One Piece Power Level Discussion Thread

[goldb]

Ground Rules for the Power Level Discussion Thread
​

As always, please follow the guidelines set by the Forum Rules that apply across the board.

It's important that discussions from a current chapter are spoiler tagged until 24h have passed from an english release.

• For the sake of constructive discussion, where and when possible please quote/ source any information you provide. Particularly when it comes to conversations carried over from other threads.
• Avoid passive agressive posts, sly remarks or baiting/trolling. You can certainly have fun or disagree without it being at someone's expense.
• Only use anime examples that are canon and as means to provide clarity to pages in the manga. Any other anime material is otherwise non-canon and should only be referenced if it can be proved that the mangaka had approved it.
• We will strive to avoid repetitive discussions and any extensive battle topics will be guided to the Davy Back fight to existing threads or new ones can be made there.

As of now these topics are shelved due to repetitiveness or until the manga can present us with material to further discussions:

1. Shanks v Mihawk
2. Hand to hand fighters > Swordsmen
3. Zoro > Luffy
4. Zoro v Sanji
5. Is Smoker a top 30 character?
6. Mihawk's rank within the story
7. Law having CoC currently.
8. Katakuri > Kaido/Luffy/Etc.

If you wish to continue any of these discussion and remove it from the list, you will need to provide manga material as proof. If there's also anything you think we've covered numerous times, let me know and I'll update the list.

This is the only warning there'll be regarding these ground rules, anything no adhering will be removed. So please just check your posts before posting them.

 

[albertwv]

One way I power gauge is by ranking people in between Gear 2/3 & Gear 4 Luffy.
I would put both Doffy and Cracker closer to Gear 4 Luffy. Law is stronger than Gear 2 Luffy but by a little.

 

[M3J]

Luffy is our protagonist so he has to make it out of situations. But WCI was very plot armorish...Jimbei rescues him jail; Bege is planning an assassination to join in on. Lucky explosion saves the failed assassination attempt. Fishman Pirates dont leave so they disabke BM intelligence network. & Germa66 definitely plays a big part in fighting of BMP.

I disagree with the 1B simply because Jack,Katakuri, Queen & likely King, Have such bounties. Luffy is only now in Wano, actually on that plateau.

I'll say his Pirate fleet is the biggest boost. Which i just love. Luffy is going to need them to actually fight these huge Yonkou crews & the next War.

I don't think Jinbei rescuing Luffy was plot armorish, it's not like there was no hint of him being on WCI at all. Even back during Fishman Island he said he had to withdraw from being in Big Mom's crew in order to join with Luffy's, and in a way where the island won't face Big Mom's wrath. Bege though was probably plot armorish, but the treasure box was also hinted to possibly explode, and we all know about the Straw Hats' luck/good fate.

Bounties don't always reflect strength though, it represents what the government think is the danger level of the individual.

 

[afromarco005]

I was wondering how strong is garp?

In his prime he was around pirate king level imo.

Two years ago he was higher than admirals and slightly lower than yonko imo.

Now he should be around Admiral level or slightly higher, i still see him as stronger than Akainu

 

[Takuan]

I was wondering how strong is garp?

In his prime he was around pirate king level imo.

Two years ago he was higher than admirals and slightly lower than yonko imo.

Now he should be around Admiral level or slightly higher, i still see him as stronger than Akainu

My bias is strong with Garp. I feel like i'll get everybody's hatred towards me if i voice my opinion too loudly on Garp. So as a middle ground, i'll say he's Dobberman level.

 

[afromarco005]

My bias is strong with Garp. I feel like i'll get everybody's hatred towards me if i voice my opinion too loudly on Garp. So as a middle ground, i'll say he's Dobberman level.

How do you come to that conclusion when the dude casually destroyed mountains with a punch back in the days and duked it out with roger and whitebeard the strongest pirate of his time?
Its even inted that Garp was responsible for stopping the Rock pirates which had crewmates like Linlin and Kaido-kun who later went on to become Yonko????

