

 

[Gut's is the man]

Sorry it's a bit off topic but do we know what Zel's innate magical power is? I know he has that ability called "God", but isn't that just the magical power lent to him by his father? Shouldn't he have his own ability?

It's actually unknown whether or not God is the power lent to Zel or his innate ability.

 

[Mythoclast]

I guess my estimates were right.He isn't going to cap out at 75k,but a lot closer to 100k.

 

[kkck]

As far as zeldris defeating the one... I would argue zeldris as we have seen him wouldn't stand a chance. Heck, even zeldris with meliodas's pre assault demon mark wouldn't win IMO considering he is basically equal to mel's base form currently even when using a demon mark. The power zeldris got from the demon king likely isn't that much to begin with, it's probably even less than that of a single commandment. It's probably just enough to give zeldris authority over the demon clan considering it can lift commandment curses.

Also worth noting in this regard, sunshine appears to be a grace meaning that it is most likely more powerful than zeldris's commandment plus demon king power. If graces are the same as commandments it means the supreme deity devided half her power into 4 pieces. Basically 12.5% of her power into each grace. Meanwhile each commandment represents 5% of the demon king's power. Heck, meliodas needs commandments to become demon king... but if the power zeldris has was actually even as strong as a commandment's you'd think it'd be able to at least compensante for one, thus meliodas needing only 9 commandments at the most to become demon king.... But meliodas apparently did not even bother collecting it.

--- Double Post Merged, Apr 25, 2018, Original Post Date: Apr 25, 2018 ---

As far as the demon king not warning zeldris about escanor...
http://fanfox.net/manga/nanatsu_no_taizai/vTBD/c247/4.html

We do have a few references of the demon king talking about the seven deadly sins with his subordinates. Chandler even mentioned how the demon king wasn't sure of how to deal with the SDS. While the demon king has not necessarily given specific warnings about the enemies to his subordinates, it does seem to be the case the demon king regards the sins in general as a threat.

 

[Meliodaf]

I don't see how this is a thing honestly.The answer to this is the same it's always been for everyone facing Escanor; it depends.

 

[Gut's is the man]

I don't see how this is a thing honestly.The answer to this is the same it's always been for everyone facing Escanor; it depends.

He'll win.

 

[JOA20]

Zeldris can beat Escanor as long as it isn't close to noon (I don't see the demon prince beating 114k Escanor, but maybe...), but I don't think the two will fight. I believe that Zeldris' opponent will be Ludoshel.

 

[Meliodaf]

He'll win.

Which will win? Because as stated before, it depends as Escanor's power is entirely dependent on time.

 

[Gut's is the man]

Which will win? Because as stated before, it depends as Escanor's power is entirely dependent on time.

Zeldris. He can seal the one.

 

[kkck]

Zeldris. He can seal the one.

We just saw the archangels being largely immune to commandments. It is at best unlikely zeldris can use daddy's powers to seal the one.

 

[Demonspeed]

I don't think Zeldris can seal The One, there should be a limit to the amount of Magic he can seal depending on the power of his opponent. Dolor had 14000 in Magic and Diane powered up even more when they met. We have no details but I'd say he being able to seal someone with MP in the 40K is very unlikely.

From what we have seen, unless he gets totally overwhelmed by the sheer difference in physical abilities like Estarossa did he can beat him, his chances are higher even because Sunshine isn't really versatile. So, as long as they are at a similar level. He could use the curse he used on Merlin, who resisted this long because of her blessing. Escanor has no immunity to that.

Zeldris can beat Escanor as long as it isn't close to noon (I don't see the demon prince beating 114k Escanor, but maybe...), but I don't think the two will fight. I believe that Zeldris' opponent will be Ludoshel.

Zeldris will have to deal with the five people coming. The masters are not with him.

 

[Tragicdeath]

Yes he could beat Escanor even at his one state using DK's power. Everyone is downplaying Zel, hes the leader of the TC and has borrowed DK's power. Even AM Mel could beat Escanor's one state but Mel let his guard down so he got sliced.

 

[JOA20]

Yes he could beat Escanor even at his one state using DK's power. Everyone is downplaying Zel, hes the leader of the TC and has borrowed DK's power. Even AM Mel could beat Escanor's one state but Mel let his guard down so he got sliced.

Sorry, but I disagree. The One beat Meliodas effortlessly, Divine Slayer didn't even scratch him. Zeldris couldn't do shit against Meliodas' darkness attack despite using the Demon King's power.

 

[Mythoclast]

Zeldris cannot beat the ONE.
Beating 114k Escanor is absolutely within his capabilities tho.
All he has to do is pop a curse and it's all downhill for Escanor.

 

[Tragicdeath]

Sorry, but I disagree. The One beat Meliodas effortlessly, Divine Slayer didn't even scratch him. Zeldris couldn't do shit against Meliodas' darkness attack despite using the Demon King's power.

Zeldris doesnt let his guard down, he knows his enemy well, he doesnt charge unless it would be hard for him to penetrate, hes far smarter fighter than Esta and Mel because he doesnt downplay anyone. Yes Escanor is more powerful than him in 1 minute but I doubt that would be enough to beat a guy whos as intelligent as Zeldris. To beat Escanor is to survive that one minute of his in unscathable state. Remember thats the only timeline he has for his invulnerability which for me wont be enough to take down the leader of TC.

 

[kkck]

Zeldris cannot beat the ONE.
Beating 114k Escanor is absolutely within his capabilities tho.
All he has to do is pop a curse and it's all downhill for Escanor.

Graces have protection from commandments, we just saw that. If commandments don't work then certainly the power zeldris got from daddy won't be enough either.

 

[Mythoclast]

Graces have protection from commandments, we just saw that. If commandments don't work then certainly the power zeldris got from daddy won't be enough either.

Merlin also has protection,but look how well that helped her
I don't even know why you're equalising "God" and the decrees in the first place..
---
Also it's stated that members of the Goddess clan are the ones with protection against Commandments,not Grace holders.So Escanor does not benefit from that unless it's shown or stated otherwise.