 

[Takuan]

How do you come to that conclusion when the dude casually destroyed mountains with a punch back in the days and duked it out with roger and whitebeard the strongest pirate of his time?
Its even inted that Garp was responsible for stopping the Rock pirates which had crewmates like Linlin and Kaido-kun who later went on to become Yonko????

Lol why so serious dude xD i was joking completely, don't worry about it. I know Garp is way stronger than Dobberman.
The thing is, the dude is only hype. And the hype he has, is all in the past 20 years ago. All of his current feats are meh. His biggest feat would be... Dueling equally with pre-timeskip Blackbeard and pre-timeskip Burgess, with the help of Sengoku. I'm not impressed.
My opinion on Garp is that he was. He has been, he USED to be a great fighter. Nowadays, not that big of a deal. He might be like... I don't know. Doflamingo level. I'd rank him below Aokiji Akainu and Kizaru at least.

 

[Pirate Queen]

I think Garp could 1 shot Katakuri

 

[afromarco005]

Lol why so serious dude xD i was joking completely, don't worry about it. I know Garp is way stronger than Dobberman.
The thing is, the dude is only hype. And the hype he has, is all in the past 20 years ago. All of his current feats are meh. His biggest feat would be... Dueling equally with pre-timeskip Blackbeard and pre-timeskip Burgess, with the help of Sengoku. I'm not impressed.
My opinion on Garp is that he was. He has been, he USED to be a great fighter. Nowadays, not that big of a deal. He might be like... I don't know. Doflamingo level. I'd rank him below Aokiji Akainu and Kizaru at least.

Sorry I always am under the impression that people are serious these days I must have been traumatized by the Moes x)

When you put it that way I understand where you are coming from and you are not wrong a lot of hype but not many feats, thats the same problem I have with Shanks.

 

[McNuss]

Lol why so serious dude xD i was joking completely, don't worry about it. I know Garp is way stronger than Dobberman.
The thing is, the dude is only hype. And the hype he has, is all in the past 20 years ago. All of his current feats are meh. His biggest feat would be... Dueling equally with pre-timeskip Blackbeard and pre-timeskip Burgess, with the help of Sengoku. I'm not impressed.
My opinion on Garp is that he was. He has been, he USED to be a great fighter. Nowadays, not that big of a deal. He might be like... I don't know. Doflamingo level. I'd rank him below Aokiji Akainu and Kizaru at least.

The thing is, I am not even sure if him fighting Blackbeard and Burgess was even in the Manga, I think that was anime-only.
Anyways Garp is seriously overhyped and not even a likeable character. Sitting idle at his grandchild's execution. Garp is a piece of shit that puts himself over others. Funny how people like a person with such a trash personality simply because he is the main character's granddad.

Still, I'd put him over Doflamingo. But he and Sengoku are probably below the Pre-Skip Admirals, that fought the likes of Marco, Jozu and Vista completely unfazed.


-----

Anyways, let's rank some characters within their individual groups, since that is much easier. Let's start with the villain goups (skipping the Impostor Straw Hats):

New Fishman Pirates:

1. Hody Jones (White)
2. Wadatsumi
3. Hyozu (White)
4. Hyozu
5. Hody Jones Hyozu performed better against Luffy on land than Hody against Zoro underwater
6. Other officers - honestly not too much difference in them
7. Hammond, Harisenbon, Kasagoba

CC

1. Monet
2. Caesar Clown
3. Yeti Cool Bros
4. Brownbeard
5. Smooge, Chappe, Run, Fen Bock

Donquixote Family:

1. Doflamingo
2. Vergo
3. Pica
4. Trebol
5. Diamante - he is shit
6. Monet
7. Dellinger, Gladius, Lao G, Senor Pink, Baby 5, Bellamy
8. Machvise
9. Buffalo
10. Sugar, Jola
11. Kween

Big Mom Pirates (lots of speculation here):

1. Big Mom
2. Katakuri
3. Smoothie
4. Cracker
5. Snack
6. Perospero, Oven, Daifuku, Bege, Compote (presumably)
7. Tamago, Charlotte Decuplets (together), Custard (Cracker's twin, was sent after the Supernova Bege), Streusen
8. Pekoms
9. Opera, Galette, Mont-d'Or, Bobbin, Amande, Nusstorte, Citron, Cinammon, Bavarois
10. Counter, Cadenza, Cabaletta, Gala
11. Brulee, Broye, Raisin, Yuen, Decuplets (individually), Mondee, Hachee, Efilee, Angel, Basskarte, Dosmarche, Poire, Brownie, Joconde, Chiboust, Dacquoise, Basans, Kanten, Kato
12. Zucotto, Noisette, Moscato, Mash, Compo, Laurin, Mozart, Marnier, High-Fat, Tablet, Saint-Marc, Prim, Praline, Montb, Mobile, Marble, Myukuru, Maple, Panna, Mascarpone, Joscarpone, Nougat, Flambe, Pudding
13. Cornstarch, Melise, Lola, Chiffon, Diesel, Randolph, Noble Croc

Only difference between 9 and 10 is, that characters in 9 either have more feats or are twins of a higher ranked character. I always put twins not to far away from their siblings. Anyways, lots of speculation here. I placed Cornstarch and Melise in the bottom since they really don't look like fighters.

Beast Pirates:

1. Kaido
2. King
3. Queen
4. Jack
5. Drake, Hawinks, Apoo
6. Page One
7. Babanuki, Sheepshead (who's actually strong lol, completely unscathed after facing the Minks for days)
8. Holdem
9. Daifugo, Dobon, Solitaire, Speed, Ginrummy (presumed), Scotch
10. Gazelleman, Mouseman, Batman, Alpacaman

Anyways most of this came from the top of my head, so I didn't reread for fact checking.

 

[Takuan]

The thing is, I am not even sure if him fighting Blackbeard and Burgess was even in the Manga, I think that was anime-only.
Anyways Garp is seriously overhyped and not even a likeable character. Sitting idle at his grandchild's execution. Garp is a piece of shit that puts himself over others. Funny how people like a person with such a trash personality simply because he is the main character's granddad.

Still, I'd put him over Doflamingo. But he and Sengoku are probably below the Pre-Skip Admirals, that fought the likes of Marco, Jozu and Vista completely unfazed.

Dude thanks, i couldn't agree more. I was under the asumption that i was pretty much the only one not thinking of Garp as a legend or something. He might have been in the past, but at this point in the story he's truly overhyped.
I hate Garp ever since his Marineford actions. Even so, i would be willing to respect him as a fighter if he actually showed decent feats; but nothing noteworthy was shown from him.
Though yeah, i'd place him at Doffy level, maybe slightly higher. Along with Sengoku. Yeah i pretty much agree with everything you said lol


Quick question about your ranks above, you're placing Monet higher than Caesar Clown? Can you explain why?

 

[Fox666]

Maybe he meant Vergo instead of Monet

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Dude thanks, i couldn't agree more. I was under the asumption that i was pretty much the only one not thinking of Garp as a legend or something. He might have been in the past, but at this point in the story he's truly overhyped.
I hate Garp ever since his Marineford actions. Even so, i would be willing to respect him as a fighter if he actually showed decent feats; but nothing noteworthy was shown from him.
Though yeah, i'd place him at Doffy level, maybe slightly higher. Along with Sengoku. Yeah i pretty much agree with everything you said lol


Quick question about your ranks above, you're placing Monet higher than Caesar Clown? Can you explain why?

Guys guys, don't let your dislike for a character blind your judgement on such character.
Yes we know once upon a time, Garp was the most powerful Marine the WG had and the only man who could rival Roger in combat.
Yet, due to old age, as with many characters that ridiculous strength has dwindled quite a bit but just like White beard, he is still plenty powerful even at his current state.
The battle at Marineford confirmed that as not a single WB pirate wanted to face the man. Even after WB talked down his legend. My guess is he's at a similar level as the sick old WB and Rayleigh (who's currently shown to hurt and overpower G4 Luffy without going as far as using hardening) who have also had their true strength watered down due to old age but still have enough to handle the very best the current generation has to offer.

Just like so many powerful characters in One Piece, Garp is screentime featless but it's been emphasised time and again why it's a bad idea to engage him in combat.

 

[Fox666]

Luffy defeated Katakuri in a fair battle. Katakuri impaled himself with his spear to make up for Flampe intervention.

Luffy was at disadvantage against Cracker ability, and wouldn't have won without Nami's help. Indeed, Katakuri implied that he didn't believed Luffy could have defeated Cracker at first. But Luffy got stronger during the fight, and if he surpassed Katakuri, he surpassed Cracker too.

 

[Sachsenhesse]

Luffy was at disadvantage against Cracker ability, and wouldn't have won without Nami's help. Indeed, Katakuri implied that he didn't believed Luffy could have defeated Cracker at first. But Luffy got stronger during the fight, and if he surpassed Katakuri, he surpassed Cracker too.

1 vs. 1 against Cracker i still see him lose, its just a real bad matchup.

 

[Takuan]

Guys guys, don't let your dislike for a character blind your judgement on such character.
Yes we know once upon a time, Garp was the most powerful Marine the WG had and the only man who could rival Roger in combat.
Yet, due to old age, as with many characters that ridiculous strength has dwindled quite a bit but just like White beard, he is still plenty powerful even at his current state.
The battle at Marineford confirmed that as not a single WB pirate wanted to face the man. Even after WB talked down his legend. My guess is he's at a similar level as the sick old WB and Rayleigh (who's currently shown to hurt and overpower G4 Luffy without going as far as using hardening) who have also had their true strength watered down due to old age but still have enough to handle the very best the current generation has to offer.

Just like so many powerful characters in One Piece, Garp is screentime featless but it's been emphasised time and again why it's a bad idea to engage him in combat.

Rayleigh is as old as Garp so they are similar in power? No. Rayleigh has feats, Garp doesn't.
Actually Garp took a punch from Luffy and bled from that. He took it willingly but still bled from it, from a punch from Luffy pre-timeskip. That's incredibly lackluster. His other feat from Marineford was cheap shotting Marco.
His lack of good feats is preventing me from considering him one of the strongest characters in the series equal to Whitebeard or whatever oter things i've heard about Garp. I'm placing him, just like Sengoku, between Doflamingo and Admirals, which is already very powerful.

 

[McNuss]

Quick question about your ranks above, you're placing Monet higher than Caesar Clown? Can you explain why?

Monet was send to watch Caesar. During Luffy's second encounter with Caesar, she stepped in before Luffy could finish Caesar.
Unlike Caesar, Monet has actual combat skills instead of just relying on her DF. She also never really seemed to respect Caesar in any kind of way. Anyways, they are both Logias without Haki, and in a broader list I would put them in the same category anyways.

Maybe he meant Vergo instead of Monet

Vergo wasn't in Caesar's organization.

Guys guys, don't let your dislike for a character blind your judgement on such character.
Yes we know once upon a time, Garp was the most powerful Marine the WG had and the only man who could rival Roger in combat.
Yet, due to old age, as with many characters that ridiculous strength has dwindled quite a bit but just like White beard, he is still plenty powerful even at his current state.
The battle at Marineford confirmed that as not a single WB pirate wanted to face the man. Even after WB talked down his legend. My guess is he's at a similar level as the sick old WB and Rayleigh (who's currently shown to hurt and overpower G4 Luffy without going as far as using hardening) who have also had their true strength watered down due to old age but still have enough to handle the very best the current generation has to offer.

Just like so many powerful characters in One Piece, Garp is screentime featless but it's been emphasised time and again why it's a bad idea to engage him in combat.

When did Rayleigh fight G4 Luffy, is that anime-only?
Garp is undoubtly among the strongest, but I'd place him behind Sakazuki, Kuzan and Borsalino any day. Old age is an impediment, as shown with Rayleigh, Whitebeard, Chinjao and Lao G. Garp was asked to become an Admiral in the past.

I don't think that someone who could have been an admiral 20 years ago is stronger than someone who is an admiral now. However, note that with "now" I mean the preskip trio, since Fujitora was hiding his strenght and Ryukugyu is featless.

 

[nik87]

I would really like if Oda gave us a fight with Garp at any moment just to see what he can do and how he fights anyone who presents a challenge.
Imo, he is above Admiral based on portrayal but indeed, there are no feats so far...

 

[Pirate Queen]

1 vs. 1 against Cracker i still see him lose, its just a real bad matchup.

This is a joke right? You think CURRENT Luffy still loses to Cracker?

 

[Sachsenhesse]

This is a joke right? You think CURRENT Luffy still loses to Cracker?

Nope i am quite positiv about this, What can Luffy do against so many biscuit soldiers without Namis Rain to weaken them? Luffy didnt power up his punches, he just got better at observation.

Without Nami Luffy would have been curbstomped quite bad, so i dont see him winning now.

Just a reminder: Without G4, Luffy was just equal to one(!) Biscuit soldier in terms of power. since Cracker can produce limitless thats a real problem.

 

[AINSOOALGOWN_SAMA]

Nope i am quite positiv about this, What can Luffy do against so many biscuit soldiers without Namis Rain to weaken them? Luffy didnt power up his punches, he just got better at observation.

Without Nami Luffy would have been curbstomped quite bad, so i dont see him winning now.

Just a reminder: Without G4, Luffy was just equal to one(!) Biscuit soldier in terms of power. since Cracker can produce limitless thats a real problem.

This was the point where I felt Oda wrote Luffy bad - the battle against Cracker - I mean Luffy could not do much to 1 biscuit soldier without G4. That's just pretty stupid to me for someone who was at the time trying to challenge a Yonko.

But I hope with this little training he's had in prison his armament would've gotten stronger. Even better if it was strong enough in his basic form to actually damage a biscuit soldier. Sad there's no Cracker in Wano to test it out on.

Until basic Luffy is able to duke it out one on one with Yonko Commanders, I don't see him achieving Yonko level in strength. Especially with his reliance on G4 to give him the upper hand in any given fight.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 10, 2019, Original Post Date: Mar 10, 2019 ---

He took it willingly but still bled from it,

I see that part as him trying to fool the Marines present into thinking he was actually damaged from the hit + that was a G2 punch IIRC (it hurts a lot in truth just ask Blueno if we are talking pre-TS).
Remember, Katakuri also received a non-hardened basic kick from Luffy and bled and this was a guy famed to possess superhuman strength.

I wouldn't look too much into that if I were you.

When did Rayleigh fight G4 Luffy, is that anime-only?

Yeah it's Anime-only but it's more or less things Oda couldn't cover in the Manga. I had recently he gives permission to the Anime producers for added events he couldn't reveal in the Manga due to plenty going on in the story.

--- Double Post Merged, Mar 10, 2019 ---

Rayleigh is as old as Garp so they are similar in power? No. Rayleigh has feats, Garp doesn't.

Rayleigh would just be a similar character to Garp - legendary - with nothing much to show for it on-screen were it not that he's written to be Luffy's Sensei.

Garp was ahead of Rayleigh when they were at their peak during their generation so it's not wrong to think even in decline he's still superior.